Episode #231: The Books of Enoch Part 1 W/Ken Peterson

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And my man, you're back and
we're going to talk about Enoch

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David.
I think the thing I love most,

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the thing I love most about your
podcast, it provides a place for

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believers or questions about the
restored gospel to talk about

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things that you can't talk about
in gospel doctrine.

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Yeah, not, not not because
they're bad.

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They're just not appropriate.
They're not official doctrine.

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But these questions still exist
and they're not bad questions.

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Certainly.
Hugh Nibley showed us all that.

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So I just, I'm so grateful for
you and for the this format to

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be able to do this.
So I'm super excited.

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Well, I'm, I'm thankful you keep
coming on, man.

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I enjoy these conversations
because I, my mind's always

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blown every time and I love
that.

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So.
So Enoch is is that in the

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Apocrypha?
Let's for just a second define

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what we mean by apocrypha.
Apocrypha has two meanings.

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The meaning that most people are
familiar with is what is

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routinely referred to as the
biblical Apocrypha.

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That means there there are 14
books that are included in some

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Bibles but not included in say,
ours.

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For example, in the Latin
Vulgate, you'll see them, they

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call those the biblical
Apocrypha, like the Maccabees

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and that sort of thing.
In a more general sense, any

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sacred text that is not a part
of the Bible can be considered

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apocryphal or an apocryphal
text.

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So like in the terms of my Book
Mormon doctrine in the

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Apocrypha, it's the.
Larger your your book Mormonism

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in the apocrypha the one by Ken
Peterson, David did.

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You find on Amazon that one, is
that the book?

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Get it out of your system now
because we're going to refer to

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it a lot, but this is the
largest question.

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Look, I'm glad I asked that
first question, but that was all

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geared to get us here.
Ken, I want you to know how up

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front, because I love that book
so much.

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I will shamelessly promote that
thing any chance I get.

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But this is good stuff.
So.

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So there's Apocrypha in the
Vulgate and out as well.

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Well, the most popular example
of what are now referred to as

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extra canonical texts.
So ancient, ancient authentic

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sacred texts that are not a part
of the Canon are called extra

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canonical.
And the Dead Sea Scrolls is the

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most famous of extra canonical
texts.

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They're not a part of the
biblical Apocrypha, the smaller

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group, but it is apocryphal in
the in the much larger sense.

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So yes, the Books of Enoch are
extra canonical.

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They are not in the biblical
Apocrypha and the interesting

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thing that's been happening with
me in terms of my book, which I

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had hoped would be the case.
The initial publication of the

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book was for me just to map out
everything that was out there

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and everything that correlated
with my belief system.

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And then I could take that book
because I couldn't remember it.

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All right, so it's organized now
in terms of subject and just

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like the topical guide in our in
in our Canon of scriptures that

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we have that topical guide for
the extra canonical text is now

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helping me find additional
insights.

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When you look at it all stacked
up together and you begin to

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study these extra canonical
texts by topic.

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And so, so that that has opened
the door as you and I have

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talked and I have various ideas
of things that we could discuss

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is the fruit that has been born
of being able to see my book in

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the aggregate now to be able to
see it by subject and the and

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the insights that come from
that.

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So, yeah, thanks for that
question, Dave.

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So, so, you know, you brought up
a couple things, and I have a

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question about Enoch here before
we really dive in, but as

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Mormons, we shouldn't
necessarily be afraid of extra

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canonical sources, right?
If there's any people in the

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world that should be OK with
extra canonical sources, it's

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us.
Right.

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Yeah.
Why do you say that, Dave?

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Because as we look at at what
the definition of scripture is

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in Mormonism, it's different
than what it is in a lot of

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other religions, right?
I believe DNC, I can't remember

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the section, but DNC something
says that the definition of

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scripture is anything that the
servants of the Lord say when

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moved upon by the Holy Ghost,
right.

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That leaves a lot of room for
scripture.

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And now we have a Canon of
scripture, which is your quad

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right, That's that's the Canon.
But we should absolutely expect

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to see scripture from outside
the Canon.

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And, and the trick is with this
is to judge what is legitimate

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and what is not right?
And, and typically how I've been

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able to to make that jive is, is
I say, how does this hold water

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against the dispensation head,
right?

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Does this support and bolster
what Joseph Smith taught or is

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this outside of that?
Right?

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And, and even that, I would say
we'd have to be a little bit

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careful on right.
You don't want to be too rigid,

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but I would say that that we
should, we should feel empowered

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as Mormons to be able to look at
these extra canonical sources

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and be able to, to extract what
we can out of them and be

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blessed for that.
That's the one of the gifts of

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the restoration that are
afforded to us as adherents of

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the of the restoration.
Well, Amen.

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And all of the Restoration
scriptures command us and

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encourage us to seek knowledge.
Well, what did Brigham Young

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say?
Show me a man who knows who's

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read nothing but the Bible and
the Book of Mormon, and I'll

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show you a man who knows nothing
but the Bible and the Book of

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Mormon.
Absolutely then.

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And then, of course, I was
having this discussion years

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ago.
I wanted to read the Christmas

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story from a new translation of
Luke 2.

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And I had and I had a
sister-in-law who was really

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upset by that.
I mean, she was hard line

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conservative, you know, Mormon.
And she was giving me a hard

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time.
My little brother shouted out a

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Bible of Bible.
We already have a Bible.

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Nice day.
Well, damn straight.

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Well played.
Well played.

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So I mean, so that's second
Nephi 29, which basically says

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we're going to have other
scriptures come forth and of all

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and of all people, Latter Day
Saints should be looking for

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that.
Now then there's Hugh Nibley,

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who said that First Enoch, the
Book of Enoch is what it's

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referred to, is a gift for the
Latter Day Saints.

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Yes.
And that was before all of the

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rest of this stuff has come out.
And then he said at one time,

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let's see, entire libraries are
coming forth, amazing and

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confounding Jewish and Christian
scholars alike, but bursting

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with good news for the Latter
Day Saints who ignore them

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completely.
And I, and I understand it.

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I get it.
Yep.

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I mean, absolutely.
It's enough to be well versed.

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It's enough of to be well versed
in the Old and the New

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Testaments.
But then as Latter Day Saints,

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we're expected to be equally
well versed in the Old

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Testament, New Testament and the
Book of Mormon and the Doctrine

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and Covenants and the Pearl of
great price.

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And now along comes Ken Peterson
and says, oh, hey, here's 66

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more for you to look at. 10s of
thousands of pages anyway, so.

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But we want more truth.
And Joseph Smith says a man can

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progress only as fast as he
gains knowledge, 100%.

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So as long as my brain will
function and help and remember

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all this stuff, and if I can
keep my ducks in a row, I'm

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going to keep plowing.
It might be the same stuff over

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and over again.
Just doesn't do it for me.

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If you're not moving forward,
you're moving backward.

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You ask me.
Absolutely.

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So I OK, so I got a question.
You got the three pictures of

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the you got the pictures up here
of the three books of Enoch.

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Correct.
So are are these all kind of the

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same book, right?
Can could we classify these as

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all the Ethiopian texts?
Like how are they different?

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Well.
You're a little bit ahead of the

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game, but I'll answer your
question.

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They are completely distinct
texts.

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They are not the same text at
all, OK?

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They are were discovered at
different times at different

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places and talk about different
aspects of Enoch and Enoch's

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ministry, OK.
And the reason they're, they're

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numbered sequentially like that,
if that's what in terms of the

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time they were discovered, first
Enoch was discovered or

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rediscovered first, second Enoch
after that, and 3rd Enoch was

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the last to be rediscovered.
So we're going to talk about all

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of that.
And I love your question, so

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keep pounding away, buddy.
And so I wanted to throw that up

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there initially.
So people know that when we talk

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about the Book of Enoch, we need
to distinguish which book

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because we now have 3 extensive
and large texts.

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And the good news is that the
all three of them could be

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purchased in the same volume.
This volume here, which we're

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going to read from, which is
like a ten 1000 pages.

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And and it's a highly scholarly
respected edition.

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So you don't have to buy
different ones.

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There are lots of different
translations.

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There's a newer one than what I
just showed you but but I'm

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getting ahead of myself so.
No, you're good.

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Let's talk about Enoch the man
first before we dive in here.

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Oh, look at that.
Never mind.

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We're going to go right there.
OK, let's.

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I'm just going to stop.
Ken's got this.

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Let's roll.
Enoch who?

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Right.
Who are we talking about in

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Genesis chapter 5?
It gives us the genealogy of

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those early patriarchs and this
is the chapter heading which

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throws it down really quickly.
Generations of Adam are Adam,

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Seth, Enos, Canaan, Mahalalel,
Jared, Enoch who walked with

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God, Methuselah, Lamech and
Noah.

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And then from Noah we get
Hamsheim, Japheth, the

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population of the earth.
So OFT times Enoch is referred

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to as the 7th from Adam.
So that's who that's who he is

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in terms of his ancestry and
where he fits relative to Adam

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and his posterity.
What is the big deal about

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Enoch?
The big deal is at least

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threefold #1 doctrinally.
These books of Enoch have

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everything to say.
It will blow your mind with

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this.
That will be dessert.

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We're just going to plow through
it.

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Or at least highlights for me
sequentially.

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Well, and I'm just going to go 2
places right now.

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And secondly, it has to do with
Joseph Smith in a very, very

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large way.
Because prior to Joseph Smith,

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the Christian world, what the
Christian world knew about Enoch

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is what we're looking at right
here.

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Enoch is mentioned in three
verses in the Holy Bible,

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period.
Any Christian today will tell

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you he was a minor prophet.
So now the Jewish tradition had

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the same thing, but they also
had some, what we call it Jewish

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traditions about Enoch that
we're not commonly known by

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everyone to be sure.
But amongst the more educated,

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Joseph Smith surprised him
immensely and to this day still

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does.
So keep in mind, this is what

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the Bible knows.
What Joseph Smith knows is going

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to occupy the next dozen slides
or so.

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OK.
So.

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So this is what the Bible in the
Christian world is.

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I just want to read this so
people who aren't watching can

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hear it.
Go ahead.

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So.
Genesis 522 through 25.

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Enoch walked with God after the
birth of Methuselah, 300 years,

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and had other sons and
daughters.

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Thus all the days of Enoch were
365 years.

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Enoch walk with God and he was
not before God took him, meaning

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that he was translated human is
right.

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But that even that's not common
knowledge.

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What does that mean right.
Enoch grew off God and God took

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him.
What does that mean?

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We so there's a massive
difference between the Christian

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view of Enoch and the and the
restoration view of Enoch.

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So that we've set the stage for
that.

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Then along comes not one, not 2,
but three different accounts of

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Enoch, all of them after Joseph
Smith's revelation on Enoch.

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OK.
I think you've talked about.

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00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:05,600
This.
So what is sets up with this?

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00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:09,440
Go ahead.
Would Joseph had had?

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00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:13,560
Would would Joseph have had any
access to these texts during his

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00:14:13,560 --> 00:14:16,360
ministry?
We'll talk about that more

230
00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,600
that's in in the process.
But that's the right question

231
00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,840
because we've now set up this
test of Joseph Smith, which is

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00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,160
just as great as test of the
book of Abraham stuff we talked

233
00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:30,960
about.
Do the three accounts, ancient

234
00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:36,240
authentic accounts relate to
what Joseph Smith gave us or

235
00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:39,960
not?
So it says marvelous test of the

236
00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,840
revelatory abilities of Joseph
Smith, the Prophet.

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00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:49,480
So let's review quickly now what
Joseph Smith told us and what he

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00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:53,400
told us about Enoch occupies the
book of Moses chapter 6 through

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00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:58,360
7, which was given to him 8
between 1830 and 1831.

240
00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:04,280
So we'd have the the timeline
and various sections of the

241
00:15:04,280 --> 00:15:07,080
Doctrine and Covenants also
mentioned Enoch.

242
00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:11,520
What the restored Church knows
about Enoch.

243
00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:13,880
Enoch holds a prominent place
and Latter Day Saints scripture

244
00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,400
and tradition as a prophet, seer
and builder of Zion.

245
00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:20,960
In Revelations to Joseph Smith,
much additional information is

246
00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:25,000
given about Enoch, his knowledge
of the sanctifying atonement of

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00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:26,720
Christ.
Let's pause.

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00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:32,920
Why is that strange?
Enoch lived.

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00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,600
Yeah, he, he's Genesis time,
right?

250
00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,280
Well, like he's at the very
beginning of things, right?

251
00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:44,160
He so he's preaching Christ.
Joseph Smith said that Enoch

252
00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:48,120
preached Christ three years
before Christ was born.

253
00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,680
What other Christian religion on
earth teaches such a crazy idea?

254
00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:56,800
Nobody.
The Restorationists know that

255
00:15:56,840 --> 00:16:02,560
Adam was the first Christian,
not Christ going on.

256
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:07,360
So let's see additional
information.

257
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:09,520
Joseph Smith gave us additional
information about Enoch, his

258
00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:13,200
knowledge of the atonement of
Christ, the visions he saw of

259
00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:18,000
the future of the world.
Apocalyptic stuff, the messages

260
00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:21,320
he proclaimed, the wickedness he
opposed, which we'll talk a lot

261
00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:25,560
about, the miracles he worked,
the priesthood ordinances he

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00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:30,080
performed, and the promises he
received from the pre mortal

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00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:34,200
Lord Jesus Christ.
That's all crazy talk to the

264
00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:36,280
rest of the world.
Absolutely.

265
00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,880
So Joseph Smith, so going
through Moses six and seven, the

266
00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:43,480
Doctrine Covenants, we're going
to identify these aspects, how

267
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,480
Enoch was called.
Enoch was born, and this is

268
00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:48,200
taken from the Encyclopedia of
Mormonism.

269
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,640
He was born in a land of
righteousness that they fled to

270
00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:53,160
because of the wickedness of the
people.

271
00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,400
An Enoch's father, who was
righteous, taught him in all.

272
00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,680
That's interesting.
Well, because we know that

273
00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:04,240
Christ did that right?
Suddenly.

274
00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:09,880
Suddenly, if we know and believe
that this Scripture was had

275
00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:14,920
amongst the ancient Jews, what
Christ did harkening back to

276
00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:19,960
what Enoch did would tie, and of
course it would cause Joseph.

277
00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:23,839
I could see, yeah, I could see
the rub, right?

278
00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:27,520
If you're the Pharisees and
you're watching the Savior apply

279
00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:31,680
the, you know, the, the, the
clay on the blind person's eyes,

280
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,600
you know exactly what he's
doing.

281
00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:39,040
And that's going to that is
going that's that's going to

282
00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,640
punch you where it hurts, right,
If you're the Pharisees.

283
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,280
So there's so much to this when
you see, and how it relates to

284
00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:47,120
the restored gospel as well as a
New Testament.

285
00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:51,080
All right, so Enoch anoints his
eyes with clay, he washes them.

286
00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:55,880
Whereupon he saw a vision of the
spirits that God created.

287
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,600
What premortal spirits?
Oh, here we go.

288
00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:02,600
And things which were not
visible to the natural eye.

289
00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:06,320
The word seer thus applies to
Enoch.

290
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,600
Enoch's preaching.
Enoch then went forth preaching

291
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:14,680
the hills in the high places,
ancient in the time of the

292
00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:17,800
patriarchs.
The righteous fled to the hills

293
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,840
of the high places, and the
wicked remained at the valleys

294
00:18:21,360 --> 00:18:22,800
where they did all this
debauchery.

295
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:27,680
But the people took offence and
considered him a wild man, as

296
00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:32,720
they did John the Baptist.
One man named Mahajah.

297
00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:40,680
And let's cover this ground now,
the Dead Sea Scrolls excerpts of

298
00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:43,040
the Book of Enoch, and we'll
talk much more about that.

299
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:47,240
A similar name, Mahuya Mahawi,
was found.

300
00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:51,280
So this seems like an extremely
lucky strike for Joseph Smith to

301
00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:52,760
have pulled Mahajah out of the
hat.

302
00:18:54,120 --> 00:18:57,560
And Mahajah would ask Enoch who
he was and where he came from.

303
00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:01,080
Enoch explained his vision of
heaven and his understanding of

304
00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:05,000
the fall of Adam also straight
up build his doctrine.

305
00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:06,680
I mean, this is where this comes
from for us.

306
00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:10,040
He taught how humans after the
fall had become carnal and

307
00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:14,040
devilish by worshiping Satan,
but how according to the plan of

308
00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,560
salvation, they may repent,
become sons of God through the

309
00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:20,840
blood of Jesus Christ, the only
begotten Son of the man of

310
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:24,440
holiness.
So here again, Joseph Smith is

311
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:29,040
doubling down.
Enoch was a Christian against

312
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,160
whatever all other Christian
faiths understand.

313
00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:35,360
So, so back up just a second.
That name, what was it?

314
00:19:35,360 --> 00:19:39,400
Mahajan.
Previous Mahajah.

315
00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:43,800
Thank you.
That name appears in the actual

316
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,080
Book of Enoch and then Joseph
Smith calls it out.

317
00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:53,200
But right presumed.
Now, and, and we're going to get

318
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:55,320
to this $10,000 question you're
alluding to.

319
00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,720
So then Moses, the book of Moses
teaches us that Enoch brought a

320
00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:04,920
larger body of converts to the
gospel of Jesus Christ, right?

321
00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,120
But his success did not come
without fierce opposition.

322
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:11,080
The enemies of the righteous
mobilized against them.

323
00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,320
The scriptural account describes
miracles of extraordinary power.

324
00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:17,720
By Enoch's words, the earth
trembled and the mountains fled,

325
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,200
and the rivers of water were
turned out of their course,

326
00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:24,280
stricken by fear.
Now why would he have to resort

327
00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:29,080
to such incredible means of
protecting his people by moving

328
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,280
mountains and changing the
courses of rivers?

329
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,960
Because Enoch's enemies were not
just people, they were the

330
00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:38,280
giants of the land that stood
afar off.

331
00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:42,080
Now these giants were not the
same as Goliath.

332
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,640
Goliath was well after the flood
of Noah, which destroyed all the

333
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:49,440
wicked, including the giants of
Enoch's day.

334
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,960
We'll talk way more about that,
but suffice to say, at this

335
00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:56,800
point, the only way Enoch could
protect his people from these

336
00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:00,920
giants was to move mountains and
change its course of rivers,

337
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:03,840
which struck fear in the heart
of these incredible giants.

338
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,440
And that's how he was able to
protect his people.

339
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:11,520
Are we going to talk a little
later about who these giants

340
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,720
were?
Yeah, in great detail.

341
00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:17,120
OK, I'll, I'll more.
Detail than anybody's heard or

342
00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:18,960
thought of, probably.
All right.

343
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:23,200
And so and the enemies and the
and the giants of the land stood

344
00:21:23,360 --> 00:21:27,400
far off, and the Lord came and
dwelt with his people, the city

345
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,080
of Enoch, and they dwelt in
righteousness.

346
00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:33,960
So Joseph Smith called all of
this out.

347
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:35,440
This is all from the book of
Moses.

348
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,520
Then it taught then that Moses
teaches about the city of Enoch.

349
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,720
The spiritual unity of Enoch's
people took on physical

350
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:46,640
dimensions to the construction
of the city that was called the

351
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,480
city of holiness, even Zion.
Their lives are based on the

352
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,080
order of him who was without
beginning of days or end of

353
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:57,520
years, the holy priesthood,
after the order of the Son of

354
00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:02,560
God and after the order of the
covenant which God made with

355
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:04,360
Enoch.
Same order.

356
00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:07,400
And that's from the Joseph Smith
translation.

357
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,080
And of course, which is going to
look a lot like the book of

358
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,360
Moses because that's where the
book of Moses came from.

359
00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:15,680
Joseph's work on the Joseph
Smith translation.

360
00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,680
This unique community matured
over a period of 365 years,

361
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:27,480
after which it was received up
into heaven, fulfilling his

362
00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:29,440
covenant to preserve.
I wish somebody were keeping a

363
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:31,240
tab.
I should have tallied how many

364
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:36,600
of these unique and incredibly
bold teachings regarding this

365
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,200
unknown prophet, this minor
prophet, how many of them he's,

366
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:45,040
he's given us and left behind
Enoch, son Methuselah and

367
00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:48,800
grandson Lamech.
Lamech's son was Noah, and they

368
00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:50,600
were left behind so the earth
could be redeemed.

369
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:54,240
Born four years after the city
Enoch, The city of Enoch was

370
00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:59,720
taken into heaven.
Then we have a council Phoenix

371
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:04,040
visions.
Through Joseph Smith, Enoch was

372
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:05,600
shown all the inhabitants of the
earth.

373
00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,760
This is what is commonly known
as the vision of all.

374
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:11,600
He was shown the vision of
everything.

375
00:23:12,360 --> 00:23:14,120
Who else has had that vision
that we know of?

376
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,480
Moses.
Well, Yep, I was going to say

377
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:20,680
Moses was shown it I.
Mahan Ryan Maury Ankimer,

378
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:23,560
Brother of Jared.
Yeah.

379
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:29,560
Joseph Smith A. 100%.
Beyond that, I'm drawing a

380
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,600
blank, but at least those three,
right?

381
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:37,720
Who was the first?
Yes, who was the first would

382
00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:40,560
have received that?
Wouldn't have been Adam.

383
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,720
Sorry, what did you say?
We don't know that he'd

384
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:44,560
perceived that or not.
OK, all right.

385
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,000
I could have.
OK, so.

386
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,560
Far as the sacred documents
concerned, Enoch's it Enoch is

387
00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:57,080
the first and the only up to
this point in time to have

388
00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:59,680
received this vision of all to
show you how extraordinary

389
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:04,160
person he was in this panoramic,
panoramic revelation.

390
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:06,880
He witnessed the wickedness and
violence in the days of Noah.

391
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:12,720
He saw Satan laughing with great
with a great chain in his hand,

392
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:17,880
saw the Lord weeping over his
creations, for mankind had

393
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:21,560
rejected, for mankind had
rejected God and become without

394
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:23,680
affection.
Enoch saw the atoning sacrifice

395
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:28,120
of Jesus Christ.
Enoch himself wept and received

396
00:24:28,120 --> 00:24:30,720
a promise that a remnant of his
seed should always be found

397
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,920
among all nations.
Is that fulfilled?

398
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,680
Most certainly.
Finally he saw the joyous

399
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:41,000
reunion of his city, city of
Enoch, with a latter day Zion

400
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,080
built in anticipation of Jesus
second coming.

401
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,880
So he seized the Enoch.
He had the vision of all

402
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,960
according to Joseph Smith.
According to Joseph Smith, he

403
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:57,840
also had priesthood described in
several passages, and here we

404
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:01,720
have so Enoch is mentioned in
our Doctrine and Covenants,

405
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:10,680
sections 7684 and one of seven.
He was ordained at age 25 under

406
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,760
the hand of Adam himself before
his father's.

407
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:18,280
His priesthood was after the
holiest order of God, holding

408
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,720
the key of the mysteries of the
Kingdom, which means the the

409
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:25,040
highest ordinances.
Even the key of the knowledge of

410
00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:27,440
God he had received had been
endowed and made those

411
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:29,800
covenants.
The Scriptures confirmed that

412
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:34,560
Enoch saw the Lord and walked
with him and was before his face

413
00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:40,800
continually indicative of
Enoch's eternal priesthood

414
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:42,720
station.
Heirs of the Celestial Kingdom

415
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,280
are described as priests of the
Most High after the order of

416
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:52,360
Melchizedek, which was after the
order of Enoch, which was after

417
00:25:52,360 --> 00:25:54,240
the order of the whole Oly
begotten Son.

418
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:57,920
So it's all the same order, the
holy priest, and after the order

419
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,400
of the sun God.
And that's all.

420
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:04,800
You find that in Encyclopedia of
Mormonism.

421
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:10,440
So if Joseph Smith was simply
restoring all of this stuff, and

422
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,160
let's just make a grand
assumption for the sake of

423
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,520
discussion that all of this
stuff was known before Joseph

424
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:21,400
Smith, why didn't anybody at
Joseph Smith today know anything

425
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:26,920
about any of that?
Well, I can think of a couple

426
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:28,840
reasons and you can correct me
if I'm wrong here.

427
00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:35,760
One, most people hadn't seen the
text and the text, and

428
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:39,040
especially in an American
context, it was not available

429
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,800
with an English translation, to
my understanding.

430
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:54,000
Right, which we'll get to 2nd.
2nd is that along with that the

431
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,760
the the the one if I'm not
mistaken, wasn't Enoch in the

432
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:03,400
Vulgate at one point?
No, no, no.

433
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:08,680
But I so here's what happened
right at one time, we now know

434
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:13,320
at one time they had these
records and this is Encyclopedia

435
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,760
Mormonism again.
The it's called the exit of

436
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:18,800
Enoch.
Despite the fact that the author

437
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:24,200
of Jude in the New Testament in
verse 9 quotes for his Enoch.

438
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:29,000
He quoted from Enoch.
So as the Bible quotes from

439
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,240
texts that we don't have, which
it also give heart to Latter Day

440
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,400
Saints who don't believe that
the the Canon is closed.

441
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:42,840
It never was, never will be.
Anyway, despite the fact that

442
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:47,000
the author of Jude quoted from
First Enoch as prophecy and that

443
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:52,680
the Ethiopian Christian Church,
they have canonized First Enoch.

444
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:55,720
That's part of their scripture
and they were some of the

445
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:58,160
earliest Christians after
Christ.

446
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:03,600
They canonized Enoch.
In fact, First Enoch or the Book

447
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:08,320
of Enoch was at 1st called
Ethiopian Enoch because that's

448
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:11,080
where it was rediscovered.
And we'll talk more about that.

449
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:17,120
So despite all that, the Books
of Enoch fell out of favor in

450
00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:21,400
mainstream Judaism and
Christianity because in about

451
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:27,680
8200, they compiled the Mishnah
by Rabbi Judah around 8200.

452
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:33,160
And the tendency to den, which
had the tendency to denigrate or

453
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,440
to talk down apocalypticism, the
apocalypse, the end of the

454
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:39,720
world.
First, Enoch is apocalyptic

455
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,560
because remember, Enoch had the
vision of the end of the world

456
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:49,360
#1 so Enoch fell out of favor
for that reason because it was

457
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:58,040
denigrated by in the year 200 CE
or AD by this official Jewish

458
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,000
rabbi.
Then with the closing of the

459
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:06,200
Christian Canon around the 4th
century, they decided and, and

460
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,000
I'm, I'm not the guy who wants
to come down on these early

461
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:13,040
church fathers who were trying
to decide which of these

462
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:17,320
so-called scriptural texts were
valid and which were not.

463
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:22,000
Because there were spurious
documents and they were doing

464
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,520
the right thing trying to
determine which ones are valid

465
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:28,320
and which ones were not.
Of course they didn't have the

466
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:30,120
whole story.
So you know what, what could

467
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:32,760
they do?
They did the best they could in

468
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,880
that process.
They closed the Canon and they

469
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:41,960
excluded the Book of Enoch.
What I've heard the reason it

470
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,720
was excluded.
The New Testament is arranged

471
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:47,560
like this.
You have the four gospels,

472
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:52,600
followed by the Acts of the
Apostles, followed by the

473
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:56,520
epistles.
The epistles arranged by length.

474
00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,240
The longest ones are first, the
shortest ones are last, those

475
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:02,480
very short ones at the end.
And Hebrews.

476
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:04,560
I don't know why it's thrown in
there for whatever reason.

477
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:09,600
And then the last book of the
New Testament is the apocalyptic

478
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,920
book, the book about the end of
the world, the Book of

479
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:15,440
Revelation.
When they were determining which

480
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:18,720
apocalyptic book they wanted at
the end, apparently First Enoch

481
00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,680
was being considered alongside
the Book of Revelation.

482
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:29,600
But of course, you can only have
one apocalyptic book, right?

483
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:34,080
So they settled on Revelation.
That I don't have a problem with

484
00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,360
that.
Rejecting Enoch.

485
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:43,480
So Enoch went into the discard
pile, they closed the Canon, and

486
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,120
as a result of the emergence of
the Holy Roman Empire in the 4th

487
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:50,640
century, the Books of Enoch were
branded from that time forth as

488
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,240
extra canonical outside of the
Canon.

489
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:59,560
And the veneration once given to
the wise scribe Enoch was

490
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:04,560
transferred to or reserved for
Jesus Christ.

491
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:10,320
Because Enoch, as Moses and
others, was a Christ figure, a

492
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:14,400
prefigurement of Christ.
So they fell into disrepute.

493
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:20,120
The remaining copies were lost
or destroyed and were not

494
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:28,360
discovered again until the 1700s
In in in their full length,

495
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:33,320
which we'll talk about.
Where were OK, what we'll talk

496
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:34,160
about later.
All right?

497
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,480
Yep.
Let's talk about the larger

498
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:41,880
context now of these extra
canonical writings as of this

499
00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:49,280
day, As of today, by my count,
there are currently over 400

500
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:58,440
extra canonical texts.
They dwarf the Canon of those

501
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,640
400.
I have read almost all of them.

502
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,240
Some of them are so new that I'm
still working my way through

503
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,280
that.
When my book Mormon Doctrine in

504
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:11,680
the Apocrypha was published in
2021, five years ago there were

505
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:18,680
354 extra canonical texts that I
had read and studied and

506
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:20,840
considered for inclusion into my
reference book.

507
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:28,080
In the past five years, another
40 or around 40, have been

508
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,080
published in English.
New one past five years.

509
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:35,440
In the past five years, yeah,
that's I think 3 or 4 brand new

510
00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:37,720
volumes.
I mean when you say.

511
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:39,520
Volume of those.
I'm in.

512
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:43,880
I'm reading them now.
Here's the one I'm working my

513
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,760
way through.
If I don't New Testament

514
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:53,760
Apocrypha volume 2, and then
there's another volume after

515
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:55,560
that that I'm working my way
through.

516
00:32:55,640 --> 00:33:01,760
Yeah.
And another volume of Old

517
00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:05,840
Testament pseudepigrapha.
So 3.

518
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:07,360
And I mean, and these are big
fat volumes.

519
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,000
And you can see I'm working my
way through.

520
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:11,920
Oh, yeah.
So then the question is, are you

521
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:15,160
finding can, are you finding
corollaries as well on these new

522
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,160
ones?
Unquestionably.

523
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,360
And the reason I'm working my
through my way through it,

524
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:24,880
because it's fascinating #1 #2
I'm going to have to make a

525
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:30,480
second edition of my because of
this new new body of literature.

526
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:34,080
So including these new things
published in the last five

527
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:39,160
years, there are now over 400
extra canonical texts.

528
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:47,360
Of those, 400, in Ken Peterson's
opinion, 100 of those texts have

529
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:54,200
significant correlations with
Mormon teachings. 66 I've

530
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:58,360
documented in my book.
An additional 30 or 40, I won't

531
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:02,440
know until I'm done, will be
added to that body of

532
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:09,600
correlating scriptures.
So yeah, I in my by my count, I

533
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:14,080
discovered 179 distinct LDS
teachings in 66 of these ancient

534
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:17,040
texts, and there will
undoubtedly be more with the

535
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,480
second edition if I finish it
before Jesus comes.

536
00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:24,120
If.
I'm working on it.

537
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:30,360
Given the state of affairs, it
could be tomorrow.

538
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:34,440
I mean like, doubt it, but it
could be tomorrow.

539
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:37,960
No, Dave, we unless the two
prophets have been secretly

540
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,440
prophesying in Jerusalem, which
is Yeah, no.

541
00:34:41,639 --> 00:34:48,679
Now listen, brother, if come
October 2, crazy prophets who

542
00:34:48,679 --> 00:34:52,760
can't be killed start
prophesying in Jerusalem. 3 1/2

543
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:54,840
years. 3 1/2 years.
Oh, we'll see.

544
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,000
We'll see.
That's go time.

545
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:01,920
That's go time there.
There will be an announcement.

546
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:07,040
It's go time.
So among all of these 400 extra

547
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,280
canonical texts, and I mean
books, big books, some of them

548
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:14,520
are like hundreds of pages.
Among these texts are three

549
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:18,560
separate books of Enoch.
First Enoch, formerly known as

550
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,080
Ethiopian Enoch.
Second, Enoch, so also referred

551
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,200
to as Slavonic.
It has a reference to the the

552
00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:26,880
text that was discovered.
Third, Enoch is referred to as

553
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,920
Hebrew Enoch.
They are distinct from one

554
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,560
another in content and in
Providence, meaning where and

555
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,560
how they were discovered.
They are not the same books at

556
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:39,360
all.
They're.

557
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:41,880
Going to similar accounts like
not.

558
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:44,080
Really, there's not a lot of
overlap.

559
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:46,400
They're they do have some
commonality, of course, because

560
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,040
they're talking about the same
person, but they're talking

561
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:53,200
about different aspects of it.
Enoch was about Enoch's life,

562
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:57,560
what he experienced.
Second, Enoch has to do more

563
00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:01,120
about the process of his
translation.

564
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:04,600
It is mind blowing.
OK.

565
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:08,320
Third, Enoch talks about what
Enoch does after he was

566
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:14,080
translated and after he was
resurrected, what he's doing

567
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:15,280
now.
OK, all right.

568
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:18,800
So, so as opposed to the Gospel?
Yeah.

569
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:23,360
So as opposed to the Gospels,
which tend to talk about the

570
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:25,960
same events from a different
viewpoint, right.

571
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:27,600
That's essentially what the
Gospels are.

572
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:32,680
This seems to be 1 narrative
telling different parts of

573
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:35,280
Enoch's life.
So it's not a retelling.

574
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,200
It's not a retelling from a
different point of view.

575
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:42,240
This is obviously the.
These three texts work together

576
00:36:42,240 --> 00:36:44,080
to form a whole.
Right.

577
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:45,800
Think.
Think of it as a trilogy.

578
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:50,120
Yep and that.
And there's sequels of Enoch 1.

579
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:54,520
So why do?
Why should Mormons even care

580
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:58,000
about these books?
Just to give you an idea how

581
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:02,480
they correlate with our belief
system, I have listed here how

582
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:06,960
many times I have referenced
these texts in my book.

583
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:12,520
Meaning for example, first Enoch
is referenced 24 times in Mormon

584
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:15,600
doctrine.
In the Apocrypha, that means in

585
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:21,560
first Enoch I found 24 doctrinal
correlations with what we

586
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,400
believe.
Second Enoch is referenced 48

587
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,560
times in my book.
Wow.

588
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,840
Third Enoch is referenced 29
times.

589
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:40,080
So I said that I found 179
teachings that have been

590
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:42,480
attested in these ancient texts,
but they've been attested

591
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,360
multiple times by these texts.
So there are, and I haven't

592
00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:50,720
counted them up, but thousands
of attestations amongst these

593
00:37:50,720 --> 00:37:54,840
documents.
More than just a one off.

594
00:37:55,840 --> 00:38:01,880
Right, attested multiple times,
most of them of these 100 or so

595
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:03,560
extra.
So talk about the law of

596
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:06,360
witnesses, right?
So these doctrines, these

597
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:08,720
teachings that the Latter Day
Saints believe have been

598
00:38:08,720 --> 00:38:13,200
attested, I mean in some cases
pages and pages, scores of

599
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:17,320
attestation of these 100 or so
extra canonical texts that

600
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:21,840
correlate with Mormon teachings,
all of them were discovered and

601
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:25,360
translated into English well
after the life of Joseph Smith.

602
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:33,360
The one and only possible
exception to this is First Enoch

603
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,560
Ethiopian, which was first
translated into into the English

604
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:45,880
language in England in 1821.
So here comes the.

605
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:47,040
Text What year?
What?

606
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,280
What year, What year was, did,
did Joseph?

607
00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:57,160
Book of Moses, 18301831 So
here's Here's what's fun.

608
00:38:57,720 --> 00:39:01,880
Here's the question Did Joseph
plagiarize First Enoch?

609
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,080
The people who are desperate to
explain away the hundreds of

610
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:13,360
Joseph Smith's miraculous
doctrinal bull's eyes are

611
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:18,400
desperate to claim that Joseph
Smith somehow had access to 1st

612
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:24,800
Enoch before 1830, from which he
lifted all of these teachings.

613
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:32,440
Here's my response.
My first response is this

614
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,680
argument in and of itself that
they're trying to make against

615
00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:41,520
Joseph isn't a bald faced
admission of the miraculous

616
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:43,320
nature of Joseph Smith's
teachings.

617
00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:49,160
The fact that people are trying
to find some secret spring of

618
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:54,840
how of these miraculous
doctrines is an admission that

619
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:58,400
they are miraculous.
That Joseph Smith couldn't have.

620
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:01,920
He couldn't possibly have come
up with all these bull's eyes by

621
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:03,840
himself.
He had to have cheated somehow.

622
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,200
Now, to their credit, they're go
ahead.

623
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:15,640
Look, even if it was in America,
I don't know if we have

624
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:17,240
reference if it was in America
yet.

625
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:18,560
Oh, we're going to talk about
that.

626
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:23,560
OK.
Even if it was in America, I'm

627
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:27,760
guessing in 1830 or 31, that's
early in the Joseph's ministry,

628
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:29,040
right?
Yeah.

629
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:32,160
He's going to have a little bit
of a rough time trying to make

630
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,640
his way through that.
You can see the prophets, you

631
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:40,640
can see the prophets ascension,
so to speak, in terms of of not

632
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:45,120
only his growing ability to
receive revelation, complex

633
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,160
theological ideas and
principles.

634
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:51,480
You see that over time that is
not something that Joseph gets

635
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:57,280
all at once, right.
And so even if it was available

636
00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:01,400
in the States, I have a very
hard time then coming up with,

637
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:06,600
OK, if it's 1821, then let's
say, you know, I'm, I'm just

638
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:09,720
imagining there's not a lot of
churches that are requesting the

639
00:41:09,720 --> 00:41:12,360
Book of Enoch for their
congregants, right?

640
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:14,760
A lot of that, damn it is
heresy.

641
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:17,920
Yes.
So then then you're down to

642
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:24,520
three, you know, maybe dozens of
of eclectic individuals who are

643
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:28,040
just out to collect it.
Then it somehow has to make its

644
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:32,920
way to Western New York, and
then it has to make its way to a

645
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:36,920
poor farm boy who, quite
frankly, his family doesn't have

646
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:41,120
two pennies to rub together, and
he's going to acquire that.

647
00:41:41,720 --> 00:41:45,920
Then he's going to go ahead,
stash it, and then go ahead and

648
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:48,400
start the plagiarism process.
Yeah.

649
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:52,760
Just just watching like
logically follow that out, it

650
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:56,120
brings every step of the way.
But how else could he possibly

651
00:41:56,120 --> 00:42:01,080
have done that, Dave, Unless he
was telling the unless he was

652
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:03,840
telling the truth, right?
Right.

653
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:08,520
Now, here's the thing.
As you say, the Restoration

654
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:12,640
expanded line upon line.
On the one hand, I agree with

655
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:17,120
you.
On the other hand, by 1831, the

656
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:21,040
Book of Mormon and the Book of
Moses have been published.

657
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:28,480
There are two significant
problems with that accusation

658
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:36,000
against Joseph Smith #1 Of the
179 LDS teachings I found in 66

659
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:40,400
of the extraconic canonical
texts, only a small percentage

660
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:42,640
correlate with First Enoch
alone.

661
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:47,280
So even if, for the sake of
argument, that Joseph Smith

662
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:57,280
secretly had First Enoch, it
accounts for one percent, 2% of

663
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,840
the restored doctrines, 2%.
That's it.

664
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:06,480
Even if that were true, even if
we're true, however #2 even, as

665
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:10,440
we shall see, as and as you
pointed out, it's a stretch, to

666
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:14,440
say the least, that Joseph had
any access to an English

667
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:16,840
translation of First Enoch
before 1830.

668
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:19,160
There was a knowledge of its
existence.

669
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,360
But the very first English
translation in its entirety was

670
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:29,560
1821 in England.
Now this is interesting.

671
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:34,280
There was a master's student
desperate to prove this point

672
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,240
that Joseph cheated and
plagiarized.

673
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:45,680
And then notorious ex Mormon
Michael Quinn, who is now dead,

674
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:50,760
who a very respectable scholar
and has done some wonderful

675
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:55,800
significant works.
And to his credit, he was

676
00:43:55,800 --> 00:44:01,960
excommunicated.
He came out of the closet, Even

677
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:06,280
so was a true believer right
until the point of his right, up

678
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:09,720
until he died, even though he'd
come out of the closet and had

679
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:12,280
been excommunicated, he believed
that it was divine.

680
00:44:13,240 --> 00:44:16,240
He believed in the Restoration,
and people forget that.

681
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:22,360
So Michael Quinn noted that
Lawrence's Lawrence was the

682
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:28,360
translator in 1821 in England.
Lawrence's Book of Enoch had

683
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:35,080
another printing in 1828.
Michael Quinn says only one copy

684
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:40,600
of the 1828 imprint now
survives, and it is in the New

685
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:44,000
York Public Library, according
to his source.

686
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:49,280
So the contention is that First
Enoch was available in the

687
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:52,400
Public Library in New York City
in 1828.

688
00:44:54,720 --> 00:44:59,240
Now what I'm quoting here is
from a guy named Colby Townsend,

689
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,040
who's a contemporary of you and
I.

690
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:06,680
He's a non latter day St.
But he has taken up this cause

691
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:11,920
of trying to prove that Joseph
Smith did was clearly, he

692
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:16,240
acknowledges that what Joseph
Smith did was extraordinary, but

693
00:45:16,240 --> 00:45:21,640
he, his faith will not allow or
his lack of faith will not allow

694
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:23,880
him to believe that Joseph Smith
had divine help.

695
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:29,440
So he's, he's beating the same
drum that Joseph Smith cheated.

696
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:37,120
So he's investigating this.
And this is from the dialogue

697
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,840
journal, Doc from the Mormon
Dialogue Journal.

698
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:46,000
They published him because I
mean, it was unbiased research

699
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,280
that he was giving us.
I can no longer say that he's

700
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:53,520
unbiased.
He's doing gradual work now, and

701
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:58,200
I have directly and indirectly
crossed paths with him and

702
00:45:58,200 --> 00:46:00,280
refuted some of what he said on
Facebook.

703
00:46:02,240 --> 00:46:06,120
His knowledge is incomplete, but
it is interesting.

704
00:46:06,720 --> 00:46:11,720
So here's what he discovered
about that erroneous 1828

705
00:46:11,720 --> 00:46:15,840
printing.
He says 1 might expect to be

706
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:19,800
able to locate this copy in the
New York Public Library, he

707
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:25,280
says, but it does not exist.
The Manuscripts, Archives and

708
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:30,360
Rare Books Division does not
have any record of ever having

709
00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:33,120
an 1828 printing of Lawrence's
Book of Enoch.

710
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:39,600
Nor is it the case that the New
York Public Library ever had a

711
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:43,560
copy of an 1828 printing of the
Book of Eating Book of Enoch and

712
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:47,560
then later removed it from their
holdings because a catalog

713
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:51,120
published in 1928 by the library
specifically listed their

714
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:55,520
holdings in Ethiopic and Amerik
up to that year.

715
00:46:55,960 --> 00:47:00,760
In this catalog there are two
entries on page 42 about the

716
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:07,160
Book of Enoch that were printed
in 18381 was in the original

717
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:10,120
Ethiopia and the other was in
English.

718
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:16,800
The National Union Catalog only
lists one version of the 1838

719
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:19,240
the English edition of the Book
of Enoch.

720
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:23,440
It is possible that the second
Ethiopic edition of Lawrence's

721
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:29,000
Book of Enoch was mistakenly
marked as the 1828 entry in the

722
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:32,840
catalog, because there is no
evidence that an 1828 printing

723
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,240
ever existed outside of the
catalog itself.

724
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:42,600
Unfortunately, Quinn's discovery
only leads to a dead end, so

725
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:44,680
they're out of.
They're out of options.

726
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:46,840
They're out of.
Options, right?

727
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:49,760
So the assumption is that, aha,
there was an 1828 edition there,

728
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:55,720
that that edition is fiction.
It's actually an 1838 edition.

729
00:47:55,720 --> 00:47:59,520
There is no record even in
England, of an 1828 printing.

730
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:04,560
There's an 1821 printing and an
1838 printing, and there is no

731
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:07,520
evidence of any of those copies
anywhere in the United States

732
00:48:08,200 --> 00:48:13,080
until 1838.
Which is 7 years after Moses is

733
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,200
out too late.
Yeah, too late.

734
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:21,360
So that's got to drive a guy
like that nuts though, right?

735
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:24,440
I mean, like, that's got to
drive a guy nuts like that, that

736
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:27,200
wants to disprove it, thinks
he's got him and then done.

737
00:48:28,360 --> 00:48:30,680
But here's here's the
interesting thing, And I it's

738
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:36,640
kind of a a litmus test of a
person's face.

739
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:41,280
Is it easier to believe that
Joseph Smith was telling the

740
00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:45,840
truth or that he had some secret
access?

741
00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:52,680
And he would have had to have
secret access to, oh, gosh, the

742
00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:59,520
Book of Enoch, the Pista Sophia,
I mean, to get those an ancient

743
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:06,000
Egyptian texts that would give
us some detail of those temple

744
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:08,560
rites.
Oh, and then he would have had

745
00:49:08,560 --> 00:49:12,000
to have some ancient secret
access to the annals of the

746
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:15,960
ancient Americans and everything
that they did, since he was 97%

747
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:20,200
correct thus far regarding their
anthropology and archaeology.

748
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:26,520
And it goes on and on.
And at a certain point, see, I,

749
00:49:26,520 --> 00:49:32,160
I, let me finish.
I, I can, I sympathize.

750
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:35,280
No, I empathize with Colby
Townsend and others because

751
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:38,200
that's how my brain works.
Certainly there has to be a

752
00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:42,440
conventional explanation of how
he did this, but at a certain

753
00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:49,200
point, the evidence in favor of
his divine claims becomes so

754
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:54,000
overwhelming that even a
doubting Thomas like Ken

755
00:49:54,000 --> 00:50:00,080
Peterson has to believe.
And I can't deny it.

756
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:01,480
And it's it's still boggles my
mind.

757
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:03,480
It's very interesting, you were
going to say.

758
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:08,400
You know, as as a convert to
Mormonism, like I was a

759
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:10,960
reluctant Mormon at the
beginning, right?

760
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:14,040
Those people are weird.
I don't want to do this.

761
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:20,760
But when you start stacking
evidence right time after time

762
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:27,520
after time, and this is my big
critique, I guess of of some

763
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:32,720
scholarship is that when they're
out of options, they don't even

764
00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:36,240
say I don't know, right?
I can, I can accept, I don't

765
00:50:36,240 --> 00:50:42,240
know, it's OK, right?
But they do the one thing that

766
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:49,480
scholars say you shouldn't do,
which is they begin to put

767
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:54,640
together kind of, for lack of a
better term, half assed

768
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:57,560
theories, right?
They're like, well, maybe he got

769
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:01,480
it from somewhere, right?
Instead of, you know, Occam's

770
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:03,840
razor.
The simplest answer is probably.

771
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:05,280
The right one.
Right.

772
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:08,560
And I know it's painful, and I
know it's got to stink for the

773
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,280
critics, but at some point,
when's it enough?

774
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:14,600
The funny thing is, though,
right at what?

775
00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:17,760
For some critics.
For some critics, Occam's Razor

776
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:20,920
doesn't stink and they joyfully
become converted.

777
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:23,640
That has happened.
Right.

778
00:51:24,120 --> 00:51:26,600
To many people do you and I for
example, right.

779
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:33,320
And so I and I, you know, and I
have read accounts of people who

780
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:38,600
say, well, eventually we'll find
the record that explains how he

781
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:41,120
did that.
And they're not mean people.

782
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:43,840
They're not bad people.
It's just, it's like this litmus

783
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:48,520
test of are they prone to be
able to believe in God and

784
00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:52,480
divine beings and divine purpose
or I mean, it's very interesting

785
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:58,280
to me how that happens.
So these books of Enoch, these

786
00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:01,560
extra canonical texts fall into
a couple of different

787
00:52:01,560 --> 00:52:04,480
categories.
Some of them are called New

788
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:09,120
Testament apocrypha.
So they're ancient texts that

789
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:11,800
are relative to the New
Testament that are not in the

790
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:18,720
New Testament.
Pseudepigrapha are non canonical

791
00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:22,040
extra canonical texts that have
to do with the Old Testament

792
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:27,400
peoples and Old Testament times.
The books of Enoch fall into

793
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:29,040
this category.
Pseudepigrapha.

794
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,720
A lot of people make have a
mistaken assumption about what

795
00:52:33,720 --> 00:52:37,360
pseudepigraphy is.
So from Wikipedia,

796
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:42,840
pseudepigraphy covers the false
ascription of names of authors

797
00:52:42,840 --> 00:52:46,600
to works.
Here's A and so they stop right

798
00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:49,160
there.
Oh, it's called the Book of

799
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:51,760
Enoch, but it really isn't
because it's pseudepigrapha.

800
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:55,280
Because Enoch didn't write this.
But they they don't read the

801
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:59,600
rest of the definition, even to
authentic works that make no

802
00:52:59,600 --> 00:53:02,720
such claim within their text.
Thus, A widely accepted but

803
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:06,680
incorrect attribution of
authorship may make a completely

804
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:09,840
authentic text pseudepigrapho
pseudepigraphical.

805
00:53:10,720 --> 00:53:18,200
Which is to say, we know that
even the most ancient manuscript

806
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:23,520
of first Enoch that we have does
not coincide with Enoch's

807
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:27,720
lifetime.
It's not the text that Enoch

808
00:53:27,720 --> 00:53:32,160
himself wrote.
The word for that is UR text.

809
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:35,400
The UR text is the original
document.

810
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:39,560
So the document that do we do
have, we'll talk more about that

811
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:44,880
which is very ancient, is not
the UR text.

812
00:53:45,240 --> 00:53:48,640
And because it's not the
original document and we know

813
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:52,000
it's not the same age as Enoch,
it can't be the one that he

814
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:55,680
wrote.
So we call it pseudepigrapha.

815
00:53:57,000 --> 00:54:01,800
So in the same sense that your
copy of the book of Matthew is

816
00:54:01,800 --> 00:54:05,880
pseudepigraphic because the one
you have, he didn't write it.

817
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:10,040
So in other words,
pseudepigrapher are not

818
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,400
necessarily false works which
some people make.

819
00:54:13,240 --> 00:54:15,600
There are, I have to tell you,
there are people in this world

820
00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:19,640
who love to jump to the
conclusions that all of these

821
00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:23,120
extra canonical writings should
be thrown out of the window

822
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:26,040
because they're not true when
they're irrelevant.

823
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:31,720
It's this litmus test again, the
people who are more comfortable

824
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:35,880
throwing them out the window
than examining them at all.

825
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:45,360
I have a dear friend who's a
pastor and a member of his

826
00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:50,640
congregation was formerly A
Latter Day St. from Las Vegas

827
00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:58,160
and he left the church and lived
this sinful, riotous life and

828
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:01,520
found Jesus again through
evangelical Christianity.

829
00:55:02,320 --> 00:55:07,680
Then he stumbles across my book,
which if the the over and under

830
00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:10,040
of my book is that it's evidence
that Joel Smith was telling the

831
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:11,520
truth.
I mean, period.

832
00:55:13,240 --> 00:55:15,600
In any case, he tells this
pastor friend of mine, he says,

833
00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:18,200
I'd like to meet the author.
And my pastor says, oh, I know

834
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:22,560
that guy.
So we set up a meeting, I take

835
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:25,320
time out of my busy schedule and
I sit down with this guy for an

836
00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:30,680
hour or so who had read my book,
who was an ex Mormon, only to

837
00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:34,240
find out that all he want now I
was expecting an exciting

838
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:36,920
fruitful conversation.
You know like we have.

839
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:42,440
What this guy said wanted to
visit with me about was to to my

840
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:47,640
face discount my life's work so
that he can feel better about

841
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:50,480
his life's choices.
Oh geez.

842
00:55:53,120 --> 00:55:56,320
I'm not an angry person and
that's one of the few times in

843
00:55:56,320 --> 00:56:02,200
my life I became quite angry.
She could have put that in an

844
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:04,440
e-mail.
Well, what?

845
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:10,000
I said, I said, wait a minute,
are you telling me that you

846
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:12,640
wanted to sit down with the
author of this book so you could

847
00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:15,600
discredit, try and discredit the
whole book to his face?

848
00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:20,560
I said, and usually what I
bring, I mean, everybody knows

849
00:56:20,560 --> 00:56:21,760
that Dead Sea Scrolls are
authentic.

850
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:25,040
We found them in situ.
We know what they are.

851
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:27,560
We know where they came from.
We know who wrote them for the

852
00:56:27,560 --> 00:56:29,880
most part.
I said, so you're telling me you

853
00:56:29,880 --> 00:56:32,480
discount the Dead Sea Scrolls?
And he started Hemming in high

854
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:35,440
is the what about all the
anachronisms of the Book of

855
00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:37,360
Mormon?
I said, dude, your archaeology

856
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:42,480
is 50 years late, right?
He said, bottom line, 97% of the

857
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:44,600
Book of Mormon has been
authenticated in terms of its

858
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:46,520
archaeological and
anthropological claims.

859
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:50,560
You need to catch up.
And I I let him have it and I

860
00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:54,520
was mad for a week.
Anyway, blame you.

861
00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:58,080
Anyway, so that's the idea.
Some people are just they they

862
00:56:58,080 --> 00:57:03,400
want to cast it aside because
they can't conscience the fact

863
00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:08,000
that it might be true anyway.
Indeed, most of the theological.

864
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:11,720
Stakes are massive, right?
I mean, look, Oh, yeah, this is

865
00:57:11,720 --> 00:57:17,080
where, this is where I, I take a
stance with, with Joseph Smith

866
00:57:17,080 --> 00:57:18,920
here.
That makes some people

867
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:21,600
uncomfortable, right?
They'll say, well, we don't

868
00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:23,840
worship Joseph Smith.
You're right, we don't, we

869
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:29,000
shouldn't.
However, let's not kid ourselves

870
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:32,880
for a minute that much of the
restoration and its veracity

871
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:36,040
lies on Joseph's prophetic
ability.

872
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:42,360
And if that prophetic ability
seems to hold water, it

873
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:47,120
threatens all sorts of sacred
cows in theology, and people

874
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:51,480
have to contend with that.
And so, yes, I agree, we don't

875
00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:53,880
worship Joseph Smith.
We shouldn't worship Joseph

876
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:57,120
Smith, But we better pay
attention to what he has to say,

877
00:57:57,520 --> 00:58:00,680
because he's been right way more
than he's been wrong.

878
00:58:01,560 --> 00:58:04,560
Richard Lyman Bushman,
award-winning author of Rough

879
00:58:04,560 --> 00:58:09,080
Stone Rolling in his preface
characterized what we're

880
00:58:09,080 --> 00:58:12,240
discussing this way.
He says everything about Joseph

881
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,760
Smith matters to people who have
built their lives on his

882
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:18,400
teachings.
To protect their own deepest

883
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:21,840
commitments, believers want to
shield the prophet's reputation.

884
00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:25,920
On the other hand, people have
broken away from Mormonism and

885
00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:30,000
they produce a large amount of
scholarship have to justify

886
00:58:30,000 --> 00:58:34,320
their decision to leave.
They cannot countenance evidence

887
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:37,760
of divine inspiration in his
teachings without catching

888
00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:40,600
themselves in a disastrous
error.

889
00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:44,720
That's why.
That's why the debate is so

890
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:51,280
intense among both members.
In anti Mormons anyway.

891
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:54,800
Very interesting.
So pseudepigrapha are not

892
00:58:54,800 --> 00:58:56,880
necessarily false work.
Indeed most are.

893
00:58:57,120 --> 00:59:00,960
Most really are of ancient
origin, despite the obvious fact

894
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:03,960
that said ancient manuscripts do
not date to the attributed

895
00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:07,240
authors time period.
Just because the text is not the

896
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:10,960
UR text does not mean it lacks
authenticity.

897
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:15,120
It doesn't mean it's not true.
It's just like, in fact, let's

898
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:22,280
call what it is of all the Canon
from Genesis to Revelation, we

899
00:59:22,280 --> 00:59:25,120
don't have the ertext of any of
it.

900
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:29,400
Not even close.
Correct.

901
00:59:29,680 --> 00:59:32,280
So in that sense, they're all
pseudo graphic anyway.

902
00:59:33,680 --> 00:59:37,480
Yep.
So let's talk about what these

903
00:59:37,480 --> 00:59:40,120
individual documents are, where
they came from.

904
00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:45,280
So this is the bibliography
where the 1st that I and I've,

905
00:59:45,320 --> 00:59:48,640
I've read different
translations, but the one that

906
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:52,760
we're going to talk read tonight
is James Charlesworth in the Old

907
00:59:52,760 --> 00:59:54,440
Testament pseudo printed for
volume one.

908
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:56,920
They can't.
You can buy them volume 1 and

909
00:59:56,920 --> 00:59:58,760
volume 2.
And now there's volume 3 and 4,

910
00:59:59,720 --> 01:00:02,960
an ancient text ascribed to
Enoch of the Old Testament,

911
01:00:02,960 --> 01:00:05,840
scholars estimate.
The older sections of this text

912
01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:13,840
date from as early as 300 BC.
The the ancient texts.

913
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:19,160
The earliest texts of First
Enoch predate Christ as the text

914
01:00:19,160 --> 01:00:23,160
was in use in pre Christian era
Qumran, but we'll talk more

915
01:00:23,160 --> 01:00:26,400
about that.
First Enoch was easier, used to

916
01:00:26,400 --> 01:00:30,240
be much easier to discount for
people who were inclined to do

917
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:35,480
so because the earliest
manuscript we had of it dated to

918
01:00:35,480 --> 01:00:39,680
the late medieval to the 14th,
15th century.

919
01:00:39,680 --> 01:00:46,440
So that was the between 14th and
16th century, no 15th and 17th

920
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:56,560
century, the 14th, 1400 to 1600,
which is not that old until 19th

921
01:00:56,600 --> 01:01:03,680
until 1948, when in Cave 4IN
Qumran they discovered

922
01:01:04,040 --> 01:01:06,440
fragmentary the fragments of
First Enoch.

923
01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:11,200
Anyway, the complete text only
exists in Ethiopia, the Gia's

924
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:14,160
language, with fragments in
Aramaic from the Dead Sea

925
01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:16,080
Scrolls and a few fragments in
Greek and Latin.

926
01:01:17,320 --> 01:01:19,600
Although First Enoch played an
important role in early

927
01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:23,360
Christianity, it fell into
disfavor in the 4th century and

928
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:25,800
was essentially lost to the
Christian world until its

929
01:01:25,800 --> 01:01:30,440
rediscovery in the Ethiopic in
1773.

930
01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:34,680
The Scotsman by the name of
James Bruce went on an adventure

931
01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:41,640
to Ethiopia and found them and
brought them back with him, and

932
01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:44,880
it and it remained untranslated
until 1821.

933
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:51,680
In its completion.
Second Enoch from the same Old

934
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:54,960
Testament of Sederburg for
volume One, another ancient text

935
01:01:54,960 --> 01:01:56,800
ascribed to Enoch of the Old
Testament.

936
01:01:57,400 --> 01:02:00,120
The dating of Second Enoch
varies between the 1st and the

937
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:06,000
2nd between the 1st century BC
and the 9th century of the

938
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:09,440
Common Era.
The only manuscripts that exist

939
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:12,880
for Second Enoch are in
Slavonic, although it has been

940
01:02:12,880 --> 01:02:15,360
hypothesized that its original
language is Greek.

941
01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:18,760
With Uber sources it would have
to be if it were from the first.

942
01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:21,360
Where does the Slavonic language
come from?

943
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:24,520
It's a think of it as a Slavic
languages.

944
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:29,160
We'll read more about that.
It wasn't rediscovered or nor

945
01:02:29,160 --> 01:02:32,040
published until the end of the
19th century.

946
01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:36,360
Second Enoch is distinct from
First Enoch, and there's an

947
01:02:36,360 --> 01:02:39,800
unrelated 13.
Second Enoch, also known as the

948
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:42,560
Secrets of Enoch, was
rediscovered at the end of the

949
01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:46,880
19th century when a scholar
Sokolov discovered the full text

950
01:02:47,240 --> 01:02:52,320
in Church Slavonic manuscripts
within the Belgrade Public

951
01:02:52,320 --> 01:02:57,400
Library like a Protoslavic,
around 1886.

952
01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:00,920
Previously lost for centuries,
it is distinct from First Enoch

953
01:03:00,920 --> 01:03:02,280
and exists primarily in
Slavonic.

954
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:06,000
There are some later Coptic
fragments that were found in

955
01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:09,440
1963.
Again, the Law of Witnesses

956
01:03:09,640 --> 01:03:15,720
coming in 3rd Enoch from the
same volume is the alleged

957
01:03:15,720 --> 01:03:19,840
account of how Rabbi Ishmael,
who is a real historic person,

958
01:03:20,760 --> 01:03:25,480
was taken into heaven and saw
God's throne just like Enoch

959
01:03:25,480 --> 01:03:28,640
did.
Third Enoch also states that

960
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:33,080
Rabbi Ishmael was taught by an
Archangel who called himself

961
01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:36,920
Metatron.
Metatron identifies himself as

962
01:03:36,920 --> 01:03:41,160
hey, I'm Enoch, I'm the
resurrected Enoch now serving

963
01:03:41,160 --> 01:03:42,800
God.
OK?

964
01:03:42,800 --> 01:03:45,520
And we're shown the heavens.
And that's how we learned about

965
01:03:45,800 --> 01:03:47,840
what happened to Enoch after his
translation.

966
01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:51,320
The original language of Third
Enoch is Hebrew.

967
01:03:52,160 --> 01:03:55,840
It is attributed to Rabbi
Ishnell, a revered Palestinian

968
01:03:55,840 --> 01:03:58,920
scholar.
He wasn't Palestinian

969
01:03:58,920 --> 01:04:03,480
politically, he lived in
Palestine region who died

970
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:07,840
shortly before AD 132, very
early.

971
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:11,640
Although parts of Third Enoch
are rooted in the 1st century or

972
01:04:11,640 --> 01:04:16,120
earlier, and although estimates
of the date of its the final

973
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:19,160
redaction of what we have very
scholars believe the final

974
01:04:19,160 --> 01:04:22,800
redaction to have occurred in
the 5th or the 6th century.

975
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:24,600
It doesn't mean that's where it
came from, but that's when it

976
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:27,640
was all put together.
It was not discovered in a

977
01:04:27,640 --> 01:04:30,080
single archaeological dig, but
rather identified through

978
01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:32,440
scholarly study of Jewish
mystical traditions.

979
01:04:33,200 --> 01:04:37,920
It was curated into a critical
edition in 1928, with the oldest

980
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:40,920
text dating around dating to
around 1650.

981
01:04:42,360 --> 01:04:44,040
So that's.
Those Jewish mystical

982
01:04:44,040 --> 01:04:47,720
traditions, are they talking
about like Kabbalah and that

983
01:04:47,720 --> 01:04:50,760
sort of stuff?
I suppose so it not necessarily

984
01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:56,040
the Kabbalah itself, but it's
kind of that same what what we,

985
01:04:56,040 --> 01:05:01,720
what would we call it?
I don't know apocryphal Jewish

986
01:05:01,720 --> 01:05:03,000
traditions.
OK.

987
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:05,280
All right.
But but the fact that it's

988
01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:12,760
talking about a true historic
figure who most likely wrote of

989
01:05:12,760 --> 01:05:16,960
his account, this Rabbi Ishmael,
lends to its credibility.

990
01:05:18,160 --> 01:05:21,360
Ultimately, for me, what lends
to its credibility and which

991
01:05:21,360 --> 01:05:24,640
lends to the credibility of the
other 66 ancient texts I include

992
01:05:24,640 --> 01:05:26,920
in my book, is the fact that
they teach restored doctrine

993
01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:30,720
unmistakably.
How do you write that off?

994
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:33,000
Oh, it just happens to say what
Joseph Smith thought.

995
01:05:33,040 --> 01:05:34,560
Oh, I'm sure it was just a
coincidence.

996
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:37,400
Time after time after time after
time.

997
01:05:40,520 --> 01:05:47,920
All right, so those are the
three accounts then, in 194811

998
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:50,680
Aramaic language.
Fragments of the Book of Enoch

999
01:05:50,680 --> 01:05:55,640
were found in K4 of Qumran in
1948 and are in the care of the

1000
01:05:55,640 --> 01:05:59,800
Israel Antiquities Authority.
The documents are white or cream

1001
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,120
in color, blackened in areas,
and made of leather that was

1002
01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:06,560
smooth, thick, and stiff.
They were also partly damaged,

1003
01:06:06,880 --> 01:06:13,760
with the ink blurred and faint.
These fragments constitute the

1004
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:20,080
most ancient Enoch text we have.
Which means the the historical

1005
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:21,640
veracity.
It sounds like it's been

1006
01:06:21,640 --> 01:06:25,200
established, right?
We're finding where people have

1007
01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:28,760
made translations of these
hanging out in libraries, and

1008
01:06:28,760 --> 01:06:32,600
then they find these in the Dead
Sea Scrolls, they find other

1009
01:06:32,600 --> 01:06:36,680
fragments, and they seem to
correspond with what the later

1010
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:39,120
translations seem to bear out,
right?

1011
01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:46,080
Yes, these so even though that's
what was found in the Dead Sea

1012
01:06:46,080 --> 01:06:52,320
Scrolls as highly fragmented,
these are the chapters from

1013
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:57,680
Qumran the the chapters from
first Enoch that were found in

1014
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:02,240
the Dead Sea Scrolls chapters
1/6 through 912 through 1730

1015
01:07:02,240 --> 01:07:08,680
through 333676 through 82868991
through 93 and one O 6 through

1016
01:07:08,680 --> 01:07:11,320
one O 7.
So almost the entirety.

1017
01:07:12,640 --> 01:07:15,320
Right.
Which to me is miraculous.

1018
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:22,600
To me it shows us what that the
people in Qumran, 3 centuries

1019
01:07:22,600 --> 01:07:25,760
before Christ, had the Book of
Enoch in its entirety.

1020
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:33,600
Now some people are confused,
thinking that the Book of Enoch

1021
01:07:33,600 --> 01:07:36,400
fragments are a different book
than first Enoch.

1022
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:39,520
They're not some people because
they come in different

1023
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:41,200
fragments.
There's a part that talks about

1024
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:44,520
the giants, then we've heard the
Dead Sea Scrolls section that

1025
01:07:44,520 --> 01:07:46,280
talks about giants as the Book
of the Giants.

1026
01:07:46,280 --> 01:07:49,400
You can call it what you want.
It's still First Enoch.

1027
01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:54,640
It's the same thing got you.
You can even, you can even buy

1028
01:07:54,640 --> 01:07:58,200
one of the more recent
translations of First Enoch that

1029
01:07:58,200 --> 01:08:00,920
incorporates the slight
variations from the Dead Sea

1030
01:08:00,920 --> 01:08:03,120
Scrolls into that.
That's something that I would

1031
01:08:03,120 --> 01:08:08,400
like to do in my spare time.
Yeah, no, that would be a great

1032
01:08:09,200 --> 01:08:09,880
a great.
Team there.

1033
01:08:11,040 --> 01:08:16,040
I mean the Dead Sea Scrolls, the
most consequential scriptural

1034
01:08:16,040 --> 01:08:21,160
find in our in in in modern
history.

1035
01:08:22,479 --> 01:08:25,920
Absolutely.
Showing that the claims of the

1036
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:30,080
naysayers that the old test when
the new test, when all these

1037
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,319
teachings are just very recent
constructs.

1038
01:08:33,319 --> 01:08:35,760
You know, a first Enoch was
made-up by these people in

1039
01:08:35,760 --> 01:08:36,600
Ethiopia.
Nope.

1040
01:08:37,800 --> 01:08:40,560
They belong to a very ancient
scriptural tradition.

1041
01:08:40,640 --> 01:08:45,399
They are authentic.
So this is the the book that

1042
01:08:45,399 --> 01:08:48,840
we're going to read from
regarding these teachings from

1043
01:08:48,840 --> 01:08:54,080
first, second and third.
Enoch, is it OK if we take a

1044
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:56,840
bathroom break first?
Please do.

1045
01:08:56,840 --> 01:08:59,680
Yeah, let's do that.
Let me just hit pause here real

1046
01:08:59,720 --> 01:09:00,760
quick.
OK.

1047
01:09:02,359 --> 01:09:05,479
OK, so this this text we're
looking at here, this is the

1048
01:09:05,479 --> 01:09:07,600
actual text of First Enoch,
right?

1049
01:09:08,080 --> 01:09:11,399
That is correct.
This is First Enoch chapter 6

1050
01:09:12,240 --> 01:09:14,560
over here in the margins to see
verses 1 and 2.

1051
01:09:16,880 --> 01:09:20,160
I'm not just going to present
some of my favorite things from

1052
01:09:20,160 --> 01:09:21,840
First Enoch and then second,
Third Enoch.

1053
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:27,120
Eventually, First Enoch occupies
itself primarily at the

1054
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:31,680
beginning with describing the
conditions that brought about

1055
01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:36,680
Noah's flood.
So this is First Enoch chapter 6

1056
01:09:37,160 --> 01:09:41,120
and it's giving us additional to
detail to Genesis chapter 6 one

1057
01:09:41,120 --> 01:09:46,200
through 6.
So reading verse one, in those

1058
01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:50,520
days when the children of man
had multiplied, it happened that

1059
01:09:50,520 --> 01:09:53,439
they were born unto them,
handsome and beautiful

1060
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:57,120
daughters.
And the angels, the children of

1061
01:09:57,120 --> 01:10:03,960
heaven, also known as the
watchers, saw them, these women,

1062
01:10:03,960 --> 01:10:08,320
and desired them.
And they said to one another,

1063
01:10:09,440 --> 01:10:12,640
come, let us choose wives for
ourselves from among the

1064
01:10:12,640 --> 01:10:16,160
daughters of man and bigot us
children.

1065
01:10:17,560 --> 01:10:21,640
We're going to discuss more
about who in the heck are they?

1066
01:10:22,120 --> 01:10:25,360
What did they think they were
doing so?

1067
01:10:27,120 --> 01:10:29,560
Can, can can I just interject
something right here?

1068
01:10:29,880 --> 01:10:33,200
Just kind of a connection that
popped out popped up in my head

1069
01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:38,600
for me.
This looks like they're almost

1070
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:40,800
trying to be God the Father,
right?

1071
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:48,040
They want sire children who I
can only imagine they're

1072
01:10:48,040 --> 01:10:52,200
thinking could be Christ type
figures.

1073
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:56,600
Not Christ like, but Christ type
in terms of being both mortal

1074
01:10:56,600 --> 01:10:59,680
and divine.
Don't know if that's the case,

1075
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:04,040
but I couldn't help but wonder
here if that's what those angels

1076
01:11:05,080 --> 01:11:09,000
thoughts were usurping some sort
of level of authority.

1077
01:11:11,200 --> 01:11:14,360
They were an authority they had.
As you will see, they had no

1078
01:11:14,360 --> 01:11:20,280
interest in salvation at all.
Their role as watchers.

1079
01:11:21,800 --> 01:11:26,080
Wikipedia describes them as a
type of biblical Angel.

1080
01:11:26,080 --> 01:11:29,720
The word is related to the root
meaning to be awake.

1081
01:11:29,720 --> 01:11:31,480
It occurs of both plural and
singular forms.

1082
01:11:31,480 --> 01:11:35,200
In the book of Daniel, the word
watchers itself, where reference

1083
01:11:35,200 --> 01:11:37,920
is made to the holiness of the
beings, the apocryphal books of

1084
01:11:37,960 --> 01:11:42,560
Enoch refer to both good and bad
watchers, with a primary focus

1085
01:11:42,560 --> 01:11:46,160
on the rebellious ones.
So their job, their assignment,

1086
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:52,160
was to observe and report, which
Latter Day Saints should be

1087
01:11:52,160 --> 01:11:56,680
familiar with that role, to
observe and to report.

1088
01:11:56,680 --> 01:12:01,880
So clearly these were beings who
were in authority to do what

1089
01:12:01,880 --> 01:12:05,880
they were supposed to do.
And the Book of Enoch talks

1090
01:12:05,880 --> 01:12:10,800
about what order they belong to
and what they were thinking and

1091
01:12:10,800 --> 01:12:12,360
that sort of thing.
And they were good ones and

1092
01:12:12,360 --> 01:12:15,400
rebellious ones.
So we already know that they

1093
01:12:15,400 --> 01:12:20,360
weren't, what, celestial.
Yeah, they were immortal.

1094
01:12:20,760 --> 01:12:26,880
All right, let's go on Chapter
7.

1095
01:12:28,240 --> 01:12:30,360
Let's read this paragraph
verses.

1096
01:12:30,520 --> 01:12:35,760
Oops, one through 6.
And they took wives unto

1097
01:12:35,760 --> 01:12:40,280
themselves, and everyone
respectively chose one woman for

1098
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:45,840
himself, these watchers.
And they began to go unto them.

1099
01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:50,880
And they taught them magical
medicine, incantations, the

1100
01:12:50,880 --> 01:12:53,560
cutting of roots, taught them
about plants.

1101
01:12:53,560 --> 01:12:58,880
And the women became pregnant
and gave birth to great giants

1102
01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:06,760
whose heights were 300 cubits.
That's that's not Goliath size,

1103
01:13:06,760 --> 01:13:10,160
that's massive.
These giants consumed the

1104
01:13:10,160 --> 01:13:15,320
produce of all the people until
the people detested feeding

1105
01:13:15,320 --> 01:13:18,480
them.
So the giants turned against the

1106
01:13:18,480 --> 01:13:24,960
people in order to eat them.
And they, the giants, began to

1107
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:30,240
sin against birds, wild beasts,
reptiles and fish, meaning to

1108
01:13:30,240 --> 01:13:35,480
eat them also, right?
And their flesh was devoured,

1109
01:13:35,480 --> 01:13:39,440
the one by the other, and they
drank the blood.

1110
01:13:40,360 --> 01:13:45,040
That should ring massive alarm
bells for students of the Book

1111
01:13:45,040 --> 01:13:47,120
of Mormon.
Yeah, absolutely.

1112
01:13:47,760 --> 01:13:51,280
At the end of the Book of Mormon
where where the Nephites really

1113
01:13:51,280 --> 01:13:54,680
fall into depravity.
Is it a coincidence?

1114
01:13:54,960 --> 01:13:57,320
Yes.
Is it a coincidence that that

1115
01:13:57,320 --> 01:13:59,040
would happen just before their
destruction?

1116
01:14:00,040 --> 01:14:03,440
No.
Well, no, it's not coincidence.

1117
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:07,600
I'm agreeing with you.
The ultimate sin that mankind

1118
01:14:08,320 --> 01:14:15,520
can commit is the Mahan
principle, committing murder to

1119
01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:21,280
get gain, and in this case to
actually feast upon the flesh of

1120
01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:25,280
God's children, of the very
purpose of God's.

1121
01:14:25,480 --> 01:14:28,640
This is my work and my glory to
bring to pass immortality of

1122
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:32,120
immortality in your life of man,
which you are now eating.

1123
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:35,920
It is the ultimate sign of
depravity.

1124
01:14:37,320 --> 01:14:39,760
And that's what these giants
were doing in a very, very big

1125
01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:43,880
way, because their appetites
were insatiable.

1126
01:14:46,600 --> 01:14:49,000
And it goes on elsewhere in the
text to say that there was no

1127
01:14:49,000 --> 01:14:57,800
escape from these giants, except
for whom Enoch got his people

1128
01:14:58,240 --> 01:15:01,680
and how by moving mountain.
Triggers.

1129
01:15:03,040 --> 01:15:05,360
The power of only the power of
God could protect them from

1130
01:15:05,360 --> 01:15:10,520
these giants.
Now a lot of people say, oh, the

1131
01:15:10,520 --> 01:15:12,800
giants weren't real, That's just
fantasy.

1132
01:15:12,800 --> 01:15:17,120
The problem for Latter Day
Saints is it is confirmed in the

1133
01:15:17,120 --> 01:15:20,120
book of Moses and restored
scripture.

1134
01:15:20,320 --> 01:15:23,320
These giants were genuine.
They were real.

1135
01:15:23,840 --> 01:15:27,440
They were malicious.
They wanted to destroy the city

1136
01:15:27,440 --> 01:15:32,360
of Enoch and his people, and
only Enoch in the power of God

1137
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:35,760
could save them.
So what about the rest of the

1138
01:15:35,760 --> 01:15:39,920
people?
The only thing, the only thing

1139
01:15:39,920 --> 01:15:43,520
that could save the plan of
salvation at this point was

1140
01:15:43,520 --> 01:15:45,760
Noah's flood.
Right.

1141
01:15:46,200 --> 01:15:50,760
A reboot because of this?
What's the $10,000?

1142
01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:54,360
And, and it does add some
context that that, you know,

1143
01:15:54,360 --> 01:15:59,320
we're in Genesis that the world
was filled with violence, right?

1144
01:16:01,320 --> 01:16:06,480
And I can only imagine that like
the if they were as big as what

1145
01:16:06,480 --> 01:16:10,400
it says it would, it would the,
the, the ecosystem would have a

1146
01:16:10,400 --> 01:16:12,960
hard time keeping up.
Of course.

1147
01:16:14,040 --> 01:16:21,440
So the $10,000 question has to
be what was wrong with God?

1148
01:16:21,440 --> 01:16:24,960
Where was God?
How could you let this happen

1149
01:16:27,120 --> 01:16:31,920
When we discovered, well, my
answer part of earth's destiny

1150
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:36,960
was to receive baptism, to be
cleansed by water.

1151
01:16:39,120 --> 01:16:43,720
In order for the world to be
destroyed by a flood, to be

1152
01:16:44,080 --> 01:16:47,680
submerged.
There had to be justification

1153
01:16:47,680 --> 01:16:50,640
for that.
That justification was to

1154
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:54,760
preserve the plan of salvation,
or in other words, the existence

1155
01:16:54,760 --> 01:16:58,040
of mankind, God's children.
The only way to completely

1156
01:16:58,040 --> 01:17:01,920
eradicate the giants, who,
according to First Enoch, would

1157
01:17:01,920 --> 01:17:06,080
have haunted and killed all
mankind, thus destroying and

1158
01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:09,000
frustrating the plan of
salvation, was to cleanse the

1159
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:13,960
whole world with a flood, thus
preserving mankind and rebooting

1160
01:17:14,520 --> 01:17:18,880
the plan of salvation.
In summary, in the foreknowledge

1161
01:17:18,880 --> 01:17:23,200
of God, the watchers and the
giants became the catalysts for

1162
01:17:23,200 --> 01:17:25,240
the cleansing of the earth by
water.

1163
01:17:27,480 --> 01:17:30,440
And so it is with the plan of
salvation throughout.

1164
01:17:30,440 --> 01:17:34,760
Wicked is not only allowed, it
becomes a means to fulfilling

1165
01:17:34,760 --> 01:17:41,000
the plan of salvation.
That last, not this one, but the

1166
01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:45,120
one before, I'm still, I'm still
contemplating the theological

1167
01:17:45,120 --> 01:17:51,040
significance of that, because
these angels have physical

1168
01:17:51,040 --> 01:17:53,120
bodies.
Yeah, we're not done with them

1169
01:17:53,120 --> 01:17:55,680
yet.
OK, I'll I'll wait.

1170
01:17:56,200 --> 01:17:59,800
I'll I'll, I'll wait on that.
Let let's let's hold off on that

1171
01:17:59,800 --> 01:18:01,520
thought.
I'll let you let you cook a

1172
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:02,760
little bit here and tell me
when.

1173
01:18:02,760 --> 01:18:05,840
You're done with the.
With the walk with with those

1174
01:18:05,840 --> 01:18:08,160
angels, because I I guess we
have stuff.

1175
01:18:08,600 --> 01:18:13,080
As Latter Day Saints, how do
these fallen watchers fit into

1176
01:18:13,080 --> 01:18:14,960
our belief system?
How does that work?

1177
01:18:15,560 --> 01:18:17,200
That doesn't sound like
Celestial Kingdom.

1178
01:18:17,480 --> 01:18:22,240
Sure doesn't.
All right, skipping now to page

1179
01:18:22,240 --> 01:18:29,320
20 talking about Enoch's vision.
That's what I'm reading here.

1180
01:18:30,280 --> 01:18:35,000
And I kept coming into heaven.
Enoch is speaking until I

1181
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:39,640
approached a wall which was
built of white marble and

1182
01:18:39,640 --> 01:18:49,560
surrounded by tongues of fire.
So when the brother of Jared

1183
01:18:52,240 --> 01:18:57,480
gave molten glass so that the
finger of the preborder Messiah

1184
01:18:57,480 --> 01:19:04,080
could touch them and turn them
into what white 16 stones that

1185
01:19:04,080 --> 01:19:09,480
would produce light, two of
which later became the Urim and

1186
01:19:09,480 --> 01:19:14,360
Thummim to the people in the
Book of Mormon, what we're

1187
01:19:14,360 --> 01:19:16,840
talking about is purified
matter, that when the finger of

1188
01:19:16,840 --> 01:19:21,840
the Lord touches normal matter,
it purifies it and makes it

1189
01:19:21,840 --> 01:19:24,400
luminous.
The ancient word for that was

1190
01:19:24,400 --> 01:19:31,680
called Zohar, and the the Jewish
tradition is a wind that talks

1191
01:19:31,680 --> 01:19:33,520
about the windows that were in
Noah's ark.

1192
01:19:33,520 --> 01:19:37,120
It was a mistranslation of Urim
and Thummim.

1193
01:19:41,080 --> 01:19:45,280
That's interesting.
Because the Book of Ether says

1194
01:19:46,120 --> 01:19:50,280
that the Jaredites built their
barges like the Ark.

1195
01:19:50,880 --> 01:19:53,720
How would they know?
Because their ancestor just got

1196
01:19:53,720 --> 01:19:56,680
off the Ark.
They remember the Ark.

1197
01:19:57,360 --> 01:20:00,000
Not only that, they remember how
the Ark was illuminated.

1198
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:02,640
They would know that.
So where did the brother of

1199
01:20:02,640 --> 01:20:07,480
Jared get the idea to make these
lighted stones from the

1200
01:20:07,480 --> 01:20:10,560
tradition?
From Noah, OK.

1201
01:20:11,200 --> 01:20:14,680
Now, yeah, I this is nibbly
talking here through me, but

1202
01:20:14,680 --> 01:20:17,880
there was Zohar, right?
Any of this gives us a sense and

1203
01:20:18,520 --> 01:20:24,920
and in the Doctrine and Covenant
section 130, it tells us about

1204
01:20:25,240 --> 01:20:28,600
the destiny of this world that
would become a great Urim and

1205
01:20:28,600 --> 01:20:31,440
Thummim, a sea of glass and
fire.

1206
01:20:31,680 --> 01:20:37,440
It will become purified matter,
otherwise known as crystal.

1207
01:20:37,600 --> 01:20:41,280
We would call it the glows.
Now here we have Enoch

1208
01:20:41,280 --> 01:20:43,800
describing coming into the
celestial.

1209
01:20:45,000 --> 01:20:49,160
I see white marble surrounded by
tongues of fire, also translated

1210
01:20:49,160 --> 01:20:56,800
as pillars of fire.
And it began to frighten me.

1211
01:20:57,080 --> 01:21:01,160
And I came into the tongues of
fire, quoting Enoch here, and

1212
01:21:01,160 --> 01:21:06,040
drew near to the great house
which was built of Yerman Thelma

1213
01:21:06,640 --> 01:21:10,040
purified matter, white marble.
And the inner walls were like

1214
01:21:10,040 --> 01:21:14,880
mosaics of white marble, the
floor of crystal, and the

1215
01:21:14,880 --> 01:21:18,600
ceiling like the path of the
stars and the lightnings between

1216
01:21:18,600 --> 01:21:25,560
which stood fiery cherubim and
their heaven of water.

1217
01:21:27,440 --> 01:21:32,720
The cherubim are known for
having flight, and the angels

1218
01:21:32,720 --> 01:21:35,920
are sometimes depicted as having
figurative wings, showing that

1219
01:21:35,920 --> 01:21:38,840
they can fly.
The wings on the cherubim are

1220
01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:43,320
apparently literal wings because
as they sit on top of the Ark of

1221
01:21:43,320 --> 01:21:45,960
the Covenant, the mercy seat,
the wings.

1222
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:49,240
The outstretched wings of the
cherubim form the chair part of

1223
01:21:51,360 --> 01:21:53,840
it, and the cherubim, as we will
read elsewhere in the books of

1224
01:21:53,840 --> 01:21:58,040
eunuch, would sometimes
transport the Savior himself on

1225
01:21:58,040 --> 01:22:02,200
their shoulders.
So they're they're not humans,

1226
01:22:03,320 --> 01:22:07,640
but they are celestial.
Not only do they participate in,

1227
01:22:07,640 --> 01:22:13,800
but they assist directly God the
Father and the Son in the

1228
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:19,040
enacting of this great plan.
Interesting, so there's a

1229
01:22:19,080 --> 01:22:22,560
different species of celestial
being?

1230
01:22:23,120 --> 01:22:25,600
Should should Latter Day Saints
be surprised by that?

1231
01:22:26,360 --> 01:22:30,000
No, because Joseph Smith taught
that very thing.

1232
01:22:30,720 --> 01:22:34,640
The Book of Revelation teaches
that for us to presume that

1233
01:22:34,640 --> 01:22:40,360
humanoids are the only ones that
have celestial existence is

1234
01:22:41,680 --> 01:22:42,920
ignorant.
I like it's blind.

1235
01:22:43,880 --> 01:22:46,320
And the fact that or if you
assume that we're the only

1236
01:22:46,320 --> 01:22:50,320
intelligent celestial beings is
also short sighted.

1237
01:22:52,200 --> 01:22:56,440
Consider the possibilities.
All right, so the ceiling like

1238
01:22:56,440 --> 01:22:59,280
the path of the stars and
lightnings between which stood

1239
01:22:59,280 --> 01:23:02,120
fiery cherubim and their heaven
of water that it was like they

1240
01:23:02,120 --> 01:23:06,920
were swimming there.
And flaming fire surrounded the

1241
01:23:06,920 --> 01:23:12,840
walls and its gates.
While you enter and exit that

1242
01:23:12,840 --> 01:23:14,400
space.
We're like burning fire.

1243
01:23:15,240 --> 01:23:17,360
The purpose of the tongues of
fire, purpose of the pillars of

1244
01:23:17,360 --> 01:23:19,360
fire to transport beautiful
thing.

1245
01:23:19,520 --> 01:23:24,280
All right, let's go on.
Is your mind blown yet?

1246
01:23:24,480 --> 01:23:25,800
My every time.
I yeah, a little.

1247
01:23:25,800 --> 01:23:29,800
Bit I got I got some serious
questions because because a few

1248
01:23:29,800 --> 01:23:36,200
of these carry some pretty heavy
theological ramifications if if

1249
01:23:36,200 --> 01:23:37,840
I'm understanding them
correctly.

1250
01:23:38,920 --> 01:23:43,560
Continuing on in chapter 14,
Enoch speaking and I observed

1251
01:23:43,560 --> 01:23:47,400
and saw inside this room a lofty
throne.

1252
01:23:48,760 --> 01:23:50,520
Its appearance was like
crystals.

1253
01:23:50,520 --> 01:23:55,400
Surprise, surprise.
And it's wheels like the shining

1254
01:23:55,400 --> 01:24:04,560
sun whenever I I have the
Ezekiel's wheels in the Old

1255
01:24:04,560 --> 01:24:06,960
Testament, and wheels are
discussed here.

1256
01:24:07,720 --> 01:24:10,520
Ken Peterson now interprets that
to mean orbits.

1257
01:24:11,840 --> 01:24:15,240
Interesting.
And it's wheels, like the

1258
01:24:15,240 --> 01:24:17,840
signing, the like the shining
sun.

1259
01:24:18,440 --> 01:24:20,440
And I heard the voice of the
Cherubim.

1260
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:22,920
Cherubim apparently are great
singers.

1261
01:24:23,400 --> 01:24:27,840
And from beneath the throne the
Cherubim are always singing and

1262
01:24:29,000 --> 01:24:30,960
celebrating the throne.
Praising.

1263
01:24:30,960 --> 01:24:35,720
Yes, from beneath the throne
we're issuing streams of flaming

1264
01:24:35,720 --> 01:24:39,560
fire, more pillars of light.
It was difficult to look at it,

1265
01:24:40,280 --> 01:24:43,440
and the great glory was sitting
upon it.

1266
01:24:45,520 --> 01:24:49,280
As for his gown, which was
shining more brightly than the

1267
01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:54,280
sun, shining glorious garments,
and it was whiter than any snow,

1268
01:24:54,400 --> 01:24:58,880
but that sounds like Doctrine
and Covenants. 110 None of the

1269
01:24:58,880 --> 01:25:03,240
angels was able to come in and
see the face of the excellent

1270
01:25:03,240 --> 01:25:07,560
and the glorious. 1 And no one
of the flesh can see him.

1271
01:25:07,560 --> 01:25:13,480
Why they would be consumed.
The flaming fire was round about

1272
01:25:13,480 --> 01:25:15,840
him, and a great fire stood
before him.

1273
01:25:16,320 --> 01:25:20,400
No one could come nearer to him
from among those that surrounded

1274
01:25:20,400 --> 01:25:24,520
the 10s of millions that stood
before him.

1275
01:25:26,640 --> 01:25:31,720
He needed no counsel, but the
most holy ones who are near to

1276
01:25:31,720 --> 01:25:36,360
him neither go far away at night
nor move away from him.

1277
01:25:37,280 --> 01:25:39,080
So he has counsel.
He doesn't need it, but he does

1278
01:25:39,080 --> 01:25:41,440
have counsel.
So that's just the order.

1279
01:25:43,320 --> 01:25:45,280
Hey I want to dive into
something.

1280
01:25:45,800 --> 01:25:48,360
Just a second, let me finish
this spot because I want to hear

1281
01:25:48,360 --> 01:25:48,920
your question.
Sorry.

1282
01:25:50,160 --> 01:25:52,000
It's not a bad, It's so
exciting.

1283
01:25:52,600 --> 01:25:58,240
The expansive vision of this is
mind blowing for 21st century

1284
01:25:58,240 --> 01:26:05,080
idiots like me and you.
But they're describing this 2300

1285
01:26:05,080 --> 01:26:09,040
years ago at least.
Possibly 4005 thousand years ago

1286
01:26:10,120 --> 01:26:13,760
because it was given in vision.
OK, your turn.

1287
01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:18,240
OK, you, you said something
interesting you said when you

1288
01:26:18,240 --> 01:26:21,600
read wheels now, like in this
context, you think of orbits.

1289
01:26:22,160 --> 01:26:27,480
OK, OK, So when you say when
when it says that the throne had

1290
01:26:27,480 --> 01:26:32,200
the appearance like crystal and
its orbits like that of the

1291
01:26:32,200 --> 01:26:36,920
shining sun, what's that saying
there Is that saying that

1292
01:26:36,920 --> 01:26:41,560
there's that that planets move
around the throne of God?

1293
01:26:41,960 --> 01:26:48,080
Is that meaning that that the
Lord himself on wherever he

1294
01:26:48,080 --> 01:26:52,040
dwells is wrote like what, what,
what's, what are the

1295
01:26:52,040 --> 01:26:54,840
implications of that?
That's a wonderful question.

1296
01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:57,960
Just one reason I just one of
the reasons I like you.

1297
01:26:58,160 --> 01:27:02,760
So this, the genesis of this
idea for me comes from the Dead

1298
01:27:02,760 --> 01:27:08,120
Sea Scrolls, which gives us
incredible description of this

1299
01:27:08,120 --> 01:27:14,240
same vision, only it's a little
more detailed than this even.

1300
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:20,080
And it describes this throne
room like Grand Central Station,

1301
01:27:21,960 --> 01:27:27,480
and it describes these gates,
these fiery gates that there are

1302
01:27:27,480 --> 01:27:32,880
servants, angelic beings
constantly is the word that is

1303
01:27:32,880 --> 01:27:41,000
used going to and fro going in
and out of these gates as they

1304
01:27:41,000 --> 01:27:47,560
serve the wheels of the chariot.
So in other they're being

1305
01:27:47,560 --> 01:27:51,560
transported from the throne of
God to these various worlds in

1306
01:27:51,560 --> 01:27:55,400
different orbits to enact the
plan of salvation throughout the

1307
01:27:55,400 --> 01:27:58,360
Kingdom of God, if that makes
sense.

1308
01:27:59,160 --> 01:28:01,960
Now here's the other question.
Here's the other thing.

1309
01:28:04,000 --> 01:28:08,320
Doctrine Covenant section 88
describes where the throne of

1310
01:28:08,320 --> 01:28:14,400
God is relative to the rest of
creation, and the wording is he

1311
01:28:14,400 --> 01:28:19,320
is in the midst, He's in the
middle of creation.

1312
01:28:19,320 --> 01:28:23,560
So from where God dwells, and
with of course His almighty

1313
01:28:23,560 --> 01:28:27,080
power, he sees all of creation
laid out before him in these

1314
01:28:27,280 --> 01:28:34,080
orbits, these wheels.
That is that even that has some

1315
01:28:34,160 --> 01:28:39,440
profound implications, right?
Because as human beings we tend

1316
01:28:39,440 --> 01:28:46,880
to set God apart from us, right?
So so he's he's there he's he's

1317
01:28:47,840 --> 01:28:53,000
he's the way now according to
DNC 88, he is in the middle of

1318
01:28:53,000 --> 01:28:54,960
it.
He is he is an active

1319
01:28:54,960 --> 01:28:59,760
participant.
He has not simply the God of the

1320
01:28:59,760 --> 01:29:03,400
deists that wind it up and then
watch it run, right He is.

1321
01:29:04,000 --> 01:29:05,800
He is in the middle of his
creation.

1322
01:29:07,040 --> 01:29:11,120
So so you think he's in the
middle, surrounded by his

1323
01:29:11,120 --> 01:29:15,680
creations, and suddenly it makes
a lot the the symbolism of the

1324
01:29:15,680 --> 01:29:18,080
true order of prayer becomes
much more significant.

1325
01:29:19,960 --> 01:29:21,520
Yeah, I didn't even think about
that.

1326
01:29:23,680 --> 01:29:27,560
That is fascinating.
And when Lehi talks about the

1327
01:29:27,560 --> 01:29:30,000
throne of God being surrounded
by numberless concourses of

1328
01:29:30,000 --> 01:29:35,280
angels, he's in the middle.
Now, when you put that together

1329
01:29:35,280 --> 01:29:42,320
with the Kolob Theorem, this
book that tries to place God

1330
01:29:42,320 --> 01:29:45,280
cosmologically and
astronomically in a physical

1331
01:29:45,280 --> 01:29:49,520
location in space, which they
say is the center of the Milky

1332
01:29:49,520 --> 01:29:53,200
Way.
And from the center you would be

1333
01:29:53,200 --> 01:29:55,720
able to see all of creation if
you had the ability and the

1334
01:29:55,720 --> 01:29:57,880
power to do so, which God
clearly does.

1335
01:30:00,200 --> 01:30:03,560
You know, that's interesting
too, because this is as we look.

1336
01:30:04,000 --> 01:30:07,160
I'm a guy who believes that if
this stuff is true, we should

1337
01:30:07,160 --> 01:30:11,720
expect to see echoes of it
across different civilizations

1338
01:30:11,720 --> 01:30:15,320
with different ideas, right?
Even if they're God's names are

1339
01:30:15,320 --> 01:30:17,520
different, we should still see
an echo.

1340
01:30:18,400 --> 01:30:22,200
And what I find fascinating
about being at the center, you

1341
01:30:22,200 --> 01:30:25,800
know, the Milky Way.
There are so many traditions

1342
01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:28,960
that say you, you.
For whatever reason, Orion's

1343
01:30:28,960 --> 01:30:33,000
Belt seems to be a pretty big
constellation form.

1344
01:30:33,120 --> 01:30:35,560
Not all of them call them or
Orion's Belt, right?

1345
01:30:35,760 --> 01:30:37,480
Sadly, Orion's belt there.
It's in the wrong.

1346
01:30:37,600 --> 01:30:40,960
It's in the wrong.
Direction, right?

1347
01:30:41,400 --> 01:30:46,640
But they say, and then and then
you, you go through the great

1348
01:30:46,640 --> 01:30:51,600
rift, right?
That is a fascinating concept

1349
01:30:51,600 --> 01:30:54,080
when we stop to think if the
Co-op theorem is correct.

1350
01:30:54,080 --> 01:30:58,560
And that's where God is hanging
out, That's where he lives, that

1351
01:30:58,560 --> 01:31:02,800
that's the final destination.
You go up through that and then

1352
01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:07,520
down to the center of of the
Great Rift, the center of my.

1353
01:31:07,520 --> 01:31:10,760
Favorite My favorite ancient
tradition along these lines

1354
01:31:10,760 --> 01:31:14,760
since you brought it up is the
Lakota Sioux says that when you

1355
01:31:14,840 --> 01:31:20,200
die, your spirit travels the
great Highway which is the Milky

1356
01:31:20,200 --> 01:31:27,120
Way.
And in where we live in August,

1357
01:31:27,120 --> 01:31:34,000
September, after sunset, the
galactic core Sagittarius A is

1358
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:40,160
visible to us.
And so if I were looking

1359
01:31:40,160 --> 01:31:45,880
southward would find the Milky
Way, I would find Cassiopeia, I

1360
01:31:45,880 --> 01:31:48,680
would find the swan in the Milky
Way and then follow it down to

1361
01:31:48,680 --> 01:31:52,280
the horizon.
If I follow it down to the

1362
01:31:52,280 --> 01:31:54,880
horizon, you will see it's
called the teapot.

1363
01:31:54,880 --> 01:31:59,000
And the teapot points to
Sagittarius A, which you can't

1364
01:31:59,000 --> 01:32:01,760
see with the naked eye, but it's
the galactic center.

1365
01:32:02,720 --> 01:32:05,520
But before you get there, the
Milky Way has like a little a

1366
01:32:05,520 --> 01:32:09,360
spur, a split to the right.
The Lakota soup tradition says

1367
01:32:09,360 --> 01:32:13,840
that if you you follow it down,
you'll get to where the Great

1368
01:32:13,840 --> 01:32:16,600
Spirit is.
If you take the spur off to the

1369
01:32:16,600 --> 01:32:17,960
right, you'll end up in
oblivion.

1370
01:32:19,360 --> 01:32:22,080
And the spur is one of the arms,
one of the arms of the Milky

1371
01:32:22,080 --> 01:32:24,920
Way.
It's like, wow, that's a

1372
01:32:24,920 --> 01:32:27,440
coincidence, right?
It's yeah, yes, it is.

1373
01:32:27,800 --> 01:32:31,080
And then the other thing is we
don't often get a peek at the

1374
01:32:31,080 --> 01:32:35,600
mechanics of of the exalted
rounds, right.

1375
01:32:35,880 --> 01:32:39,800
We don't get to know how it is
they get from point A to point

1376
01:32:39,800 --> 01:32:42,240
B.
But here this like if I was to

1377
01:32:42,240 --> 01:32:47,200
put it into a quasi scientific
term, it's some sort of portal,

1378
01:32:47,280 --> 01:32:50,000
right?
I mean it goes it goes from

1379
01:32:50,000 --> 01:32:51,920
there to to where they need to
be.

1380
01:32:51,960 --> 01:32:54,560
That's how Joseph Smith
described it when Morona used

1381
01:32:54,560 --> 01:32:56,480
it.
Yeah.

1382
01:32:56,480 --> 01:32:58,360
A conduit.
Yep.

1383
01:32:59,160 --> 01:33:02,040
A purpose.
And when he, when the conduit

1384
01:33:02,040 --> 01:33:05,480
formed after Morona, I was done
talking to him for second to

1385
01:33:05,560 --> 01:33:08,760
third time.
All three times he could see the

1386
01:33:08,760 --> 01:33:12,600
other side, he could see heaven.
Yep.

1387
01:33:13,560 --> 01:33:20,400
And his his concise and and very
precise description is the best

1388
01:33:20,400 --> 01:33:24,040
description of a wormhole of our
time Hold its.

1389
01:33:24,040 --> 01:33:26,320
Space and then and.
Then Marona didn't have to get

1390
01:33:26,320 --> 01:33:29,880
some stupid spaceship, he just
walks through a door and ends up

1391
01:33:29,880 --> 01:33:32,840
in the throne room and the Dead
Sea Scrolls describes the other

1392
01:33:32,920 --> 01:33:37,680
where it went anyway.
And then, and then we have the

1393
01:33:37,680 --> 01:33:41,080
account of the pillar of light
that shows up at Joseph's first

1394
01:33:41,080 --> 01:33:42,680
vision.
And yeah, same thing.

1395
01:33:43,400 --> 01:33:45,400
Right.
Same sort of a, a, a theory

1396
01:33:45,400 --> 01:33:47,560
there.
That's fascinating.

1397
01:33:48,120 --> 01:33:51,000
OK.
Well, not only that, these near

1398
01:33:51,000 --> 01:33:53,280
death experiences when people
die, what did they describe?

1399
01:33:53,840 --> 01:33:56,240
The tunnel of light?
What do you think that is?

1400
01:33:57,040 --> 01:33:59,240
Conduits.
Yep, that's how we get around

1401
01:33:59,240 --> 01:34:01,600
physically and spiritually.
Matter still has to be

1402
01:34:01,600 --> 01:34:03,360
transported one way or another,
right?

1403
01:34:05,320 --> 01:34:09,880
Anyway, this is so fun.
OK, I think it's all I want to

1404
01:34:09,880 --> 01:34:15,760
say about that one.
Then we get back down to back to

1405
01:34:15,760 --> 01:34:23,640
the subject in chapter 15.
So well, I want to take this see

1406
01:34:23,640 --> 01:34:24,880
how that let's do this a little
bit.

1407
01:34:26,200 --> 01:34:29,880
So God raised Enoch up and said
to him said to me with his

1408
01:34:29,880 --> 01:34:35,200
voice, Enoch is talking Enoch.
I then heard, do not fear Enoch,

1409
01:34:35,200 --> 01:34:38,600
righteous man, scribe of
righteousness, come near to me

1410
01:34:38,600 --> 01:34:43,040
and hear my voice.
Now this is what he tells them

1411
01:34:43,040 --> 01:34:46,400
to tell the watchers, because in
in previously the watcher said,

1412
01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:49,720
Enoch, help us out.
God likes you.

1413
01:34:49,720 --> 01:34:53,480
You go tell you go plead to God
on our behalf because we've done

1414
01:34:53,480 --> 01:34:58,680
this bad thing.
God tells Enoch, tell the

1415
01:34:58,680 --> 01:35:02,400
watchers of heaven, on whose
behalf you have been sent to

1416
01:35:02,400 --> 01:35:07,360
intercede.
It is meet for you, watchers,

1417
01:35:07,720 --> 01:35:11,880
that you intercede on behalf of
man, not man on your behalf.

1418
01:35:13,320 --> 01:35:17,360
For what reason, watchers, have
you abandoned the high hole in

1419
01:35:17,400 --> 01:35:20,920
eternal heaven and slept with
women and defiled yourselves

1420
01:35:20,920 --> 01:35:25,560
with the daughters of the
people, taking wives, acting

1421
01:35:25,560 --> 01:35:29,000
like the children of the earth,
and be getting giant sons?

1422
01:35:29,960 --> 01:35:35,760
Surely, you watchers, you used
to be Holy, spiritual, the

1423
01:35:35,760 --> 01:35:40,240
living ones, possessing eternal
life or immortality, I would put

1424
01:35:40,240 --> 01:35:44,360
it, but you have defiled
yourselves with women and the

1425
01:35:44,360 --> 01:35:46,600
blood of the flesh begotten
children.

1426
01:35:47,040 --> 01:35:50,640
You have lusted with the blood
of the people like them,

1427
01:35:50,640 --> 01:35:54,480
producing blood and flesh which
die and perish.

1428
01:35:56,240 --> 01:35:59,800
On that account I have given you
wives in order that seeds might

1429
01:35:59,800 --> 01:36:02,800
be sown upon them and children
born by them, so that the deeds

1430
01:36:02,800 --> 01:36:06,240
that are done upon the earth
will not be withheld from you.

1431
01:36:06,240 --> 01:36:08,880
Indeed you.
Then he gives us a clue who they

1432
01:36:08,880 --> 01:36:12,320
were formally.
You were spiritual, having

1433
01:36:12,320 --> 01:36:15,880
immortality, immortal in all
generations of the world.

1434
01:36:17,320 --> 01:36:19,600
That is why formerly I did not
make wise for you.

1435
01:36:19,600 --> 01:36:21,520
For the dwelling of the
spiritual beings of heaven is

1436
01:36:21,520 --> 01:36:25,600
heaven.
So they were immortal formally.

1437
01:36:26,640 --> 01:36:32,840
He gave us a clue later.
More about that in chapter 16.

1438
01:36:34,280 --> 01:36:38,160
And yeah, tell them that they
should be interceded for you,

1439
01:36:38,200 --> 01:36:42,640
Enoch, not the other way around.
He goes on to Enoch, God says.

1440
01:36:42,640 --> 01:36:46,280
And so to the watchers on whose
behalf you have been sent to

1441
01:36:46,280 --> 01:36:50,680
intercede, who were formerly in
heaven, say to them, you were

1442
01:36:50,680 --> 01:36:53,400
once in heaven.
Now here's the clue.

1443
01:36:55,040 --> 01:37:00,280
But not all of the mysteries of
heaven are open to you.

1444
01:37:01,720 --> 01:37:05,040
What?
What did he mean by that?

1445
01:37:05,400 --> 01:37:09,120
I got to mark this again.
What are mysteries?

1446
01:37:09,920 --> 01:37:15,000
Ordinances.
But not all the mysteries of

1447
01:37:15,000 --> 01:37:18,240
heaven are open to you, and you
only know the rejected

1448
01:37:18,240 --> 01:37:23,800
mysteries, the ones you have
broadcast to the women in the

1449
01:37:23,800 --> 01:37:27,040
hardness of your hearts.
And by those mysteries the women

1450
01:37:27,040 --> 01:37:28,840
and men multiply evil deeds.
Of what was he?

1451
01:37:28,960 --> 01:37:31,720
What were they teaching them?
Chemistry and physics?

1452
01:37:31,720 --> 01:37:33,480
How to make stuff?
How to do stuff?

1453
01:37:35,080 --> 01:37:38,520
What does God call those?
The rejected mystery.

1454
01:37:39,760 --> 01:37:41,960
Those are things.
Relative to which Kingdom?

1455
01:37:43,040 --> 01:37:45,400
The telestial.
That's right.

1456
01:37:46,760 --> 01:37:52,800
So who were these watchers?
In my opinion, they were

1457
01:37:52,800 --> 01:37:56,520
telestials who were serving as
watchers.

1458
01:37:58,000 --> 01:38:01,200
OK.
And who allowed to make this

1459
01:38:01,200 --> 01:38:02,400
anyway?
Let's see.

1460
01:38:02,400 --> 01:38:06,800
Let's finish this.
And by the hardness of your

1461
01:38:06,800 --> 01:38:09,840
hearts and by those rejected
mysteries, the women and men

1462
01:38:09,840 --> 01:38:10,960
multiply evil leads on the
earth.

1463
01:38:10,960 --> 01:38:14,360
Tell them, tell them, Enoch.
Tell the watchers.

1464
01:38:14,360 --> 01:38:18,200
Therefore you will have no
peace.

1465
01:38:18,200 --> 01:38:21,640
Because of what?
OK.

1466
01:38:23,120 --> 01:38:27,680
What do you think of that?
I got some questions here,

1467
01:38:27,840 --> 01:38:30,600
right?
And, and I'm and, and I'm sure

1468
01:38:30,600 --> 01:38:32,520
you got the answers, but I'm
curious.

1469
01:38:34,440 --> 01:38:39,120
So with the keyless, if they are
a keyless, chill people, so to

1470
01:38:39,120 --> 01:38:42,320
speak, right?
They're dwelling in that space.

1471
01:38:42,960 --> 01:38:46,520
They're immortal, but they don't
have the higher ordinances.

1472
01:38:47,360 --> 01:38:48,840
That means they cannot be
celestial.

1473
01:38:49,560 --> 01:38:53,840
Now how do they then have powers
of procreation?

1474
01:38:54,480 --> 01:39:00,360
Because it isn't the powers of
procreation saved for those who

1475
01:39:01,440 --> 01:39:06,440
who have proven worthy right and
received the ordinances.

1476
01:39:06,440 --> 01:39:08,600
Wait, where does that teaching,
Where does that teaching come

1477
01:39:08,600 --> 01:39:12,760
from?
Hey, it would be inferred based

1478
01:39:12,760 --> 01:39:19,920
on based on the teachings that
that we probably received in

1479
01:39:19,920 --> 01:39:21,840
Sunday school, to be honest with
you, right?

1480
01:39:22,200 --> 01:39:26,560
And it's inferred.
It's inferred because the only

1481
01:39:26,560 --> 01:39:30,480
place it talks about having seed
endlessly is a celestial

1482
01:39:30,480 --> 01:39:36,680
existence.
OK, in section 132 says that

1483
01:39:37,280 --> 01:39:41,560
that we will bare the souls of
men in eternity, right?

1484
01:39:41,600 --> 01:39:50,000
As as celestials in the highest
degree in exalted beings, and

1485
01:39:50,000 --> 01:39:55,680
that only marriage performed
according to section 132 with

1486
01:39:55,680 --> 01:39:59,240
the proper authority, right?
And let having lived worthy of

1487
01:39:59,240 --> 01:40:04,240
our covenants, will that
marriage be honored in the

1488
01:40:04,240 --> 01:40:08,880
celestial Kingdom.
So far so good.

1489
01:40:09,240 --> 01:40:11,720
So God says if you do it, if you
do it the way I tell you, and

1490
01:40:11,720 --> 01:40:16,360
you're worthy of that, I.
By the authority of my Kingdom

1491
01:40:16,400 --> 01:40:18,640
will recognize and honor your
marriage.

1492
01:40:20,000 --> 01:40:23,880
What does that not say?
Or let me put it this way,

1493
01:40:23,880 --> 01:40:28,840
Joseph F Smith said the holy
priest adapted The order of the

1494
01:40:28,840 --> 01:40:33,160
Son of God is the only order we
know anything about.

1495
01:40:34,360 --> 01:40:38,840
So what God is saying is it, you
know, people can get married in

1496
01:40:38,840 --> 01:40:40,920
this life, right?
Right.

1497
01:40:41,040 --> 01:40:44,040
By various authorities, whatever
they claim state.

1498
01:40:46,680 --> 01:40:49,480
Does God disallow that marriage
on earth?

1499
01:40:50,080 --> 01:40:54,640
No.
No, He's only saying that I, I

1500
01:40:54,720 --> 01:40:57,960
because that marriage was not by
my authority, I won't recognize

1501
01:40:57,960 --> 01:41:03,120
it in my Kingdom.
Which means of course people are

1502
01:41:03,120 --> 01:41:06,600
going to have associations in
other kingdoms, correct?

1503
01:41:07,360 --> 01:41:08,440
Right.
Yep.

1504
01:41:08,880 --> 01:41:11,480
Of that I have no doubt.
Now here's the other interesting

1505
01:41:11,480 --> 01:41:16,680
thing about these watchers.
They envied men because guess

1506
01:41:16,680 --> 01:41:18,040
what?
They had no children.

1507
01:41:21,760 --> 01:41:26,960
So in the Telestial, apparently
the capacity to create the souls

1508
01:41:26,960 --> 01:41:30,440
or the spirits of men is limited
to the Exalted.

1509
01:41:31,880 --> 01:41:33,640
But the ACT.
That that's what I'm putting

1510
01:41:33,640 --> 01:41:38,040
forth as a hypothesis, as a.
Supposition.

1511
01:41:40,040 --> 01:41:43,440
OK, so you're saying that a
telestial person can't believe?

1512
01:41:43,440 --> 01:41:45,360
I'm going to put it this way,
but I don't have any.

1513
01:41:45,720 --> 01:41:47,600
Yeah, they got the junk.
Yeah, they got the junk.

1514
01:41:47,640 --> 01:41:50,240
They're functional.
They're they're junk and they're

1515
01:41:50,240 --> 01:41:55,840
functional, but like so, so are
they just burning with desire

1516
01:41:55,840 --> 01:41:58,240
and they see the women down on
earth and like.

1517
01:41:59,560 --> 01:42:03,240
Let me ask a rich environment,
Let me ask you, according to 70,

1518
01:42:03,240 --> 01:42:08,040
Section 76, what are celestial
beings like, by the way?

1519
01:42:08,200 --> 01:42:11,640
They existed, They're immortal,
and they exist in a glory that

1520
01:42:11,640 --> 01:42:19,400
is beyond our comprehension.
But it describes them as those

1521
01:42:19,560 --> 01:42:25,000
who love and make lies.
Even though they're given the

1522
01:42:25,000 --> 01:42:27,000
Kingdom of glory, and even
though they're given

1523
01:42:27,000 --> 01:42:29,120
immortality, it doesn't mean
they're good.

1524
01:42:29,120 --> 01:42:34,320
Do you know what I mean?
Yep, Yep.

1525
01:42:35,440 --> 01:42:39,280
And so they would have those
desires still, of course, I

1526
01:42:39,320 --> 01:42:43,400
mean, and then.
The The selfish will remain

1527
01:42:43,400 --> 01:42:45,920
selfish in eternity, just like
the devil and his followers.

1528
01:42:47,600 --> 01:42:51,280
Interesting.
But it's also interesting now

1529
01:42:52,280 --> 01:42:57,000
because something that people
have wondered about for a while

1530
01:42:57,000 --> 01:43:02,360
is once you've been assigned a
Kingdom, can you fall from that

1531
01:43:02,360 --> 01:43:07,720
Kingdom?
And that is a scary proposition,

1532
01:43:07,920 --> 01:43:11,680
right?
Well, I mean, my problem with

1533
01:43:11,680 --> 01:43:14,120
the question is that assumes
that the plan of salvation is

1534
01:43:14,120 --> 01:43:18,880
flawed, that we didn't give
enough time to prove ourselves,

1535
01:43:18,880 --> 01:43:21,040
and so the final judgement was a
mistake.

1536
01:43:23,400 --> 01:43:25,320
God is omniscient.
He's omnipotent.

1537
01:43:26,080 --> 01:43:28,800
He knows what you will do.
He knows what you will do.

1538
01:43:28,800 --> 01:43:30,440
He's seen it.
He sees it.

1539
01:43:31,840 --> 01:43:34,720
So final judgement.
I take that quite literally.

1540
01:43:34,920 --> 01:43:36,960
You're final.
And so, for example, these

1541
01:43:36,960 --> 01:43:41,600
watchers, they're telestial.
Now what happens to them?

1542
01:43:43,000 --> 01:43:44,520
They can't go any lower than
that.

1543
01:43:44,720 --> 01:43:48,520
Outer darkness only occurs if
you reject the atonement.

1544
01:43:49,240 --> 01:43:52,560
Clearly, they don't do that.
I see what you're where you're

1545
01:43:52,560 --> 01:43:53,880
going, OK.
So they're, they're just,

1546
01:43:53,880 --> 01:43:57,240
they're still telestials.
OK.

1547
01:43:57,720 --> 01:44:00,760
Now here's what's cool.
I forget which Enoch it's in,

1548
01:44:01,520 --> 01:44:08,960
but it describes the telestials
of these watchers mourning for

1549
01:44:08,960 --> 01:44:11,400
these people who did this and
how ashamed they are of it.

1550
01:44:12,160 --> 01:44:16,680
We'll we'll read some of that.
OK, Good question.

1551
01:44:17,480 --> 01:44:18,840
All right, how I get?
So.

1552
01:44:19,080 --> 01:44:23,760
So according to the Book of Can,
these fallen watchers are

1553
01:44:23,760 --> 01:44:28,120
telestials who don't have access
to the higher ordinances because

1554
01:44:28,120 --> 01:44:31,200
they were not worthy of it.
And we're allowed as a catalyst

1555
01:44:31,200 --> 01:44:34,400
for the flood to screw up on
purpose.

1556
01:44:35,040 --> 01:44:42,680
Wow.
Now let's skip to oh, dude,

1557
01:44:42,680 --> 01:44:49,800
there's so much in here.
Skipping to page 26.

1558
01:44:51,200 --> 01:44:58,080
So we're at chapter 24.
At the end of Chapter 24, we're

1559
01:44:58,080 --> 01:45:03,960
going to go from here.
Do they get that all in there?

1560
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:08,160
Almost.
So we're talking about he is

1561
01:45:08,160 --> 01:45:14,840
looking at describing this holy
place where he is.

1562
01:45:15,840 --> 01:45:21,360
And among them there was one
tree such as I have never at all

1563
01:45:21,360 --> 01:45:25,320
smelled, and there is not a
single one among those or other

1564
01:45:25,320 --> 01:45:31,320
trees which is like it.
Among all the fragrances nothing

1565
01:45:31,320 --> 01:45:34,880
could be so fragrant.
Its leaves, its flowers, its

1566
01:45:34,880 --> 01:45:40,640
wood would never wither forever.
Its fruit is beautiful and

1567
01:45:40,640 --> 01:45:44,840
resembles the clustered fruits
of a palm tree ringing a bell.

1568
01:45:44,840 --> 01:45:48,240
Yet at that moment I said, this
is a beautiful tree, beautiful

1569
01:45:48,240 --> 01:45:51,840
to view, with leaves so handsome
blossom, so magnificent in

1570
01:45:51,840 --> 01:45:54,800
appearance.
Then Michael, one of the holy

1571
01:45:54,800 --> 01:45:58,280
and revered angels, he is their
chief, who was with me,

1572
01:45:58,280 --> 01:46:02,240
responded to me, and he said
unto me, so there's this guide,

1573
01:46:02,280 --> 01:46:05,960
very common figure.
Enoch, what is it that you are

1574
01:46:05,960 --> 01:46:09,240
asking me concerning the
fragrance of this tree and you

1575
01:46:09,240 --> 01:46:12,480
are so inquisitive about?
At that moment I answered

1576
01:46:12,480 --> 01:46:16,440
saying, I'm desirous of knowing
everything, which was one of why

1577
01:46:17,080 --> 01:46:19,800
Enoch was awesome, but
especially about this thing.

1578
01:46:20,080 --> 01:46:22,280
He answered, saying, This tall
mountain which you saw, who

1579
01:46:22,280 --> 01:46:25,920
somewhat resembles the throne of
God, is indeed his throne, on

1580
01:46:25,920 --> 01:46:29,080
which the holy and great Lord,
Lord of Glory, the Eternal King,

1581
01:46:29,080 --> 01:46:33,880
will sit when he descends to
visit the earth with goodness.

1582
01:46:35,200 --> 01:46:38,120
So he's still on.
This is a vision of the earth,

1583
01:46:38,600 --> 01:46:43,040
and it's glorified.
Ah, paradocyical state.

1584
01:46:43,680 --> 01:46:47,560
And As for this fragrant tree,
not a single human being has the

1585
01:46:47,560 --> 01:46:52,240
authority to touch it until the
Great Judgement, when he shall

1586
01:46:52,240 --> 01:46:55,280
take vengeance on all and
conclude everything forever.

1587
01:46:55,280 --> 01:46:59,440
This is for the righteous and
the pious, and the elect will be

1588
01:46:59,440 --> 01:47:02,600
presented with its fruit for
life.

1589
01:47:02,600 --> 01:47:04,680
What would you call?
It a tree of life.

1590
01:47:05,000 --> 01:47:07,640
It's a tree of life.
He will plant it in the

1591
01:47:07,640 --> 01:47:11,600
direction of the northeast, upon
the holy place, in the direction

1592
01:47:11,600 --> 01:47:15,200
of the House of the Lord and the
Eternal King.

1593
01:47:15,800 --> 01:47:19,280
Then they shall be glad and
rejoice in gladness.

1594
01:47:19,680 --> 01:47:21,720
They shall enter into the holy
place.

1595
01:47:22,120 --> 01:47:24,520
It's fragrance shall penetrate
their bones.

1596
01:47:24,840 --> 01:47:28,760
Long life will they live on
earth, such such as your

1597
01:47:28,760 --> 01:47:34,240
father's lived in their days.
Speaking of Adam, who else knows

1598
01:47:34,240 --> 01:47:37,600
about the tree of life in that
kind of detail?

1599
01:47:38,400 --> 01:47:44,560
Just us love that.
Isn't that a Oh, there's so much

1600
01:47:44,560 --> 01:47:49,520
this so.
There's, there is some way deep

1601
01:47:49,520 --> 01:47:54,720
temple theology there and I'm
not even going to touch it, but

1602
01:47:54,880 --> 01:48:00,280
for those who've studied those
things out, that should really

1603
01:48:00,280 --> 01:48:04,960
ring a bell, especially where it
talks about the judgement and

1604
01:48:04,960 --> 01:48:07,560
that sort of thing.
And then partaking of the fruit

1605
01:48:07,800 --> 01:48:10,360
which will grant eternal life
essentially.

1606
01:48:15,280 --> 01:48:18,320
The other thing I love about
these these doctrines not only

1607
01:48:18,320 --> 01:48:22,520
correlate with what we know and
believe already, but they give

1608
01:48:22,520 --> 01:48:25,680
us additional detail, which is
so cool.

1609
01:48:26,520 --> 01:48:34,400
Now chapter 32 describes another
tree and the tree of wisdom,

1610
01:48:35,280 --> 01:48:39,120
which we would call.
Knowledge of good and evil.

1611
01:48:39,560 --> 01:48:43,640
And the tree of wisdom, of which
one eats and knows great wisdom,

1612
01:48:43,640 --> 01:48:47,200
was among them.
It looked like the colors of the

1613
01:48:47,200 --> 01:48:51,560
carob tree, its fruit like the
beautiful grape clusters.

1614
01:48:51,760 --> 01:48:56,120
So instead of being white,
terrestrial is a telestial

1615
01:48:56,120 --> 01:48:59,840
fruit, and the fragrance of this
tree travels and reaches afar.

1616
01:49:00,400 --> 01:49:03,000
And I said this tree is
beautiful, and it's appearance

1617
01:49:03,000 --> 01:49:06,440
beautiful and pleasant.
Then the holy Angel Raphael, who

1618
01:49:06,440 --> 01:49:10,560
was with me, responded to me and
said this very thing is the tree

1619
01:49:10,560 --> 01:49:14,640
of wisdom from which your old
father and aged mother, Adam and

1620
01:49:14,640 --> 01:49:18,160
Eve, they who are your
precursors, ate and came to know

1621
01:49:18,160 --> 01:49:20,600
wisdom.
And consequently their eyes were

1622
01:49:20,600 --> 01:49:23,520
opened and they realized that
they were naked.

1623
01:49:23,840 --> 01:49:25,480
And so they were expelled from
the garden.

1624
01:49:32,240 --> 01:49:35,840
Interesting.
Yeah, it's also good.

1625
01:49:36,600 --> 01:49:43,440
Now we're going to read.
Oh, it taught me.

1626
01:49:43,480 --> 01:49:51,000
OK, let's do that 38 Chapter 38
talks about this one.

1627
01:49:51,760 --> 01:49:59,480
Where will the dwelling of the
sinners be and where doing that?

1628
01:49:59,480 --> 01:50:01,520
And where the resting place of
those who denied the name of the

1629
01:50:01,520 --> 01:50:05,400
Lord of the spirits?
Oh, here's the second part of

1630
01:50:05,400 --> 01:50:10,040
the question is, is the one and
where is the resting place of

1631
01:50:10,040 --> 01:50:16,280
those who denied God, who denied
the name of the Lord, who denied

1632
01:50:16,280 --> 01:50:18,000
Christ?
The answer?

1633
01:50:18,360 --> 01:50:23,040
It would have been better for
them not to happen more because

1634
01:50:23,040 --> 01:50:24,560
they're going to be an outer
darkness anyway.

1635
01:50:25,400 --> 01:50:34,280
Yep.
OK, now I want to skip down to

1636
01:50:35,120 --> 01:50:40,080
chapter 39 verse 11 which reads
this.

1637
01:50:41,360 --> 01:50:44,520
This is going to fly in the face
of the rest of Christianity.

1638
01:50:45,520 --> 01:50:51,200
There is no such thing as non
existence before him.

1639
01:50:52,160 --> 01:50:57,160
Even the world was created.
He knows what is forever and

1640
01:50:57,160 --> 01:50:59,320
what will be from generation to
generation.

1641
01:51:01,600 --> 01:51:07,800
Not X nila, correct?
Not X nila, not out of nothing.

1642
01:51:08,200 --> 01:51:11,600
There's no such matter
unorganized.

1643
01:51:11,840 --> 01:51:15,400
There's no such thing as
immaterial matter, says Joseph

1644
01:51:15,400 --> 01:51:18,680
Smith.
Oh, there's a lucky 10.

1645
01:51:18,680 --> 01:51:24,600
Let's skip to chapter 46.
Well, let's see how far we want

1646
01:51:24,600 --> 01:51:29,000
to go here at that place.
I saw the one to whom belongs

1647
01:51:29,000 --> 01:51:33,960
the time before time.
Joseph Smith may have explained

1648
01:51:33,960 --> 01:51:38,200
this when he said God, the
Father of us all was once a

1649
01:51:38,200 --> 01:51:48,520
Christ on his world.
The time before time, the

1650
01:51:48,520 --> 01:51:51,200
previous eternity, the time
before our.

1651
01:51:51,600 --> 01:51:53,640
OK, Yep.
Nope, that makes sense.

1652
01:51:54,760 --> 01:51:56,920
And his head was like white
wool.

1653
01:51:56,920 --> 01:52:00,400
And there was with him another
individual whose face was like

1654
01:52:00,400 --> 01:52:02,600
that of a human being.
And his countless was full of

1655
01:52:02,600 --> 01:52:05,840
grace, like that of one among
the holy angels.

1656
01:52:06,280 --> 01:52:08,800
And I asked for the one from
among the angels who was with

1657
01:52:08,960 --> 01:52:11,880
who was going with me and who
had revealed to me all the

1658
01:52:11,880 --> 01:52:14,680
secrets regarding the one who
was born of human beings.

1659
01:52:15,320 --> 01:52:18,200
Guy who was translating this
didn't know anything about

1660
01:52:18,200 --> 01:52:22,480
Joseph Smith and the teaching
eternities in plural.

1661
01:52:23,200 --> 01:52:26,920
He's just translating the word
and putting it down and hope

1662
01:52:26,920 --> 01:52:29,280
somebody can make sense of it.
Right.

1663
01:52:30,120 --> 01:52:33,240
And it takes educated louder to
say to read this and go, and

1664
01:52:33,240 --> 01:52:36,600
that's what he's talking about.
Who's the prototype of the

1665
01:52:36,600 --> 01:52:38,080
before time?
Who's the prototype of the

1666
01:52:38,080 --> 01:52:41,000
Father?
The Son?

1667
01:52:43,160 --> 01:52:45,400
He's the prototype of the before
time.

1668
01:52:45,800 --> 01:52:49,240
And he answered me and said to
me, This is the Son of man, TA

1669
01:52:49,240 --> 01:52:52,880
Dah, to whom belongs
righteousness, and with whom

1670
01:52:52,880 --> 01:52:54,960
belongs righteousness.
And he will open all the hidden

1671
01:52:54,960 --> 01:52:57,360
storerooms.
For the Lord of the spirits has

1672
01:52:57,360 --> 01:53:01,000
chosen him, and he is destined
to be victorious before the Lord

1673
01:53:01,000 --> 01:53:02,520
of the spirits in eternal
uprightness.

1674
01:53:02,520 --> 01:53:06,640
This Son of Man whom you have
seen is the one who would remove

1675
01:53:06,640 --> 01:53:08,720
the kings and the mighty ones
when they come from seats and

1676
01:53:08,720 --> 01:53:09,960
the strong ones from their
Thrones.

1677
01:53:10,600 --> 01:53:14,360
I love that how he it shows the
relationship between the Father

1678
01:53:14,360 --> 01:53:17,680
of the Son in an eternal sense.
Absolutely.

1679
01:53:19,440 --> 01:53:24,400
Oh, that's that's deep.
And here, this, this almost

1680
01:53:24,400 --> 01:53:32,600
feels like these last few don't
feel like it's it's, it's

1681
01:53:32,600 --> 01:53:36,400
groundbreaking as far as new
theology, but it is fascinating

1682
01:53:36,400 --> 01:53:39,200
to see the bull's eyes, right?
Yeah, yeah.

1683
01:53:39,480 --> 01:53:43,720
Looking towards Christ, the one
like unto the Son of man, or the

1684
01:53:43,720 --> 01:53:49,880
one like unto to God.
Yeah, Chapter 51, talking about

1685
01:53:49,880 --> 01:53:54,080
when people are resurrected in
those days of the resurrection,

1686
01:53:54,360 --> 01:54:00,240
Sheol, the Earth will return all
the deposits which she has

1687
01:54:00,240 --> 01:54:02,360
received.
The resurrection.

1688
01:54:03,120 --> 01:54:06,440
Yeah, that's it.
I love.

1689
01:54:06,440 --> 01:54:08,000
That's just an interesting way
to put it.

1690
01:54:08,640 --> 01:54:15,280
Now let's skip over to chapter
62 and 65.

1691
01:54:16,520 --> 01:54:20,080
The righteous and elect ones
shall be saved on that day,

1692
01:54:20,600 --> 01:54:24,840
Speaking of the elect, and from
thenceforth they shall never see

1693
01:54:24,840 --> 01:54:26,920
the faces of the sinners and the
oppressors.

1694
01:54:28,080 --> 01:54:30,240
The Lord of the spirits will
abide over them.

1695
01:54:30,760 --> 01:54:35,800
They shall eat and rest and rise
with the Son of Man forever and

1696
01:54:35,800 --> 01:54:37,440
ever.
How does that sound?

1697
01:54:40,160 --> 01:54:43,920
Yeah, the righteous and elect
ones shall rise from the earth

1698
01:54:44,520 --> 01:54:46,920
and shall cease being of
downcast face.

1699
01:54:47,560 --> 01:54:49,480
They shall wear the garments of
glory.

1700
01:54:51,200 --> 01:54:53,840
These garments of yours shall
become these.

1701
01:54:54,880 --> 01:54:58,360
Speaking to Edith, these
garments of yours that you're

1702
01:54:58,360 --> 01:55:02,120
wearing now because he's been
endowed shall become the

1703
01:55:02,120 --> 01:55:04,960
garments of life from the Lord
of Spirits.

1704
01:55:05,600 --> 01:55:10,480
Neither shall your garments wear
out, nor your glory come to an

1705
01:55:10,480 --> 01:55:12,120
end before the Lord of the
Spirits.

1706
01:55:12,760 --> 01:55:14,760
The symbolism of the garments
he's wearing is it.

1707
01:55:15,280 --> 01:55:16,840
Those will be the garments of
eternal life.

1708
01:55:18,040 --> 01:55:21,120
To give us pause as Mormons when
we think about the garments that

1709
01:55:21,120 --> 01:55:28,360
we are gifted.
Yeah, OK, Now we're starting to

1710
01:55:28,360 --> 01:55:35,000
talk about the flood.
I want to go to here.

1711
01:55:36,800 --> 01:55:39,880
Chapter 65.
In those days, Noah saw the

1712
01:55:39,920 --> 01:55:42,840
earth, that she had become
deformed.

1713
01:55:44,320 --> 01:55:48,120
I forgot something.
Remember the big deal that was

1714
01:55:48,120 --> 01:55:51,120
made out of the giants?
How they drank their blood.

1715
01:55:52,320 --> 01:55:58,040
Yeah.
When that that was a commonly

1716
01:55:58,040 --> 01:56:01,640
understood teaching by the
writers of the New Testament

1717
01:56:02,240 --> 01:56:03,840
because they had the writings of
Enoch.

1718
01:56:05,600 --> 01:56:07,720
Remember the scriptures.
I don't know exactly which one

1719
01:56:07,720 --> 01:56:11,160
is where it talks about in the
days of Noah and they were

1720
01:56:11,160 --> 01:56:15,360
eating and drinking and making
merry and how horrible that was.

1721
01:56:17,520 --> 01:56:20,600
I've always read that so I
should never eat or drink or

1722
01:56:20,600 --> 01:56:22,440
make merry.
Is that is that?

1723
01:56:22,440 --> 01:56:24,880
What caused the blood?
No, it's about.

1724
01:56:24,880 --> 01:56:28,520
What they were eating.
That phrase is commonly

1725
01:56:28,520 --> 01:56:31,840
understood euphemism for
cannibalism.

1726
01:56:33,440 --> 01:56:34,560
You know.
I can't.

1727
01:56:34,560 --> 01:56:37,920
Eating the flesh, eating the
flesh and drinking the blood of

1728
01:56:37,920 --> 01:56:41,320
mankind and making merry.
That's what that is in reference

1729
01:56:41,320 --> 01:56:46,080
to.
Interestingly enough, Satan

1730
01:56:46,080 --> 01:56:50,800
being like, say it's not enough
for Satan just to go the

1731
01:56:50,800 --> 01:56:54,120
opposite direction.
He's got to take something and

1732
01:56:54,120 --> 01:57:04,360
twist it and, and, and so like
eating the flesh and drinking

1733
01:57:04,360 --> 01:57:07,960
the blood is also for the
sacrament, right?

1734
01:57:08,360 --> 01:57:09,560
And there's this.
Twisting.

1735
01:57:10,440 --> 01:57:13,240
There's a the same twisting that
we see, right?

1736
01:57:13,600 --> 01:57:15,080
And look, I'll get, I'll get
real.

1737
01:57:15,080 --> 01:57:17,200
He's the He's the great
counterfeit.

1738
01:57:17,920 --> 01:57:21,440
Yes, exactly.
It's, it's a twisting the, the

1739
01:57:21,440 --> 01:57:26,600
other thing I want to say about
this, this is interesting too.

1740
01:57:26,600 --> 01:57:28,440
And this is going to go beyond
Joseph Smith.

1741
01:57:28,440 --> 01:57:29,960
This is going to go to John
Taylor.

1742
01:57:30,480 --> 01:57:35,960
There's that interesting vision
that John Taylor has when he's

1743
01:57:35,960 --> 01:57:40,280
in the Tabernacle.
And then he's the dream starts

1744
01:57:40,280 --> 01:57:45,680
out in the Tabernacle, and then
he sees massive disease in war

1745
01:57:45,680 --> 01:57:50,200
in America.
And the most horrific scene, the

1746
01:57:50,200 --> 01:57:53,320
most horrific scene is when
mothers kill their children to

1747
01:57:53,320 --> 01:57:54,840
eat their flesh and drink their
blood.

1748
01:57:55,320 --> 01:57:58,920
Right.
Like these ancient things creep

1749
01:57:58,920 --> 01:58:02,720
back into the modern right, into
modernity.

1750
01:58:03,400 --> 01:58:05,800
And I think that's the most
frightening part about it.

1751
01:58:06,360 --> 01:58:09,800
You know we.
Tend to look at ourselves as so

1752
01:58:10,200 --> 01:58:15,200
advanced, but we are just the
veil of the the veneer of

1753
01:58:15,200 --> 01:58:19,960
civilization is so thin you.
Know who else you know who else

1754
01:58:19,960 --> 01:58:22,800
saw that vision, Enoch?
We'll read about it.

1755
01:58:23,000 --> 01:58:24,480
Saw that same vision almost.
OK.

1756
01:58:26,960 --> 01:58:30,080
All right.
So chapter in those days, Noah

1757
01:58:30,080 --> 01:58:33,040
saw the earth, that she had
become deformed, sinful, and

1758
01:58:33,040 --> 01:58:35,120
that her destruction was at
hand.

1759
01:58:36,000 --> 01:58:40,040
And Noah took off from there and
went on to the extreme ends of

1760
01:58:40,040 --> 01:58:42,240
the earth.
And he cried out to his

1761
01:58:42,240 --> 01:58:48,240
grandfather.
His grandfather was Enoch and

1762
01:58:48,240 --> 01:58:50,640
said it to him three times with
a bitter voice.

1763
01:58:51,080 --> 01:58:57,400
Hear me, hear me, hear me.
Oh, now this.

1764
01:58:57,400 --> 01:58:59,720
Is how did he know that pattern
of prayer?

1765
01:59:01,400 --> 01:59:06,640
Well, this is interesting too,
Ken, because if, if I'm

1766
01:59:06,640 --> 01:59:09,760
remembering correctly, back at
the beginning where we started

1767
01:59:09,760 --> 01:59:13,640
all this.
No, yeah, no, it was, it was

1768
01:59:13,640 --> 01:59:16,320
Noah that was born, what, five
years before?

1769
01:59:18,800 --> 01:59:22,600
Five years.
He he born five years after they

1770
01:59:22,600 --> 01:59:27,040
were translated, I think.
I should, yeah.

1771
01:59:27,040 --> 01:59:28,640
I shouldn't have said die.
I meant translated.

1772
01:59:30,680 --> 01:59:32,680
He's doing something interesting
here.

1773
01:59:33,360 --> 01:59:36,920
He's he's essentially praying to
his grandfather.

1774
01:59:36,920 --> 01:59:43,600
Correct.
Yeah, well, yeah, says he cried

1775
01:59:43,600 --> 01:59:46,960
out to his grandfather, but it
doesn't say he said hear me,

1776
01:59:46,960 --> 01:59:48,800
hear me, hear me three times to
his grandfather.

1777
01:59:49,240 --> 01:59:51,800
He could have cried out his
grandfather and then engaged in

1778
01:59:51,800 --> 01:59:54,320
prayer anyway.
OK.

1779
01:59:54,640 --> 01:59:58,720
All right.
And I said unto him, Tell me,

1780
01:59:58,720 --> 02:00:01,600
what is this thing that is being
done upon the earth?

1781
02:00:02,520 --> 02:00:06,520
For the earth is struggling and
in this manner and is being

1782
02:00:06,520 --> 02:00:09,360
shaken.
So something is happening to the

1783
02:00:09,360 --> 02:00:10,920
earth that's being deformed and
shaken.

1784
02:00:12,000 --> 02:00:14,440
But this part really struck me
perhaps.

1785
02:00:14,960 --> 02:00:19,080
I will perish with her, with the
earth in the impact.

1786
02:00:20,400 --> 02:00:22,760
Are they seeing celestial bodies
fall from heaven?

1787
02:00:23,520 --> 02:00:27,960
That's see that's what struck me
and clearly when I, this is I

1788
02:00:27,960 --> 02:00:31,600
read this at the time I was
understanding learning about

1789
02:00:32,040 --> 02:00:35,320
mass extinction events that have
happened previously on this

1790
02:00:35,320 --> 02:00:40,280
Earth that we know have happened
at least four or five times in a

1791
02:00:40,600 --> 02:00:44,240
very, very big way.
And that there have been

1792
02:00:44,240 --> 02:00:49,040
astronomical killer asteroids
strike the Earth hundreds of

1793
02:00:49,040 --> 02:00:53,200
times.
Certainly Noah would be

1794
02:00:53,200 --> 02:00:55,800
describing this.
Certainly he's describing and

1795
02:00:55,800 --> 02:00:59,080
there are other passages we'll
come across at First Enoch that

1796
02:00:59,080 --> 02:01:02,160
describe the just the flood
occurring by this mechanism.

1797
02:01:03,760 --> 02:01:07,720
This is interesting too, because
if we start looking at incidents

1798
02:01:08,240 --> 02:01:11,440
that and, and this is the whole
reason I'm not a young earth

1799
02:01:11,440 --> 02:01:15,640
creationist, by the way, there
are statements from Joseph Smith

1800
02:01:15,640 --> 02:01:18,800
that talks about the difference
between a world and earth,

1801
02:01:19,040 --> 02:01:22,160
right?
A world is a sphere that is

1802
02:01:22,160 --> 02:01:26,760
inhabited.
OK, so we start looking at

1803
02:01:27,040 --> 02:01:31,000
events and look, carbon dating
is pretty accurate, but it's got

1804
02:01:31,000 --> 02:01:33,320
some flaws, right?
There's a few things in there

1805
02:01:33,320 --> 02:01:36,320
that that don't quite.
It's only good for, it's only

1806
02:01:36,320 --> 02:01:37,760
good for 10s of thousands of
years.

1807
02:01:37,840 --> 02:01:41,520
It doesn't do that really right.
But if we look at like an event

1808
02:01:41,520 --> 02:01:45,440
like the younger driest period,
the younger, the younger driest

1809
02:01:45,440 --> 02:01:49,880
impact hypothesis, that gets
very interesting, especially in

1810
02:01:49,880 --> 02:01:55,200
connection with the flood, the
flood stories that seem to be

1811
02:01:55,200 --> 02:01:57,560
ubiquitous across the globe.
Yep.

1812
02:01:58,760 --> 02:02:00,080
Yeah.
The end of the Ice Age could

1813
02:02:00,080 --> 02:02:02,440
well have been the end of the
age of the patriarchs.

1814
02:02:02,440 --> 02:02:05,560
I I think that could be there
could be a coincidence there.

1815
02:02:06,680 --> 02:02:10,560
All right.
In those days, the word of God

1816
02:02:10,560 --> 02:02:14,480
came unto me and said unto me,
Noah, your lot has come up

1817
02:02:14,480 --> 02:02:19,080
before me, a lot without blame,
a lot of true love.

1818
02:02:19,480 --> 02:02:22,800
And this time the angels are
working with wood, making an

1819
02:02:22,800 --> 02:02:25,080
ark.
And when it is completed, I

1820
02:02:25,080 --> 02:02:29,080
shall place my hands upon it and
protect it, and the seed of life

1821
02:02:29,080 --> 02:02:33,400
shall arise from it, and a
substitute generation will come

1822
02:02:33,880 --> 02:02:36,160
so that the earth will not
remain empty.

1823
02:02:37,080 --> 02:02:41,240
I shall strengthen your seed
before me forever and ever, as

1824
02:02:41,240 --> 02:02:43,600
well as the seeds of those who
dwell with you.

1825
02:02:44,640 --> 02:02:47,960
I shall not put it to trial on
the face of the earth, but it

1826
02:02:47,960 --> 02:02:49,640
shall be blessed.
I'll multiply on the earth in

1827
02:02:49,640 --> 02:02:51,760
the name of the Lord.
And they shall imprison those

1828
02:02:51,760 --> 02:02:55,280
angels who revealed oppression
in that burning valley.

1829
02:02:55,280 --> 02:02:59,000
So they're going to imprison
those watchers that fell.

1830
02:03:00,800 --> 02:03:02,560
It's shown to me in the West
among the mounds of gold,

1831
02:03:02,560 --> 02:03:05,920
silver, arbrozatin.
I also saw that valley in which

1832
02:03:05,920 --> 02:03:08,120
there took place a great
turbulence in the stirring of

1833
02:03:08,120 --> 02:03:11,840
the waters.
Now when all this took place, it

1834
02:03:11,840 --> 02:03:13,280
was produced from that bronze
and fire.

1835
02:03:13,280 --> 02:03:15,720
I smell of silver which blended
the waters, etcetera, filled

1836
02:03:15,720 --> 02:03:17,960
with the Rose of the water shall
be punished.

1837
02:03:18,040 --> 02:03:21,800
Now let's go on from now.
I don't.

1838
02:03:21,840 --> 02:03:25,720
I don't need to read that.
Oh, on one second before we go

1839
02:03:25,720 --> 02:03:28,880
on, there's an interesting piece
of information that's

1840
02:03:28,880 --> 02:03:33,520
transmitted right there.
And that is we we, we make the

1841
02:03:33,520 --> 02:03:36,080
assumption that it's just Noah
and his boys working on that

1842
02:03:36,080 --> 02:03:37,800
ark.
But here it says the angels were

1843
02:03:37,800 --> 02:03:42,760
helping.
The book of the book of Adam and

1844
02:03:42,760 --> 02:03:46,440
Eve say that Noah was given to
that.

1845
02:03:46,440 --> 02:03:50,760
Noah was translated during this
time so that his things wouldn't

1846
02:03:50,760 --> 02:03:53,760
wear out and he would have the
energy to do it, to build, and

1847
02:03:53,760 --> 02:03:56,680
that he was paying the wicked to
build it with jewels.

1848
02:03:57,160 --> 02:03:59,680
The Lord had provided with all
these jewels and gems to pay

1849
02:03:59,680 --> 02:04:02,680
people to build it.
They were building their the ark

1850
02:04:02,680 --> 02:04:05,360
for Noah.
But he also said that there was

1851
02:04:05,360 --> 02:04:09,320
an Angel who sealed up the ark
and who guided the ark and

1852
02:04:09,320 --> 02:04:10,960
protected the ark through the
flood.

1853
02:04:11,680 --> 02:04:15,200
So clearly there was divine
intervention to help save the

1854
02:04:15,800 --> 02:04:25,000
plan of salvation.
Let's see chapter 69 that starts

1855
02:04:25,000 --> 02:04:31,040
here at the very end.
Through their agency, the

1856
02:04:31,040 --> 02:04:33,560
children of the people, death
proceeds.

1857
02:04:34,840 --> 02:04:36,280
I wish there wasn't a page break
there.

1858
02:04:37,640 --> 02:04:40,640
Death through their agency
because they've chosen evil.

1859
02:04:40,800 --> 02:04:44,120
Their agency, which that's
straight up Mormon doctrine.

1860
02:04:45,000 --> 02:04:47,880
Death proceeds against the
people who dwell upon the earth

1861
02:04:47,880 --> 02:04:52,720
from that day forevermore.
The 4th is named to one of these

1862
02:04:52,720 --> 02:04:55,920
fallen watchers, who
demonstrated to the children of

1863
02:04:55,920 --> 02:04:59,720
people the bitter in the sweet.
Oh.

1864
02:05:00,200 --> 02:05:02,360
This one demonstrated the
children of the people.

1865
02:05:02,360 --> 02:05:07,040
The bitter in the sweet
opposition revealed to them all

1866
02:05:07,040 --> 02:05:09,080
the secrets of their wisdom.
Furthermore, he caused the

1867
02:05:09,080 --> 02:05:11,880
people to penetrate the secret
of writing.

1868
02:05:11,880 --> 02:05:15,320
They use ink and paper.
There are many who have erred

1869
02:05:15,320 --> 02:05:18,080
from eternity to eternity until
this very day.

1870
02:05:20,880 --> 02:05:24,520
Anyway, it goes on permanently
maintain.

1871
02:05:24,520 --> 02:05:29,080
For indeed, human beings were
not created to be like angels,

1872
02:05:29,080 --> 02:05:30,960
permanently to maintain fear and
righteous life's.

1873
02:05:30,960 --> 02:05:34,360
Death, which destroys
everything, would have not

1874
02:05:34,360 --> 02:05:36,480
touched them had it not been
through their knowledge by which

1875
02:05:36,480 --> 02:05:38,920
they shall perish.
Talking about the tree of

1876
02:05:39,320 --> 02:05:43,320
knowledge, death is now eating
us by means of this power.

1877
02:05:45,480 --> 02:05:50,200
Oh, here we go.
The 5th is then Casadia and he

1878
02:05:50,200 --> 02:05:53,160
who revealed to the children of
the people the various

1879
02:05:53,160 --> 02:05:57,040
flagellations of all evil,
flagellation of the souls and

1880
02:05:57,040 --> 02:06:02,000
the demons, the smashing of the
embryo in the womb, so that I

1881
02:06:02,000 --> 02:06:05,240
might be crushed.
They were doing abortion.

1882
02:06:05,240 --> 02:06:07,440
They were taught abortion.
That's right.

1883
02:06:10,600 --> 02:06:12,200
That gave me chills in a bad
way.

1884
02:06:13,000 --> 02:06:17,800
Like, like just, and it should
just go to show, and I've said

1885
02:06:17,800 --> 02:06:20,800
it before, right?
There's nothing new about the

1886
02:06:20,800 --> 02:06:23,720
evil we engage in.
It's just simply repackaged for

1887
02:06:23,720 --> 02:06:30,240
modern consumption.
And that shows that the, in my

1888
02:06:30,240 --> 02:06:34,360
opinion, the most abominable act
we commit today.

1889
02:06:35,120 --> 02:06:39,560
Agreed.
Has its origins in a fallen

1890
02:06:40,160 --> 02:06:46,800
species of of heavenly beings, I
mean.

1891
02:06:49,280 --> 02:06:53,440
The the the truly wicked yet
well, we get to some good stuff.

1892
02:06:54,880 --> 02:07:02,280
Thus it happened that Thus it
happened in the Book of Mormon

1893
02:07:02,280 --> 02:07:05,360
would read, and it came to pass.
And thus it came to pass, yeah.

1894
02:07:06,160 --> 02:07:07,960
And so it happened.
Thus it happened that it came to

1895
02:07:07,960 --> 02:07:11,520
pass after this that my spirit
passed out of sight and

1896
02:07:11,520 --> 02:07:15,040
descended into the heavens.
And I saw the sons of the holy

1897
02:07:15,040 --> 02:07:21,600
angels walking upon the flame of
fire, being transported by the

1898
02:07:21,600 --> 02:07:25,280
pillar of light.
Is not In another word, their

1899
02:07:25,280 --> 02:07:28,760
garments were white and their
overcoats, and the light of

1900
02:07:28,760 --> 02:07:33,840
their faces was like snow.
I love that.

1901
02:07:36,120 --> 02:07:39,680
Yep.
And down here he carried off my

1902
02:07:39,680 --> 02:07:42,160
spirit, and I, Enoch was in the
heaven of heavens.

1903
02:07:42,880 --> 02:07:45,560
There I saw in the midst of that
light a structure built of

1904
02:07:45,560 --> 02:07:52,320
crystals like this, and between
those crystals tongues of living

1905
02:07:52,320 --> 02:07:54,080
fire.
This thing again in my spirit

1906
02:07:54,080 --> 02:07:59,720
saw a ring which encircled the
structure of fire, and on its

1907
02:07:59,720 --> 02:08:03,600
four sides were rivers full of
living fire which encircled it.

1908
02:08:04,360 --> 02:08:10,200
Moreover, seraphim, cherubim,
and ofanim the sleepless. 1 So

1909
02:08:10,200 --> 02:08:14,400
here we have 3 celestial
creatures serving this plant,

1910
02:08:14,400 --> 02:08:18,040
serving God, Cherubim.
We have descriptions, Seraphim

1911
02:08:18,040 --> 02:08:20,840
ofum.
We don't know as much about who

1912
02:08:20,840 --> 02:08:24,520
guard the throne of his glory
Also encircled it.

1913
02:08:25,040 --> 02:08:30,160
And I saw countless angels
100,000 * 100 thousand 10

1914
02:08:30,160 --> 02:08:34,440
million * 10 million encircling
that house.

1915
02:08:35,440 --> 02:08:39,000
This is a 4000 year old document
talking about numbers at that

1916
02:08:39,000 --> 02:08:42,880
magnitude.
Michael, Raphael, Gabriel

1917
02:08:42,880 --> 02:08:46,560
Faneuil and numerous other holy
angels that are in heaven above

1918
02:08:46,560 --> 02:08:52,640
go in and out of that house.
They are countless with them as

1919
02:08:52,640 --> 02:08:57,120
the antecedent of time, the
before time, The Father.

1920
02:08:57,680 --> 02:08:59,520
His head is white and pure like
wood.

1921
02:08:59,520 --> 02:09:03,560
His garment is indescribable.
I fell on my face, my whole body

1922
02:09:03,560 --> 02:09:05,240
mollified, and my spirit
transformed.

1923
02:09:05,240 --> 02:09:06,640
But then I cried with a great
voice.

1924
02:09:06,640 --> 02:09:08,960
By the spirit of the power
blessing, glorifying and

1925
02:09:08,960 --> 02:09:13,360
extolling crying with a great
voice is to sing.

1926
02:09:14,200 --> 02:09:17,520
We'll read about this has a
little bit of overlap with third

1927
02:09:17,520 --> 02:09:22,320
Enoch and those are the
blessings which went forth out

1928
02:09:22,320 --> 02:09:28,120
of my mouth, being well pleasing
in the presence of that of the

1929
02:09:28,120 --> 02:09:29,480
Father.
Antecedent of time.

1930
02:09:30,080 --> 02:09:33,320
Then the antecedent of Time came
with Michael Gabriel Raphael

1931
02:09:33,320 --> 02:09:38,560
Fanwell at 100,000 * 10 million
* 100,000 angels that are

1932
02:09:38,560 --> 02:09:43,360
countless.
It's a big book, isn't it?

1933
02:09:45,200 --> 02:09:48,640
What's that?
It's a big book, yes.

1934
02:09:48,640 --> 02:09:53,080
It is.
We're just in First Scenic.

1935
02:09:54,520 --> 02:10:01,520
Yeah, no, in respect to their
days, the sinners and the winter

1936
02:10:01,520 --> 02:10:05,160
are cut short.
Their seeds shall lag behind in

1937
02:10:05,160 --> 02:10:08,720
their lands and their fertile
and in their fertile fields, and

1938
02:10:08,720 --> 02:10:10,000
in all their activities upon the
earth.

1939
02:10:10,000 --> 02:10:14,440
He will turn and appear in their
time and withhold rain, and the

1940
02:10:14,440 --> 02:10:16,480
sky shall stand still at that
time.

1941
02:10:16,920 --> 02:10:21,800
Then the vegetables shall slice,
talk about famine, and not grow

1942
02:10:21,800 --> 02:10:23,600
in its season.
The fruit shall not be born as

1943
02:10:23,600 --> 02:10:27,360
proper season.
The moon shall alter its order,

1944
02:10:31,120 --> 02:10:33,400
talking about changing the signs
in the heavens.

1945
02:10:35,280 --> 02:10:36,800
Oh, this is what I wanted to get
to.

1946
02:10:36,800 --> 02:10:40,800
It's very short.
So after viewing all of this,

1947
02:10:41,520 --> 02:10:47,120
seeing all the wickedness of
mankind in chapter 81, Enoch

1948
02:10:47,120 --> 02:10:49,960
says.
And I wept on account of the

1949
02:10:49,960 --> 02:10:51,800
children of the people upon the
earth.

1950
02:10:52,680 --> 02:10:55,480
There is a coincidence.
Right.

1951
02:10:56,800 --> 02:10:59,600
Now here it comes this other.
Because that's in, that's in the

1952
02:10:59,600 --> 02:11:02,160
Joseph Smith.
That's in Moses six and seven.

1953
02:11:02,160 --> 02:11:08,040
Yeah.
Now we get to chapter 83 where

1954
02:11:08,040 --> 02:11:13,560
Enoch describes more about the
flood, the vision where he says,

1955
02:11:14,760 --> 02:11:21,800
and I saw in a vision the sky
being hurled down and snatched

1956
02:11:21,800 --> 02:11:26,160
and falling upon the earth and
went up, fell upon the earth.

1957
02:11:26,920 --> 02:11:29,880
I saw the earth being swallowed
up into the great abyss,

1958
02:11:30,640 --> 02:11:33,800
mountains being suspended upon
mountains and hills sinking down

1959
02:11:33,800 --> 02:11:38,640
upon the hills, tall trees being
uprooted and thrown and sinking

1960
02:11:38,640 --> 02:11:42,360
into the deep abyss.
Thereupon a word fell into my

1961
02:11:42,360 --> 02:11:46,960
mouth and I began crying aloud
to saying the earth is being

1962
02:11:46,960 --> 02:11:51,200
destroyed.
He's describing the description

1963
02:11:51,200 --> 02:11:54,440
of the Earth.
And impact.

1964
02:11:55,040 --> 02:12:00,560
As right the sky falling upon
the earth, creating a giant

1965
02:12:00,560 --> 02:12:04,760
crater filling it.
Oh, pretty cool stuff.

1966
02:12:06,920 --> 02:12:13,040
Skipping to 89.
Yes.

1967
02:12:14,360 --> 02:12:17,000
And again I raised my eyes
toward heaven and saw a lofty

1968
02:12:17,000 --> 02:12:23,080
ceiling with 7 cascading streams
upon it, and those cascading

1969
02:12:23,160 --> 02:12:27,160
streams flowed with much water
into one enclosed area.

1970
02:12:27,160 --> 02:12:31,320
Again I saw and behold fountains
were opened upon the ground of

1971
02:12:31,320 --> 02:12:33,960
that great enclosed area in the
water began to swell and rise

1972
02:12:33,960 --> 02:12:35,600
upon the slows describing the
flood.

1973
02:12:36,920 --> 02:12:38,960
I saw that enclosed area until
the whole ground was completely

1974
02:12:38,960 --> 02:12:40,800
covered with water.
Water, darkness and mist

1975
02:12:40,800 --> 02:12:44,880
accumulated heavily upon it.
I looked at the ascent of that

1976
02:12:44,880 --> 02:12:47,840
water going up and up until it
rose above that enclosed area

1977
02:12:47,840 --> 02:12:49,600
and was streaming above the
enclosed area.

1978
02:12:49,600 --> 02:12:51,240
Thus I was standing above the
ground.

1979
02:12:51,800 --> 02:12:55,080
Thus it was standing above the
ground, and everything that was

1980
02:12:55,080 --> 02:12:57,760
in the enclosed area, and all
those on the ground were

1981
02:12:57,760 --> 02:13:01,200
gathered together, until I saw
them sinking, being swallowed

1982
02:13:01,200 --> 02:13:07,040
up, and perishing in that water.
Yet the boat, so this is the

1983
02:13:07,040 --> 02:13:10,800
valley where the ark was built,
was floating up, floating above

1984
02:13:10,800 --> 02:13:15,120
the water, though all the
cattle, elephants, camels and

1985
02:13:15,120 --> 02:13:17,840
donkeys were sinking to the
bottom that were not on the

1986
02:13:17,840 --> 02:13:20,920
boat, so I could no longer see
any one of the animals.

1987
02:13:20,920 --> 02:13:23,400
They had no ability to come out,
but only to perish and sink at

1988
02:13:23,400 --> 02:13:26,600
the deep water again.
I kept singing the vision until

1989
02:13:26,600 --> 02:13:29,360
those cascading streams were
dissipated from that high

1990
02:13:29,360 --> 02:13:31,720
ceiling.
The fountains of the earth were

1991
02:13:31,720 --> 02:13:35,320
normalized and other pits were
opened, and the water began to

1992
02:13:35,320 --> 02:13:38,800
descend into them until the
ground became visible.

1993
02:13:39,280 --> 02:13:41,960
That boat settled upon the
earth, the darkness vanished,

1994
02:13:42,560 --> 02:13:47,200
and it became light.
Describing the the waters

1995
02:13:47,200 --> 02:13:49,280
bursting forth and then
eventually receding.

1996
02:13:49,960 --> 02:13:53,400
That's right and that well, and
it talks about the seven streams

1997
02:13:53,400 --> 02:14:00,680
cascading from the heavens.
When and what people don't

1998
02:14:00,680 --> 02:14:04,920
consider is that the greatest
destruction that occurs from a

1999
02:14:04,920 --> 02:14:09,440
killer asteroid is not the
initial strike, but the but the

2000
02:14:09,480 --> 02:14:11,440
ejecta.
Yep.

2001
02:14:11,920 --> 02:14:15,160
All the mass in the matter
that's that's kicked up into the

2002
02:14:15,160 --> 02:14:20,560
atmosphere and the other thing
that we don't really discuss is

2003
02:14:21,760 --> 02:14:27,400
there have been more killer
asteroids strike non land masses

2004
02:14:27,400 --> 02:14:31,880
than strike land masses.
Yep, which would make sense

2005
02:14:31,880 --> 02:14:34,480
because the earth is way more
water than it is land.

2006
02:14:34,960 --> 02:14:38,720
Precisely, and especially those
that would strike the polar

2007
02:14:38,720 --> 02:14:41,560
northern polar region, which has
no land mass, which is just a

2008
02:14:41,560 --> 02:14:46,120
giant iceberg.
The consequence of that.

2009
02:14:46,160 --> 02:14:49,640
So consequences of that.
I, I think about that a lot.

2010
02:14:52,840 --> 02:14:57,040
Chapter 98 Describing the last
days.

2011
02:14:58,640 --> 02:15:02,680
You'll like this one now I swear
unto you, to the wise and to the

2012
02:15:02,680 --> 02:15:04,280
foolish.
For you shall see many things

2013
02:15:04,280 --> 02:15:07,920
upon the earth for you, for you,
for you.

2014
02:15:07,920 --> 02:15:13,520
Men in the end shall put on more
jewelry than women, and more

2015
02:15:13,520 --> 02:15:15,920
multi colored ornaments than a
virgin.

2016
02:15:17,360 --> 02:15:20,280
In sovereignty and grandeur and
in authority, and silver and

2017
02:15:20,280 --> 02:15:22,920
gold and clothing and honor and
edibles, they shall be poured

2018
02:15:22,920 --> 02:15:27,280
out like water.
Does that not describe our day?

2019
02:15:28,320 --> 02:15:32,080
100% does.
For this reason they are devoid

2020
02:15:32,080 --> 02:15:36,280
of knowledge and wisdom.
So they shall perish thereby

2021
02:15:36,280 --> 02:15:39,280
together with their goods and
together with all their glory

2022
02:15:39,280 --> 02:15:43,080
and honor.
Then in dishonor, in slaughter,

2023
02:15:43,520 --> 02:15:47,200
and in great misery, their
spirits shall be cast away.

2024
02:15:49,760 --> 02:15:51,960
The men will wear more jewelry
than the women.

2025
02:15:51,960 --> 02:15:55,000
I'm like, holy cow, that's just
funny.

2026
02:15:55,600 --> 02:15:59,440
He's describing today.
I mean, I just the references

2027
02:15:59,440 --> 02:16:03,720
to, in my opinion, the reference
seems to be kind of

2028
02:16:03,720 --> 02:16:07,360
transvestism, right?
I mean when, when?

2029
02:16:07,480 --> 02:16:10,440
You start talking.
About more women, you know,

2030
02:16:10,440 --> 02:16:15,400
wearing more jewelry than than
the women, that sort of thing.

2031
02:16:15,720 --> 02:16:17,880
Multi.
Colored ornaments and garbage,

2032
02:16:17,960 --> 02:16:20,680
yeah.
Yeah, I can't help but go there

2033
02:16:20,680 --> 02:16:25,880
Ken and I might be wrong, but I
I have a hard time not making

2034
02:16:25,880 --> 02:16:29,000
that connection.
All right, you're not going to

2035
02:16:29,000 --> 02:16:31,320
like this one.
His vision of the last days.

2036
02:16:31,320 --> 02:16:35,840
In those days they, the women,
shall become pregnant, but they,

2037
02:16:35,840 --> 02:16:40,840
the sinners, shall come out and
abort their infants and cast

2038
02:16:40,840 --> 02:16:43,920
them out from their midst.
And they shall also abandoned

2039
02:16:43,920 --> 02:16:47,520
their other children, casting
their infants out while they are

2040
02:16:47,520 --> 02:16:51,160
still suckling.
They shall neither return to

2041
02:16:51,160 --> 02:16:54,680
them, their babies, nor have
compassion upon their loved

2042
02:16:54,680 --> 02:16:58,280
ones.
Boy, did he see the last days or

2043
02:16:58,320 --> 02:17:02,840
what?
Man, Enoch called it.

2044
02:17:03,760 --> 02:17:05,480
OK, I'm going to stop this
episode right here.

2045
02:17:05,480 --> 02:17:07,120
Now.
This conversation that Ken and I

2046
02:17:07,120 --> 02:17:10,920
had, it was 5 hours long.
Now, I'm not breaking it up just

2047
02:17:10,920 --> 02:17:14,040
because of the time.
What I'm breaking it up for is

2048
02:17:14,040 --> 02:17:17,559
that there is so much useful
data in in these episodes that I

2049
02:17:17,559 --> 02:17:20,240
want to make sure I give you,
the audience time to digest all

2050
02:17:20,240 --> 02:17:21,639
this.
Make any of the notes you want

2051
02:17:22,000 --> 02:17:23,680
now.
Ken's going to join me next week

2052
02:17:23,680 --> 02:17:26,559
as we continue on.
We finish up the first book of

2053
02:17:26,559 --> 02:17:29,400
Enoch and then move on to the
second and third books of Enoch.

2054
02:17:29,760 --> 02:17:33,280
And spoiler alert, if you are a
fan of the temple and you

2055
02:17:33,280 --> 02:17:36,879
understand the temple even a
little bit, oh boy, do I got

2056
02:17:36,879 --> 02:17:39,240
some stuff for you next week
that I think you're really going

2057
02:17:39,240 --> 02:17:41,360
to like.
And that'll be, like I said,

2058
02:17:41,360 --> 02:17:44,360
next week Saturday.
Until then, thanks for listening

2059
02:17:44,360 --> 02:17:45,600
and we'll talk to everyone
later.

2060
02:17:45,959 --> 02:17:46,600
Bye everybody.