Episode #174 PT 4 Of The Temple Covenant Series-The Law Of The Gospel W/Ken Peterson

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The.
You're listening to the Mormon

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Renegade podcast.
You know, there are certain

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times, Ken, that I wish we could
like record for the people what

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you and I talk about off the
air.

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At certain, at certain times
not.

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And then at certain times it's
like, no, I don't really, really

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do that, right.
I mean, so yo, it's interesting.

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How you doing man?
Say again, how you doing?

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Oh, I'm doing good.
Good kids are all healthy,

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wife's all healthy.
No, we've all been sicker than

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dogs over Christmas, but we're
healthy now.

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Life is good.
I was sick over Thanksgiving,

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although I didn't, I didn't tell
you about this.

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All right, horrible admission
time.

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You know, I've been hitting the
gym pretty steady and pretty

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hard now for a few years.
And I got up Christmas morning,

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we had opened all of our
presents and I was taking some

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stuff out to my shop and I got
like a new set of tools, right?

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And say, I'm going to take these
tools out.

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And Ken, I don't know what I
did, but I twisted just the

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right way and my back locked up.
And this is stupid, right?

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Like, I've never had back
problems.

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And I spent the rest of
Christmas Day in my recliner

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with my mascara running right.
And, and the girls are like,

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should we take you in?
And I'm like, no, it's

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Christmas.
I'll be fine.

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Just let's just eat, eat deck
food and let's give me a soda

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and I'll, I'll walk this off.
But it was, it was kind of

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rough.
I'm so sorry, that's terrible.

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It sucks being down over the
holidays, but it was only a day,

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so I was able to bounce back
pretty quick.

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So dude, I'll tell you what,
this one I'm excited for.

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So in this series that we're
doing on the temple covenants,

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this one here might be, on the
surface it seems really direct

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and really easy, but there's
some stuff going on here with

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this particular covenant, the
law of the gospel, that I can't

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wait to dive into.
Well, like everything in the

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temple, there's far more to it
than meets the eye initially.

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And I wanted to begin with a
little insurance policy to put

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all of our listeners, LDS and
otherwise, at ease that Ken and

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Dave aren't divulging things
that shouldn't be discussed in

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public.
Oh, we're, we're not going to

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make the signs here.
Oh.

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So here my bad.
Oh, let me just scrap the idea.

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David Bednar, apostle in the LDS
Church himself saying this,

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Elder David A Bednar encouraged
us to, quote, discuss the basic

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purposes of and the doctrine and
principles associated with

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temple ordinances and covenants,
UN quote.

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And he specified, he specified
what these covenants are, quote,

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the law of obedience, the law of
sacrifice, the law of the

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gospel, the law of chastity, and
the law of consecration, UN

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quote.
So he has set the stage for all

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of us to be able to discuss
those five covenants that we

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make in the temple by name, and
not only to know what they are,

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but he says he encourages us to
discuss them, right, without

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revealing the things that were
under covenant not to discuss,

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right?
And that's what we have to keep

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in mind.
But I see this also as a

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reflection, a very welcome
reflection of how the Church, at

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least the Church of Christ, the
Latter Day Saints, is preparing

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its membership to attend the
temple.

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And I've taught temple prep
classes over the past 20 years.

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And so I've had a ringside seat
as to how this this course has

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been taught versus how it is
taught today.

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And I'm super happy to be able
to say that we can discuss that

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people who are preparing,
initiates, who are preparing to

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go to the temple now know what
they're preparing to covenant to

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do what, what the garments are
and how they're going to look

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and how they wear them.
And even the sacred temple

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clothing.
We can talk about all of that

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stuff so that people are better
prepared and not surprised when

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they go to the temple.
I think, I think that's so

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important, right?
Yeah.

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Look, the, the, the gospel's an
interesting thing, right,

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Because the Sunday meetings, the
day-to-day stuff looks kind of

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more.
I don't want to stay Protestant.

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That isn't the right word, but
it's more traditional, right?

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Sure, right.
The temple's a different animal

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entirely.
And so if we don't prepare

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people well when they go
through, of course they're going

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to be to be caught off guard.
I remember when I went through

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my temple prep course, this is
how prepared I was.

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Now, to be fair, part of that is
how I could just be a bad

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student, right?
I want to, I want to say that

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that's, that's a very real
possibility.

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But like I remember I went into
the temple and we were super

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poor when we first got married
and so couldn't really afford to

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buy my own temple clothing.
So I had to rent the the packet,

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right?
Right.

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And somebody goes, yeah, just go
over there and, and, and give

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them $5 or 250 or whatever it
was, and they'll rent you the,

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the stuff that you need.
And so they hand me this packet,

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but it to me it looked like a
pillow, right?

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I'm like sweet, you know, I
think, you know, they want you

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just to relax and contemplate
the eternities.

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And then it gets to the part
where they're instructing you

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to, you know, put on the
ceremonial clothing and I'm

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like, I, I don't have one of
those.

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And my escort's like it's in
there and I'm like, Oh, I got

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ya.
So I mean, but, but no, really

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like if if you're not prepared,
it can feel a little jarring,

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right?
And and.

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Or at the very least, it
diminishes your initial

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experience, right?
Which?

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Which should be a wonderful
experience, you know.

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Right, exactly.
And so I think you're 100%

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correct that that preparation
there is the key.

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So with this little bit of
insurance from David Bednar, I

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am perfectly happy and confident
to go in and be able to discuss

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these covenants in some detail
as he instructed us to do.

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Yep.
But first a a slight detour.

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OK.
How many covenants?

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5 right?
Five.

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Straight up five from the Pista
Sophia, an ancient Gnostic text.

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Nice and.
Let me just describe people what

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the Pista Sophia is.
The majority of the Pista Sophia

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is a dialogue between Jesus and
his male and female disciples

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after his resurrection, wherein
he reveals to them the higher

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mysteries, among other things.
By the way, when we're reading

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these ancient early Christian
texts, whenever we read the word

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mysteries, we need to translate
that as we were just talking of

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ordinances.
Ordinances, the higher

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ordinances, that's what they
call the mysteries.

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The Epistle Phia exists in a
single Coptic manuscript. 174

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leaves of parchment was
discovered in 1773.

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It it's estimated that it was
written between the 3rd and the

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4th centuries of the Common Era,
so we're talking about between.

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It's it's very recent to Christ
time.

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Very close.
So we're talking about the two

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hundreds to 303rd century is 2
hundreds, right.

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So this is very, very early.
So we're I'm quoting this piss

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of Sophia, which is translated.
They'd have just this one copy

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in Coptic in parchments.
They know it's ancient, they

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know it's alvetic, been
translated once into English.

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And this is how it reads page
197.

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By the way, all of this stuff
that I'm going to be quoting is

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in my book under temple rights.
What?

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What?
What's the name?

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What's the name of your book
again?

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Oh my gosh, Mormon doctrine in
the apocrypha.

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Oh, if there was only a place
where people could go to get

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that book.
I don't know.

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Where, where, where could they
go to get that book at Ken?

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I mean hypothetically.
Well, Benchmark Book sells it,

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or you can just go to Amazon and
get it.

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Oh really?
You can go to Amazon and get it?

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Wow, wow.
I'd I, I would recommend

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everybody get a copy of that
book.

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I hate, I hate selling stuff.
I know you do.

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That's why I'm here.
But it's not a money maker.

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But the saying is you want to
write the book that you want to

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read.
And I needed a resource where I

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could compile all of these
latter day St. teachings, LDS

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teachings, that I found
thousands of them in these

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ancient texts that have nothing
to do with Mormonism directly,

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right?
And there are so many it's just

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mind boggling.
Yep.

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Undeniable evidence that Joseph
Smith was tapping into something

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that was not conventional right
to say.

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More than just a good guesser.
More, he was a darn good

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guesser.
So pissed Sophia Jesus answered

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and said unto her, speaking to
Mary Magdalene.

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Indeed, it possesseth A1 and
only mystery, yet that mystery

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can constitute A3 mysteries.
Although it is the one and only

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mystery, but the type of every
one of them is different and

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moreover it constituted 5.
That's pretty interesting and.

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Although it is a one and only
one, but the type of everyone is

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different, so that these five
mysteries are alike with one

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another.
In the mystery of the Kingdom,

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in the inheritances of the light
is talking about Celestial realm

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OK, but the type of each of them
is different.

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So basically what we could say
there and, and correct me if I'm

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wrong if I'm misunderstanding
five, you know, 5 alike, meaning

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these are all the higher
mysteries or the things that you

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would be taught in a temple
setting, but they're all

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different within that temple
setting.

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Right, five mysteries, but all
leading to the same point in the

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same place.
Interesting, right?

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Yep.
Now this issue of five mysteries

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and five iterations of this is
found all over the place.

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This is the first.
Here's a second Pissa.

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Sophia again come unto us, for
we will draw nigh unto thee,

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Christ, to clothe thee with the
first Mystery, Father, and all

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His glory, clothing us with the
glory of the Father, by

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commandment of Himself, in that
the first Mystery hath given us

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it, consisting of two vestures.
To clothe thee herewith sacred

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clothing, besides the one which
we have sent Thee.

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For Thou art worthy of them,
since Thou art prior to us, and

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existeth before us.
For this 'cause therefore hath

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the first Mystery sent thee
through us, The Mystery or the

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Ordinance of all of His glory,
consisting of two vestures. 2

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sets of sacred cooling.
In the 1st is the whole glory of

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all the names of all mysteries
and all emanations of the orders

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of the spaces of the Ineffable.
So in these vestures are the

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names of the Mysteries.
And in the second vesture is the

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whole glory of the name of all
mysteries and all emanations,

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which are in the orders of the
two spaces of the first Mystery.

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And in this third vesture, which
we have just sent thee, is the

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glory of the Name of the Mystery
of the Revealer, which is the

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first Commandment, and the
Mystery of the Five Impressions.

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What?
Five impressions now non Latter

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Day Saints, the non endowed
reading this, they have no clue

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where to go with this.
Right.

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The endowed our minds going
crazy making these associations.

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When I read the word impression,
I think of the handclasp.

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The tokens, Yep.
Five impressions.

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Wow.
So he's talking about with these

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associated with these sacred
garments, these sacred vestures

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and these mysteries and these
ordinances are five impressions.

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2.
Pretty awesome.

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That is awesome.
Now from the second book of

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Yeau, and let me tell you what
second Book of Yeau is. 2nd book

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of Yeau is one of three texts,
1st and the second book is video

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and the untitled types
comprising what's called the

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Bruce Codex, again a Coptic
manuscript purchased by James

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Bruce in Upper Egypt and
Stephanie James Bruce.

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I wish I could have met that
guy.

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He's the guy who discovered the
Ethiopic copies, 7 Ethiopic

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copies of the first Enoch and
all these this great Coptic

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library in 1769.
He had money, he just wanted to

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go explore and he did, risking
his life and everything.

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The 1st and the second books of
Yay, who appear to be the very

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books of Yay who mentioned in
the Piss of Sophia.

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00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:09,440
So in the Piss of Sophia, Christ
is describing these higher

225
00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:14,280
ordinances to his disciples.
He says, and I'm trying to

226
00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:17,880
remember exactly how he said it.
If you want to know the details

227
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,440
of these ordinances, refer to
the books of Yehu.

228
00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:25,000
Interesting.
So as you've gone through the

229
00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:27,360
Book of Yehu, can you see the
temple themes?

230
00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:31,880
The books of Yehu are the
script.

231
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:39,040
Holy cow, if there was only a
book that that would be in, is

232
00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:43,600
that is that in that book you
were just telling me about Ken?

233
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:47,560
Yeah, this really good looking
guy wrote this, put together,

234
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,040
compiled this book Mormon
Doctrine in the Apocrypha.

235
00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:51,880
Right, right.
Well, the same one that's

236
00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:54,280
available on on Amazon.
Amazon, right?

237
00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:55,360
Yeah.
OK, all right.

238
00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,480
Good.
And in that book he quotes

239
00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:01,520
extensively from the books of
Yahoo, First, second books and

240
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:05,040
the untitled text.
They they go really deep.

241
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:08,880
And to give you an idea of like
I say, the books of Gay or the

242
00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:13,760
script for these rights, it will
say, when you approach this

243
00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:21,640
veil, make this cipher in your
hand and say this name and you

244
00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:25,240
will be allowed to enter.
Only instead of giving you the

245
00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,040
name, they give you this code
that is written in meaningless

246
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,600
Greek, because they're hiding
what the name is, right?

247
00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:34,520
So you don't actually get the
name, but you know exactly

248
00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:36,360
what's going on.
Right.

249
00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:41,880
And so the text consists
primarily of the resurrected

250
00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:45,520
again, Jesus Christ teaching
rituals to his disciples.

251
00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:49,000
It's amazing.
All right, so this is what it

252
00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:51,840
says in second book of the page
121.

253
00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:58,240
Jesus Christ says again, you
will go into their interior to

254
00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:06,319
the rank of the five incisions
of the light, and they, yes, and

255
00:17:06,319 --> 00:17:10,280
they will give to you their
mystery, their ordinance and

256
00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:15,520
their seal and the great name of
the treasury of the light.

257
00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:21,000
Wow.
When Unibli was talking about

258
00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:24,000
these type of texts, he says
they're amazing and confounding

259
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:25,760
Jewish and Christian scholars
alike.

260
00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:28,600
They don't do.
But a bursting with good news

261
00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:31,680
for endowed Latter Day Saints.
Yeah, if you've been through the

262
00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:37,200
temple, this should like be
setting off bells everywhere.

263
00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:42,040
Exactly.
Because like literally I mean

264
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,200
the fact they use the term the
five incisions, right?

265
00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:48,400
I wanted to talk about that.
Yeah, who?

266
00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:54,080
Go ahead.
So I think it was Terrell

267
00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:57,880
Gibbons I heard on a podcast
talking about this, the word

268
00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:08,480
incisions is incredible.
And Speaking of the the number

269
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:11,960
of the marks of the garment
correspond roughly with the

270
00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:17,640
wounds in Christ's body.
And that when we do know that

271
00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:21,720
symbolically, most of what
occurs in the temple is remains

272
00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:23,360
unexplained.
Right.

273
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:27,880
Ever.
But when we put on the garment,

274
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:34,160
in a very real symbolic sense,
we're putting on Christ and the

275
00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:38,960
marks in the garment can further
symbolize the wounds in his body

276
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:45,080
and and what they mean to us.
Kind of interesting, I think.

277
00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:47,880
Yeah, it is.
These five incisions and that

278
00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:51,560
they call them the incisions of
life and and the deep connection

279
00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:56,800
between that and the Holy
Sacrifice itself of the Savior.

280
00:19:01,360 --> 00:19:06,920
This trimorphic protanoia, page
520 And let me give you a sense

281
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:09,440
of what this is.
This is from the Nag Hammadi

282
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:14,000
library.
The trimorphic protanoia means

283
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,600
the three forms of the first
thought.

284
00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:20,600
It is an explanation of
cosmology, creation and the

285
00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,200
nature of Jesus.
It is part of the Nag Hamadi

286
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,560
Library which consists of 13
leather bound 3rd and 4th

287
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:31,800
century papyrus.
In very very early we're buried

288
00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:35,320
in a seal to jar and what buried
in the earth.

289
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:42,320
Whoever does that, they're the
Upper Egyptian town of Nag

290
00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:44,240
Hamadi.
They were found by a local

291
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:47,920
farmer in 1945, the same year
the Dead Sea skulls were

292
00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:49,480
discovered.
Against all odds.

293
00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:52,600
Their contents are early
Christian and Gnostic texts

294
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:56,480
written in the Coptic language.
Although the manuscripts date to

295
00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,760
the third and 4th century, the
original composition of some of

296
00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:02,920
the text could date as far back
as. 2nd century.

297
00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:06,480
The one hundreds.
OK, so let let me ask you this.

298
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,680
He talks about the three forms
there of the first thought.

299
00:20:10,120 --> 00:20:17,360
What do you take that to be?
The non Hamadi library and this

300
00:20:17,360 --> 00:20:19,400
is also discussed in that book
we talked about.

301
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:25,800
Oh, that talks it talks about
the original the first Godhead.

302
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:32,280
Oh, oh, you know who?
The God and the very first

303
00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:34,160
Godhead, according Fist of
Sophia.

304
00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:37,600
Was the three forms of the first
thought OK?

305
00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:44,480
Was father, mother, son.
Interesting.

306
00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:50,040
Stick that in your pipets, OK?
Interesting.

307
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:52,080
The three, yeah.
There are lots of cool things

308
00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:56,640
about that notion.
That's that's where, that's

309
00:20:56,640 --> 00:21:01,400
where it leads me, anyway.
So in the trimorphic protanoia,

310
00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:06,880
Christ says I am the light that
illuminates the all.

311
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:10,240
I am the light that rejoices in
my brethren.

312
00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:14,040
For I came down to the world of
mortals, on account of the

313
00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:17,280
Spirit that remains in that
which descended.

314
00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:22,080
I came and I delivered, and I
gave to him from the water of

315
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,600
life, and I put upon him a
shining light, that is the

316
00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,320
knowledge of the thought of the
Fatherhood.

317
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:35,400
And I delivered him to those who
I who give robes, and they

318
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:39,280
covered him with a robe from the
robes of the light.

319
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:45,400
The word to enrobe is the same
word as to embrace.

320
00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:52,520
Interesting.
So then the Book of Mormon is

321
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,760
also full of this imagery.
Right.

322
00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:00,160
To be enrobed is to be embraced.
OK.

323
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:04,320
I'm not going to say anymore he
that it have ears to hear, let

324
00:22:04,360 --> 00:22:06,680
him hear.
Yep, Yep.

325
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,080
So.
Covered him with a robe from the

326
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,200
robes of light.
And I delivered him to the

327
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:15,480
baptizers, and they baptized
him, and they immersed him in

328
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:19,200
the spring of the water of life.
And I delivered him to those who

329
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:23,200
enthroned.
And they enthroned him from the

330
00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:26,040
throne of glory.
And I delivered him to those who

331
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,520
glorified, and they glorified
him with the glory of the

332
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:32,360
Fatherhood.
And those who snatch away,

333
00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:37,520
snatched away, and they, and
they're referred to as different

334
00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:40,640
beings, but they're responsible
when you die for retrieving your

335
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,440
spirit and delivering your
spirit where it belongs.

336
00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:47,160
OK.
And they took him into the light

337
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:54,080
place of his fatherhood, and he
received the five seals 5 again.

338
00:22:54,360 --> 00:23:00,760
So we have 5 mysteries, five
impressions, 5 incisions, and

339
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:06,480
now 5 seals received the five,
yes, the five seals from the

340
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:09,920
light of the Mother.
And it was granted him to

341
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,520
partake of the mystery of
knowledge, and he became a light

342
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:17,040
in light.
Interesting.

343
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:22,840
OK, so like the the stuff they
talk about there with the

344
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:27,840
fatherhood, I mean they got to
be talking about deification at

345
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:33,320
that point, right of of getting.
When it says enthroned him from

346
00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:36,680
the throne of Gory, that's in
the Egyptian endowment.

347
00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,520
When you pass, when you've made
all the covenants and you've

348
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,160
made the last covenant right,
which is the law of

349
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:46,480
consecration, you pass through
the veil and you go into the

350
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:48,920
throne room and you sit down on
the throne with the God of the

351
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:52,960
temple.
Yep, Yep, absolutely who?

352
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,520
And then he received the five
seals from the Light of the

353
00:23:56,520 --> 00:24:04,240
Mother.
Let me ask you about that if

354
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:08,120
you're if, if you can.
If not, we can.

355
00:24:08,120 --> 00:24:12,280
We can skip it, but I'm drawing
a blank there.

356
00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:17,160
Oh well.
Whether whether he's talking

357
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:22,640
about the Fatherhood, the light
of the Mother, or the spirit

358
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:25,200
that remains, they all represent
deity.

359
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:27,920
Right and.
And whether you received from

360
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:31,680
the Mother or the Father or the
Son, it's all by the same

361
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:37,600
authority.
Let me just say this in regard

362
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:44,520
to the light of the Mother.
Our knowledge of our Heavenly

363
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,120
Mother remains extremely
limited.

364
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:54,480
Unibly surmises.
That is so because mankind

365
00:24:54,480 --> 00:25:02,520
perverts.
Feminine deity, we tend to

366
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:05,400
sexualize it.
And so to protect us from

367
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:09,160
ourselves, our knowledge of
Heavenly Mother and her role in

368
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:12,560
all of this, and you know, her
role in all of this is going to

369
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,840
be at least as involved as our
Heavenly Father.

370
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,200
Right.
And yet we don't.

371
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:24,840
We as humans, particularly male
species, are not prepared to

372
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,840
cope with.
Right.

373
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,480
The knowledge of feminine deity
because we would tend to pervert

374
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:35,440
that, sexualize and turn it into
or like they did anciently, they

375
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,680
turned into orgiastic rites.
Right.

376
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:44,720
Yeah, we can't go there, but the
restored gospel in these last

377
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,720
days and especially more
recently, is helping us

378
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:51,160
understand a bit more about our
Heavenly Mother.

379
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:55,640
And at least the LDS Church is
becoming more open and

380
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,440
discussing her.
We do have sources now and

381
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:02,680
visions of Joseph Smith having
seen her acknowledging her

382
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,400
presence at the beginning of
creation in Genesis and

383
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:07,840
acknowledging her presence in
the Book of Revelation.

384
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:15,440
Yep.
And, and I have deeply held

385
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:22,000
beliefs about her nature, who
she is and why we're not knowing

386
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:23,880
more about her at this present
time.

387
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:29,160
But those are things that I've
told maybe half a dozen people

388
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,800
about in, in very guarded
situations.

389
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:39,560
Because that's, that's something
that sure that that's, that's

390
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,080
not something that I want to be
responsible for wrong, You know,

391
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,200
Anyway, I get it.
Good question, though.

392
00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:52,760
And you will find in this book
again, that I put together loads

393
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:57,480
of references to our Mother in
Heaven and a very, and a whole

394
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,520
section dedicated to her.
And a number of very important

395
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,880
things are suggested by these
ancient documents in terms of

396
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:08,040
her nature and her role.
She is intimately, of course,

397
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:12,160
has to be intimately.
Who could love us more than our

398
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,200
Heavenly Father, our Heavenly
Mother, right?

399
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:17,920
Tell us she's not involved in
this plan, you know.

400
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:25,840
Yep, absolutely.
The Apocryphon of John, a New

401
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:30,800
Testament Apocryphon, it's
translated from Greek to Coptic,

402
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:36,160
is the Apostle John's account of
Jesus Christ appearing and

403
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,040
giving again secret knowledge to
him.

404
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,320
It is part of the Nag Habadi
library, which consists of the

405
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:44,200
And we talked about what those
are and where they were found

406
00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:46,000
and how old they are.
Right.

407
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:54,360
Quoting the apocryphon of John
I, Jesus Christ went that I

408
00:27:54,360 --> 00:27:57,720
might enter into the midst of
darkness and the inside of

409
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,680
Hades.
What's His talking about?

410
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,960
Right.
When he went to the spirits in

411
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:05,440
prison.
He went to the spirit world to

412
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:10,200
free to, to basically set up the
the missionary program that

413
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:13,840
would that would get people to
to be able to receive their

414
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:16,600
ordinances through vicarious
work here on this side.

415
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,200
And there's a whole section of
my book dealing with those

416
00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:21,440
accounts, and there are a number
of significant accounts.

417
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:26,520
And I filled my face with the
light of the completion of their

418
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:30,200
aeon or their region, and I
entered into the midst of their

419
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:32,640
prison, which is the prison of
the body.

420
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:37,240
And I said, he who?
He who hears, let him get up

421
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:40,960
from the deep sleep.
And he wept and shed tears,

422
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,360
bitter tears he wiped from
himself.

423
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,040
And he said, Who is it that so?
One of the people in prison.

424
00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:50,200
Who is it that calls my name?
And from where has this hope

425
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,400
come to me?
I love things like this where

426
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:58,600
where it takes this grand event
that could barely be described

427
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:01,600
and personalizes it.
Right.

428
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,440
So we get a sense of what it
means to individuals.

429
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:09,800
Yep, he's and he, he and he
wept.

430
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,440
He shed tears, bitter tears
wiped from himself.

431
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:14,920
And he said, who's calling my
name?

432
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:19,840
From where has his hope come to
me while I am in the chains of

433
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:23,840
the prison?
And I, Christ said I am the

434
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,280
pronoy of the divine Providence
of the pure light.

435
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,960
I am the thinking of the
virginal Spirit who raised you

436
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:36,520
up to the honored place.
Arise and remember that it is

437
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:41,160
you who hearkened and follow
your route, which is I.

438
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:45,320
He's the root, right, the
Merciful. 1 And guard yourself

439
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:50,360
against the angels of poverty
and the demons of chaos, and all

440
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:55,120
those who ensnare you, and
beware of the deep sleep and the

441
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,200
enclosure of the inside of
Hades.

442
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,960
And I raised him up and sealed
him in the light of the water

443
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:08,960
with five seals, in order that
death might not have power over

444
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:16,840
him from this time on.
So there are those who love to

445
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,960
imagine that Joseph Smith
cobbled together what we do in

446
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:23,720
the temple.
Right.

447
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:30,960
When you read these 2000 year
old documents that talk about

448
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:36,680
exactly the same thing in
exactly the same context.

449
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,520
Yeah.
Contexts, plural.

450
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,840
You know that he wasn't making
Crapo.

451
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,800
No, no, it's extraordinary to
me.

452
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:51,160
And when President Russell M
Nelson at the pulpit at General

453
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,920
Conference said, I testify, he
says I know that our temple

454
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,960
rites are of ancient origin.
Yeah.

455
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:01,120
You know that he's read some of
this stuff.

456
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,680
You know this.
Yeah, that's just.

457
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:05,800
Yeah.
It's just.

458
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,960
And you know what?
I wish, You know what I wish we

459
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,000
could have someday?
A no hold barred discussion.

460
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,840
Or we can discuss not just the
five covenants.

461
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:22,520
Right.
We can discuss every aspect of

462
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,440
what we do in that temple that
is attested in these ancient

463
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:31,240
documents, again, which comprise
over 50 pages in my book, which

464
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:36,160
I can't, which I I'm bound by
covenant not to divulge, but

465
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:38,720
they're listed there, and the
reader can make those

466
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,520
connections themselves.
It's too much, right?

467
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:49,080
I mean, when someone says Joseph
made all this up, I'm like the

468
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:54,120
the the scientist of statistical
probability bears out that for

469
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:59,920
him to be this right this often
and not just like, yeah, he's in

470
00:31:59,920 --> 00:32:03,840
the ballpark, but Bull's eyes,
that's too much.

471
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:05,520
You can't.
You can't just say he was

472
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:07,880
throwing stuff against the wall
to see what sticks.

473
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:13,240
Or or he secretly had the 1st
and 2nd books of Yahoo somehow

474
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,560
magically under his pillow.
Right, right.

475
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,320
Forget that they hadn't been
translated into English yet,

476
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:21,400
but.
Even all of even all of these

477
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,440
different sources that we're
quoting here and we're talking

478
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:27,960
to dozens of different texts
individually, none of them have

479
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:32,520
it all together.
You put them all together and

480
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:37,920
they comprise what we were given
by very specific revelation in

481
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,920
our temples.
And the specificity of

482
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:46,800
revelation is always surprises.
Me, me too.

483
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,240
Let me just the one in
particular.

484
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:55,000
You're reading along in the
Manual of Discipline in the Dead

485
00:32:55,000 --> 00:33:00,880
Sea Scrolls and you read this
paragraph and suddenly bells are

486
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:09,640
ringing like you say, and
suddenly you're at the veil and

487
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:11,560
you're going, what is this doing
here?

488
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:19,840
Verbatim translated from Hebrew,
ancient Hebrew, pre Christian

489
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:23,520
Hebrew into English by a
translator who doesn't know

490
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:27,400
anything about Mormonism or our
temples and it is the same

491
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:29,080
thing.
Is it really?

492
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,800
Maybe I'll show you later.
You should you should Book of

493
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:36,800
discipline.
The manual discipline, yeah,

494
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:42,400
you'll find it in my book.
You that you mean the one that's

495
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:44,840
on Amazon by Ken Peterson?
Yes.

496
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,040
About Mormonism in the.
Apocalypse, stop selling my

497
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:48,760
book.
Let's just talk about it, OK?

498
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:52,600
My bad, my bad.
The Gospel of the Egyptians,

499
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,360
so-called because it referred to
it, is referred to as the

500
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,480
Egyptian Gospel toward the end
of the text itself written in

501
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:04,720
Coptic.
Again, it deals primarily with

502
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:08,040
the earth coming into being and
the creation of the heavenly

503
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,440
world.
It comes from the Nag Nagamadi

504
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:14,960
Library.
And thus he was completed,

505
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:22,480
namely the Father, the Mother,
the Son, the Five Seals, the

506
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:26,440
Unconquerable Power, which is
the great Christ of all the

507
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:30,239
incorruptible ones.
This one brought praise to the

508
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:34,440
unrevealable, hidden mysteries,
hidden mystery, the eons,

509
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:39,520
Thrones, and each one, when you
see those bracketed ellipses,

510
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:46,400
yeah, that's that signifies what
scholars call lacuna, which is

511
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:49,159
to say a hole in the, in the
ancient text.

512
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:53,920
Oh, So when they're looking at
these ancient papyri, if the

513
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:57,520
edges are worn off or if there's
a hole in it, this is what that

514
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,480
looks like in our text.
Lacuna, each one myriads of

515
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,640
power without numbers surround
them, Glories and incorruptions.

516
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:10,960
And they of the Father and the
Mother and the Son and the whole

517
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,360
plurama, the region of light
which I mentioned before, and

518
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:17,920
the five seals and the mystery
of mysteries.

519
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:22,400
Then Providence came forth from
silence, and the living silence

520
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:27,160
of the Spirit, and the word of
the Father, and a light she.

521
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:32,520
Oh, and I wish I knew it was
next the five seals which the

522
00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:34,520
Father brought forth from his
bosom.

523
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:40,240
And she passed through all the
eons angels which I mentioned

524
00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:42,240
before.
And she established Thrones of

525
00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:45,840
glory, and myriads of angels
without number, who surrounded

526
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:49,240
the powers and incorruptible
glories, who sing and give

527
00:35:49,240 --> 00:35:52,240
glory, all giving praise of the
single voice with one accord,

528
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:57,200
with one never silent voice to
the Father and the Mother and

529
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,240
the Son, and all the pluramas
that I mentioned before.

530
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:03,800
So these five seals came forth
from the the bosom of the Father

531
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:05,200
himself.
Wow.

532
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:12,600
And and I think I can I can
safely discuss this.

533
00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:23,920
The tokens are routinely mocked
by the naysayers, but if they're

534
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:30,600
coming forth from the father,
what what those tokens reveal to

535
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:33,400
us about the nature of the
father, who he is?

536
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:37,160
Yes.
And how he wants to relate to

537
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,000
us.
Yep.

538
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:40,920
And who?
Who can give and receive those

539
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:42,640
tokens?
Right.

540
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:48,720
Is very specific to our natures.
Yep.

541
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:54,120
But it tells us everything about
who the father is and who we are

542
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:57,960
relative to him.
And my favorite is and my

543
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:02,400
favorite is the last where we're
in wrote, you know?

544
00:37:03,240 --> 00:37:09,960
Here's the thing, right, I
cannot think of a more elegant

545
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:13,640
teaching method for these higher
principles and what's

546
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,160
demonstrated in the temple,
right?

547
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,640
Just elegant is the best word I
can come up with.

548
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:21,080
I like it.
That's a good word.

549
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:26,400
Because of the way that it's
done it it, I've tried to

550
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,360
explain to people that the
ordinance and the liturgy that

551
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:36,120
go in with this are like
scripture, and you're going to

552
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,800
get different things from them
at different times.

553
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:43,040
And it is elegant the way it's
delivered so that at different

554
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:48,440
points your mind will be, will
be engaged in a way that maybe

555
00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:51,760
it wasn't the 1st 9 times you
went through, but you've

556
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:55,480
matured.
And now this, it, it will take

557
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,200
on new things and the mysteries
never stop, right?

558
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:05,840
And 1 will lead to another.
And so as we talk about all this

559
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:08,680
here, I, I, I again want to
impress on people,

560
00:38:10,240 --> 00:38:14,360
fundamentalist LDS, whatever, go
to the temple, right?

561
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:18,720
Go get these ordinances because
and then listen to this again,

562
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:21,760
because you're going to find all
sorts of new things here.

563
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:25,400
Sorry, Ken, go ahead you.
Thought that was awesome.

564
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:31,960
But of all the things that a God
could do to us or teach to us or

565
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,680
show us in the temple, the
things that are given to us are

566
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:46,280
of such a personal nature that
our God in our temple wants to

567
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:50,400
welcome us into his Kingdom
personally, personally.

568
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:52,280
Yep.
Intimately.

569
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,400
Yep.
Like a father and a son.

570
00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:02,000
Absolutely.
It's it's divine in in its

571
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:07,640
profundity and in its simplicity
all at the same time.

572
00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,440
And as you say, it's it's
perfectly elegant.

573
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:16,200
Yep.
Anyway, yeah, I love that gospel

574
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:20,040
of Egyptians again.
And the incorruptible spiritual

575
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:24,680
church increased in the four
lights of the great living auto

576
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,920
genes.
I can't help you with that.

577
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:33,000
The God of Truth, praising,
singing and giving glory with

578
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:38,800
one voice, with one accord, with
a mouth which does not rest to

579
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:42,640
the Father and the Mother and
the Son and their whole

580
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:48,520
pleurama, the region of light
before the five seals which

581
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:52,520
possessed the myriads, and they
who rule over the eons, and they

582
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:56,000
who bear the glory of the
leaders, were given the command

583
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:59,040
to reveal to those who are
worthy.

584
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:04,200
So this time it adds.
Not only were they.

585
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:07,720
These five seals were given to
bear.

586
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:11,720
The Goya leaders were given
command only to reveal these

587
00:40:11,720 --> 00:40:14,000
five seals to those who were
worthy.

588
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:17,880
True.
Go figure.

589
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:22,920
Here's the trimorphic pronoi
again.

590
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:28,360
And among the angels I revealed
myself in their likeness and

591
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:30,920
among the powers, as if I were
one of them.

592
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:36,400
But among the sons of man, as if
I were a son of man, even though

593
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:39,840
I am Father of everyone.
So when God appears to mankind,

594
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:45,200
He appears without His glory.
Initially, as He goes on, I hid

595
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:49,640
myself within them all, until I
revealed myself among my

596
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:54,920
members, which are mine, and I
taught them about the ineffable

597
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:58,520
ordinances.
Ordinances he can't talk about

598
00:40:59,240 --> 00:41:03,640
and about the brethren, but they
are inexpressible to every

599
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:07,600
sovereignty and every ruling
power, except the sons of the

600
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:12,040
light alone.
The Gospel of Philip says the

601
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:16,040
sons of light are those who are
endowed in the holy bullies,

602
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:20,080
that is, the ordinances of the
Father.

603
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:25,080
These are the glories that are
higher than every glory, that is

604
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:29,520
the five seals complete by
virtue of intellect.

605
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:34,880
He who possesses the five seals
of these particular names has

606
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,720
stripped off the garments of
ignorance and put on a shining

607
00:41:38,720 --> 00:41:42,000
light, and nothing will appear
to him that belongs to the

608
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,280
powers of the Archons, those of
the less lower powers.

609
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:49,000
Within those of this sort,
darkness will dissolve and

610
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:52,520
ignorance will die, and the
thought of the creature which is

611
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:56,760
scattered will present a single
appearance, and dark chaos will

612
00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:00,200
dissolve.
And until I reveal myself to all

613
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:03,960
my fellow brethren, and until I
gather together all my fellow

614
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,840
brethren within the eternal
Kingdom, and I proclaimed to

615
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:13,520
them the ineffable 5 seals, in
order that I might abide in

616
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:16,560
them, and they also might abide
in me.

617
00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:22,240
Interesting.
Now is this Christ still talking

618
00:42:22,240 --> 00:42:24,920
here in this prime?
More interesting.

619
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:29,240
Yes, tell him what he's doing.
This is he came down as one of

620
00:42:29,240 --> 00:42:35,400
them so he could reveal to them
these 5 seals, the pistol Sophia

621
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:38,280
among others.
Talk about when we die, if we

622
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:44,600
have received these mysteries
and these seals, that the veils

623
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:48,160
of the various kingdoms that
stand between US and the throne

624
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:53,280
of God will part and will open
for us to pass through and will

625
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,680
have no power over us because of
these covenants that we have

626
00:42:56,680 --> 00:43:00,480
made.
Yeah, You know, and it speaks to

627
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:06,040
something else here that was
taught by Joseph regularly,

628
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:09,200
right?
This idea that that knowledge is

629
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:11,680
what we should really be after
in this.

630
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,120
Yeah, in this probation, right.
Where A.

631
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,880
Man can only be saved.
A man can only be saved as fast

632
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:18,280
as he gains knowledge.
Right.

633
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:23,160
And here they talk about it that
the ignorance will die the the

634
00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:27,560
virtue of intellect, right.
All those things have have a

635
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:29,240
certain Joseph Smith ring to
them.

636
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,160
You know, except for they're
like 2000 years apart.

637
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:36,480
I mean, that's.
It sounds like they've had the

638
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:39,000
same teacher or something.
Almost right.

639
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:43,280
Yeah.
Which?

640
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:45,640
So I'm done with the detour for
now.

641
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:46,600
I hope you.
Like it?

642
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:50,200
Good, I like it.
The five covenants.

643
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:53,240
The five mysteries.
The five seals.

644
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,120
The five impressions, the five
incisions.

645
00:43:56,520 --> 00:44:01,640
Right.
So yeah, the fact that we make 5

646
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:07,000
covenants is not random.
No, no, it's, it's ancient.

647
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:11,720
Absolutely.
So this comes from this.

648
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:15,120
There are a couple of articles
that deal at length with this

649
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,920
law of the gospel of what it is
and in this one that I have the

650
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:20,640
link I have at the bottom of
quote here.

651
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,720
It goes through the definitions
what the New Testament describes

652
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:31,160
what the gospel is right?
The good news of of the

653
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:33,240
atonement of Jesus Christ,
right.

654
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:36,600
So the Scripture discussed above
suggests the following two-part

655
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:38,760
definition of what the gospel
is.

656
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:42,640
A The gospel is the good news
that through the Atonement of

657
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:47,120
Christ, all mankind may be
redeemed from both death and

658
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:50,680
sin, allowing us to stand before
the Lord and resurrected bodies

659
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:52,640
of the dead judgement and
receive an eternal reward.

660
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:54,720
That's the good news.
Right.

661
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:57,800
B.
If we abide by the 1st

662
00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:00,920
principles and ordinances of the
Gospel, we will be declared

663
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,240
guiltless and saved in the
Kingdom of God.

664
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:09,120
Have faith in Jesus Christ,
repent of all your sin, be

665
00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:11,920
baptized for the remission of
sins and sanctified through the

666
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:13,720
deception of the Holy Ghost and
endured to the end.

667
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:18,760
The 1st 4 Principles and
Ordinances of the Gospel, right.

668
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:20,440
OK.
So far, so good.

669
00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:25,080
So do we agree that this is
what, when we say the word

670
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:27,600
gospel, Yep.
Fundamentally, this is what

671
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:28,480
we're talking about.
Yep.

672
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:36,080
Absolutely, you said that.
Fundamentally, President Ezra

673
00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:39,400
Taft Benson, and I really love
what he says there, also found

674
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:41,640
the meaning of the law of the
Gospel in the words that Jesus

675
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:43,720
Christ used to describe the
gospel.

676
00:45:43,720 --> 00:45:49,600
He said the law of the gospel
embraces all laws, principles,

677
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:51,680
and ordinances necessary for
exaltation.

678
00:45:52,720 --> 00:45:57,080
We agree to exercise faith in
Jesus Christ and sincere

679
00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:01,240
repentance born out of a broken
heart and a contrite spirit as

680
00:46:01,240 --> 00:46:05,400
we comply with the ordinances of
baptism and confirmation and

681
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:08,800
continue in faith and prayer.
The power of the Savior's

682
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:12,200
atoning sacrifice covers our
sins, and we are cleansed from

683
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:15,000
all unrighteousness.
Now this is the commandment.

684
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:18,240
And he quotes Third Nephi,
Repent all the ends of the

685
00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:22,000
earth, and come unto me, and be
baptized in my name, that you

686
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,720
may be sanctified by the
reception of the Holy Ghost,

687
00:46:25,240 --> 00:46:28,520
that you may stand spotless
before me at the last day.

688
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:33,640
Verily, verily, I say unto you,
this is my gospel.

689
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:39,600
So Jesus Christ himself really
gives us the condensed

690
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:42,920
definition of what Gospel is.
Right.

691
00:46:44,120 --> 00:46:47,600
As the captain goes on, the law
of the gospel is more than

692
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:49,280
understanding the plan of
salvation.

693
00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:54,280
It consists of partaking of the
ordinances and the sealing

694
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:59,600
powers, culminating in a man
being sealed up unto eternal

695
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:03,280
life, being born again, said the
Prophet Joseph Smith.

696
00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:08,200
Comes by the Spirit of God
through ordinances.

697
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:12,960
Interesting.
What's funny is I mean, you and

698
00:47:12,960 --> 00:47:16,040
I, we've these concepts have
been in our brains for decades,

699
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:22,040
Yet when we look at it in this
in the light of this context, it

700
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,280
takes on more meaning, at least
for me.

701
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:26,560
I.
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

702
00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:32,720
So now this is interesting here,
Ken, right, Because

703
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:36,880
theoretically, in order to be
able to partake of the

704
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:40,720
ordinances of the temple, we
already need to be living some

705
00:47:40,720 --> 00:47:42,480
of these things he's already
talking about.

706
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:46,840
Right, yes, I'm not there yet,
but you're asking the obvious

707
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:47,480
question.
All right.

708
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:49,920
Now, I'll hold that question
because it sounds like it'll be

709
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:52,760
revealed, OK?
That's an that's a beautiful

710
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,200
question, which leads us to more
truth.

711
00:47:55,200 --> 00:48:00,720
All right, with the, with these
insights from the Scriptures, we

712
00:48:00,720 --> 00:48:05,720
can conclude that the definition
of the law of the gospel is

713
00:48:05,720 --> 00:48:10,360
essentially the same as the
gospel that was defined earlier.

714
00:48:11,240 --> 00:48:13,680
And here's and here's I, I love
this point he makes.

715
00:48:14,240 --> 00:48:19,280
This should not surprise us, for
the same is true with the other

716
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:24,120
laws in the covenant path, such
as obedience.

717
00:48:24,720 --> 00:48:27,360
And so we just talk about the
five covenants we make in the

718
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:30,760
temple.
Do they mean the same thing that

719
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:32,800
the basic word means?
Right.

720
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:35,440
Does the law of obedience mean
straight up obedience?

721
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:39,000
Yes.
Likewise do sacrifice and the

722
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:44,240
law of sacrifice, chastity and
the law of chastity and

723
00:48:44,240 --> 00:48:49,000
consecration and the law of
consecration that on the face of

724
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:53,040
it, it means what it says right
now a part of us is a little bit

725
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:55,400
discipline to go, well, what
certainly there's some secret

726
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:58,760
meaning to that.
I don't know that there is.

727
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:02,120
I think there are far deeper
implications which we have

728
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,120
already discussed and we'll
continue to discuss.

729
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:16,160
This is interesting to me.
The pre 1990 ceremony moves

730
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:18,440
sequentially through LDS
scripture.

731
00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:23,360
The Old and New Testaments are
named in connection with the law

732
00:49:23,360 --> 00:49:25,720
of sacrifice.
Right.

733
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:30,280
So in the ordinance itself, as
discussed in the scripture and

734
00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:33,200
the Book of Mormon is named in
connection with the law of the

735
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:37,040
gospel, and the doctrine of
covenants is named in connection

736
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:39,040
with the law of consecration.
Right.

737
00:49:39,720 --> 00:49:43,280
The 1990 revision abandons this
sequence, referring to the

738
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:47,480
Scriptures generically, not by
specific standard works, except

739
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:50,240
in the case of the law of
consecration, where the Doctrine

740
00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:52,840
of Covenants is specifically
named.

741
00:49:53,360 --> 00:49:55,840
Right.
This is interesting in at least

742
00:49:55,840 --> 00:50:00,440
two ways to me.
Number one, it's insightful to

743
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:05,200
me how these progressive
covenants were viewed.

744
00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:08,000
Number one, that they were
progressing and that the law of

745
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:11,280
sacrifice was what was given as
part of the Old Testament.

746
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:16,320
The Law of Moses, which was in
preparation for the Law of the

747
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:20,160
Gospel, which we'll see later,
is a reference to the higher Law

748
00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:25,680
relevant to the Law of Moses.
And I was going to say, I, I

749
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:29,560
think the fact that that the,
the law of the gospel is used,

750
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:32,520
or let me rephrase this, the
Book of Mormon is used to

751
00:50:32,520 --> 00:50:35,320
reference the law of the gospel.
That should give us a pretty

752
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,840
good indication that, hey, we
may want to look there.

753
00:50:39,720 --> 00:50:42,120
Very good.
Now the second thought that

754
00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:45,080
occurs to me, why would they
abandoned that in the 1990

755
00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:47,720
revision?
And what makes sense to me, if

756
00:50:47,720 --> 00:50:52,040
they're talking about the Bible,
the New Testament really is the

757
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:54,720
higher law.
So technically it wouldn't be

758
00:50:54,720 --> 00:50:57,160
correct to name it as just the
law of sacrifice.

759
00:50:57,160 --> 00:50:59,680
But so I can see why that might
be the case.

760
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:05,320
Christ further taught.
Therefore, those things which

761
00:51:05,320 --> 00:51:09,160
were of old time, and he's 23rd
Nephi again, which were under

762
00:51:09,160 --> 00:51:13,400
the law in me, are fulfilled.
Old things are done away, and

763
00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:16,560
all things have become new.
As part of this new law,

764
00:51:16,560 --> 00:51:20,760
Christ's Sermon at the Temple
recorded in 3rd Nephi and his

765
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:24,120
Sermon on the Mount recorded in
Matthew have been described as a

766
00:51:24,120 --> 00:51:27,640
higher law by President James E
Faust and others.

767
00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:31,480
These signature sermons of Jesus
Christ teach how to live the law

768
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:35,960
of the gospel in a higher way.
And I was going to point out the

769
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:38,440
image that I put with this where
he's talking about these

770
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:41,400
progressive covenants because
they are progressives.

771
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:42,160
Right.
Yep.

772
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:47,240
And here I have the Manti temple
where they still have the stairs

773
00:51:47,720 --> 00:51:49,720
progressing from one level to
the other.

774
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:51,600
Yep.
Which makes it more obvious

775
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:55,080
what's happening with our
covenants that they each

776
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:59,360
covenant that you make is
progressive, requiring, that's

777
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:05,000
right, further commitment in
addition to renewing a stronger

778
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:08,600
commitment to follow the first
principles and ordinances of the

779
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:15,360
gospel, the scriptures and the
temple specify an oh, OK, so

780
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:17,800
this is the answer to the
question you were going to ask

781
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:19,400
earlier.
OK.

782
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:23,320
The covenant of obedience, the
covenant of the law of

783
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:25,840
sacrifice, and the covenant of
the law of the gospel.

784
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:29,040
Haven't we made these covenants
already?

785
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:33,760
We we made these covenants when
we were baptized.

786
00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:37,560
We renew these covenants every
week when we partake of the

787
00:52:37,560 --> 00:52:40,520
sacrament.
Is this what?

788
00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:44,040
Why are we doing this?
This is in part the answer to

789
00:52:44,040 --> 00:52:47,280
that question.
In addition to renewing a

790
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:52,480
stronger commitment to follow
the first principles that orders

791
00:52:52,480 --> 00:52:55,840
of the gospel, the Scriptures,
and the temple specify

792
00:52:56,600 --> 00:53:00,640
additional ways that we can
elevate our holiness to prepare

793
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:02,200
ourselves to enter God's
presence.

794
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:07,280
We additionally promise to
become more holy by abstaining

795
00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:11,480
from certain practices.
So this is the the the rest of

796
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:17,080
that covenant is kind of flat as
detailed out for us in the words

797
00:53:17,080 --> 00:53:22,680
that follow light mindedness,
loud laughter, evil speaking and

798
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:26,560
taking the name of God in vain.
The Doctrine and Covenant

799
00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:30,680
specifically states quote and
this is from section 88 that

800
00:53:30,680 --> 00:53:33,880
your in Cummings may be in the
name of the Lord that your

801
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:37,200
outgoings may be in the name of
the Lord that all your

802
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:40,440
salutations may be in the name
of the Lord.

803
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:45,560
By the way it occurred to me, I
mean, having grown up in the

804
00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:49,920
church, we're so used to hearing
and saying in the name of Jesus

805
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:52,400
Christ, right?
In the name of Jesus Christ,

806
00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:57,640
almost to the point where it
becomes meaningless, sure.

807
00:53:57,640 --> 00:54:02,160
But as as I was old enough to
really ponder what am I doing,

808
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:09,360
even when I was taking it for
granted, it inevitably helped me

809
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:17,440
even as a child and as a young
adult, consecrate whatever I was

810
00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:22,000
doing, praying or administering
ordinances in the name of Jesus

811
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:23,720
Christ.
Consecrate that.

812
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:26,800
Right.
Making it obvious to me I'm not

813
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:33,640
doing this for me, not doing it
for my mom, right in the name of

814
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:38,000
Jesus Christ.
And it it's imbued in everything

815
00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:40,400
we do and say, it's really quite
amazing.

816
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:43,360
Me and see this whole time I
thought every time we said that

817
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:45,440
it was just to show we were
getting closer to the end of the

818
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:46,840
meeting and I could go home and
eat.

819
00:54:47,320 --> 00:54:53,240
I had no idea, I just.
You're awesome, and that's why,

820
00:54:53,520 --> 00:54:57,200
and that's why you're awesome.
So Doctor Covenants kind of

821
00:54:57,200 --> 00:55:01,520
explains that in more detail.
Our incomes and our outgoings

822
00:55:01,520 --> 00:55:04,160
and all our salutations in the
name of the Lord.

823
00:55:05,080 --> 00:55:07,160
What is?
What is he getting at?

824
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:13,320
Ultimately, if we are, if our
lives are consecrated, are made

825
00:55:13,320 --> 00:55:20,000
holy to the Kingdom of God,
everything we do is going to be

826
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:22,440
in His name.
Yep, Yep.

827
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:26,000
Every, every waking moment,
every aspect of our lives will

828
00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:28,520
be seen from that perspective.
Go ahead.

829
00:55:29,840 --> 00:55:33,400
You know, this is one of those
things that I have tried to to

830
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:36,200
perfect in my own life, not
always super successful.

831
00:55:36,200 --> 00:55:42,840
I try, which is especially as
men, we tend to want to

832
00:55:42,840 --> 00:55:46,680
compartmentalize things, right?
We want to be like, no, no, no,

833
00:55:46,680 --> 00:55:49,240
this is work.
This is this is play, this is,

834
00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:54,240
you know, whatever.
Lately I've been trying to

835
00:55:54,240 --> 00:55:56,000
really get away from that,
right.

836
00:55:56,600 --> 00:56:00,680
And how is it my work, what I do
in my day job?

837
00:56:00,720 --> 00:56:05,960
How, how can that be more geared
towards something that could be

838
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:10,200
consecrated, right?
How can just my leisure time be

839
00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:15,160
more of a, of a consecrated
activity, right?

840
00:56:15,760 --> 00:56:18,680
All those things, right?
What, what can we do to up the

841
00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:21,640
game a little bit, so to speak?
And that's one of the things

842
00:56:21,640 --> 00:56:24,120
that I think the temple does.
And especially this covenant

843
00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:28,520
here.
It's an injunction or not an

844
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:31,760
injunction.
It is a, it is, is an

845
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:36,840
invitation, a very strong
invitation of up your game, up

846
00:56:36,840 --> 00:56:41,480
your game.
Because I think too often it'd

847
00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:43,520
be easy to be like, yeah, I got
that one down.

848
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:45,920
I'm good, right?
Are you, though?

849
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:49,040
I mean, look, usually in
spiritual matters, if someone

850
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:52,040
says they're good, I'm like, I
don't know, right?

851
00:56:52,040 --> 00:56:53,000
Maybe you are.
Maybe you.

852
00:56:53,240 --> 00:56:55,680
Have it down.
None of us are there yet, buddy.

853
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:56,560
Yeah.
Right.

854
00:56:56,640 --> 00:57:00,320
But so I tend, I tend to be
like, OK, So what can we do to

855
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,680
up that game?
What can we do to be a little

856
00:57:02,680 --> 00:57:04,600
bit better today than we were
yesterday?

857
00:57:05,120 --> 00:57:07,640
Oh, yeah.
I think the temple is is is one

858
00:57:07,640 --> 00:57:10,120
of those places that definitely
gives us that invitation.

859
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:14,760
Absolutely.
Therefore, recording Section 88

860
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:18,600
again, Cease from all your light
speeches, from all laughter,

861
00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:22,560
from all your lustful desires,
from all your pride and like

862
00:57:22,560 --> 00:57:25,280
mindedness, and from all your
wicked doings.

863
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:29,400
This scripture specifies like
mindedness, laughter, lustful

864
00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:36,040
desires, pride as and wicked and
wickedness as ways that detract

865
00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:38,280
from our holiness and I'll
specifically what do some of

866
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:43,680
those words mean?
Let me go back for just a

867
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:45,040
second.
I want to finish this thought

868
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:51,800
about we've already made these
covenants in baptism.

869
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:55,600
Why are we making those same
covenants again in the temple?

870
00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:02,080
The the covenants that we make
in the temple are progressive,

871
00:58:02,440 --> 00:58:06,000
leading to the highest and the
holiest ordinance of all, which

872
00:58:06,000 --> 00:58:07,400
is to be sealed together
eternally.

873
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:15,000
Those high and holy ordinances
cannot occur in a vacuum.

874
00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:18,560
Whenever in the scriptures, the
Book of Mormon and elsewhere,

875
00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:28,480
when Lehi or Ammon or Nephi or
Alma, whenever they're in a

876
00:58:28,480 --> 00:58:31,200
missionary situation and they're
preaching the gospel to people

877
00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:34,200
for the first time, they always
teach the same thing.

878
00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:37,520
They start with the fall.
Right.

879
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:42,800
And then because you can't
understand the need for the

880
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:46,920
Savior without understanding our
our relationship with God and

881
00:58:46,920 --> 00:58:49,080
what has happened to us and why
we need a Redeemer.

882
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:52,040
Right.
You have to start at the

883
00:58:52,040 --> 00:58:54,920
beginning in order to be able to
understand the end.

884
00:58:56,080 --> 00:58:57,520
That is exactly what we're
doing.

885
00:58:57,520 --> 00:58:59,520
I mean, that's what is the
endowment.

886
00:58:59,760 --> 00:59:01,360
It's exactly what it's teaching
us.

887
00:59:01,360 --> 00:59:04,680
Yep, Yep.
We can't understand our

888
00:59:04,680 --> 00:59:08,040
relationship with God or what
we're even doing here without

889
00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:13,040
understanding how we got here.
So why would you expect to go to

890
00:59:13,040 --> 00:59:15,680
the temple and only hear about
the highest and holiest

891
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:19,880
ordinance without the initial
steps to help us understand how

892
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:22,840
we get there?
Well, yeah, and and not just

893
00:59:22,840 --> 00:59:27,040
that it it gives us the pattern,
right of of what?

894
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:36,160
To an ascension to, to to deity,
right, to become as he is.

895
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:40,360
And so that pattern is very
important, right?

896
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:46,760
And, and becomes super important
as you continue on because,

897
00:59:46,760 --> 00:59:49,760
look, the whole temple itself is
a narrative, right?

898
00:59:51,320 --> 00:59:54,600
And that's why I'm a guy that
tends to believe that the, that

899
00:59:54,600 --> 00:59:58,720
the liturgy is important there
because it's, it's communicating

900
00:59:58,720 --> 01:00:01,080
higher, higher and holier
principles.

901
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,200
And it's, it's done in one
narrative.

902
01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:08,920
And, and I'm a guy who loves
origin stories, right?

903
01:00:10,360 --> 01:00:12,600
Origin stories, to me are some
of the best stories.

904
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:16,840
Well, in the temple, you get the
ultimate origin story, right?

905
01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:21,080
And by having that, that gives
you a fixed position in

906
01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:23,920
proximity to where it is you
want to get.

907
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:28,240
And anybody who's ever read a
map understands that that map is

908
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:31,880
worthless till you figure out
where you are at that moment on

909
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:34,800
the map to read it further.
Yeah.

910
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:38,120
Or, as the Book of Mormon
concisely states, line up online

911
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:42,240
except upon precept.
Yep, you can't understand

912
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:45,760
consecration without
understanding devotion in the

913
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:49,040
law of chastity, without
understanding the saving

914
01:00:49,040 --> 01:00:51,440
ordinances of the gospel, the
law of the gospel, without

915
01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:55,560
understanding sacrifice without
understanding obedience.

916
01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:59,680
First of all, all right, light
mindedness.

917
01:00:59,960 --> 01:01:03,600
Modern Scripture deals with like
mindedness as trivializing the

918
01:01:03,600 --> 01:01:06,600
sacred or making light of sacred
things.

919
01:01:07,280 --> 01:01:09,480
Latter Day Saints were
admonished early in the history

920
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:13,680
of the Church to quote trifle
not with sacred things.

921
01:01:15,560 --> 01:01:20,200
At its worst, light mindedness
may become ridicule and then

922
01:01:20,200 --> 01:01:24,440
sacrilege, then blasphemy, a
deliberate irreverence for the

923
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:30,160
things of God.
I We have this great gift given

924
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:34,240
to us, which was Webster's
Dictionary of 1828.

925
01:01:34,800 --> 01:01:38,720
OK, if we ever wanted to know
what Joseph Smith meant by the

926
01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:43,120
word that he used in the 1830s,
we have a dictionary that tells

927
01:01:43,120 --> 01:01:46,960
us and it's online.
So I looked up like minded in

928
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:50,120
Webster's 191828 online
dictionary.

929
01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,800
It's an adjective which means
unsettled, unsteady, volatile,

930
01:01:54,040 --> 01:01:57,680
not considerate.
Interesting.

931
01:01:58,760 --> 01:02:02,760
So when he's to cease from our
like mindedness, cease from our

932
01:02:02,760 --> 01:02:07,320
unsteadiness, our volatility,
cease from being inconsiderate.

933
01:02:08,680 --> 01:02:11,400
Interesting that puts it in a
whole nother light, right?

934
01:02:11,840 --> 01:02:15,320
This kind of Harkins back to not
being blown about by every wind

935
01:02:15,320 --> 01:02:19,840
of doctrine in my mind, right,
True, true, true about anchoring

936
01:02:19,840 --> 01:02:22,560
yourself to the to the
principles of the restored

937
01:02:22,560 --> 01:02:28,240
gospel.
And you know, you, you see guys

938
01:02:28,240 --> 01:02:32,680
who jump around a lot from
religion to religion and it can

939
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:35,920
be worrisome at times, right?
I mean, that's, that's the, I

940
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:37,800
think that's the definition of
volatile.

941
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,360
And then the considerate part, I
mean, that's huge as well,

942
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:48,040
right?
Because I think it, that

943
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:52,080
consideration that we extend to
others, I think is a direct

944
01:02:52,080 --> 01:02:56,080
correlation on probably how we
view God in some ways, right?

945
01:02:56,640 --> 01:03:00,360
Oh, for sure.
My dad, my dad rammed my head

946
01:03:00,360 --> 01:03:05,560
full of things, quite frankly,
because I I knew he was, I think

947
01:03:05,560 --> 01:03:08,160
he knew he was getting close to
punching that time card.

948
01:03:08,600 --> 01:03:11,760
Yeah.
And I remember he had talks with

949
01:03:11,760 --> 01:03:15,280
me in the truck that you just
normally wouldn't have with a 13

950
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:18,560
year old boy, right?
And one of them I remembered and

951
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:20,840
I this will come full circle
here in a minute with this

952
01:03:20,840 --> 01:03:26,000
consideration thing.
He said if you ever marry a

953
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:30,640
woman who who already has kids,
the best way to show her that

954
01:03:30,640 --> 01:03:32,600
you love her is to love her
children.

955
01:03:33,040 --> 01:03:38,840
Oh, for sure.
Now, if we show Christ like

956
01:03:38,840 --> 01:03:42,960
consideration to our brothers
and sisters, it's showing love

957
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,640
to God as much as it is to that
person.

958
01:03:45,640 --> 01:03:47,440
Not clearly.
Yeah, right.

959
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:50,520
And so I think that becomes huge
here in this.

960
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:55,320
Yeah, absolutely.
The other thing that comes to my

961
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:58,320
mind is a term that was used
frequently in the doctrine

962
01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:01,640
confidence that we don't use as
much now.

963
01:04:01,680 --> 01:04:04,560
It's the, the, the term solemn
assemblies.

964
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:08,280
Yes.
And I remember my oldest son

965
01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:12,360
when he was like a teenager and
we were, we were living in South

966
01:04:12,360 --> 01:04:16,200
Dakota and his friends were
going to these contemporary

967
01:04:16,200 --> 01:04:19,960
Christian services where they
had drums and guitars and going

968
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:23,320
in their services.
He thought that was so cool.

969
01:04:24,120 --> 01:04:26,160
And he says, why can't we do
that?

970
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:31,480
And I said to him, I said, first
of all, we do.

971
01:04:32,600 --> 01:04:34,680
Have you ever been to one of the
church dances?

972
01:04:35,240 --> 01:04:37,280
That's what the cultural hall is
for.

973
01:04:37,840 --> 01:04:42,560
That's the that's the purpose of
that meeting, right?

974
01:04:43,040 --> 01:04:46,240
Said our sacrament meetings are
not for that purpose.

975
01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:50,520
Our sacrament meetings are what
are called solemn assemblies,

976
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:57,560
where we come together in
solemnity with consideration of

977
01:04:57,560 --> 01:05:02,240
the weight of what has been done
and how significant and how

978
01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:06,520
important these things are,
which is not to be trivialized,

979
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:11,120
right?
It is not to be taken lightly.

980
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:16,280
And so the word we've used today
contemporarily is, you know, to

981
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:18,320
take it seriously.
Right.

982
01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:21,840
Right, that's the ought to be
like minded is to not you're not

983
01:05:21,840 --> 01:05:25,600
taking this seriously.
You know, solemn assemblies are

984
01:05:25,600 --> 01:05:30,360
what we're about.
You know, this is such, this can

985
01:05:30,360 --> 01:05:32,520
be tricky at times.
And let me explain why.

986
01:05:34,520 --> 01:05:38,600
I think all of us as Mormons and
probably every religion,

987
01:05:39,320 --> 01:05:43,760
sometimes we get up and we go to
church on Sunday when we don't

988
01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:47,240
feel like it because quite
frankly, that's just what we do,

989
01:05:47,840 --> 01:05:49,760
right?
And that's a good thing, right?

990
01:05:49,760 --> 01:05:51,840
There is something to fake it
till you make it.

991
01:05:51,840 --> 01:05:53,920
But at some point, you got to
make it, right?

992
01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:58,600
At a point you have to, you have
to dig a little bit deeper than

993
01:05:58,600 --> 01:06:00,520
just, yeah, I'm going to sit
here and I'm going to take the,

994
01:06:01,080 --> 01:06:04,040
the, the emblems of the
sacrament and that'll be good

995
01:06:04,040 --> 01:06:05,640
enough.
I can punch that card and go

996
01:06:05,640 --> 01:06:09,040
home for the week, right?
At some point, something higher

997
01:06:09,040 --> 01:06:12,480
has to be reached for.
Yeah, I agree.

998
01:06:14,800 --> 01:06:18,560
Loud laughter and I've
intentionally included a

999
01:06:18,560 --> 01:06:24,240
photograph the chosen Jesus
Jesus laughing with his

1000
01:06:24,240 --> 01:06:28,560
disciples.
It's not usually the volume of

1001
01:06:28,560 --> 01:06:32,520
1's laughter that's the problem,
and this is from the church's

1002
01:06:32,520 --> 01:06:36,800
website.
In this in something like

1003
01:06:36,800 --> 01:06:41,960
inappropriate or disrespectful,
loud laughter is laughter that

1004
01:06:41,960 --> 01:06:46,760
is rude, mocking or
inconsiderate and I would add

1005
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:48,840
inappropriate.
Yep.

1006
01:06:49,320 --> 01:06:54,520
Can you imagine loud?
I had a friend who was visiting

1007
01:06:54,520 --> 01:06:59,800
our ward and was giving him a
report on his mission that he

1008
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:03,680
had just returned from and he's
one of these guys.

1009
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:05,360
I don't know where he got the
idea.

1010
01:07:07,120 --> 01:07:10,480
Who thought that a sacra meeting
talk should be entertaining.

1011
01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:14,960
It was the most embarrassing
thing I have ever seen.

1012
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:19,040
He stands up when he was
treating this talk in the solemn

1013
01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:25,200
assembly as stand up comedy,
that it was his responsibility

1014
01:07:25,200 --> 01:07:29,680
to tell jokes and to make the
audience laugh and it was a

1015
01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:33,920
mockery.
It was like minded and some of

1016
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:36,560
the words he used were
completely inappropriate for a

1017
01:07:36,560 --> 01:07:39,400
setting of a solemn assembly.
Right.

1018
01:07:40,080 --> 01:07:43,800
And it was clear to me he wasn't
taking himself seriously at all.

1019
01:07:44,840 --> 01:07:46,880
It was one of the saddest things
I've ever seen.

1020
01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:50,040
So it's not it's not to prohibit
laughter.

1021
01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:54,920
Joseph Smith had a had a a very
hearty laugh.

1022
01:07:55,720 --> 01:07:58,760
And when I think of the children
being drawn to Christ, and he

1023
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:01,200
says forbid them not.
Right.

1024
01:08:01,720 --> 01:08:06,480
Children are not, are not drawn
to people who are angry or sad.

1025
01:08:07,040 --> 01:08:10,520
No, no, they he, his love for
them must have radiated.

1026
01:08:11,160 --> 01:08:23,359
Yeah, his persona.
It was light mindedness and loud

1027
01:08:23,359 --> 01:08:27,359
laughter seem to be go hand in
hand, which gives us an idea of

1028
01:08:27,359 --> 01:08:30,479
what the loud laughter is really
about it.

1029
01:08:30,600 --> 01:08:32,960
It's the light mindedness.
Yeah, it's not, it's not the

1030
01:08:33,040 --> 01:08:35,359
like you said, it's not the
volume, right.

1031
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:45,120
I tend to look at this as almost
like, you know, there's a time

1032
01:08:45,120 --> 01:08:46,960
to cut it up with the boys,
right?

1033
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:49,800
Within, within reason, right?
Yeah.

1034
01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:54,279
But when you're dealing with
holy things, that's probably not

1035
01:08:54,279 --> 01:08:56,080
the place for it.
Right?

1036
01:08:56,279 --> 01:08:58,920
An amusing, an amusing quip here
or there.

1037
01:08:58,920 --> 01:09:03,040
There's nothing wrong with that.
But at some point, you got to

1038
01:09:03,040 --> 01:09:05,479
start taking these things a
little more seriously.

1039
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:09,279
Could you imagine standing at
the veil after everything in the

1040
01:09:09,279 --> 01:09:14,600
temple and and hear somebody
bust out, No, this, you know,

1041
01:09:14,600 --> 01:09:17,760
raucous laughter, It's
inappropriate, right?

1042
01:09:17,800 --> 01:09:21,240
It's like minded.
It's not taking seriously the

1043
01:09:21,240 --> 01:09:24,000
solemnity of what we're doing.
And in order for Latter Day

1044
01:09:24,000 --> 01:09:26,720
Saints to participate in these
high and holy ordinances, they

1045
01:09:26,720 --> 01:09:29,720
have to understand what
solemnity means.

1046
01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:33,080
Yep, Yep.
And I and I also think that, you

1047
01:09:33,080 --> 01:09:37,800
know, if you're if your
laughter's coming at the expense

1048
01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:40,080
of another.
Absolutely, yeah.

1049
01:09:40,200 --> 01:09:43,279
I think, I think we're we're
getting dangerously close to

1050
01:09:43,279 --> 01:09:46,439
that territory.
Yeah, evil.

1051
01:09:46,439 --> 01:09:48,279
Speaking of the Lord's anointed
in the temple.

1052
01:09:48,279 --> 01:09:51,680
We are warned about speaking
evil of the Lord's anointed When

1053
01:09:51,680 --> 01:09:55,560
you make these sacred covenants
in the temple, take a look at

1054
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:57,680
all those in the endowment room
around you.

1055
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:00,960
Who else in this room has been
anointed?

1056
01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:03,800
Everyone.
Perhaps the warning on speaking

1057
01:10:03,800 --> 01:10:08,800
evil can apply to all members of
the covenant community speaking

1058
01:10:08,800 --> 01:10:11,640
evil of one another.
Everyone who has been washed,

1059
01:10:11,640 --> 01:10:15,360
anointed and endowed with holy
priesthood power is anointed for

1060
01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:20,120
holy purposes unto the Lord and
deserves respect and honor at

1061
01:10:20,120 --> 01:10:22,680
least for that, and that
includes you.

1062
01:10:23,320 --> 01:10:27,360
Evil Speaking of yourself is
also a form of speaking evil of

1063
01:10:27,360 --> 01:10:29,600
the Lord's anointed priest or
priestess.

1064
01:10:30,040 --> 01:10:33,000
Yep, the Scriptures also speak
of another category of evil

1065
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:37,040
speaking, and that is of the
Lord's anointed leaders.

1066
01:10:37,360 --> 01:10:40,840
This can apply to the kings of
ancient Israel and also to

1067
01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:44,320
today's church leaders.
As part of becoming a covenant

1068
01:10:44,320 --> 01:10:48,560
community, we agree to sustain
and support the Lord's appointed

1069
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:52,440
leaders even when their
teachings do not always align

1070
01:10:52,920 --> 01:10:57,800
with society's values.
I don't think this means that

1071
01:10:57,800 --> 01:11:02,080
there is no room to work through
times when you may struggle with

1072
01:11:02,080 --> 01:11:04,760
decisions or teachings of church
leaders.

1073
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:10,200
The church values counsels and
feedback in decision making.

1074
01:11:10,200 --> 01:11:15,560
However, we should never mock,
ridicule, or be hostile to the

1075
01:11:15,560 --> 01:11:19,280
Lord's anointed leaders.
It contributes to the unity and

1076
01:11:19,280 --> 01:11:22,280
harmony of the covenant
community.

1077
01:11:22,280 --> 01:11:24,800
It also shows respect and honor
to God.

1078
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:27,680
I think this most importantly
applies to the Lord's anointed

1079
01:11:27,680 --> 01:11:31,240
prophets and apostles.
However, this can also apply in

1080
01:11:31,240 --> 01:11:34,400
varying degrees to other general
officers and local church

1081
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:37,000
leaders.
It shows respect for the order

1082
01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:40,360
of the priesthood, I think.
OK.

1083
01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:43,680
So, Ken, I'm going to ask you a
question here on this one.

1084
01:11:44,200 --> 01:11:47,240
Yeah.
What would we have to do in

1085
01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:52,440
order to become a Zion society?
Let me let me ask this question.

1086
01:11:52,960 --> 01:11:55,400
This is probably a better
question for our where I want to

1087
01:11:55,400 --> 01:12:01,400
take this.
What's the temple's role in

1088
01:12:01,480 --> 01:12:04,760
helping people reach a place
where they could live in a Zion

1089
01:12:04,760 --> 01:12:14,240
society?
Zion defined as whether pure in

1090
01:12:14,240 --> 01:12:16,280
heart dwell.
What does that mean?

1091
01:12:17,160 --> 01:12:20,280
To be pure in heart means that
your intentions are pure.

1092
01:12:21,480 --> 01:12:23,720
Right.
How do we purify our intentions?

1093
01:12:23,720 --> 01:12:29,160
By by becoming one with the mind
and the will and the purposes of

1094
01:12:29,160 --> 01:12:31,640
God.
How do we do that?

1095
01:12:32,000 --> 01:12:36,400
By understanding His plan and
becoming one with that which is

1096
01:12:36,440 --> 01:12:40,480
provided to us in great detail
in His holy temple.

1097
01:12:40,680 --> 01:12:44,800
OK.
Yeah, the temple, You know, we

1098
01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:48,200
discussed this once.
I I can't remember what

1099
01:12:48,200 --> 01:12:54,080
conversation it was, but in
preparation for their journey

1100
01:12:54,080 --> 01:12:58,200
across the plains when they were
expelled from Nauvoo, the Saints

1101
01:12:58,200 --> 01:13:02,520
were desperate to receive their
endowments in the as yet

1102
01:13:02,520 --> 01:13:06,360
unfinished Nauvoo Temple.
Brigham Young was trying to tell

1103
01:13:06,360 --> 01:13:07,840
them to go home and they
wouldn't.

1104
01:13:09,080 --> 01:13:14,160
Well, Brigham remained all day,
all night, non-stop.

1105
01:13:16,040 --> 01:13:22,200
And it what it, I forget how he
put it, but it endowed the

1106
01:13:22,200 --> 01:13:27,400
Saints with the power necessary
to do what was going to be asked

1107
01:13:27,400 --> 01:13:31,480
of them, which is unprecedented
in American history.

1108
01:13:31,840 --> 01:13:36,120
Yep, this exodus.
Now this is the question I asked

1109
01:13:36,560 --> 01:13:40,480
the question the pragmatic
person power.

1110
01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:43,960
What are they talking about?
What kind of magic did the

1111
01:13:43,960 --> 01:13:47,080
temple in Nabu give them to
cross the plains?

1112
01:13:47,640 --> 01:13:50,000
They they couldn't fly across
the plains.

1113
01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:52,200
They weren't given magical
powers.

1114
01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:55,080
I mean, they were miracles that
happened, but some people died.

1115
01:13:56,320 --> 01:14:00,120
It was still incredibly
difficult and demanding.

1116
01:14:00,440 --> 01:14:05,840
They still had to walk over 1000
miles to arrive in a place that

1117
01:14:05,840 --> 01:14:07,480
had nothing for them when they
arrived there.

1118
01:14:08,120 --> 01:14:10,160
They still had to make the land
arable.

1119
01:14:10,280 --> 01:14:11,720
They still had to grow their
crops.

1120
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:13,520
They still had to build their
homes.

1121
01:14:13,960 --> 01:14:20,200
What power was it?
And I, I think it was embodied

1122
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:25,680
in the hymn Come Come He Saints.
Yep, as they crossed the plains

1123
01:14:25,680 --> 01:14:27,840
that they sang that hymn to
themselves, which reminded

1124
01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:32,360
themselves the power that they
had was the power of their

1125
01:14:32,360 --> 01:14:35,880
wills, the power of the the
hope.

1126
01:14:36,320 --> 01:14:39,440
So the willpower comes from
their hope and their faith that

1127
01:14:39,440 --> 01:14:43,240
what they were doing was
building the Kingdom of God and

1128
01:14:43,800 --> 01:14:46,840
with that kind of pure intent.
Yeah.

1129
01:14:47,200 --> 01:14:52,360
The pureness of heart that it
defines Zion, that's the power

1130
01:14:52,360 --> 01:14:56,000
that God is talking about.
The power of the the real power

1131
01:14:56,520 --> 01:15:01,360
of the restored gospel is that
ability to change men's hearts.

1132
01:15:01,880 --> 01:15:04,680
Absolutely.
And that's yeah.

1133
01:15:04,680 --> 01:15:08,280
I think it also gave them the
the ability to stare, to

1134
01:15:08,320 --> 01:15:12,200
frankly, stare death in the face
and be like that line, right?

1135
01:15:12,200 --> 01:15:15,960
If if we die before our journey
is through, all's well happy.

1136
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:18,880
Day, all is well.
We, we can stare the beast in

1137
01:15:18,880 --> 01:15:25,800
the face and, and not flinch.
Lately, I've been thinking about

1138
01:15:25,800 --> 01:15:29,520
the temple and its connection to
Zion, right?

1139
01:15:29,760 --> 01:15:32,200
Because it's Mormons.
That's what we really are aiming

1140
01:15:32,200 --> 01:15:36,000
at, right?
And, and as I thought about

1141
01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:40,920
this, and, and feel free to
disagree with me on this, but

1142
01:15:40,920 --> 01:15:45,000
if, if Zion is its own nation,
so to speak, right?

1143
01:15:47,720 --> 01:15:51,240
I think the temple is where you
take your citizenship courses.

1144
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:54,440
Agreed.
Right.

1145
01:15:54,440 --> 01:15:58,600
I think that is the place where
you learn how to be a citizen

1146
01:15:58,600 --> 01:16:03,600
within that Zion type community.
I agree.

1147
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:10,040
Now, how many communities have
we seen be blown apart by

1148
01:16:10,040 --> 01:16:16,920
backbiting, by gossip, by all
sorts of benevolent things that

1149
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:18,880
we say about one another?
Right.

1150
01:16:19,200 --> 01:16:23,680
And just as you alluded to, if
there are people that have been

1151
01:16:23,680 --> 01:16:29,920
anointed in the temple of our
God and they have proven worthy

1152
01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:34,520
to be able to receive those
ordinances, I think that's

1153
01:16:34,520 --> 01:16:36,120
really what we're looking for,
right?

1154
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:43,160
Because I think that that that
is the that's what half has to

1155
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:46,280
be there in Zion in order to for
it to function of people who

1156
01:16:46,600 --> 01:16:50,200
have no I'll intent, who want
nothing but the best for their

1157
01:16:50,200 --> 01:16:53,600
brother or sister.
That has to be enforced.

1158
01:16:53,600 --> 01:16:56,720
And you can't have that if
you're constantly tearing them

1159
01:16:56,720 --> 01:17:00,120
down either to their face or
behind their back, right.

1160
01:17:00,480 --> 01:17:04,360
And so this not Speaking of the
Lord's anointed, it becomes very

1161
01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:07,840
important when you start
thinking about trying to foster

1162
01:17:07,840 --> 01:17:11,720
a Zion type society.
Yes, I love how the Doctrine

1163
01:17:11,720 --> 01:17:18,240
Covenants, in the most succinct
way possible says God says if

1164
01:17:18,240 --> 01:17:21,720
you are not one, you are not
mine.

1165
01:17:22,360 --> 01:17:26,560
Right.
Now, so how do we become one?

1166
01:17:26,560 --> 01:17:31,080
How do we become so unified?
The temple is the way to do that

1167
01:17:31,080 --> 01:17:35,440
because ultimately we consecrate
everything, right?

1168
01:17:35,520 --> 01:17:39,480
We consecrate our very lives to
building up the Kingdom of God.

1169
01:17:39,480 --> 01:17:44,200
And if we are all committed to
that same covenant, we win.

1170
01:17:44,440 --> 01:17:49,840
Yep, Yep, provided us the same
vision right now.

1171
01:17:50,200 --> 01:17:52,080
The vision's important there
too, right?

1172
01:17:52,080 --> 01:17:55,480
Because there was a time where
people were united and the Lord

1173
01:17:55,480 --> 01:17:58,840
wasn't happy with that, right?
The Tower of Babel, right?

1174
01:17:58,840 --> 01:18:01,920
So now make sure it's around
correct principles.

1175
01:18:01,920 --> 01:18:07,120
But yes, rally around those and,
and unify around those correct

1176
01:18:07,120 --> 01:18:09,360
principles.
And that's where Zion can begin

1177
01:18:09,360 --> 01:18:10,720
to happen, I think.
Right.

1178
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:13,960
And I love again Paul's analogy
of the body.

1179
01:18:14,520 --> 01:18:16,520
Right.
The body is the Church.

1180
01:18:16,720 --> 01:18:19,040
The head of the body is Christ.
Yep.

1181
01:18:19,560 --> 01:18:22,080
And if we're all working under
that same head and that same

1182
01:18:22,080 --> 01:18:25,520
vision.
Now the practical aspect that

1183
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:33,040
the only time we've had Zion
societies on this earth that we

1184
01:18:33,040 --> 01:18:40,000
know of a pure Zion society to
the point of either being

1185
01:18:40,440 --> 01:18:47,200
translated or near there unto
one was the Nephites after

1186
01:18:47,200 --> 01:18:51,400
Christ's visit for 100 years and
the other was the city of Enoch.

1187
01:18:53,720 --> 01:18:57,200
And the the third one that we
know of will be during the

1188
01:18:57,200 --> 01:19:01,800
Millennium, right?
And what all three of these Zion

1189
01:19:01,800 --> 01:19:07,600
cities have in common that
allowed them to become Zion was

1190
01:19:07,600 --> 01:19:10,600
the destruction and or expulsion
of the wicked.

1191
01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:15,360
Yep.
So try as we might, and I'm not,

1192
01:19:15,480 --> 01:19:17,520
I don't want to say so let's
just give up.

1193
01:19:17,520 --> 01:19:19,000
I'm not saying that.
No.

1194
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:24,200
But realistically speaking, as
long as the wicked remain among

1195
01:19:24,200 --> 01:19:30,480
us, which is part which part of
the deal and the, the the

1196
01:19:30,480 --> 01:19:33,120
parable of the wheat and the
tears is critical.

1197
01:19:33,440 --> 01:19:36,400
They have to be allowed to grow
up together because until they

1198
01:19:36,400 --> 01:19:39,880
do grow, we don't know if
they're a wheat or a tear.

1199
01:19:40,880 --> 01:19:43,560
Only after they've had a chance
to grow and reveal who and what

1200
01:19:43,560 --> 01:19:48,160
we are is the wheat gathered in.
Yep, to the barn.

1201
01:19:48,600 --> 01:19:53,000
Then the field is burned and the
earth is purified and Zion

1202
01:19:53,000 --> 01:19:56,080
remains.
But you know, people think what

1203
01:19:56,280 --> 01:19:57,680
they beat their heads against
all.

1204
01:19:57,680 --> 01:20:00,800
Why can't we be like the
Nephites after Jesus is there?

1205
01:20:00,800 --> 01:20:04,680
Well, because we still have evil
and wickedness among us, right?

1206
01:20:04,680 --> 01:20:07,840
We shouldn't stop trying, but we
shouldn't beat ourselves up

1207
01:20:08,440 --> 01:20:10,400
because our situation is
different.

1208
01:20:11,000 --> 01:20:15,960
And we are to continue to strive
with the wicked to try and call

1209
01:20:15,960 --> 01:20:20,160
them to repentance and to give
them a chance to change before

1210
01:20:20,160 --> 01:20:24,080
it's too late, right as
ultimately happened with the

1211
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:30,360
Nephites and others.
So taking the name of God in

1212
01:20:30,360 --> 01:20:34,120
vain can take many forms.
It could be using the name

1213
01:20:34,120 --> 01:20:36,960
lightly as an expletive or in
place of a swear word.

1214
01:20:37,560 --> 01:20:40,960
That is certainly disrespectful.
It could be committing evil in

1215
01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:44,960
God's name or pretending to
serve him, but in reality

1216
01:20:44,960 --> 01:20:47,800
failing to do so.
See, growing up with the church

1217
01:20:47,800 --> 01:20:50,200
taking the Lord's name in vain,
it was always cussing.

1218
01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:51,480
That's what we were talking
about.

1219
01:20:52,760 --> 01:20:57,560
But this is more committing evil
in God's name or pretending to

1220
01:20:57,560 --> 01:20:59,800
serve him, but in reality
failing to do so.

1221
01:21:00,440 --> 01:21:03,080
In certain periods of ancient
Judaism, it may have been

1222
01:21:03,080 --> 01:21:07,120
considered blasphemous to even
speak the name of God without

1223
01:21:07,120 --> 01:21:09,000
proper authority.
Yep.

1224
01:21:09,000 --> 01:21:11,680
One of the purposes of the
temple is to take upon us the

1225
01:21:11,680 --> 01:21:17,040
name and the visage of God, the
appearance of God, the names of

1226
01:21:17,040 --> 01:21:21,160
God in the temple.
And notice it says the names of

1227
01:21:21,160 --> 01:21:23,160
God in the temple are very
sacred.

1228
01:21:23,680 --> 01:21:26,400
To reveal them lightly is a
serious violation of the temple

1229
01:21:26,400 --> 01:21:28,400
covenant.
Absolutely.

1230
01:21:29,160 --> 01:21:34,600
You know, the, the other thing
that I'll say is I think this is

1231
01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:37,360
also something to be very
careful what it is you're going

1232
01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:40,360
to attribute to the Lord as
well, right?

1233
01:21:41,280 --> 01:21:45,800
I've heard some guys both in the
church and out who made bold

1234
01:21:45,800 --> 01:21:49,920
proclamations and said this was
given to me by God.

1235
01:21:51,120 --> 01:21:53,880
And I'm like, oh, you want to be
careful there, right?

1236
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:57,440
You better be darn sure that
that's given to you by the Lord.

1237
01:21:58,160 --> 01:22:01,480
Otherwise, I think that's
another form of, of taking the

1238
01:22:01,480 --> 01:22:06,320
Lord's name in vain.
And one, you know, look from my

1239
01:22:06,320 --> 01:22:08,240
side of the aisle here, I'll say
this.

1240
01:22:08,920 --> 01:22:13,400
I think the guy who may be
epitomized as of late the very

1241
01:22:13,400 --> 01:22:15,440
ideal of taking the Lord's name
in vain.

1242
01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:18,920
Warren Jeffs, right?
Oh boy, yeah.

1243
01:22:19,760 --> 01:22:23,720
He perpetrated all sorts of
horrible things in the name of

1244
01:22:23,720 --> 01:22:28,200
God, right?
And, and I have a feeling that's

1245
01:22:28,200 --> 01:22:32,440
going to, while I certainly am
not excusing ever taking the

1246
01:22:32,440 --> 01:22:35,520
name of deity in vain, I think
that's going to carry a little,

1247
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:39,600
maybe a little more stout
punishment than than the dude

1248
01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:41,960
who slips.
Up I I so agree.

1249
01:22:42,240 --> 01:22:46,640
I mean, in yearning for Zion you
go into the Holy of Holies and

1250
01:22:46,640 --> 01:22:50,640
what do you find?
Not an altar, a bed.

1251
01:22:50,920 --> 01:22:54,760
Yep.
Oh my gosh, how to pervert the

1252
01:22:54,960 --> 01:22:57,080
the covenant of the law of
chastity.

1253
01:22:57,720 --> 01:23:01,040
And then he goes and I, we were,
my wife and I were listening to

1254
01:23:01,040 --> 01:23:04,760
one of these recordings that
they'd taken him, and he

1255
01:23:04,760 --> 01:23:09,560
referred to what he was doing to
those poor women as the law of

1256
01:23:09,560 --> 01:23:12,160
heavenly comfort.
Yep.

1257
01:23:12,880 --> 01:23:15,360
Oh my gosh.
Yep.

1258
01:23:15,400 --> 01:23:18,520
Just the perversion of it all.
Yep, Yep.

1259
01:23:18,680 --> 01:23:20,280
Clear.
You could see the hand of the

1260
01:23:20,280 --> 01:23:27,320
devil and him laughing in
mockery of these sacred, most

1261
01:23:27,320 --> 01:23:28,920
sacred ordinances, and it's
crazy.

1262
01:23:29,440 --> 01:23:31,920
And, and for a second, let's
talk about why that is so

1263
01:23:31,920 --> 01:23:34,280
damaging, right?
And why I think the Lord is

1264
01:23:34,280 --> 01:23:38,760
especially concerned with this
because if you're doing it in

1265
01:23:38,760 --> 01:23:43,480
the name of the Lord, you are
absolutely damaging the

1266
01:23:43,480 --> 01:23:48,800
relationship of a child to their
father and mother.

1267
01:23:49,440 --> 01:23:50,720
Yeah.
Right.

1268
01:23:51,440 --> 01:23:54,480
If someone damaged your
relationship with your children,

1269
01:23:54,680 --> 01:24:00,000
how would you feel?
Ken exactly right.

1270
01:24:01,040 --> 01:24:06,000
And and the God we worship is a
God that's not without parts and

1271
01:24:06,000 --> 01:24:11,600
passions, right, right.
So I think this carries a quite

1272
01:24:11,600 --> 01:24:18,080
lofty, quite a lofty.
It should make us all a little

1273
01:24:18,080 --> 01:24:21,360
bit more cognizant of what we
say in the name of the Lord

1274
01:24:21,360 --> 01:24:24,800
before we just spout off at the
lip, right?

1275
01:24:24,800 --> 01:24:28,440
We we better be darn careful not
to attribute something to God

1276
01:24:28,840 --> 01:24:33,760
that's really not from God.
One of the hardest things Christ

1277
01:24:33,760 --> 01:24:36,880
ever spoke the New Testament was
those who would injure or harm a

1278
01:24:36,880 --> 01:24:40,040
child, that it would be better
for millstone to be hung about

1279
01:24:40,040 --> 01:24:41,760
their necks and they'd be
drowned in the depths of the

1280
01:24:41,760 --> 01:24:45,600
sea.
To show you that that kind of

1281
01:24:45,600 --> 01:24:48,480
damage that is done to a
person's life basically deprives

1282
01:24:48,480 --> 01:24:50,360
them of a fair shot at the plan
of salvation.

1283
01:24:51,480 --> 01:24:53,520
But only the justice of God can
correct that.

1284
01:24:54,440 --> 01:24:58,000
I can't.
I, I don't know because of where

1285
01:24:58,000 --> 01:25:04,880
I live here in Southern Utah,
how many damaged people came out

1286
01:25:04,880 --> 01:25:12,880
of the FLDS under Warren Jeffs
who were damaged fundamentally.

1287
01:25:14,160 --> 01:25:19,520
They, they didn't even know how
to have normal decent

1288
01:25:19,520 --> 01:25:23,960
relationships with members of
the opposite sex or did, or how

1289
01:25:23,960 --> 01:25:27,280
to have relationship with people
outside of, of the faith that

1290
01:25:27,280 --> 01:25:32,480
they were raised in, Right.
And worst of all, to me as a

1291
01:25:32,480 --> 01:25:37,320
person who is utterly convinced
of the truthfulness of the faith

1292
01:25:37,320 --> 01:25:40,720
claims of Joseph Smith and
others, that they come out of

1293
01:25:40,720 --> 01:25:45,720
that faith learning to hate
Joseph Smith because everything

1294
01:25:45,720 --> 01:25:48,280
that was done to them was done
to them in the name of Joseph

1295
01:25:48,280 --> 01:25:51,520
Smith and religion and Jesus
Christ.

1296
01:25:52,120 --> 01:25:55,440
So they inevitably throw the
baby out with the bathwater, not

1297
01:25:55,440 --> 01:26:03,560
being able to to unconfuse the
truth of the restored gospel

1298
01:26:03,560 --> 01:26:06,760
through Joseph Smith with the
perversion of it that was taught

1299
01:26:07,240 --> 01:26:10,160
to them as children.
Yep, absolutely.

1300
01:26:10,720 --> 01:26:16,560
I have spent personally
considerable time helping people

1301
01:26:16,560 --> 01:26:22,520
like that see the difference
between and show them having to

1302
01:26:22,520 --> 01:26:26,320
show them in black and white.
What they told you Joseph Smith

1303
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:30,200
taught is not what he taught
this and then then I have to

1304
01:26:30,200 --> 01:26:33,040
show this is what Joseph Smith
taught, right?

1305
01:26:33,440 --> 01:26:35,960
What they were teaching was an
utter perversion.

1306
01:26:36,280 --> 01:26:40,160
Yep, Yep, and.
That is, Oh my goodness, to help

1307
01:26:40,160 --> 01:26:43,520
people get past that, that's a
lifetime struggle.

1308
01:26:43,680 --> 01:26:47,280
Yeah, yeah, and and again,
you've damaged the relationship

1309
01:26:47,480 --> 01:26:50,640
that that person can have with
deity forever, right?

1310
01:26:51,360 --> 01:26:54,800
You can come out of that, but
it's a long time and it's lost

1311
01:26:54,800 --> 01:26:57,840
time, right?
It's time that is spent healing,

1312
01:26:57,840 --> 01:27:01,360
not growing, and it.
Can and it can only happen with

1313
01:27:01,360 --> 01:27:05,520
the help of people who clearly
know the difference between the

1314
01:27:05,520 --> 01:27:07,800
truth and the perversion of the
theology.

1315
01:27:08,040 --> 01:27:10,560
You know, there's not a lot of
people who can help you through

1316
01:27:10,560 --> 01:27:11,960
that.
Absolutely.

1317
01:27:12,520 --> 01:27:16,160
You know something else that has
stuck out to me about all of the

1318
01:27:16,160 --> 01:27:21,720
law of the gospel here as we've
gone over it, the the, the light

1319
01:27:21,720 --> 01:27:24,880
mindedness, the loud laughter,
the evil speaking, the taking of

1320
01:27:24,880 --> 01:27:28,800
the name of God in vain.
These all have to do with with

1321
01:27:28,800 --> 01:27:34,920
our words, right?
Things that we say now, we know

1322
01:27:34,920 --> 01:27:39,480
that that there's power in our
words, right?

1323
01:27:41,280 --> 01:27:44,960
I mean, even the temple gives a
nod to that, right?

1324
01:27:44,960 --> 01:27:47,520
Scripture gives a nod to that,
right?

1325
01:27:47,920 --> 01:27:51,560
Yeah.
While certainly I don't think it

1326
01:27:51,560 --> 01:27:56,720
literally took place, as you
know, God said let there be

1327
01:27:56,720 --> 01:27:59,400
light and then all of a sudden
there was light, right, That we

1328
01:27:59,400 --> 01:28:01,440
know that there's an
organization thing that's

1329
01:28:01,440 --> 01:28:02,640
happening there.
Sure, sure.

1330
01:28:02,960 --> 01:28:06,320
Right.
Nonetheless, the power of that

1331
01:28:06,320 --> 01:28:08,840
comes out of the plan of
speaking.

1332
01:28:09,120 --> 01:28:10,280
Right.
Yes, yes.

1333
01:28:10,560 --> 01:28:17,280
And so all of these seem to be
pointing us to watch what it is

1334
01:28:17,280 --> 01:28:23,000
we say, watch what it is, how we
communicate certain things,

1335
01:28:23,000 --> 01:28:26,640
especially holy things, because
there's some weight there to

1336
01:28:26,640 --> 01:28:29,640
that.
Yes, and if we're not?

1337
01:28:29,880 --> 01:28:33,520
Careful with that part because I
do believe that that you can

1338
01:28:33,520 --> 01:28:36,560
speak things into existence, so
to speak, right?

1339
01:28:38,200 --> 01:28:41,200
You can see a plan come to
fruition, right?

1340
01:28:41,800 --> 01:28:44,600
Yeah.
So what and, and and what you

1341
01:28:45,520 --> 01:28:49,480
how you talk about things I
think will have an impact on,

1342
01:28:49,480 --> 01:28:54,600
on, on things.
I I when I think of words in

1343
01:28:54,640 --> 01:28:58,040
context of temple rights, I
can't help but think of names,

1344
01:28:58,400 --> 01:29:03,160
right, and the critical role
names play.

1345
01:29:04,240 --> 01:29:09,160
And as I have pondered that, it
occurs to me that certainly the

1346
01:29:09,160 --> 01:29:13,680
temple is not the first and the
only place where names take on a

1347
01:29:13,680 --> 01:29:22,680
an especially significant
symbolic role in our progression

1348
01:29:22,680 --> 01:29:24,520
through the plan.
Right.

1349
01:29:25,200 --> 01:29:27,880
The the first instance we know
of is when we're born.

1350
01:29:29,000 --> 01:29:33,000
We are given the Father's
blessing and name and a blessing

1351
01:29:34,360 --> 01:29:37,920
and then that name, that which
we will be known by in this

1352
01:29:37,920 --> 01:29:39,640
mortal life.
Right.

1353
01:29:40,280 --> 01:29:43,720
And you think, oh, that's just
name my dad or my mom gave me.

1354
01:29:44,920 --> 01:29:49,640
When you go to the temple, you
realize, oh, that name has

1355
01:29:49,640 --> 01:29:52,080
eternal significance.
Absolutely.

1356
01:29:52,320 --> 01:29:55,920
My mom and dad gave me has
eternal significance.

1357
01:29:56,360 --> 01:29:59,760
The next time we take upon us a
name is a baptism.

1358
01:30:00,200 --> 01:30:06,360
Right.
Now what occurs to me is that

1359
01:30:07,320 --> 01:30:12,240
again, and those sacred names
are reiterated as we covenant in

1360
01:30:12,240 --> 01:30:19,840
the temple, that each time we
take a significant step in our

1361
01:30:19,840 --> 01:30:24,520
eternal progression, we take
upon ourselves a name.

1362
01:30:25,320 --> 01:30:28,280
Yes.
And that name signifies and

1363
01:30:28,280 --> 01:30:33,480
represents that step that we
have taken when we were born.

1364
01:30:33,480 --> 01:30:36,520
We took upon ourselves our
mortal name, which will remain

1365
01:30:36,520 --> 01:30:41,200
with us for eternity.
When we're baptized, signifying

1366
01:30:41,200 --> 01:30:44,320
that step, we take upon
ourselves the name of Christ.

1367
01:30:44,400 --> 01:30:46,640
We become Christian, we become
his.

1368
01:30:47,400 --> 01:30:52,000
When we go to the temple, names
are reiterated and we take upon

1369
01:30:52,000 --> 01:30:58,040
ourselves a new name.
Yep, which which signifies the

1370
01:30:58,040 --> 01:31:00,400
covenants that we have made on
that day.

1371
01:31:01,080 --> 01:31:03,800
Right.
Now I do extend this forward and

1372
01:31:03,800 --> 01:31:07,120
backward.
I have no doubt that I have

1373
01:31:07,120 --> 01:31:11,040
another name that I was known by
in the pre mortal as a pre

1374
01:31:11,040 --> 01:31:15,800
mortal spirit which signifies
the covenant that I made there

1375
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:19,800
step by step.
I also believe that when I enter

1376
01:31:19,800 --> 01:31:23,800
into this post mortal spirit
world there could be a new name

1377
01:31:23,800 --> 01:31:27,520
indicating that step right?
Or another, another new name

1378
01:31:27,520 --> 01:31:30,080
indicating the step of becoming
resurrected.

1379
01:31:30,600 --> 01:31:32,280
Yeah, you know, and so on and so
forth.

1380
01:31:32,800 --> 01:31:37,160
So that when you string together
all of my names, it's the code

1381
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:41,000
for the steps of my progress.
Right.

1382
01:31:41,480 --> 01:31:45,480
When you look at my whole name,
oh that is pre mortal is mortal.

1383
01:31:45,600 --> 01:31:48,840
He was baptized, he took on
ourselves a new name, he died,

1384
01:31:48,840 --> 01:31:50,680
he was resurrected, etcetera,
etcetera.

1385
01:31:51,680 --> 01:31:56,200
And that new name, which is
written upon the Whitestone that

1386
01:31:56,200 --> 01:32:00,120
all who entered the Celestial
Well realm will receive, might

1387
01:32:00,120 --> 01:32:02,560
very well be the new name of the
Celestial Realm.

1388
01:32:03,880 --> 01:32:07,120
Any case, it's all they're
they're so important to me.

1389
01:32:07,360 --> 01:32:12,560
There, there is.
There's a lot of power in names,

1390
01:32:12,680 --> 01:32:14,680
right?
I think there's a scripture that

1391
01:32:14,680 --> 01:32:17,600
all the animals come before
Adam, and he names all the

1392
01:32:17,600 --> 01:32:20,920
animals, right?
When Eve is presented to him,

1393
01:32:20,920 --> 01:32:23,360
the Lord asks him, what will you
call her, right?

1394
01:32:23,720 --> 01:32:29,080
There's all these, there's
importance to all these names.

1395
01:32:29,360 --> 01:32:33,400
Yeah, I may edit this out later.
I might not.

1396
01:32:33,400 --> 01:32:35,600
I don't know it.
It's the first time I'm going to

1397
01:32:35,600 --> 01:32:39,920
share this with hardly anybody.
I.

1398
01:32:39,920 --> 01:32:45,920
Love when you do that.
About six months before I met my

1399
01:32:45,920 --> 01:32:47,840
wife.
Well, I guess it was a little

1400
01:32:47,840 --> 01:32:49,240
shorter than that.
Actually.

1401
01:32:50,400 --> 01:32:55,480
Those were fuzzy years.
Forgive me, but I, I remember

1402
01:32:56,240 --> 01:33:02,320
and, and I won't go into the all
the details, but it was a moment

1403
01:33:02,320 --> 01:33:09,720
of clarity, right?
And I had, I had just got done

1404
01:33:09,720 --> 01:33:13,200
in participating in partying,
right?

1405
01:33:13,200 --> 01:33:17,840
I'll just leave it at that.
And it was late at night and I

1406
01:33:17,840 --> 01:33:22,240
remember I got up to use the
restroom.

1407
01:33:22,960 --> 01:33:28,240
Everybody else was asleep and I
just looked at myself in the

1408
01:33:28,240 --> 01:33:32,600
mirror and I just thought.
Oh.

1409
01:33:32,880 --> 01:33:38,080
My dad would be disappointed.
And I just said in the mirror,

1410
01:33:38,600 --> 01:33:42,120
David, what are you doing?
And the second I said my name,

1411
01:33:42,920 --> 01:33:46,520
it's like, for just a brief
instance, I could see every bad

1412
01:33:46,520 --> 01:33:51,080
thing I'd ever done.
And I thought in that moment,

1413
01:33:52,440 --> 01:33:56,560
long before I ever became a
Mormon, I need a new name.

1414
01:33:58,240 --> 01:34:01,800
And I walked away from that
experience even before I became

1415
01:34:01,800 --> 01:34:06,520
a Mormon, with an understanding
from somewhere that our names

1416
01:34:06,520 --> 01:34:12,160
are simply a container, as you
said, for covenants we've made

1417
01:34:12,760 --> 01:34:17,760
or things we have done right.
And that's why I think when the

1418
01:34:17,760 --> 01:34:21,320
Lord calls out our name, there
could be a 100 billion other

1419
01:34:21,320 --> 01:34:25,320
people with that same name.
But it we will know it's ours

1420
01:34:25,320 --> 01:34:27,680
because it will somehow be an
indication.

1421
01:34:28,240 --> 01:34:31,120
Oh, sure.
Of what we've done and if our

1422
01:34:31,120 --> 01:34:39,440
name is is just that a container
for our deeds, that that has

1423
01:34:39,440 --> 01:34:41,560
some significance to it.
That has some weight.

1424
01:34:41,560 --> 01:34:43,760
Now that comes from the book of
Dave Page 1.

1425
01:34:43,760 --> 01:34:47,480
So great, big grain of salt, but
it's something that I've I've

1426
01:34:47,480 --> 01:34:50,520
often thought and wondered and
and go back to frequently.

1427
01:34:51,320 --> 01:34:53,720
I can't, I can't disagree with
any of that.

1428
01:34:54,360 --> 01:34:57,280
I mean, that's we know names are
important.

1429
01:34:57,280 --> 01:35:01,560
We know and we know that.
I mean, even baptism, right?

1430
01:35:01,560 --> 01:35:05,680
We're we're born again unto
whom?

1431
01:35:05,680 --> 01:35:07,160
Unto Christ.
Yep.

1432
01:35:08,000 --> 01:35:09,960
Through the Spirit.
That's all.

1433
01:35:10,200 --> 01:35:11,160
Yeah.
That's incredible.

1434
01:35:11,440 --> 01:35:16,400
And the baptism is a literal
symbol of being born out of

1435
01:35:16,400 --> 01:35:19,760
water and of blood and of the
Spirit.

1436
01:35:20,160 --> 01:35:27,360
It's really quite oh, the I I
remember much younger thinking

1437
01:35:27,360 --> 01:35:31,880
of the the terrible simplicity
of our ordinances.

1438
01:35:32,240 --> 01:35:34,200
Right.
Or taking a bread and water,

1439
01:35:35,680 --> 01:35:39,800
being dunked in the water tokens
and stuff like that.

1440
01:35:39,800 --> 01:35:43,680
But when you really come right
down to it, I mean, if you were

1441
01:35:43,680 --> 01:35:47,480
God and you were wanting to make
eternal promises with your

1442
01:35:47,480 --> 01:35:52,320
children, how better to do that
than something that they could

1443
01:35:52,320 --> 01:35:56,160
all participate in in a way that
only they could participate in,

1444
01:35:56,400 --> 01:35:59,840
That they would understand the
truth when when they really get

1445
01:35:59,840 --> 01:36:01,840
down to the true meaning behind
the symbol.

1446
01:36:02,440 --> 01:36:04,520
Yep.
It's undeniably critical,

1447
01:36:05,920 --> 01:36:07,280
fundamental to their very
existence.

1448
01:36:07,360 --> 01:36:09,440
Anyway.
Yeah, that's a beautiful thing.

1449
01:36:10,640 --> 01:36:14,200
The other unholy and impure
practices, avoiding light

1450
01:36:14,200 --> 01:36:16,640
mindedness, loud laughter, evil
speaking, and taking the name of

1451
01:36:16,640 --> 01:36:24,480
God in vain helps us show Jesus
Christ that we are serious in

1452
01:36:24,480 --> 01:36:27,320
our desire to become holy like
him.

1453
01:36:27,640 --> 01:36:32,640
Or as my dad would often say,
son, talk is cheap, right?

1454
01:36:34,360 --> 01:36:39,120
No unclean thing can enter into
the presence of God.

1455
01:36:39,760 --> 01:36:44,560
And I like to reiterate people,
that's not a an arbitrary rule.

1456
01:36:45,200 --> 01:36:49,480
You know some guy saying Oh no,
no, sorry, you can't, it's not

1457
01:36:49,480 --> 01:36:53,360
possible.
It's a natural law.

1458
01:36:53,760 --> 01:36:59,880
If anything impure or unholy
will not survive an attempt to

1459
01:36:59,960 --> 01:37:03,680
enter into the Kingdom of God.
You have to be insufficient

1460
01:37:03,760 --> 01:37:06,040
purity to be able to withstand
the glory.

1461
01:37:06,440 --> 01:37:12,200
It's as sure as physics, right?
If absolutely it's, it's just

1462
01:37:12,200 --> 01:37:17,280
that way.
So no unclean thing can enter,

1463
01:37:17,280 --> 01:37:19,840
it's not possible, into the
presence of God.

1464
01:37:20,160 --> 01:37:22,240
And through practices of
holiness.

1465
01:37:22,720 --> 01:37:27,360
We are trying to wash our
garments in the blood of the

1466
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:32,080
land.
We are striving to be clean by

1467
01:37:32,080 --> 01:37:37,640
the clean of the blood and sins
of ourselves and of this

1468
01:37:37,640 --> 01:37:43,080
generation, by relying on the
grace and mercy of Jesus Christ.

1469
01:37:43,680 --> 01:37:46,160
Right.
But I I love how it just sums

1470
01:37:46,160 --> 01:37:49,600
that what and it it seems
obvious, but to have it stated

1471
01:37:49,600 --> 01:37:53,000
so succinctly, so concisely.
Right.

1472
01:37:53,680 --> 01:37:56,680
We're trying to do this.
We're trying to purify

1473
01:37:56,680 --> 01:37:59,760
ourselves.
And we know that we can't purify

1474
01:37:59,760 --> 01:38:03,560
ourselves right without the
grace and the mercy of Jesus

1475
01:38:03,560 --> 01:38:05,520
Christ.
But we also know that if we

1476
01:38:05,520 --> 01:38:10,040
don't try, we're not serious.
And you know, we, we have to

1477
01:38:10,080 --> 01:38:14,360
emulate, we have to develop
those habits and that behavior.

1478
01:38:14,760 --> 01:38:16,520
Absolutely.
All right.

1479
01:38:17,120 --> 01:38:18,960
That's all I got.
Well.

1480
01:38:20,320 --> 01:38:23,600
Dude, that was awesome, that was
good 'cause look, that's one of

1481
01:38:23,600 --> 01:38:27,600
those that I know as Mormons, we
take we take this covenant.

1482
01:38:28,800 --> 01:38:33,600
But yet like the other covenants
are really straightforward,

1483
01:38:33,600 --> 01:38:36,520
right?
I mean it's pretty spelled out.

1484
01:38:36,520 --> 01:38:39,440
Cut and dry.
This one had a lot to it and

1485
01:38:39,440 --> 01:38:44,880
even even that end part there
that that you will see every

1486
01:38:44,880 --> 01:38:47,320
other unholy and in pure
practice right?

1487
01:38:47,320 --> 01:38:52,880
Yeah, yeah.
Now look there, some people are

1488
01:38:52,880 --> 01:38:56,240
going to look.
What I'm about to describe now

1489
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:59,680
reminds me of a movie.
You have those nights, Ken, when

1490
01:38:59,680 --> 01:39:02,720
you've just been so sick that
you couldn't lay down.

1491
01:39:02,840 --> 01:39:04,880
Right.
Like, Oh yeah, you're just.

1492
01:39:04,880 --> 01:39:09,280
Congested and laying flat is
just a bad, bad deal.

1493
01:39:09,720 --> 01:39:15,440
Yeah, it was one of those nights
and I remember I woke up and I

1494
01:39:15,440 --> 01:39:17,920
was like, I I'm keeping my wife
awake.

1495
01:39:17,920 --> 01:39:22,680
I'm just going to go lay on the
couch and wither and whine in my

1496
01:39:23,600 --> 01:39:25,160
by myself.
Yeah.

1497
01:39:25,760 --> 01:39:28,800
Well, one of the things I love
old movies.

1498
01:39:28,920 --> 01:39:32,800
I mean, look, I watched a lot of
old John Wayne movies with my

1499
01:39:32,800 --> 01:39:34,840
dad, right?
A lot of old Western.

1500
01:39:34,840 --> 01:39:40,680
So I like old movies and at the
time we had the TCM channel,

1501
01:39:40,680 --> 01:39:43,640
Turner, Turner Classic Movie.
Yeah, yeah, I remember that.

1502
01:39:44,760 --> 01:39:48,000
And so I flipped it on and it
was this old black and white

1503
01:39:48,000 --> 01:39:50,000
movie.
And for the life of me, I

1504
01:39:50,000 --> 01:39:52,240
couldn't tell you who any of the
actors were.

1505
01:39:52,360 --> 01:39:56,080
I've never seen the movie since,
so it could all be a fever dream

1506
01:39:56,080 --> 01:40:01,320
too, but I don't think so.
And then it it had like, I

1507
01:40:01,320 --> 01:40:03,680
didn't know the title of the
movie and I've never seen it

1508
01:40:03,680 --> 01:40:05,760
since, but it was an old black
and white movie.

1509
01:40:06,960 --> 01:40:12,080
And it followed a doctor and a
lawyer in kind of this frontier

1510
01:40:12,080 --> 01:40:15,480
western town, right?
And shows the town going from,

1511
01:40:15,480 --> 01:40:20,400
you know, a sparse outpost
essentially in, you know, when

1512
01:40:20,400 --> 01:40:23,040
these guys are in their 20s and
follows them through to where

1513
01:40:23,040 --> 01:40:24,840
the town becomes a little more
modern.

1514
01:40:24,840 --> 01:40:27,640
And you get a feeling that, you
know, you're somewhere in the

1515
01:40:27,640 --> 01:40:33,640
1910s or 1920s.
But it follows this doctor and

1516
01:40:33,640 --> 01:40:37,880
this lawyer who had kind of a it
kind of reminds me of like Hugh

1517
01:40:37,880 --> 01:40:41,720
Nibley and his buddy, right?
The one guy, Yeah.

1518
01:40:41,800 --> 01:40:43,120
Paul Springer, Yeah.
Yep.

1519
01:40:43,160 --> 01:40:49,040
And, and, and he was really,
really, you know, serious about,

1520
01:40:49,120 --> 01:40:51,040
about his studies and that sort
of thing.

1521
01:40:51,760 --> 01:40:55,680
The, the doctor was really, you
know, go to church every Sunday,

1522
01:40:55,680 --> 01:41:00,160
straight laced kind of guy.
And the lawyer was a bit shady,

1523
01:41:00,280 --> 01:41:02,240
right?
But yet they'd struck up this

1524
01:41:02,240 --> 01:41:05,080
friendship.
And towards the end of the

1525
01:41:05,080 --> 01:41:09,640
movie, the, the attorney is
dying and the doctor comes in

1526
01:41:09,640 --> 01:41:13,800
and they're both old.
And the doctor sits down beside

1527
01:41:14,080 --> 01:41:19,200
the the lawyer and the lawyer's
reading this book and he's like,

1528
01:41:19,200 --> 01:41:20,280
well, what are you reading
there?

1529
01:41:20,440 --> 01:41:23,680
And the lawyer goes, oh, I'm,
I'm finally reading the Bible.

1530
01:41:24,080 --> 01:41:26,400
And he's like, have you finally
found religion?

1531
01:41:26,400 --> 01:41:29,000
He's like, Nope, just looking
for loopholes.

1532
01:41:30,880 --> 01:41:38,360
And with with that, with that
last charge to avoid, you know,

1533
01:41:41,120 --> 01:41:45,520
to cease all evil practices.
There's no loopholes, right.

1534
01:41:45,920 --> 01:41:49,160
And here's the other thing we
don't have, you know, the as the

1535
01:41:49,160 --> 01:41:53,160
scripture says, broad is the way
in the gate that leads to

1536
01:41:53,160 --> 01:41:57,880
damnation, right?
It's a lot of ways you can you

1537
01:41:57,880 --> 01:42:00,520
can get to that point.
Yeah.

1538
01:42:01,360 --> 01:42:05,160
And so just like I feel like
it's one of those things that

1539
01:42:05,160 --> 01:42:08,120
shouldn't have to be said, but
inevitably it does.

1540
01:42:08,600 --> 01:42:12,200
If the Spirit's not with you in
that moment that you enter into

1541
01:42:12,200 --> 01:42:15,480
some place, it's probably time
to leave, right?

1542
01:42:15,480 --> 01:42:17,080
It's it's probably time to get
out.

1543
01:42:17,080 --> 01:42:20,960
So just because it's not
enumerated doesn't mean it's

1544
01:42:20,960 --> 01:42:24,280
still not a bad deal, right?
So be very careful of what you

1545
01:42:24,280 --> 01:42:25,960
do.
Excellent.

1546
01:42:26,840 --> 01:42:31,920
So I I alluded earlier to this
paragraph, yes, from the dead,

1547
01:42:32,040 --> 01:42:35,040
from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
So here it is.

1548
01:42:35,040 --> 01:42:39,280
This is the PDF version of my
book and here it here it is page

1549
01:42:39,280 --> 01:42:42,640
121.
It reads as follows.

1550
01:42:43,920 --> 01:42:48,680
Through a gracious visitation,
all who walk in this Spirit of

1551
01:42:48,680 --> 01:42:56,200
God will know healing, bountiful
peace, long life and multiple

1552
01:42:56,200 --> 01:43:01,040
progeny, followed by eternal
blessings and perpetual joy.

1553
01:43:01,600 --> 01:43:04,840
Through life everlasting.
They will receive a Crown of

1554
01:43:04,840 --> 01:43:07,160
Glory with a Robe of Honor
resplended forever and ever.

1555
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:12,920
Wow.
That's all I'm going to say now.

1556
01:43:16,720 --> 01:43:24,160
Just want people to know oh is
this?

1557
01:43:24,680 --> 01:43:27,800
Is this that that actual book
that you were talking about just

1558
01:43:27,800 --> 01:43:28,200
in?
Yeah.

1559
01:43:29,160 --> 01:43:32,400
Yeah, interesting former doctor.
And then the Apocrypha

1560
01:43:33,360 --> 01:43:35,640
available.
On on on Amazon.

1561
01:43:36,400 --> 01:43:44,160
Yes, So what I'm looking at
here, and by the way, I may as

1562
01:43:44,160 --> 01:43:53,400
well say it, the PDF version of
my book is especially valuable

1563
01:43:53,400 --> 01:43:56,440
because you can do a digital
word search for the whole thing,

1564
01:43:57,280 --> 01:43:59,240
right?
But you can't buy the PDF

1565
01:43:59,240 --> 01:44:03,520
version anywhere.
So if anyone would like one,

1566
01:44:03,800 --> 01:44:08,040
message me on Facebook and I
will send you free of charge PDF

1567
01:44:08,120 --> 01:44:12,840
copy of my book.
So there it is.

1568
01:44:13,160 --> 01:44:17,000
Oh OK folks, Ken will be
generous and he will do that.

1569
01:44:17,640 --> 01:44:20,800
I strongly recommend you at
least leave a $5 donation.

1570
01:44:20,800 --> 01:44:24,000
This is a time.
And I don't don't you turn me

1571
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:27,000
into a filthy priest crafter.
I don't want your filthy.

1572
01:44:28,120 --> 01:44:29,680
No, I'm serious.
I'm serious.

1573
01:44:30,080 --> 01:44:34,960
I I just OK, PDF version is
valuable and and a lot of times

1574
01:44:34,960 --> 01:44:36,720
people buy the book and they'll
ask me a question.

1575
01:44:36,720 --> 01:44:38,360
I'll say, well, here have the
PDF version too.

1576
01:44:38,360 --> 01:44:43,640
But in any case, my favorite
section of the whole book is the

1577
01:44:43,640 --> 01:44:47,000
one I'm staring at right here
under T Temple writes.

1578
01:44:48,520 --> 01:44:53,320
And what I'm showing you here
are all of the various aspects

1579
01:44:53,320 --> 01:44:58,240
of our of the temple rites that
are discussed in some detail in

1580
01:44:58,240 --> 01:45:02,320
these ancient average 2000 year
old texts.

1581
01:45:02,920 --> 01:45:06,880
The blessings which we just
read, 1 consecration, endowment

1582
01:45:06,960 --> 01:45:11,480
names, prayer, true order of
prayer, sacred garments, sealing

1583
01:45:11,480 --> 01:45:15,720
signs, tokens, veils, gates,
vicarious ordinances.

1584
01:45:17,000 --> 01:45:19,920
Jesus Christ himself teaching
his disciples that these

1585
01:45:19,920 --> 01:45:24,640
mysteries can be performed on
behalf of those who have died so

1586
01:45:24,640 --> 01:45:27,680
that they may enter the Kingdom
of light and washings and

1587
01:45:27,680 --> 01:45:33,400
anointings.
You know, there are those who

1588
01:45:33,400 --> 01:45:39,200
accuse apologists like me of
trying to cook up evidence that

1589
01:45:39,200 --> 01:45:44,600
Joseph Smith was basing our
temple ordinances, our temple

1590
01:45:44,600 --> 01:45:48,640
rights, on ancient documents.
I didn't cook up any of these

1591
01:45:48,640 --> 01:45:52,080
documents, Right.
Yeah.

1592
01:45:52,360 --> 01:45:56,000
These were unknown to the world
until the recent times.

1593
01:45:56,480 --> 01:46:00,080
And they've been dug out of the
earth and translated by people

1594
01:46:00,080 --> 01:46:02,440
who didn't know anything about
Mormons or temples.

1595
01:46:03,200 --> 01:46:08,360
And it took an idiot like me to
search them out and to find

1596
01:46:08,360 --> 01:46:12,040
them.
Like, like, like, like, like

1597
01:46:12,040 --> 01:46:16,120
some treasure hunt.
And it's been amazing and it

1598
01:46:16,120 --> 01:46:19,720
continues.
This is my project now.

1599
01:46:19,720 --> 01:46:21,360
This is leading to the second
edition.

1600
01:46:22,560 --> 01:46:24,800
This is another volume.
This is volume 2 of New

1601
01:46:24,800 --> 01:46:28,120
Testament Apocrypha.
Volume three sits up on my shelf

1602
01:46:28,880 --> 01:46:32,400
and volume 3 of Old Testament
Pseudepigrapha is going to be

1603
01:46:32,400 --> 01:46:36,520
published in a month.
And I will have that adding

1604
01:46:37,160 --> 01:46:41,080
probably 40 or 50 new ancient
texts.

1605
01:46:41,080 --> 01:46:45,440
And as you can see by my
markings, they're already going

1606
01:46:45,440 --> 01:46:47,880
to be significant editions.
Holy cow.

1607
01:46:48,400 --> 01:46:52,600
The second edition of the book,
I mean straight up Mormon

1608
01:46:52,600 --> 01:46:54,200
doctrine if you want to call.
It dude, that's.

1609
01:46:54,200 --> 01:46:56,800
Awesome.
It's all very exciting stuff and

1610
01:46:57,120 --> 01:47:01,440
hundreds and hundreds of stuff.
Of that book that I got from

1611
01:47:01,440 --> 01:47:04,880
you, Mormonism.
Mormon doctrine in the

1612
01:47:04,880 --> 01:47:06,240
Apocrypha.
That's it.

1613
01:47:06,240 --> 01:47:08,840
That's the one dude.
I reference that thing probably

1614
01:47:08,840 --> 01:47:11,160
once a week.
You do not.

1615
01:47:11,240 --> 01:47:14,560
I do, I do in my personal
studies.

1616
01:47:14,560 --> 01:47:18,600
You bet I do because there's so
much there, right?

1617
01:47:18,600 --> 01:47:23,400
Like if you if you want to go on
a deep dive, like you just want

1618
01:47:23,400 --> 01:47:27,920
to go in there and like just see
how much is in there, right,

1619
01:47:27,920 --> 01:47:29,880
Pick a subject and then go to
town.

1620
01:47:30,360 --> 01:47:34,440
And that that book has added
depth to my studies.

1621
01:47:34,440 --> 01:47:40,280
Like like very few things have
it's at I can't look, I'm very

1622
01:47:40,280 --> 01:47:44,560
careful about what I put, you
know, endorse this one.

1623
01:47:44,560 --> 01:47:47,320
I endorse wholeheartedly without
even thinking twice.

1624
01:47:47,920 --> 01:47:50,480
As far as I'm concerned,
everybody should have get a copy

1625
01:47:50,480 --> 01:47:52,680
of this because.
It and there's nothing like it.

1626
01:47:53,280 --> 01:47:54,880
No, it's just.
And I.

1627
01:47:55,440 --> 01:47:57,400
We know people would say you
should publish something and I'm

1628
01:47:57,400 --> 01:47:58,560
like, yeah, but everything's
been done.

1629
01:47:58,560 --> 01:48:00,560
And then it occurred to me, this
hasn't been done.

1630
01:48:01,000 --> 01:48:04,480
This needs to be done.
And then people say we'll say,

1631
01:48:04,640 --> 01:48:07,080
how did you how did you pick the
subjects that you would include

1632
01:48:07,080 --> 01:48:09,520
in the book?
I said I I didn't select any of

1633
01:48:09,520 --> 01:48:11,480
them.
I'm just randomly reading.

1634
01:48:11,480 --> 01:48:15,680
And when I see an LDS teaching
pop out, I'm like, what is that

1635
01:48:15,680 --> 01:48:18,560
doing there?
And I had no idea how many there

1636
01:48:18,560 --> 01:48:21,440
would be.
And lo and behold, 179 Yeah,

1637
01:48:21,960 --> 01:48:24,040
distinct LDS teachings.
Yep.

1638
01:48:24,440 --> 01:48:26,840
Wow and.
And, you know, I didn't, I

1639
01:48:26,920 --> 01:48:28,120
didn't even know there were that
many.

1640
01:48:28,720 --> 01:48:29,680
Yeah.
Absolutely.

1641
01:48:29,760 --> 01:48:34,560
And it's beautiful when when the
more sure word of revelation on

1642
01:48:34,560 --> 01:48:39,040
these things gets backed up by
hard evidence, right?

1643
01:48:39,040 --> 01:48:41,520
It's it's just unbreakable at
that point.

1644
01:48:41,760 --> 01:48:44,400
Or what's cool to me is when
you're reading this and the more

1645
01:48:44,400 --> 01:48:47,160
sure word of revelation confirms
that you're like, whoa, Yep,

1646
01:48:47,200 --> 01:48:49,040
absolutely.
This is awesome.

1647
01:48:49,080 --> 01:48:50,480
Yeah.
Absolutely.

1648
01:48:51,520 --> 01:48:54,720
Well, Ken, as always man, good
stuff.

1649
01:48:55,520 --> 01:48:58,320
I can't tell you how much I
value our conversations and your

1650
01:48:58,320 --> 01:49:01,960
friendship.
I just I love you to death and I

1651
01:49:01,960 --> 01:49:05,920
always value these times.
I feel the same, all right, from

1652
01:49:05,920 --> 01:49:07,080
another mother.
That's you.

1653
01:49:07,640 --> 01:49:10,560
That's exactly right.
So awesome.

1654
01:49:10,560 --> 01:49:13,200
All right, dude.
Well, we'll get back on here

1655
01:49:13,200 --> 01:49:15,360
before long and we'll do another
one of these as we've been

1656
01:49:15,360 --> 01:49:16,720
talking.
Awesome.

1657
01:49:17,000 --> 01:49:18,920
Thanks.
Hang out for just a second.

1658
01:49:19,400 --> 01:49:53,080
Bye everybody.
You're listening to the Mormon

1659
01:49:53,120 --> 01:49:54,520
Renegade podcast.