Episode #161: The Law Of Moses Before Moses W/Joshua Erickson

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One of the reasons I love
Mormonism is the idea that God

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is no respecter of persons.
What that means for us is that

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as God dealt with his children
in the past, is how He'll deal

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with us today.
This allows us to foster a

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relationship with Him because we
know what He expects from us.

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Now with that my with that in
mind, let me ask this question.

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Should we expect to find the law
of Moses before Moses's earthly

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ministry?
The answer is, of course, yes.

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Today on the podcast, Joshua
Erickson and I have a

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conversation about this very
topic.

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Now, if you're able, I would
recommend going to the Rumble

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channel and listening because
Joshua has a lot of slides to go

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along with our conversation that
you might find helpful.

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During the course of our
conversation, we look at the

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life and ministry of the
patriarchs in the Old Testament

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and find some very compelling
evidence that they were

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practicing the Law of Moses long
before Moses.

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We wrap it all up at the end by
talking about what this should

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mean for each one of us in our
relationship with God.

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That and more on this episode of
the Mormon Renegade podcast.

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So a few weeks back I told you
about a new online merch store I

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that was up and running.
Well, after a few weeks of

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the top right of the landing
page or click the link in this

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episode show notes, you'll see
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well as a couple other designs
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funny and maybe even one where I
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you should definitely go check
that out.

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Now this is just the beginning.
In the coming weeks, more

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Now all the proceeds I get from
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So head on over to

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mormonrenegade.com and press the
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the link in this episode show
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You're listening to the Mormon
Renegade podcast.

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Hey man, what's going on?
Oh well, I'm I'm on a work trip

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right now so I'm sitting in a
hotel room and have nothing

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better to do than to do an
interview with you so.

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You that's that's perfect,
that's perfect.

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And you really kind of messed
that up because you could have

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really went, look, I'm
travelling for work, but as you

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know, I work from the for the
government and I'm coming to you

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live from an undisclosed
location.

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Top Secret.
Underground.

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Some place where no one will
ever find me.

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Yeah.
So yeah, but we'll.

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We'll make do with.
That, I mean, we'll make do with

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that, I guess so.
So.

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Everything put me in a nice.
What's that?

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They did put me in a nice hotel.
They did.

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Yeah.
Yeah.

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I'm in Embassy Suites in
Huntsville, AL.

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So yeah, it's not.
It's not too bad.

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Those those aren't bad.
Did I ever tell you about my

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trip when we were living back
East to like, New York?

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Do you tell?
Oh, OK, So all right, so if

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anybody has kids, you might just
want to like put earmuffs on

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them for this one.
I don't want to offend anybody,

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but my mother-in-law was coming
in and it was, you know, she's

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like, I want to go to New York
and I want to see the sights and

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I'm like, fair enough.
This, this sounds like it'll be

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fun.
We'll see.

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Make the make the jaunt from
Maryland up up the Eastern

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seaboard to, to New York and we
should be good.

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Now this is in the infancy of
like, oh, like like your

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Travelocity and that sort of
thing, right?

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We, you're talking like 2004,
2005, right?

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So certainly those sites are out
there, but most of the time

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you're just going straight to
the hotel's website and there's

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not ratings really right like
it.

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It's not like it is now where
you can really do a good

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thorough check.
Right.

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Well, I know I do not want to
stay in New York on a Friday

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night, right?
I, I have that figured out,

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right?
So I, I'm looking and just

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across the border in a town
called Hoboken, NJ, there was a

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hotel and it, it was a, it was a
name brand hotel and usually

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very nice hotels, right?
And I'm like looking at the

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pictures and looking at the
pictures of the room, I'm like,

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oh, that, that doesn't look bad.
So I booked that bad boy.

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Yeah, but it's New Jersey.
But it is New Jersey, Yeah.

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When they say the Garden State,
they're lying.

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Don't, don't, don't, don't.
Don't.

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That's not true Anyway.
So I'm like, OK, this will be

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all right because we're just
going to stay for, you know, 6-8

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hours, get some sleep, and then
we're into New York, right?

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So I'm sitting there, we're
driving and we we get close to

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the destination and I pull in
and the exterior doesn't look

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anything like the exterior in
the pictures.

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But I'm like, OK, all right, it
is what it is.

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It is what it is, right?
So I go in and my mother-in-law,

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she's like, well, I need to
stretch my legs so I'll go in

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with you.
I'm like, that's fine.

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So she follows me and now my
mother-in-law, nice lady, but

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not necessarily seasoned in the
ways of the world.

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And we walk in and the man at
the front desk, and this should

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have been my dad giveaway.
We walk into the front desk and

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the guy at the counter, he's
like, oh, yeah, I was like, hi,

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I'm Dave.
And he's like, oh, I don't see

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your reservation here.
And I'm like, well, I made it.

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And then he's like, oh, I see.
I, I, I, I didn't refresh the

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system.
And so, yeah, but it's OK.

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We can still get you in.
Not a problem, right?

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Then we go into the room and I
swear there's a blood stain on

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the carpet.
Right, like.

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The only thing missing missing
from this scene is like the

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chalk outline of the body.
Yeah, it's like use needles or

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something on the.
Carpet, right, right.

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I'm like, Nope, we're out,
right?

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We're out.
And so I go down there.

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I'm like, hey man, we're
checking out and oh.

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What's the hourly rate?
Right.

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I'm like, you can charge me a
couple hours, I'm gone, right?

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So I'm like, OK, And again, this
is before Google Maps, this is

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before smartphones, right?
So I'm thinking there's got to

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be something between here and
New York, right?

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Next thing I know, I'm driving
this massive Ford Excursion,

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right?
Like, this is the definition of

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an MPV, a Mormon personnel
vehicle with with, with four

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kids in the back, my wife and my
mother-in-law.

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And we're driving down there and
I'm all of a sudden in Times

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Square and, like, the most
busiest place I have ever been.

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I'm not equipped, right?
But yeah, I've got to maintain

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total calm, right?
I got to be like, we're good.

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We'll get through this.
No sweat.

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So eventually I kind of find
this hotel in downtown.

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Now, I knew it was going to be
expensive, right?

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Like, it's going to be pricey.
It's Friday.

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I get it.
But here was the other big take

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away.
If your hotel sounds like it

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could be an upscale food item
from a really fancy restaurant,

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don't stay there.
It's going to be expensive

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because the name of this place
was the Wellington, right?

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And I think a beef one, right?
So I swing in, we get into the

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parking garage, I go to the
lobby and I'm like, OK, you got

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a room?
I don't care.

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One room will do.
Doesn't matter.

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And she's like, look in at her
computer and she's like, I got

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one room.
It's one of kind of our medium

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sized rooms.
I'm like, I'll take it.

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And she's like, that'll be $500.
Yeah.

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I'm like, that hurts, right?
But I'm like whatever, we're

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just going to get the room.
We go up to the room and I kid

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you not, it is maybe the size of
like half the size of like where

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you're staying at right now.
And I got crammed 7 people into

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this bad boy.
And so like, like, I was never

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so glad the next night to see
like a Holiday Inn, right?

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I'm like, oh, this is going to
be fantastic.

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But yeah, that's that that would
the moral of the story is

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there's nothing between Hoboken
and New York.

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Just stay out of there.
There's nothing there.

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Just just stay out.
But anyway, yeah, so I've, I've

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had my share of bad rooms.
So whenever you travel it's it's

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always nice to know you got a
nice clean room to stay in for

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sure.
The only, only bad hotel room

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I've ever been in was just in
just outside Kirtland.

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OH, we went there for the
eclipse, OK.

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And it was the only place really
available and made reservations.

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And when we got there they said
we are we're tripling the price

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when you.
Got there.

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It was it.
We knew.

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Actually, I take that back, we
knew, we knew probably a week

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before because I, I called out
just to make sure that we're

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still good.
I've made these reservations

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like six months in advance.
But yeah, but then every, but

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then, you know, by the time it
was getting close to the

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eclipse, everything is filled
up.

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And they said, yeah, we're,
we're, we're not honoring that.

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We're tripling the, the price.
So you can, you can have it

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still.
But anyway, I was a little

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upset, but it still was anyway.
But I mean, what am I going to

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do?
So, but that that place was

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horrible.
It was, it was the filthiest.

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It was the filthiest place I've
ever stayed in.

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I mean, it was, it was bad, but
but the eclipse was cool.

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Kirtland was amazing.
So it was worth it.

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It's funny how how US guys can
get past that real quick, right?

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Like we're like, well, we'll see
the Statue of Liberty tomorrow

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in Ellis Island.
It'll be fine.

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Right.
Boy, my wife and my

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mother-in-law, though, that did
not fly as well as it did for

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me, right?
So, yeah.

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Yeah.
But anyway, all right dude, what

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are we talking about today?
OK, Yeah, This is, you know, I,

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I gave AI gave a version of
this, this talk, I guess this

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kind of presentation at the last
Restoration Tour conference.

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I thought it would be
interesting to give it again,

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not necessarily in the same way,
but but it's the, the idea of

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the law of Moses before Moses.
So, you know, I, I wish, I, I

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wish I had it right in front of
me.

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I don't.
But there's a pretty well well

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known a quote from quotation
from Joseph Smith.

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He's talking about animal
sacrifice and, and other things,

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but mostly about the law of
sacrifice.

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And he says that the law of
sacrifice is, you know, animal

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sacrifice is going to be
restored and is part of the

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restoration of all things spoken
by the mouths of all the holy

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prophets.
And he talks about, he talks

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about both the sacrifices
performed in the by the

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patriarchs, you know, Adam and
Noah and Abraham, and also the

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Levitical sacrifices under the
law of Moses.

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And he says all these things are
going to be restored.

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But there's, there is kind of a
little hang up or a little,

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well, a thing that people get
hung up on.

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I guess where he says, he says
in saying this, and it's just

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paraphrase, of course he says in
saying this, I'm not saying that

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all of the, all the little, the
variety, I think he says the

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variety of ceremonies and things
connected with the law of Moses

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are going to be restored.
But those things that were prior

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to Moses, all of those, all of
those things will be restored.

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OK.
So now a lot of people when

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they, when they read that part,
it's maybe it's kind of

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relieving.
I don't know, because we really

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don't, you know, we've
definitely absorbed the

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Christian, generally Christian
ideas about the law and about

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kind of the way that God changes
his plan, you know, from

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00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:30,920
dispensation to dispensation,
which Joseph Smith had some

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00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:34,480
things to say about.
And, you know, and the, the New

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00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,120
Testament, the Book of Mormon,
they also can be interpreted in

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00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:40,320
a way that seems to imply that
as well.

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00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,800
And, and I don't want to get too
much into, into that for this,

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00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:49,200
but I just want to talk about,
well, what are the things then

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00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:53,080
that were, that were given, you
know, before Moses?

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00:13:53,680 --> 00:13:57,360
What, what parts of the law at
least can can we be, Can we be

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00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:00,440
sure of there?
And we can, and we can then

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00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:04,560
infer from Joe Smith's statement
and also from the, the words of

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00:14:04,560 --> 00:14:11,320
the prophets themselves in the
Bible and other places that that

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00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,520
those things will be a part of
the restoration.

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00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:15,760
So the restoration is ongoing,
of course.

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00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:24,240
But so anyway, now I, I do want
to say, let's just say kind of

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00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:29,000
my view of what Joseph is
saying.

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00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:32,120
There goes like this, the law of
Moses.

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00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:36,920
Like if if you ask, if you ask,
well, yeah, if you ask, if you

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00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,480
ask most Jews today, then
there's many different sects of

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00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:44,560
Judaism, as you know, not as
many as there are of

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00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:49,000
Christianity, but there are
quite a few, you know, half a

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00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,640
dozen or so different sects of
Judaism, probably more than

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00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:55,640
that.
Most of them are rabbinical in

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00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,280
nature.
So which means they are the

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00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:02,800
modern descendants of the
Pharisees in Jesus's time,

246
00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:06,360
right?
And, and if you ask a rabbinical

247
00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:12,280
Jew what the Law of Moses is,
they will tell you that it

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00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:18,880
consists of two parts. 1 is the
written Torah, which is

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00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:23,840
basically contained in the five
books of Moses and the other is

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00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:27,600
what they call the Oral Torah.
And this is this is basically

251
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:32,160
the the traditions of the elders
that have been passed along and

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00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:37,320
eventually codified in in a book
called or a series of books

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00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:38,840
called the Talmud.
OK.

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00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:45,160
And they will say, they will
tell you that that these

255
00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,600
together are the law of Moses,
and also that the the

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00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:51,880
traditions, the traditions of
the rabbi's, the traditions of

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00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:56,120
the elders, they actually take
precedence over the Scriptures,

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00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:58,720
over the written Torah.
OK.

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00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:04,440
And, and a lot of the kind of
distinctive things about Judaism

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00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:10,960
are found in the Talmud and not
in the five books of Moses.

261
00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:17,400
So you know, rules about how
many steps you can take, you

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00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:23,800
know, on the Sabbath and rules
about eating meat and milk

263
00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:27,360
together and how, how many
minutes or hours you have to

264
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:30,160
wait in between eating meat and
milk.

265
00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:36,000
And you know, you know, just
kind of the, the minutia of, you

266
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,800
know, the proper way to
slaughter animals and all the,

267
00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:44,240
all the requirements for the
knife and the, the person and,

268
00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:47,160
and on and on.
And then, and I don't want to

269
00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:50,800
get into the, the weeds on that,
but a lot of the things that

270
00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:58,600
make that makes Judaism unique
and distinctive come from the

271
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,560
Talmud and not necessarily from
the five books of Moses.

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00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:05,960
So let me, let me let.
Me couple questions here real

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00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,680
quick.
I had somebody tell me the

274
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:11,960
answer to this before.
I want to see if, if it's the

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00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:17,119
same here, why, Why did the
Pharisees kind of win out, so to

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00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:19,440
speak, in history versus the
Sadducees?

277
00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:24,720
Oh yeah, that's a good question.
You know, it really is because

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00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:30,520
the the Sadducees were basically
the I mean, these are kind of

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00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:35,480
like, it's kind of akin to
political parties, but these are

280
00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:38,400
like religious parties or right
or sects.

281
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:43,840
Although everyone and actually
it's, it's kind of like this

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00:17:44,120 --> 00:17:47,320
that there's these different
sects of Judaism, but everyone

283
00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:49,080
got to use the temple.
Right.

284
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,360
Regardless, because we were all,
we're all Israelites, even if

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00:17:53,360 --> 00:17:57,440
we, even if we disagree about
the interpretation of things, we

286
00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,800
all agree that the temple's
important and we, we've got this

287
00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:02,440
temple here.
So everyone gets to use it.

288
00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:07,400
So I like that.
But the, the Sadducees were,

289
00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:13,480
were basically the priests and
like the priestly class and they

290
00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:19,320
had some different ideas from
the, the teachers or the rabbis.

291
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:26,640
And, and so, you know, back in
Jesus today, they were kind of

292
00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:30,120
maybe more evenly matched in
their, their authority of their

293
00:18:30,120 --> 00:18:32,560
influence.
But once the Temple was gone,

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00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:38,160
then the Sadducees kind of lost
their hedge, so to speak, and

295
00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:39,960
and there's nothing more for
them to do.

296
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:47,000
So Pharisaical or Rabbinical
Judaism fills in that gap and

297
00:18:48,360 --> 00:18:50,480
and that's, you know, where we
find ourselves.

298
00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:53,800
OK.
And then one other question

299
00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:55,480
here.
And that's exactly what I'd

300
00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:58,560
heard.
The synopsis I was given was,

301
00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,240
well, the Sadducees were really
over the Temple.

302
00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:03,160
That was their point of of
focus.

303
00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,120
And the Scriptures travel real
well.

304
00:19:06,120 --> 00:19:11,200
The temple not so much, right.
And so once it's destroyed, like

305
00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:14,760
the need for Sadducees kind of
went away now.

306
00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:17,960
Yeah.
Let me ask you the the Torah

307
00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:26,480
versus the Talmud as you look at
it, do you put wait?

308
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:32,280
Do you wait one higher than the
other, so to speak?

309
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,160
You put more weight on one
versus the other and then?

310
00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:38,520
Absolutely.
And then what about, you know,

311
00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:42,520
the the bulk of Judaism do do
they have are, are they weighted

312
00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:49,040
different?
Well, as far as, like, I mean,

313
00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:55,800
Judaism is the is, is the, the
Talmud and the Torah, so, you

314
00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,400
know, and the rest of the, the
rest of the scriptures too are

315
00:19:58,520 --> 00:19:59,560
definitely a part of their
faith.

316
00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:05,560
But like I said, they Judaism
does prioritize the

317
00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:11,240
interpretations of the rabbi's.
And I would say that I, I Love

318
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:15,400
Actually reading Jewish
interpretations of things and I

319
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:18,200
love reading Christian and
Mormon interpretations of things

320
00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:21,400
too.
But most of all, I love what the

321
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,520
scripture.
I love the scriptures, the

322
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:28,040
written word.
And for me, that is the that

323
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:31,880
takes precedence like the actual
revealed word of God and

324
00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:37,560
everything else is I mean, if
you ask a rabbi, I mean they

325
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,640
won't say it in these words, but
you ask them what is the law of

326
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,560
Moses?
They will say it's the

327
00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:43,480
philosophies of men mingled with
Scripture.

328
00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:50,040
You know, OK, so I, so rabbis,
the interpretations of the

329
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,720
rabbi's are, are good, like
traditions are good and

330
00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,800
beautiful and even necessary
sometimes.

331
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:03,320
But when they when there's a
contradiction between tradition

332
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:09,280
and the revealed word of God,
then for me the word, the

333
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:14,000
written word is, is what needs
to stay and the tradition needs

334
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:15,880
to be pruned away.
OK.

335
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:21,200
So when, when Joseph says, OK,
so, so if you ask, if you ask

336
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,640
the rabbis, you ask the Jews
what the the law of Moses is,

337
00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,280
they will tell you it is this
thing that is this mixture of

338
00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:31,560
the scriptures and what the
rabbi's say.

339
00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:36,800
And The thing is that if you ask
Christians or Mormons what is

340
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:39,800
the law of Moses, they'll
actually tell you the same

341
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,400
thing.
They'll say it is, it is what

342
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:44,920
the rabbi's say it is.
It's all this.

343
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:48,920
It's the, the minutia of not
eating meat and milk and all the

344
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:52,000
rules go along with that and the
rules for ritual slaughter and

345
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:58,520
the rules for, you know, all
the, whatever the other, the

346
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:04,080
other things.
And a lot of those have, I mean,

347
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:07,920
it's, I mean Jesus.
Jesus chided the Pharisees

348
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:17,960
several times about their habit
of putting precedence on the

349
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:22,600
traditions above or even to the
nullifying of the actual

350
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,160
commandment.
Gotcha.

351
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,480
So it is, it is unfortunate that
if you ask Christians or Mormons

352
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,080
what the law of Moses is, they
will actually agree with the

353
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:32,840
Pharisees instead of agreeing
with Jesus.

354
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:41,120
And so, so this is I think what
what Joseph, this is this how I

355
00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:46,440
interpret Joseph saying is that
not everything in the law of

356
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:50,160
Moses will be restored.
Meaning all those things that

357
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:53,920
Jesus chided the Pharisees about
in the New Testament, like the

358
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:57,760
the traditions that contradict
the Scriptures, like none of

359
00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:01,480
that which is called the law of
Moses, none of that will be

360
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,000
restored.
But everything that God gave to

361
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:08,720
Moses will be.
And my contention tonight is

362
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:14,360
that everything that God gave
Moses, he also gave to the

363
00:23:14,360 --> 00:23:17,440
people who lived on this earth
prior to Moses as well.

364
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:23,040
Got you.
So OK, so got a picture there

365
00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:27,240
of, you know, painting of Mount
Sinai and what happened there

366
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,840
changed the world forever.
You know this law code that was

367
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:34,360
given is is really amazing for
its staying.

368
00:23:34,360 --> 00:23:39,720
Power sure is.
Because like, there's plenty of

369
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,520
ancient civilizations and they
have laws too.

370
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:47,120
But like, can you tell me
anything about the Egyptian code

371
00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:51,440
of laws or the Assyrian code of
laws or the, you know, the

372
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,720
right, the right we don't the
Etruscan code of laws.

373
00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:01,040
You know, there are, there are
all of those, those ancient law

374
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:04,640
codes, you know, they're, those
things are studied by scholars

375
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,760
maybe, right, but like only by
very, you know, by people who

376
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,720
specialize in those things.
And certainly and certainly

377
00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:16,760
there's a lot of overlap between
those, those ancient law codes

378
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,640
for these other nations and the
law code for Israel.

379
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:23,840
But even though, even though
for, you know, thousands of

380
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:26,760
years, Israel also was not a
nation, like Israel was also

381
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:29,480
gone, just like the ancient
Egyptians and the ancient

382
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,040
Babylonians were also gone.
And yet there was something very

383
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:38,160
persistent about about the
Torah, about the law that God

384
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:43,160
gave to ancient Israel that has
affected the entire world, right

385
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,880
and Western civilization.
And, and even though Israel was

386
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:52,320
not a nation and even, and even
though, even though Christians

387
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:58,680
believe that the law of Moses
was quote done away, yet it's

388
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:03,200
still in our holy book and it's
still being studied and analyzed

389
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:08,240
and is and is instructing
people's faith.

390
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,800
Even even though they believe
it's done away, we, we can't get

391
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:16,480
rid of it still because it's so
it was so transformative to the

392
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:17,160
world.
You know what I mean?

393
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:20,640
Yep.
So, so this, this of course

394
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,800
happened in a mountain.
And you know, mountains are

395
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:25,320
temples and temples are places
where covenants are made.

396
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:31,120
But this Sinai, this was, this
was not the first mountain in

397
00:25:31,120 --> 00:25:37,960
the scriptures, obviously.
And we know that like the things

398
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,440
that God does.
I mean, this is a very Mormon

399
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:45,680
idea.
A lot of Christians and and and

400
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:50,080
even Jews to some extent.
The kind of the, the belief, the

401
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:55,080
general idea is that God gives
this progressive revelation and

402
00:25:55,120 --> 00:26:00,000
it's there is some truth to
that, but you know that God

403
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,040
reveals more and more as time
goes along.

404
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:08,240
But for for Christians and some
others, it's like it's that God

405
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:11,840
didn't actually give the whole
plan to Adam.

406
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,480
And Noah didn't really know the
whole plan of salvation.

407
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:18,640
Like he knew maybe just a little
more, or he didn't know really

408
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,320
anything more than Adam maybe.
And God just kind of kept back

409
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:27,880
the plan except just bits and
pieces and gradually revealed

410
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:31,840
more and more of his will and
his plan for humanity up until,

411
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,720
you know, the Christian era.
And then for Christians like

412
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:38,560
that was the God finally
revealed what he was up to.

413
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,200
And then that's the end of it.
OK.

414
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:48,040
The the Mormon idea is no, no,
like Adam knew everything about

415
00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:52,120
the plan, OK?
And and so did his descendants,

416
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,720
right?
Seth and Enos and all the

417
00:26:54,720 --> 00:27:01,360
patriarchs, like they knew they
were not ignorant and they were

418
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,800
not one, they were not ignorant
and two, God's plans haven't

419
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,640
changed, but the but also people
haven't changed.

420
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:11,520
And so people are wicked and
people fall into apostasy and

421
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:16,720
there is continued continual
like restoration, right?

422
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,640
Dispensation after dispensation.
But each dispensation can

423
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:23,040
contains or God reveals
essentially the same

424
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:30,600
information.
So, you know, Ecclesiastes says

425
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:33,000
whatsoever God doeth, it shall
be forever.

426
00:27:33,120 --> 00:27:38,240
That which hath been is now, and
that which is to be hath already

427
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:40,240
been.
So.

428
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,440
Yeah.
So there's nothing new under the

429
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,520
sun, right?
This is a famous line from

430
00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:49,080
Ecclesiastes.
Everything just keeps repeating.

431
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,840
So, you know, famous, famous
revelation by John Taylor.

432
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:01,920
You know what, I'm going to give
myself a laser pointer here.

433
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:10,080
Famous, famous revelation, John
Taylor, This is, you know, the

434
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,960
revelation.
He was he was asking about

435
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,080
plural marriage.
And I'm not going to, you know,

436
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:21,080
this presentation is not about
plural marriage, but this, this

437
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,920
revelation that he received was
very interesting.

438
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,280
I'm just going to point out a
couple of things, right?

439
00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,080
The Lord says, how can I revoke
an everlasting covenant?

440
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:33,760
You know, a rhetorical question.
For I the Lord am everlasting

441
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,120
and my everlasting covenants
cannot be abrogated nor done

442
00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:38,880
away with, but they stand
forever.

443
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,120
And he goes on to say, if they
were Abraham's seed and would

444
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,280
enter into my glory, they must
do the works of Abraham.

445
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:50,400
So now this is this is actually
quoting from section 132.

446
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,640
Go ye therefore and do the works
of Abraham answer you into my

447
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:57,480
law, and ye shall be saved.
Now in the context of 132, we

448
00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:01,600
often think about marriage and
Abraham's marriages, but it's

449
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:12,080
actually a lot more than this
because like the Lord knew that

450
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:17,120
that Abraham said he will that
Abraham will command his

451
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:20,560
children and his household after
him, that they shall keep the

452
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,520
way of the Lord and do justice
and judgement.

453
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:27,320
And then further on and this,
and here's where it here's where

454
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,080
I really get to my point here.
Starting to get to my point here

455
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:39,360
is when the Lord is testifying
to Isaac about Abraham, he says

456
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,040
I will perform the oath which I
swore to Abraham, your father,

457
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:47,640
and he's basically Jehovah tells
Isaac you're going to get the

458
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,800
same blessing.
And he says it's because of

459
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:55,520
Abraham's faithfulness, says
because Abraham obeyed my voice

460
00:29:55,920 --> 00:30:00,520
and kept my charge, my
commandments, my statutes and my

461
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:07,560
laws.
OK, so so Abraham kept the

462
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,320
commandments, the statutes and
the law, laws and also the

463
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,560
charge.
And what are these things, You

464
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:21,880
know, we, we certainly don't
have, Well, I'll say we don't,

465
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,560
we don't really have in the
Bible anyway, We don't have a

466
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:29,880
record of Abraham receiving
statutes, commandments, laws.

467
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,360
You know, we do have, we do have
some individual commandments

468
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,400
that he was given, But but
statutes, we don't have a record

469
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,440
of that.
And yet, and yet Jehovah

470
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,840
testifies to Isaac that Abraham
kept them all.

471
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:49,800
So now it's interesting, if we
want to know what was meant,

472
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:54,480
then the only other place that
we can look is the Torah.

473
00:30:54,480 --> 00:31:00,040
And in Deuteronomy Chapter 11,
Moses tells Israel to keep his

474
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,840
charge, his statutes, his
judgments, his commandments

475
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:07,760
always.
So like Moses says to the

476
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:12,960
children of Israel, keep the
stuff that's in the Torah and

477
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,280
you know, those things, those
things have meaning there.

478
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:16,360
And we don't need to go into
that.

479
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:23,080
But, but basically Jehovah tells
Isaac that Abraham kept his

480
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,680
commandment in Deuteronomy.
OK, But of course Deuteronomy

481
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,160
wasn't was, you know,
Deuteronomy came centuries after

482
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:33,400
Abraham, right?
So, so what's going on there?

483
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,840
Well, this is this is an
interesting conundrum for

484
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:46,720
Christians because because they
because they believe in sola

485
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:49,880
scriptura, right?
So if the Bible doesn't say it,

486
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:53,400
then it didn't happen.
So this is from Cambridge Bible

487
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:57,240
for schools and colleges.
It's a commentary right on

488
00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:00,640
Genesis and says here the
observance of legal enactments

489
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,520
ascribed to Abraham.
Speaking of this, the charge,

490
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,800
the commandments, the statutes
and the laws that we just read

491
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,480
says the the observance of those
things ascribed to Abraham is

492
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,680
strictly speaking, and
anachronism.

493
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,680
In other words, it's an error
that's out of place in the

494
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,600
Bible.
We, we don't believe Abraham did

495
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:25,120
those things because the the law
wasn't given to the patriarchs,

496
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,880
you know, until Moses.
I see.

497
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:33,080
OK.
I see where they're coming from

498
00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:34,640
on that.
Yeah.

499
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:38,120
You don't agree with it, right?
Because and I, I guess that's

500
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:40,040
one of the blessings of the
restoration, right?

501
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,680
Because we know that Adam
offered up sacrifices, right?

502
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:48,520
And, and if I'm not mistaken,
was told to even teach that to

503
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:54,680
his posterity.
And so as that goes through the

504
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,720
the above statement just really
doesn't hold much water if

505
00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:59,400
you're an adherent to the
restoration.

506
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:04,640
Yeah, it's interesting.
I, I think, I think this is a,

507
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:09,880
to me, it's just that I'm very
amusing example because quite

508
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:13,000
often, you know, Christians kind
of hammer on Mormons because

509
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,720
they'll say, you know, we
believe we, well, you only

510
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:19,560
believe the Bible as far as it
is translated correctly, which

511
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:21,200
means you don't really believe
the Bible.

512
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:25,560
But here's an example of a place
where we believe the Bible and

513
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,280
they don't.
So right, so take.

514
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:30,600
Care, Right, Right.
Yeah, yeah.

515
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,600
When when that gets spouted,
often times it's like, no, we

516
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:38,080
don't believe the Bible the same
way you read it, right?

517
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:42,320
Like it.
This is you, you you disagree

518
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:44,520
with our consensus is what?
What that.

519
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:46,960
Right.
Yeah.

520
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:53,480
Well, you know, the consensus.
The consensus is right, You

521
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:57,040
know, so.
And if you don't, and if you

522
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,280
don't believe what Fauci says,
then you disagree with science.

523
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:06,280
It's kind of like that, Yeah.
So Yep, absolutely.

524
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:12,760
So I'll just mention this
briefly.

525
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:20,080
When Jehovah says that Abraham
kept my charge, that is actually

526
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:22,080
a the word, the Hebrew word is
mishmaret.

527
00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:26,719
That is actually, it means means
the priest that he had the

528
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:28,400
priesthood.
The charge is the is the

529
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,239
priesthood.
So, so, and, and also the, you

530
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:38,360
know, the Bible doesn't have a,
a record of that of Abraham was,

531
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,440
you know, being ordained, but
you know, Mormon, Mormon

532
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:43,600
scriptures do.
So we don't have a problem with

533
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:49,120
that.
But for, for Christians that the

534
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:53,000
patriarchal age was age of
conscience and oral tradition

535
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:57,120
only.
But there's some, there's some

536
00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:00,200
real problems with this
philosophy.

537
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,040
And of course, this comes
because they're they're trapped

538
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:07,000
kind of in this sola scriptura
idea, right?

539
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,880
If the Bible doesn't say it,
then it didn't happen.

540
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:13,400
But you know, here's one
example.

541
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,280
This is a syrac.
This is one of the books in the

542
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:18,760
Apocrypha.
OK.

543
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:23,160
Says to all flesh, human,
animal, but to sinners 7 times

544
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,720
more come troubles, right?
Death, blood, strife, sword,

545
00:35:26,720 --> 00:35:28,280
catastrophes, famine, ruin,
disease.

546
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,440
All these things were created
for the lawless.

547
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,200
So the people who don't keep the
law.

548
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:37,760
And because of such people the
flood happened, right?

549
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:41,360
Because.
Yeah, because if there was.

550
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:43,720
I mean, you just ask yourself
this question.

551
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:50,200
If those ancient people who
lived before Moses had no law,

552
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:57,560
then how just would our God be
to destroy the world?

553
00:35:57,920 --> 00:35:59,800
Right, that's a.
Good.

554
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:05,240
For wickedness when he's never
gave them any instructions.

555
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:10,520
Right.
It would be extremely unjust,

556
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:15,880
right?
Absolutely, absolutely at that

557
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:19,320
point, just and loving don't
apply to the God that we would

558
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:23,400
proclaim to worship right if if
he hadn't instructed them in

559
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:25,920
those things.
He can be neither of those

560
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:31,240
things.
And so it, it's for him to be as

561
00:36:31,240 --> 00:36:36,320
he says he is.
He would have been like natural

562
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:40,200
law says, you know, he has to
teach you those things first.

563
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:49,040
They have to be right and.
And we can think of many other

564
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:54,640
like other examples too, of
humans being punished for

565
00:36:54,640 --> 00:37:01,560
wickedness without apparently
having received any instructions

566
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:06,400
about the difference between sin
and righteousness, right?

567
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:12,960
You know, right, Cain has some
problems, obviously, right, with

568
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,720
sin.
But where is the where does God

569
00:37:15,720 --> 00:37:20,160
ever say, you know, don't kill
your brother, right?

570
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,920
You know animals do that.
Right.

571
00:37:25,240 --> 00:37:27,560
Right.
I mean, you know, you know, it's

572
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:32,240
the, you know, someone, you
know, the the younger wolf is

573
00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:35,160
challenging the alpha male and
they have a battle and one of

574
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:37,280
them dies.
That's just the way it is, you

575
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:38,400
know?
Yeah.

576
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:41,720
And I wouldn't say the the wolf
or the chimpanzee or whatever.

577
00:37:41,720 --> 00:37:43,360
Like they're not.
I don't know that they're

578
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:45,920
sinning.
Yeah.

579
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:48,040
I don't know what, I don't know
what commandments animals have,

580
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:51,720
but but if, but if humans have
received no instruction from

581
00:37:51,720 --> 00:37:55,680
their creator, then, you know,
then how is that any different?

582
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,720
You just, you just, you see, you
know, you're just, it's just,

583
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:01,640
it's just a struggle for
dominance, you know, right.

584
00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:02,880
And.
And what could be?

585
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,240
What could be ethically wrong
with that?

586
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:06,480
Right, right.
Yeah, no.

587
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,600
So, yeah, that's, that's an
interesting point too, right,

588
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,360
Because the Bible doesn't
specifically say that there were

589
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,440
commandments given about, you
know, you shall not kill.

590
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:21,280
But obviously God's not happy
with the outcome between Cain

591
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,040
and Abel.
And again, God being both just

592
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:27,120
and loving, they had to have
known, you know, Cain would have

593
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:31,280
had to have known that.
Hey, don't do that in.

594
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:34,520
Fact.
In fact, God calls it sin,

595
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:35,960
right?
He says.

596
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,440
He says you better be careful,
Cain.

597
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:42,160
Like if you do well then you
know things will be good.

598
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:44,720
But if not, sin lies at the
door.

599
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:48,800
Right.
And, and sin is sin is a

600
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:51,880
technical term.
Sin means, you know, a violation

601
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:57,880
of the law, right?
So we, we know actually that

602
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,680
that Cain and Abel and Adam,
right?

603
00:39:01,720 --> 00:39:05,840
They, they have the law, right?
Or at least at least they had at

604
00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:09,240
least they had some laws.
OK, I don't want to overstate my

605
00:39:09,240 --> 00:39:13,520
case here, but just because the
Bible doesn't say it doesn't

606
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:16,560
mean that it didn't happen.
And we can definitely, I think,

607
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:22,320
like with confidence, infer that
they had some things.

608
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,400
You know, Sodom and Gomorrah is
another example, right?

609
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:30,320
This these cities are destroyed.
And again, this we have no

610
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:35,280
record of any of them ever being
instructed in, you know,

611
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:39,680
righteous living.
But we can infer from what we

612
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:46,120
know about God, right, that he
is just that this had to have

613
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:51,080
happened, right?
This is this is, this is a, a

614
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,680
necessity, like the lectures on
faith, say that like believing,

615
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,720
like knowing about the justice
of God is one of the essential

616
00:39:57,720 --> 00:40:01,040
features or one of the essential
bits of information that we need

617
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:03,800
to know, like to have a, a
correct understanding of God's

618
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:07,800
character so that we can have
faith in him, right?

619
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:12,960
Yep.
So, so there's one and we can

620
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:14,720
come up with many other
examples.

621
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:18,760
OK.
Another problem with this idea

622
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:22,400
of there being no like
revelation, no recorded

623
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:27,560
revelation is, and you're just
relying upon like some oral

624
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,760
tradition or something like
that, is that man's memory is

625
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,520
fallible too.
Yeah, right.

626
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:34,920
And we have, we have really
good.

627
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,520
There's actually several places
in the Book of Mormon, you know,

628
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:43,760
where they talk.
I mean, Nephi, you know, and his

629
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,080
brothers, they go back to
Jerusalem to get the brass

630
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:50,440
plates so that so that they can
have the commandments.

631
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:52,360
Yeah.
OK.

632
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:56,320
And if they didn't, then you
know, the Lord tells them if you

633
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,240
don't have, if you don't have
the commandments written down,

634
00:40:59,960 --> 00:41:03,960
then like the entire nation will
perish, dwindle in unbelief.

635
00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:09,640
And that is, that is 100% true.
And it's and it's true for two

636
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:12,080
reasons.
One man's memory is faulty.

637
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:17,800
So here in Mosiah, right last,
the last kind of sentence here,

638
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:21,360
right, it says last line.
See that last sentence For it

639
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:23,120
were not possible that our
Father Lehigh could have

640
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,080
remembered all of these things
to have taught them to his

641
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,160
children, except it were for the
help of these plates, the brass

642
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,400
plates.
So yeah.

643
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:34,280
And the other reason is that
even if your memory isn't

644
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:36,880
fallible, man's conscience is
fallible.

645
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:43,760
And so, you know, we, we love to
lie, we love to lie, we lie to

646
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:48,960
ourselves and we lie to other
people maybe more than we care

647
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:54,960
to admit sometimes.
But if God just left the

648
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:59,240
transmission of his laws to
mankind, they would forget them

649
00:41:59,240 --> 00:42:02,720
and also lie about them.
And, you know, tell, tell people

650
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:06,040
that things are OK when they are
not OK and vice versa.

651
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:07,960
So.
OK.

652
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:14,000
OK, Now if we we want to know,
if we want to know whether or

653
00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:18,080
not the law existed before
Moses, and we kind of already

654
00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:21,080
touched on this, we could ask
actually an equivalent question

655
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:28,840
is was there sin before Moses?
OK, Because you know, in both

656
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:32,240
the New Testament and in the
Book of Mormon, we have things

657
00:42:32,240 --> 00:42:34,800
here it says where there is no
law, there's no transgression,

658
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:36,480
right?
This in Romans, in Second Nephi,

659
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:39,080
if you say there's no law, you
shall say there's no sin.

660
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:42,640
So those are equivalent things.
So just so that's there's the

661
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:47,200
question is, was there sin
before Moses?

662
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:49,880
And we, we give them some
examples already.

663
00:42:50,640 --> 00:42:56,560
Absolutely there was right?
There was there was, you know,

664
00:42:56,560 --> 00:43:00,520
Cain and Abel and Sodom and
Gomorrah and the Tower of Babel

665
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:04,400
and like all these these these
punishments, the flood with

666
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:07,920
Noah, all these punishments that
are happening because of sin

667
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:12,440
before the law was given
apparently, right.

668
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:15,280
Yeah.
The New Testament says sin is

669
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:17,360
the transgression of the law.
So there's that that legal

670
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:22,400
definition there and and Romans
goes on says death.

671
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:26,960
Let's see wherefore as by one
man sin entered the world and

672
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:30,400
death by sin.
So death passed upon all men for

673
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:33,040
that all have sinned skimming
down.

674
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,680
Nevertheless death reigned from
Adam to Moses.

675
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:38,640
Why did death reign from Adam to
Moses?

676
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:42,480
Because sin existed from Adam to
Moses, right?

677
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:44,360
This is what the what the New
Testament says.

678
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:49,640
So, so the answer is yes, there
definitely was sin.

679
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:53,840
Therefore, and since sin is the
transgression of the law, there

680
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:57,640
absolutely was law.
OK, so, and this is, you know,

681
00:43:57,640 --> 00:44:01,160
this is, you know, Mormons
should be very comfortable with

682
00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:04,120
that.
This idea I have, there's this

683
00:44:04,240 --> 00:44:11,800
really excellent article.
It's actually in series, I can't

684
00:44:11,800 --> 00:44:13,720
remember.
It's a three or four part series

685
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:16,920
in the evening, a morning star.
So this is a kind of some

686
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,240
extracts from that.
I'll just read it.

687
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:22,280
We shall now.
This is Joseph Smith.

688
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:26,400
We shall now proceed to examine
still further the subject of

689
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:29,040
law.
However little may have been

690
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:32,080
here to forethought or said upon
the subject of law, does not

691
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:34,880
diminish in the least the
propriety nor the design of it,

692
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:38,800
since it emanated from God.
And though it may have been, and

693
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:41,840
maybe at this day, a subject
untouched by the professors of

694
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:45,440
Christianity, that does not
lessen its value, neither does

695
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:49,080
it diminish its power in judging
men from their actions according

696
00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:51,440
to it at the last day.
Wow.

697
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:56,640
Continuing on, we all admit that
the gospel has ordinances.

698
00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:59,440
And if so, had it not always
ordinances?

699
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:01,480
And we're not the ordinances
always the same?

700
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:04,200
Perhaps our friends will say
that the gospel and its

701
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:07,440
ordinances were not known until
the days of John the son of

702
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:10,320
Zechariah, in the days of Herod
the king of Judea.

703
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:12,320
But we will here look at this
point.

704
00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:16,320
For our own part, we cannot
believe that the ancients in all

705
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:19,840
ages were so ignorant of the
system of heaven, as many

706
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:24,480
suppose, since all that were
ever saved were saved through

707
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,200
the power of this great plan of
redemption, as much so before

708
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,360
the coming of Christ as since.
If not, God has had different

709
00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:35,760
plans in operation, if we may so
express it, to bring men back to

710
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:38,240
dwell with Himself.
And this we cannot believe,

711
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:42,240
since there has been no change
in the constitution of man since

712
00:45:42,240 --> 00:45:45,280
he fell.
Yeah.

713
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:51,080
Now that one, that one, I, I,
that's one of those ones that I

714
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:57,440
think as, as you think about it
carries quite a bit of weight

715
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,560
when you start talking about the
character of God.

716
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:08,600
Because if all of a sudden God
was to say, you know what, we're

717
00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:11,880
changing up the whole program,
right?

718
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:15,120
Right.
You then turn God and, and it's

719
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:19,480
based on cause 'cause I've heard
this before when people start to

720
00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:25,240
justify things when like
whenever temple changes come

721
00:46:25,240 --> 00:46:29,320
around in the LDS church, one of
the arguments I've heard for

722
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,720
that is, well, we're different
people than they were, right?

723
00:46:32,720 --> 00:46:36,920
Like we're no longer Barbarians
or, or this sort of thing.

724
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:43,000
Well, the issue I have with that
is that granted, I will say

725
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:46,160
that, you know, we aren't quite
as barbaric for the most part,

726
00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:48,560
right?
There's less murder in the world

727
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:51,800
today then certainly years and
years ago.

728
00:46:52,080 --> 00:46:55,880
However, man's heart, I don't
think is that much different,

729
00:46:56,520 --> 00:46:59,120
right?
It's a veneer, right?

730
00:47:00,240 --> 00:47:04,600
Like sometimes, well, that buddy
of mine who's an Emergency

731
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:11,040
Management, an emergency manager
says said something that that

732
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:14,760
really spooked me one day.
He's like, look, the entire

733
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:19,520
world, the Western world is 3
meals away from barbarism,

734
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:20,320
right?
Like.

735
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:21,960
Chaos.
Anarchy.

736
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:22,560
Absolutely.
Right.

737
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:27,200
One of the reasons that we don't
have that now is because we have

738
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,520
we have plenty of food to go
around, right?

739
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:35,920
He's like, when that goes away,
absolutely, you know, men will

740
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:39,480
will do horrible things, but for
more than that.

741
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:44,680
If, if that's the case, right,
if if God looks back in the

742
00:47:44,680 --> 00:47:48,600
1800s and he says, you know, I
instituted these temple

743
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:52,840
ordinances, but you know what,
Gosh, yeah, I don't think we

744
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:54,800
need the, you know, this part
anymore.

745
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:57,120
And we can just do this.
You've turned God into a

746
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:02,040
respecter of persons, which he
says over again, he is not

747
00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:04,960
right.
And it it it's one of those

748
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:08,400
things, as you were just saying,
as humans, we have a tendency to

749
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:11,120
lie, right?
And, and we have a tendency to

750
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:14,160
to protect ourselves through
lies, right?

751
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:17,440
Some of the most damning lies, I
think that ever get told for

752
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:20,800
most people aren't lies about
other people, they're lies about

753
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:22,680
ourselves, right?
Hey, you know what?

754
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:25,920
I got this figured out.
I'm good, I'm OK.

755
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:31,800
But the truth is, is that we're
probably not as awesome as we

756
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:35,360
think we are, right?
The ego, the look.

757
00:48:35,720 --> 00:48:38,880
Ego is necessary, right?
I want to say that because

758
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:42,320
without ego, we would all be
quivering masses under the

759
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:46,040
table, realizing how filthy and
loathsome we are, right?

760
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:54,040
Like we can't walk around all
the time with like, oh, I'm, I'm

761
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:57,000
lower than low, right?
I mean, we need to be humble,

762
00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:00,680
but we also have to understand
we're still children of God and

763
00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:05,520
we have a divine spark.
That said, I don't think man has

764
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:07,960
changed to such a point where
God's like, yeah, I think we can

765
00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:09,760
go ahead and alter these laws,
right?

766
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:13,240
We can go ahead and we can just
change ordinances because you

767
00:49:13,240 --> 00:49:15,280
know what?
They're a different group of

768
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,800
people now change that.
And and what you're basically

769
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:24,320
saying is I'm special and those
things don't apply to me

770
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:26,760
anymore.
You know what too, if you, if

771
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:30,640
you have, if you have a God
who's just changing his mind all

772
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:35,640
the time, you know, and this is
said with some jest here, but

773
00:49:35,720 --> 00:49:38,560
you know, if you, if you have a
God that's just a pickle like

774
00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:42,720
that, then your God might be a
Zeus or Jupiter or like one of

775
00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:45,400
the, one of the Greek or Roman
gods or, you know, whatever.

776
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:51,840
And these, these gods of these
ancient pantheons, like they

777
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:55,160
were, they were fickle.
They changed their minds And and

778
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:59,200
you know why that was, you know,
it kind of it occurs to me that

779
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:04,720
I mean, it's because these while
I while I believe there are,

780
00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:08,160
there are like real spiritual
entities behind the worship of

781
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:15,640
these, these Pagan, you know,
heathen gods for for the most

782
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:19,320
part, like these, these gods
were these guys were worshipped

783
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:22,800
as idols, right?
The humans would carve statues,

784
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:28,640
in other words, like humans
would make these gods in their

785
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:29,880
image.
Right.

786
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:37,080
And when you make a God in your
image, then it's going to be as

787
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:40,120
fickle as man is.
Absolutely.

788
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:46,960
And but, but it's, it's not,
it's not that way.

789
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:50,280
Like we, we are the ones made in
God's image and not the other

790
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:54,160
way around.
And so we need to conform rather

791
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:56,960
than conform God to us.
Right, right.

792
00:50:57,160 --> 00:51:01,080
Absolutely.
So, OK, well, Joseph Smith goes

793
00:51:01,080 --> 00:51:03,680
on, I'm not going to read the
the next part of it, but he he

794
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:06,640
basically says from the very
beginning, from the very

795
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:12,880
beginning, God gave God gave
every.

796
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:15,840
I am going to read part of I
said it wasn't God gave every

797
00:51:15,840 --> 00:51:19,040
necessary law and instruction
for the peace, happiness and

798
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:23,960
future comfort and living for
man.

799
00:51:23,960 --> 00:51:28,280
And he goes on to say, to
suppose that for the end of the

800
00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:31,160
last sentence here, suppose that
the Maker of the universe never

801
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:34,680
gave to man any law after he
informed him, would, in our

802
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:37,960
opinion, be offering an insult
to his glorious character, and

803
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:40,800
be comparing him beneath even an
earthly parent.

804
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:46,440
Like it made God a worse parent
than fallen mortals to say God

805
00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:49,680
did not give instruction like,
and not just a little bit of

806
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:52,920
instruction, but every necessary
law and instruction.

807
00:51:53,240 --> 00:51:56,880
Right.
So this goes back to this Mount

808
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:59,280
Sinai.
This was not the first mountain

809
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:05,400
in the Scriptures.
The first mountain was Eden.

810
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:09,200
But I'm going to, I'm going to,
I'm going to get to that in just

811
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:11,920
a minute.
But when we think about the, the

812
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:15,960
law that was given at Mount
Sinai and, you know, we, we see

813
00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:19,320
paintings and movies and things
with Moses coming down with the

814
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:21,800
tablets, the tablets look like
this.

815
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:25,120
They're these, they're stone,
you know, it's kind of, you

816
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:28,320
know, brown or grey stone
usually.

817
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:33,200
But the Scriptures actually have
something interesting to say,

818
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:36,640
right?
The of course, they're always

819
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:38,880
interesting, but something
particularly interesting I'm

820
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:41,360
going to point out here.
Most of the children of Israel

821
00:52:41,360 --> 00:52:43,880
were afraid to go up, right?
And they said to Moses, we want

822
00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:47,680
you to go up in the mountain.
And Moses did, along with

823
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:51,200
seventy of the elders and they
went up there and Nexus 24, it

824
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:55,360
says they, they had this, this
theophany God appeared to them.

825
00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:58,880
They actually were ushered into
God's throne room and they saw

826
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:04,480
this sapphire stone in there.
In this room, there's this

827
00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:09,120
sapphire floor where they were,
They ate, they ate a meal with

828
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:15,080
God there and says it was, you
know, blue and it was as clear

829
00:53:15,080 --> 00:53:17,280
as heaven.
Wow, OK.

830
00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:24,040
And then pretty amazing.
And then in so that's in verse

831
00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:27,360
10, the sapphire stone.
And then in verse 12, so just a

832
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:32,920
couple verses later, Lord says
I'll give you tables of stone a

833
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:34,840
long commandments which I have
written.

834
00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:39,400
So this is a a slight
mistranslation.

835
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:48,200
This tables of stone.
So in so I just have this phrase

836
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:49,480
here, I'll give you tables of
stone.

837
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:52,440
So in Hebrew stone, the the word
is Evan.

838
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:58,200
There it is.
And in Hebrew there is a common

839
00:53:58,240 --> 00:54:02,480
prefix, which is ha, which is
attached to the beginning of

840
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:05,160
words.
And it means the OR like the

841
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,800
it's like the the definite
article.

842
00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:09,920
So we're talking about a
particular thing.

843
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,480
If we put ha on the on the
beginning of a word.

844
00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:18,600
So in Exodus 24 verse 12, it
actually says ha Evan.

845
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,920
So like a more appropriate
translation is I will give you,

846
00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:26,080
I'll give you tables of the
stone.

847
00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:29,520
So which stone?
Well, there's only one stone

848
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:33,760
that's mentioned in the whole
chapter and it's it's this one

849
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:35,920
sapphire.
Yeah.

850
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:42,520
But the sapphire that was in the
throne room in God's, like it's

851
00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:48,480
like part of God's throne.
So rather than, you know, rather

852
00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:54,960
than the tablets of of stone
looking like this, they actually

853
00:54:54,960 --> 00:55:01,200
looked like this.
Wow, see that looks cooler.

854
00:55:02,280 --> 00:55:04,080
It's way cooler.
That would also look.

855
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:07,240
Right, like that's something I
could see a Marvel villain

856
00:55:07,240 --> 00:55:09,480
really wanting to get his hands
on right?

857
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:14,480
I mean that looks awesome The.
You know, destiny, the some of

858
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:16,240
them.
Yeah, yeah, there's, there's

859
00:55:16,240 --> 00:55:18,360
something else.
And, and this is kind of a side

860
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:23,800
tangent, so forgive me here, but
what was the number of elders?

861
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,920
And, and, and I've read this
before, what was the number of

862
00:55:26,920 --> 00:55:30,000
elders that went up 70, right?
You got it?

863
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:32,360
Yeah.
I've often wondered if that's

864
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:36,920
not a prelude some way to the
office of 70.

865
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:39,440
Absolutely, yeah.
And.

866
00:55:40,240 --> 00:55:42,160
The right.
Absolutely.

867
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,400
And you know when I mean the
whole, yeah, that's.

868
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:51,200
Right.
The like the priesthood or, you

869
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:55,520
know, some people might say the
church if they don't make a

870
00:55:55,520 --> 00:55:59,560
distinction there, but you know,
the organization is there's

871
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:04,840
three guys that form the the
first presidency, OK, and then

872
00:56:05,760 --> 00:56:09,200
the next quorum is 12 and then
the next is 70.

873
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:14,880
Right.
And I believe this is this.

874
00:56:15,200 --> 00:56:23,040
This structure is again an
eternal thing, but but it's,

875
00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:27,400
it's a priesthood structure and
it, it's a family structure too,

876
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:32,480
because you look at ancient
Israel and Israel, like the

877
00:56:32,480 --> 00:56:35,320
family of Israel begins with
three.

878
00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:40,160
These are the the patriarchs,
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and then

879
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:47,320
and then Jacob has 12 and then
and then it says and then Jacob

880
00:56:47,680 --> 00:56:50,760
grows.
And when they go into Egypt,

881
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,320
when the family goes into Egypt,
says there are, if you know how

882
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:59,400
many, No 70.
So it just.

883
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:04,040
Repeats Yeah.
So this is the, So now I don't

884
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:13,280
believe that the family of
Israel being 3/12/70 is trying

885
00:57:13,280 --> 00:57:20,680
to point us towards the church.
I actually think that the the

886
00:57:20,680 --> 00:57:23,720
church hierarchy or the priest
hierarchy hierarchy is actually

887
00:57:23,880 --> 00:57:28,320
pointing us towards Israel and
like reminding us that this is

888
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:31,200
this is this family that we're
going to be that we're supposed

889
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:33,360
to be emulating and and be a
part.

890
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:41,840
Right.
OK, so so Eden, Eden was a

891
00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:44,640
mountain as well, right?
How do we know that?

892
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:48,120
Well, there's a couple of clues,
OK.

893
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,200
This is a 12th century, like
illuminated manuscript, and it

894
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,480
shows Eden here.
And it's like this mountainous

895
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:57,520
region right in Genesis says a
river went out of Eden to water

896
00:57:57,520 --> 00:58:00,640
the garden.
So you know, which direction do

897
00:58:00,640 --> 00:58:04,360
rivers flow?
Downhill, downhill, right?

898
00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:05,200
Yeah.
Yeah.

899
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:08,520
So Eden.
Eden was was lifted up higher

900
00:58:08,760 --> 00:58:14,680
than the land roundabout right
in Ezekiel as well.

901
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:18,200
I don't have that here, but
Ezekiel explicitly calls Eden

902
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:20,880
the mountain of the Lord.
Right.

903
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:27,920
And there are also some other
like apocryphal works that talk

904
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,120
about Adam and Eve being when
they were kicked out that they

905
00:58:31,120 --> 00:58:38,720
went like down lower.
And and so anyway, Eden was a

906
00:58:38,920 --> 00:58:43,240
mountain as well.
And and, and mountains are

907
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:46,000
temples and temples are places
where covenants are given.

908
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:48,680
OK.
And now the Bible, the Bible

909
00:58:48,680 --> 00:58:54,080
doesn't say this, but
restoration Scripture does say

910
00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:56,840
this, right?
That Adam kept records, like

911
00:58:56,840 --> 00:59:01,760
Adam was not ignorance.
Adam was intelligent and had the

912
00:59:01,760 --> 00:59:05,800
plan revealed to him and he
wrote it down along with, you

913
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:09,360
know, his revelations and his
explanations and also his

914
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:10,880
genealogy, right?
Right.

915
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:16,560
So, so this book of remembrance
and the book of genealogy was

916
00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:23,120
kept by Adam and those were not
only kept but handed down.

917
00:59:23,120 --> 00:59:26,960
And so here's the here's kind of
the answer to the mystery about

918
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:30,120
Abraham.
And how is Abraham keeping the

919
00:59:30,120 --> 00:59:33,880
things that Moses says in
Deuteronomy, his charge,

920
00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:40,840
statutes, judgements and laws.
How is he doing that?

921
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:47,280
Because we have more restoration
Scripture, this is from the book

922
00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:52,080
of Abraham says I shall
delineate the chronology running

923
00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:55,080
back from myself to the
beginning of creation, for the

924
00:59:55,080 --> 01:00:01,880
records have come into my hands.
OK, so he, so Abraham has the

925
01:00:01,880 --> 01:00:06,960
records that were kept by Adam
and passed down through the

926
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:08,640
patriarchs.
OK.

927
01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:16,080
And what did they have?
Well, we know from Genesis 26

928
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:20,840
that those records had, among
other things, they had my

929
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:25,200
commandments, my statutes, and
my laws, just like Moses tells

930
01:00:25,200 --> 01:00:34,360
to Israel in the Torah.
OK, so now here's another

931
01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:38,160
interesting line of evidence and
I wish I would have given you

932
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:41,000
this as kind of homework to look
at earlier because it takes a

933
01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:47,440
little bit of you don't see it
at first, but once you see it,

934
01:00:47,440 --> 01:00:48,920
then you can't Unsee it, I
guess.

935
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:54,160
So we know that the no there,
there's some debate maybe about

936
01:00:54,160 --> 01:00:59,040
what happens after Jesus comes,
but I don't really want to talk

937
01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:03,760
about that right now.
As Joseph Smith said, as the

938
01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:05,560
things that were before Moses
are going to be restored.

939
01:01:05,560 --> 01:01:07,440
So I just, I just want to talk
about the things that were

940
01:01:07,440 --> 01:01:10,960
before Moses that we know we're
going to be restored and not

941
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:15,200
necessarily what happens to the
Law of Moses or the supposed Law

942
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:18,040
of Moses like after that's a
topic for another time.

943
01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:21,440
But these are the painting of
Alman Amulek.

944
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:24,840
So Alman Amulek, this is chapter
12.

945
01:01:25,560 --> 01:01:31,560
They're debating with Ziazram
and Antiona about the plan of

946
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:38,680
redemption.
And so Alma explains that there

947
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:44,960
were two sets of commandments
given to app.

948
01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:50,120
So let's see, I'm.
I'm gonna read if, if you don't

949
01:01:50,120 --> 01:01:51,960
mind, I'll just read this.
Yeah, Yeah.

950
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:56,720
But we get in the context.
I did take out some of the you

951
01:01:56,720 --> 01:01:59,720
know, people can go and read
what's in the ellipses there,

952
01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:04,120
but I have kind of the pertinent
parts just to get to the point.

953
01:02:04,400 --> 01:02:07,480
After God had appointed that
these things, so this is the

954
01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:09,640
death and the fall should come
unto man.

955
01:02:10,360 --> 01:02:14,200
Behold, then he saw that it was
expedient that man should know

956
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:17,600
concerning the things whereof he
had appointed unto them.

957
01:02:18,040 --> 01:02:23,400
OK, this is what Joseph Smith
says like God, like gave to

958
01:02:23,520 --> 01:02:26,640
starting with Adam gave them all
the laws and instructions they

959
01:02:26,640 --> 01:02:28,440
needed, right?
What is this life going to be

960
01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:29,960
about?
What is the expectations?

961
01:02:30,200 --> 01:02:32,720
What are the what are the laws?
What is sin?

962
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:34,560
What is righteousness?
What are the penalties?

963
01:02:34,560 --> 01:02:38,960
What are the blessings?
OK, and if you do mess up, how

964
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:41,840
do you fix that and what
restitution is required?

965
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:46,360
What punishment is needed?
How do we repent and how do you

966
01:02:46,360 --> 01:02:49,800
get back into God's good graces
if you choose to?

967
01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:56,160
So anyway, so he man needed to
know all the things where if he

968
01:02:56,160 --> 01:02:58,920
had appointed them, therefore
God conversed with men and made

969
01:02:58,920 --> 01:03:02,480
known unto them the plan of
redemption which he which had

970
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:04,480
been prepared from the
foundation of the world.

971
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:08,400
Actually, I want to, I just want
to pause right here.

972
01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:10,920
Well, let me, let me read this
bold part here.

973
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:16,720
Wherefore he gave second
commandments unto men, they

974
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:19,560
having first transgressed the
first commandments, right?

975
01:03:19,560 --> 01:03:22,720
So Adam, Adam got some first
commandments.

976
01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:24,960
Those were broken, they got
expelled.

977
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:28,160
So God gave them new
commandments, second

978
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:29,600
commandments.
I put that in there.

979
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:34,560
But this is in contrast to what
Alma says are the the first

980
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:37,320
commandments.
So the interesting thing here is

981
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:44,360
this the book of Mormons says
that these instructions right,

982
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:47,440
the plan of redemption and the
things that God had appointed

983
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:50,400
for man, these were have been
prepared from the foundation of

984
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:54,080
the world.
And this is this is where Mormon

985
01:03:54,080 --> 01:03:57,920
ideas and Jewish ideas actually
come together very beautifully.

986
01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:02,640
Because although most Jews I
think don't don't believe that

987
01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:06,320
the Torah was given until Moses.
Right.

988
01:04:07,120 --> 01:04:09,560
There is disagreement though,
like the rabbi.

989
01:04:09,560 --> 01:04:10,880
The rabbi's disagree with each
other.

990
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:12,840
You know this famous saying like
you asked?

991
01:04:14,360 --> 01:04:17,080
You asked 2 rabbis a question
and you'll get 3 opinions.

992
01:04:17,120 --> 01:04:18,480
That kind of thing.
Right.

993
01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:22,840
Yeah.
It's like asking fundamentalist

994
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:24,480
questions too.
Probably, yeah.

995
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:34,400
Anyway, Jewish tradition in a
number of places they say that

996
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:38,280
the the Torah was prepared from
the foundation of the world.

997
01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:40,560
Like it the Torah was pre
existent.

998
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:43,960
OK.
And actually go ahead.

999
01:04:44,800 --> 01:04:47,480
I was going to say that it it
makes sense, right?

1000
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:52,240
God like I don't think God's
ever caught unaware, right?

1001
01:04:52,240 --> 01:04:55,440
Like I, I never imagined God
going well, I didn't see that

1002
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:58,520
one coming.
Does anybody have you know I so

1003
01:04:58,600 --> 01:04:59,840
so like?
We're going to start, we're

1004
01:04:59,840 --> 01:05:03,240
going to start this thing and
we'll just kind of wing it as we

1005
01:05:03,240 --> 01:05:05,040
go.
We don't have a plan we'll but

1006
01:05:05,040 --> 01:05:09,120
we'll make up a plan as we go.
Like no, it was all planned out.

1007
01:05:09,200 --> 01:05:12,200
All the details were known and
and communicated so.

1008
01:05:12,880 --> 01:05:16,120
It's the exact opposite of how I
run this podcast, right?

1009
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:20,240
I mean, like, he, he, he knows
how it's all going to unfold.

1010
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:23,120
It's going to Yeah, he, he's got
it covered, right.

1011
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:26,640
And so this idea that that God
was caught flat footed and went,

1012
01:05:26,640 --> 01:05:30,200
well, I guess I better give him
laws now, right.

1013
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:30,960
No.
Yeah.

1014
01:05:31,040 --> 01:05:33,320
That plan didn't work.
Yeah, that plan didn't work.

1015
01:05:33,320 --> 01:05:35,320
Let's see what else we can get
to stick against the wall,

1016
01:05:35,320 --> 01:05:37,520
right?
That's not how it works, right?

1017
01:05:37,720 --> 01:05:44,640
He these plans were were well
established before mortality.

1018
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:49,200
And boy, you can really blow
your mind when you start looking

1019
01:05:49,200 --> 01:05:53,040
at at certain parts of like Adam
God doctrine or or one of those

1020
01:05:53,040 --> 01:05:56,560
things and you start getting
into this whole pattern of the

1021
01:05:56,560 --> 01:06:00,400
gods, right.
And so this idea that that

1022
01:06:00,560 --> 01:06:04,360
again, somehow we're special and
we just keep somehow Catch God

1023
01:06:04,360 --> 01:06:06,960
flat footed is kind of a silly
premise.

1024
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:10,320
Yeah, yeah.
Again, That's, that's, that's

1025
01:06:10,320 --> 01:06:14,160
the, that's the way the Pagan
gods operate, you know, is they

1026
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:16,720
just fly by the seat of their
pants and change their plans.

1027
01:06:16,720 --> 01:06:20,240
And, you know, they thwart each
other's plans all the time.

1028
01:06:20,240 --> 01:06:23,600
They're, they're messing with
mortals and messing with each

1029
01:06:23,600 --> 01:06:26,240
other and, and you know, our
gods are not like that.

1030
01:06:26,960 --> 01:06:31,320
So OK, so he gave them these
second commandments.

1031
01:06:31,800 --> 01:06:34,800
They having first transgressed
the first commandments, placing

1032
01:06:34,800 --> 01:06:37,680
themselves in a state to act or
being placed in a state to act

1033
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:40,320
according to their wills and
pleasures, whether to do evil or

1034
01:06:40,320 --> 01:06:42,440
to do good.
Therefore God gave unto them

1035
01:06:43,560 --> 01:06:46,560
commandments, the second
commandments, after having made

1036
01:06:46,560 --> 01:06:49,160
known to them the plan of
redemption, that they should not

1037
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:54,080
do evil, the penalty thereof
being a second death, which was

1038
01:06:54,080 --> 01:06:56,120
an everlasting death, as to
things pertaining unto

1039
01:06:56,120 --> 01:06:59,640
righteousness.
For on such the plan of

1040
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:02,880
redemption could have no power,
for the works of justice could

1041
01:07:02,880 --> 01:07:06,560
not be destroyed according to
the supreme goodness of God.

1042
01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:07,880
OK, now here's a question for
you.

1043
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:17,400
Alma and Amulet.
They lived BC or 80 BCBCK and

1044
01:07:18,360 --> 01:07:22,720
according to the plain testimony
of the Book of Mormon, which law

1045
01:07:22,760 --> 01:07:26,400
were Alma and Amulet keeping.
Bob Moses.

1046
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:29,880
Bob Moses Yeah, it's, it's, you
know, I don't know, half a dozen

1047
01:07:29,880 --> 01:07:32,320
places in the Book of Mormon
they like to say, yes, we kept

1048
01:07:32,320 --> 01:07:33,680
the law of most.
They had, they had an

1049
01:07:33,680 --> 01:07:37,840
understanding of Messiah and of
redemption through Christ.

1050
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,720
And they, I would say they
understood the proper place of

1051
01:07:41,720 --> 01:07:44,320
the law and, and you know, and I
agree with that, but they

1052
01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:47,800
absolutely were keeping the law.
So interesting.

1053
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:54,880
Then the next thing that Alma
says, says continuing in that

1054
01:07:54,880 --> 01:07:57,000
same chapter.
Now my brethren, seeing that we

1055
01:07:57,000 --> 01:08:01,360
know these things about the fall
of Adam, and about the plan of

1056
01:08:01,360 --> 01:08:04,800
redemption, and about the second
commandments given to Him,

1057
01:08:05,840 --> 01:08:09,320
seeing we know these things and
they are true, let us repent and

1058
01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:13,240
harden not our hearts, that we
provoke not the Lord our God to

1059
01:08:13,400 --> 01:08:17,040
pull down His wrath upon us in
these His second commandments

1060
01:08:17,040 --> 01:08:20,479
which He has given unto us.
But let us enter into the rest

1061
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:23,439
of God, which is prepared
according to His word.

1062
01:08:25,120 --> 01:08:29,800
OK, Alma is saying that these
second commandments which God

1063
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:34,600
has given to us is, but he's
saying that those second

1064
01:08:34,600 --> 01:08:37,399
commandments that God gave to
Adam, that is the law of Moses.

1065
01:08:37,399 --> 01:08:39,680
That's what that is what Alma
and Amulek are saying.

1066
01:08:40,200 --> 01:08:42,880
Interesting.
OK, All right.

1067
01:08:43,319 --> 01:08:46,479
Yep.
So yeah, which commandments had

1068
01:08:46,479 --> 01:08:49,120
God-given to Alma and Amulek?
These ones, right?

1069
01:08:50,080 --> 01:09:00,319
So, OK, well, so even if the
Bible doesn't explicitly mention

1070
01:09:00,319 --> 01:09:06,160
records given to Adam passed
down to the days of Moses, we

1071
01:09:06,160 --> 01:09:10,640
have, we have these, these
witnesses, OK, there's just

1072
01:09:11,080 --> 01:09:15,359
reason we can reason based on
God's justice and eternal nature

1073
01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:19,479
and also the the fondness of man
like that God is not going to

1074
01:09:20,160 --> 01:09:23,600
leave us without instruction or
leave us to instruct each other

1075
01:09:23,840 --> 01:09:25,840
without having some standard
from him.

1076
01:09:26,439 --> 01:09:29,160
Teachings of Joseph Smith on the
subject.

1077
01:09:29,960 --> 01:09:32,800
The the, the JST and Joseph
Smith target might say here kind

1078
01:09:32,800 --> 01:09:40,240
of tongue in cheek, but in the
book of Moses, OK, I read some

1079
01:09:40,439 --> 01:09:42,640
quotes from that earlier.
The book of Abraham says it's

1080
01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:44,880
the Book of Mormon we just read.
And there are actually other

1081
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:50,840
kind of apocryphal works that
talk very clearly about the law

1082
01:09:50,840 --> 01:09:56,520
being given to being given since
Adam, like before Moses.

1083
01:09:57,080 --> 01:10:02,240
So now the Bible doesn't
explicitly mention that and even

1084
01:10:02,280 --> 01:10:06,040
even in the book of Abraham
things like it it, it says that

1085
01:10:06,040 --> 01:10:08,720
there were records, but it
doesn't it doesn't give us very

1086
01:10:08,720 --> 01:10:10,160
much detail about what was on
it.

1087
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:17,000
However, if those ancient people
before Moses had the law, then

1088
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:22,600
we would expect there to be kind
of some echoes at least, like

1089
01:10:22,600 --> 01:10:29,560
mentions of things in the law
being commandments or observed

1090
01:10:29,880 --> 01:10:34,280
prior to the law being given.
And so in order to kind of find

1091
01:10:34,280 --> 01:10:36,880
out where those things are,
we're really going to have just

1092
01:10:36,880 --> 01:10:39,720
a couple of places.
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1093
01:10:39,720 --> 01:10:43,400
Renegade podcast?
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1094
01:10:43,400 --> 01:10:47,320
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1095
01:10:47,320 --> 01:10:49,440
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1096
01:10:50,360 --> 01:10:53,880
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1097
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:58,200
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1098
01:10:58,200 --> 01:11:02,600
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1099
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:06,560
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1100
01:11:06,560 --> 01:11:10,000
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Click the link in this episode's

1101
01:11:10,040 --> 01:11:14,920
show notes today.
However, if those ancient people

1102
01:11:14,920 --> 01:11:20,160
before Moses had the law, then
we would expect there to be kind

1103
01:11:20,160 --> 01:11:26,200
of some echoes at least, like
mentions of things in the law

1104
01:11:27,240 --> 01:11:33,160
being commandments or observed
prior to the law being given.

1105
01:11:33,160 --> 01:11:36,320
And so in order to kind of find
out where those things are,

1106
01:11:36,320 --> 01:11:39,400
we're really going to have just
a couple of places to look.

1107
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:42,640
One is Genesis, because that
that occurred.

1108
01:11:42,680 --> 01:11:48,120
And of course, the book of Moses
that occurred before Mount

1109
01:11:48,120 --> 01:11:54,440
Sinai, the book of Abraham, OK,
the first part of Exodus is also

1110
01:11:54,440 --> 01:12:00,080
before Sinai.
And and then the book of Job,

1111
01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:06,360
actually the book of Job is, is
also a lot of people believe, a

1112
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:10,360
lot of scholars believe that Job
is actually the oldest book.

1113
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:15,200
Like the Job was written prior
to Moses time.

1114
01:12:15,640 --> 01:12:19,400
Really, although yes, although
Job may have been contemporary

1115
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:21,600
of Moses or, you know, lived
around that time.

1116
01:12:24,960 --> 01:12:28,600
Yes, Job is Job is the oldest
Job is the oldest book that we

1117
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:30,120
have.
So those are kind of be kind of

1118
01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:32,800
the places that we're going to
look for these things.

1119
01:12:32,800 --> 01:12:36,400
And I actually went through and
I asked some other people for to

1120
01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:39,240
kind of brainstorm with me too.
And this is actually, this is

1121
01:12:39,240 --> 01:12:43,960
actually not the full list of
things that I found, but these

1122
01:12:43,960 --> 01:12:46,320
are all things and I'm, I'll
just read this list.

1123
01:12:46,320 --> 01:12:50,400
These are all things that are in
people's mind are very clearly

1124
01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:53,680
associated with the law of
Moses, that we actually have a

1125
01:12:53,680 --> 01:12:59,240
record of these things being
observed in the Scriptures prior

1126
01:12:59,240 --> 01:13:02,520
to Sinai.
So the biblical calendar,

1127
01:13:02,560 --> 01:13:09,080
Sabbath, animal sacrifice of
various kinds, firstlings,

1128
01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:15,720
Passover, animal sacrifice in
general, the difference like the

1129
01:13:15,720 --> 01:13:19,680
types of animals that are
appropriate to sacrifice is

1130
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:21,440
mentioned.
You know the commandment to

1131
01:13:21,440 --> 01:13:24,520
teach children sabbatical years
indent.

1132
01:13:24,520 --> 01:13:28,800
You know, laws for servants,
laws about murder.

1133
01:13:29,440 --> 01:13:32,480
You know, prohibition on murder,
penalty for murder, law of

1134
01:13:32,480 --> 01:13:36,680
witnesses, cities of refuge,
restrictions on intermarriage

1135
01:13:37,400 --> 01:13:45,840
with non non Israelites or you
know non covenant lines, incest,

1136
01:13:46,480 --> 01:13:51,160
various sorts are discussed.
Plural marriage is talked about

1137
01:13:51,360 --> 01:13:54,640
forbidden plural marriages, you
know, allowed and forbidden

1138
01:13:54,640 --> 01:13:59,000
plural marriages, homosexuality,
Leverett marriage, adultery,

1139
01:13:59,560 --> 01:14:04,240
bribes, circumcision, clean and
unclean animals for food, right

1140
01:14:04,240 --> 01:14:09,160
stealing, kidnapping, lying,
ritual purity, shabuo, which is

1141
01:14:09,160 --> 01:14:12,080
Pentecost.
Things about the priesthood,

1142
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:14,320
things about tithing,
worshipping of idols, eating

1143
01:14:14,320 --> 01:14:19,320
blood, putting returning blood
to the dust, temples, dividing

1144
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:24,320
the land by lot, first fruits,
offerings, slavery, the piece of

1145
01:14:24,320 --> 01:14:29,040
tabernacles, the day of
Atonement, prostitution, loving

1146
01:14:29,040 --> 01:14:33,000
God, being righteousness and
judgment, Feast of trumpets,

1147
01:14:33,400 --> 01:14:38,120
priestly robes.
And actually have some other

1148
01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:41,080
ones on another list that I've
kind of come up with, you know,

1149
01:14:41,080 --> 01:14:45,880
the building of the construction
of altars, just weights and

1150
01:14:45,880 --> 01:14:52,160
measures blaspheming God.
There's a there's a few more

1151
01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:54,840
that I've added actually since
this presentation and maybe

1152
01:14:54,840 --> 01:14:56,040
we'll get to those, maybe we
won't.

1153
01:14:56,040 --> 01:15:00,240
But anyway, so, so there's,
there's a lot of things actually

1154
01:15:00,240 --> 01:15:06,400
us like a surprising number of
things that are in our, I think

1155
01:15:06,400 --> 01:15:09,800
in our minds are generally
associated with the law of Moses

1156
01:15:10,080 --> 01:15:14,080
that were actually pretty
clearly understood and being

1157
01:15:14,080 --> 01:15:17,000
observed before that time,
right.

1158
01:15:17,000 --> 01:15:19,600
And you know, my contention is
that those things were always

1159
01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:21,840
observed because because God's
laws are eternal.

1160
01:15:22,240 --> 01:15:27,520
And so, you know, so the
calendar, the calendar itself,

1161
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:30,520
like it begins on the 4th day of
creation.

1162
01:15:30,600 --> 01:15:35,600
God says he made the sun, the
moon and the stars for days and

1163
01:15:35,720 --> 01:15:40,280
months and for signs and for
seasons and seasons, you know,

1164
01:15:40,280 --> 01:15:43,440
in the, the King James's
seasons, but that in Hebrews,

1165
01:15:43,440 --> 01:15:46,160
the, the MOA Dean, that's the
appointed times.

1166
01:15:46,160 --> 01:15:49,640
Those are the, the, the festival
days, right?

1167
01:15:49,640 --> 01:15:53,120
The Passover, you know, the
Sabbath, the Passover, the

1168
01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:58,280
unleavened bread and Pentecost
and all the other feast days.

1169
01:15:58,280 --> 01:16:01,760
You know, we've done podcasts
about those things God says from

1170
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:04,520
the beginning, like before man's
even placed in the garden.

1171
01:16:04,960 --> 01:16:09,200
I'm setting up a calendar.
So that calendar that's, you

1172
01:16:09,200 --> 01:16:14,760
know, later on described in
Leviticus was actually put into

1173
01:16:14,760 --> 01:16:21,520
place from the very beginning.
OK, so I have a couple examples

1174
01:16:23,480 --> 01:16:26,280
and we can then we can talk
about some more probably just

1175
01:16:26,280 --> 01:16:30,600
like briefly, but this is this
is a story was one of the first

1176
01:16:30,600 --> 01:16:33,200
stories in the Bible.
We're all familiar with it.

1177
01:16:34,520 --> 01:16:37,720
Cain and Abel, they bring their
offerings.

1178
01:16:39,160 --> 01:16:43,160
And of course, Abel, you know,
we know he brings the his

1179
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:44,840
vegetables, right, the fruits of
the ground.

1180
01:16:45,080 --> 01:16:52,120
Abel brings his, you know, a
lamb, the first things of the

1181
01:16:52,960 --> 01:16:57,280
the lambs.
And so we all know that, but

1182
01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:01,160
there's an interesting detail
that probably people haven't

1183
01:17:01,160 --> 01:17:08,000
noticed or just glossed over.
But this is a Genesis 4.

1184
01:17:08,640 --> 01:17:14,520
Abel brought the first thing to
his flock and of the fat

1185
01:17:14,520 --> 01:17:17,720
thereof.
OK, you ever noticed that

1186
01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:20,200
before?
I've noticed that, yeah.

1187
01:17:20,200 --> 01:17:25,280
But I, you know, to be honest
with you, I, and I'll tell you

1188
01:17:25,280 --> 01:17:27,720
how I interpreted it and then
you get to correct me.

1189
01:17:28,200 --> 01:17:31,920
So how, how I thought about that
is when you think of the fat

1190
01:17:31,920 --> 01:17:34,760
thereof, I, I think of
abundance, right?

1191
01:17:35,200 --> 01:17:38,800
And, and I've often thought is
this kind of an injunction about

1192
01:17:38,800 --> 01:17:46,480
bringing the best that you have
of your flocks, I would say.

1193
01:17:47,240 --> 01:17:51,720
Yes, yes and no.
It is literal fat and it's not

1194
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:55,400
just the best, they're actually
specific laws about firstly.

1195
01:17:55,480 --> 01:17:58,920
So it that's the that is the.
1st.

1196
01:17:59,160 --> 01:18:03,280
Male child of any of your
cattle, and whether we're

1197
01:18:03,280 --> 01:18:08,720
talking about actually it's any
of your animals you were

1198
01:18:08,720 --> 01:18:13,200
supposed to offer to the Lord.
So and so here it is.

1199
01:18:13,200 --> 01:18:16,000
This is this is the, this is the
commandment in the Torah.

1200
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:19,920
This is in Numbers chapter 18.
But the first thing of a cow or

1201
01:18:19,920 --> 01:18:22,640
the first thing of a sheep or
the first thing of a goat, they

1202
01:18:22,640 --> 01:18:24,480
are holy.
Thou shalt sprinkle their blood

1203
01:18:24,480 --> 01:18:28,280
upon the altar and shall burn
their fat for an offering made

1204
01:18:28,280 --> 01:18:32,000
by fire for a sweet savour unto
the Lord.

1205
01:18:32,360 --> 01:18:35,840
So here we have Abel keeping the
commandment in the Book of

1206
01:18:35,840 --> 01:18:39,560
Numbers.
OK, thousands of years before

1207
01:18:39,560 --> 01:18:42,760
the Book of Numbers was given or
written down.

1208
01:18:43,000 --> 01:18:47,480
And how is he doing that?
Well, that's because because

1209
01:18:47,680 --> 01:18:53,320
what Alma and Amulex say is the
law that Moses was given was the

1210
01:18:53,320 --> 01:18:55,960
commandments that Adam was
given.

1211
01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:58,480
And so and Adam taught.
Fascinating.

1212
01:18:59,440 --> 01:19:04,560
OK, so, OK, so so that's that's
pretty amazing.

1213
01:19:07,160 --> 01:19:10,320
Now, Adam, like Adam would have
been, would have been the first

1214
01:19:10,320 --> 01:19:14,280
high priest, OK.
And you know, he, he would, he

1215
01:19:14,280 --> 01:19:17,840
would have been the one who
received the offerings, you

1216
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:19,560
know, and, and performed those
functions.

1217
01:19:20,200 --> 01:19:24,760
So OK, so there's one kind of
interesting example that maybe

1218
01:19:25,080 --> 01:19:29,360
people have not noticed before,
but interesting details.

1219
01:19:30,440 --> 01:19:36,280
Here's another one.
OK, going to talk about incest

1220
01:19:36,280 --> 01:19:38,440
here.
So you know, everyone's favorite

1221
01:19:38,440 --> 01:19:45,240
topic, it's just season.
You know, Leviticus 18 is where

1222
01:19:45,240 --> 01:19:47,960
kind of the laws about incest
are spelled out.

1223
01:19:47,960 --> 01:19:49,880
Leviticus 18 and Leviticus 20 as
well.

1224
01:19:50,560 --> 01:19:53,680
But it says you know, the
nakedness of thy sister, the

1225
01:19:53,680 --> 01:19:57,160
daughter of thy father or the
daughter of thy mother, thou

1226
01:19:57,160 --> 01:20:01,400
shalt not uncover.
So this is allowing like you, it

1227
01:20:01,400 --> 01:20:06,360
says you, you know, incest
between siblings or half

1228
01:20:06,360 --> 01:20:07,680
siblings.
That's what this is saying,

1229
01:20:07,920 --> 01:20:08,760
right?
So if you have.

1230
01:20:09,280 --> 01:20:11,440
Even if it's from a different
mother, if it's from the same

1231
01:20:11,440 --> 01:20:13,600
father.
It's a big name.

1232
01:20:14,680 --> 01:20:25,360
Yeah, that's right.
OK, Now this, this happens, you

1233
01:20:25,760 --> 01:20:28,720
know, this happens after this
is, you know, this is after

1234
01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:31,200
Sinai when Leviticus is written
down.

1235
01:20:31,800 --> 01:20:38,320
But prior to Sinai, we know that
incest was not allowed then

1236
01:20:39,640 --> 01:20:44,640
because of Abraham's word
playing to save his life, right?

1237
01:20:44,640 --> 01:20:48,880
Calling Sarai his sister.
Oh yeah.

1238
01:20:49,400 --> 01:20:50,880
Yep.
OK, why did he call?

1239
01:20:50,880 --> 01:20:55,000
Why did he call Sarai's sister?
It's it's so that Abimelech

1240
01:20:55,000 --> 01:20:59,160
first, right?
Abimelech would think that

1241
01:20:59,320 --> 01:21:04,920
thought that Abram was saying,
well, she's not my wife because

1242
01:21:05,600 --> 01:21:07,440
I, because I wouldn't be
marrying my sister.

1243
01:21:07,800 --> 01:21:10,400
Obviously because everybody
knows that incest is wrong.

1244
01:21:10,600 --> 01:21:12,560
Even though Leviticus had not
been given.

1245
01:21:12,880 --> 01:21:14,600
OK, fascinating.
Yep.

1246
01:21:15,360 --> 01:21:23,080
OK now, so, so let's read that
in Genesis 12.

1247
01:21:23,080 --> 01:21:26,480
It came to pass when he was come
near into Egypt that he said

1248
01:21:26,480 --> 01:21:29,320
unto Sarai his wife, Behold, now
I know that thou art a fair

1249
01:21:29,320 --> 01:21:32,040
woman to look upon.
Therefore it shall come to pass,

1250
01:21:32,040 --> 01:21:36,760
when the Egyptians shall see
thee, that they shall say, this

1251
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:39,720
is his wife, and they will kill
me, but they will save thee

1252
01:21:39,720 --> 01:21:41,880
alive.
Say, I pray thee, thou art my

1253
01:21:41,880 --> 01:21:45,760
sister, that it may be well with
me for thy sake, and my soul

1254
01:21:45,760 --> 01:21:48,520
shall live because of thee.
So again I said right.

1255
01:21:48,520 --> 01:21:52,040
The normal assumption then was
the brothers and sisters do not

1256
01:21:52,040 --> 01:21:56,520
marry.
Thus the reaction of Pharaoh.

1257
01:21:56,560 --> 01:21:59,080
So Pharaoh was the fact.
It was Abimelech first and then

1258
01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:03,400
Pharaoh 2nd, right?
They do this trick twice.

1259
01:22:03,760 --> 01:22:07,080
Pharaoh called Abraham and said,
What is this that thou has done

1260
01:22:07,080 --> 01:22:09,360
unto me?
Why does thou not tell me that

1261
01:22:09,360 --> 01:22:12,120
she was thy wife?
Why saidest thou?

1262
01:22:12,120 --> 01:22:15,600
She is my sister, so I might
have taken her to meet a wife.

1263
01:22:15,640 --> 01:22:18,360
Now therefore, behold that
behold thy wife, take her, go

1264
01:22:18,360 --> 01:22:21,240
thy way.
Right, so.

1265
01:22:21,800 --> 01:22:29,400
OK, so in that story, it doesn't
say explicitly that incest is

1266
01:22:29,400 --> 01:22:31,800
not allowed, right?
We don't get that explicitly

1267
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:35,200
until Leviticus, but it's
definitely implied, right?

1268
01:22:36,040 --> 01:22:43,600
So here's a question to Abraham.
Who is who is Sarai like, like

1269
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:47,240
genealogically?
I mean, she is.

1270
01:22:47,320 --> 01:22:50,280
She is his wife.
Well, right.

1271
01:22:51,200 --> 01:22:53,520
But they're related in another
in another way.

1272
01:22:54,040 --> 01:22:56,800
And we'll get to law in a minute
here.

1273
01:22:58,040 --> 01:23:03,360
But when?
So this is Pharaoh.

1274
01:23:03,360 --> 01:23:06,480
When?
When Abimelech asks him the same

1275
01:23:06,480 --> 01:23:14,600
thing as Pharaoh, then Abram
tells Abimelech, indeed, she is

1276
01:23:14,600 --> 01:23:17,080
my sister.
She is the daughter of my

1277
01:23:17,080 --> 01:23:19,880
father, but not the daughter of
my mother.

1278
01:23:19,880 --> 01:23:25,800
And she became my wife.
So it sounds like it sounds like

1279
01:23:26,920 --> 01:23:36,720
Sarai is Abraham's half sister,
which which the Torah forbids,

1280
01:23:36,800 --> 01:23:38,520
right?
We read that in Leviticus 18.

1281
01:23:39,600 --> 01:23:47,080
And yet, and yet we have Jehovah
testifying to Isaac that Abraham

1282
01:23:47,080 --> 01:23:50,440
kept my laws, my statutes, my
judgments, my commandments.

1283
01:23:51,200 --> 01:23:53,760
So, Josh, can I put something
forward here?

1284
01:23:54,440 --> 01:23:57,760
Please.
When when we're dealing with the

1285
01:23:57,760 --> 01:24:01,440
patriarchs, we're dealing with a
lot of patriarchal order, right?

1286
01:24:01,960 --> 01:24:05,720
Yeah.
Now Sarai would have joined.

1287
01:24:06,560 --> 01:24:11,440
Well that might not necessarily
hold water cause 'cause

1288
01:24:11,440 --> 01:24:15,360
Abraham's father wasn't
necessarily seeking after the

1289
01:24:15,400 --> 01:24:20,080
the the blessings of the fathers
like Abraham's Abraham was.

1290
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:24,640
But maybe culturally he could
still say that 'cause she joined

1291
01:24:25,040 --> 01:24:32,600
Abraham's household, which have
theoretically been right, you

1292
01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:36,200
know, father-in-law, that sort
of thing, right?

1293
01:24:36,200 --> 01:24:40,720
Kind of a semantic there, kind
of semantics there.

1294
01:24:41,320 --> 01:24:44,800
And and that's maybe that's how
he got away with it.

1295
01:24:45,400 --> 01:24:49,400
You're on to something.
So a lot of times people again,

1296
01:24:49,400 --> 01:24:55,240
people will say, yeah, Abraham
married his half sister, but he,

1297
01:24:55,240 --> 01:25:00,240
he hadn't been commanded not to.
So God excused that, you know,

1298
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:04,560
but you know it.
You have to in order to believe

1299
01:25:04,560 --> 01:25:09,520
that, you have to reject what
Jehovah said to Isaac.

1300
01:25:10,160 --> 01:25:14,200
Right.
And you also, and of course, if

1301
01:25:14,200 --> 01:25:18,080
you're, you know, if you're a
child of the restoration, then

1302
01:25:18,080 --> 01:25:21,880
you have to reject, you know
what, what the Book of Mormon

1303
01:25:21,880 --> 01:25:24,480
and the Book of Moses and the
Book of Abraham say about God's

1304
01:25:24,480 --> 01:25:28,600
law being passed down from Adam.
So, so that's that's a tricky

1305
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:32,080
thing to say, but there's
another place in Genesis.

1306
01:25:33,000 --> 01:25:37,520
Interesting.
Genesis 11 says something a

1307
01:25:37,520 --> 01:25:40,240
little bit different, but along
the lines that you were getting

1308
01:25:40,240 --> 01:25:41,720
at, I think.
So that was cool.

1309
01:25:42,600 --> 01:25:44,800
Tara, that's Abraham's father,
right?

1310
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:50,080
Took Abraham, his son, and Lot,
the son of Haran, his son's son,

1311
01:25:50,720 --> 01:25:54,400
and Sarai his daughter-in-law.
Yep.

1312
01:25:55,400 --> 01:25:59,200
Not it, not his daughter, but
says Sarai is Tara's

1313
01:25:59,200 --> 01:26:02,040
daughter-in-law, his son
Abraham's wife.

1314
01:26:02,400 --> 01:26:05,840
And they went forth with them
from Herb to Caldees to go to

1315
01:26:05,840 --> 01:26:10,360
the land of Canaan, and they
came in to Haram and dwelt

1316
01:26:10,440 --> 01:26:20,760
there.
So interesting that so it can,

1317
01:26:21,200 --> 01:26:25,520
you know, is a daughter, a
daughter-in-law, a daughter, a

1318
01:26:25,520 --> 01:26:29,080
kind of daughter.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

1319
01:26:29,640 --> 01:26:34,480
OK.
So so here when says, well, she

1320
01:26:34,480 --> 01:26:37,440
is the she is the daughter of my
father.

1321
01:26:37,520 --> 01:26:40,840
In other words, like she's part
of my father's family, you know,

1322
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:45,040
by marriage here, but not the
daughter of my mother.

1323
01:26:45,040 --> 01:26:49,560
So not, not my blood, not my
blood.

1324
01:26:49,560 --> 01:26:52,840
Sister is kind of what he's
saying, you know, And we kind of

1325
01:26:52,840 --> 01:26:59,360
use, we use the term sister,
brother and sister in a

1326
01:26:59,760 --> 01:27:02,400
metaphorical way to like more
than just biological, right.

1327
01:27:02,800 --> 01:27:05,080
Right.
So.

1328
01:27:05,360 --> 01:27:08,000
Can I say one other thing too
that that jumped out at me as

1329
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:12,400
you were reading these?
There seems to be like it.

1330
01:27:12,440 --> 01:27:15,160
And I think this supports the
idea that that the law was

1331
01:27:15,160 --> 01:27:21,800
around even before Moses, right?
Because even Pharaoh understands

1332
01:27:22,320 --> 01:27:25,920
this, right?
Even Pharaoh acknowledges this.

1333
01:27:26,280 --> 01:27:30,480
And Pharaoh then goes on and
acknowledges it even more with

1334
01:27:30,480 --> 01:27:33,680
like, I could have ended up
laying with your wife, bro,

1335
01:27:34,200 --> 01:27:36,840
right?
So that seems to be repugnant to

1336
01:27:36,840 --> 01:27:39,160
him as well, right?
And we start looking.

1337
01:27:40,920 --> 01:27:44,280
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and so even Pharaoh

1338
01:27:44,280 --> 01:27:47,600
himself, right.
And and it does say in the in

1339
01:27:47,600 --> 01:27:50,280
the Pearl of great price that
Pharaoh by all accounts was a

1340
01:27:50,280 --> 01:27:53,400
righteous man, right?
Tried to imitate the orders of

1341
01:27:53,400 --> 01:27:55,640
the fathers.
So of course he would be

1342
01:27:55,640 --> 01:27:59,600
repulsed by that idea of who I
dodged a bullet.

1343
01:27:59,760 --> 01:28:03,120
I almost slayed with another
man's wife and then like, get

1344
01:28:03,120 --> 01:28:05,440
your crap and get out of my
country, right?

1345
01:28:05,440 --> 01:28:08,680
Like you almost have me screw up
here, bro.

1346
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:13,360
And so even Pharaoh gets to
acknowledge the law here in

1347
01:28:13,360 --> 01:28:17,520
this.
Yeah, which is if, if you don't

1348
01:28:17,520 --> 01:28:25,040
have, OK, if you don't have the,
if you don't have the

1349
01:28:25,040 --> 01:28:29,400
restoration scriptures, OK, that
talks about Pharaoh being

1350
01:28:29,400 --> 01:28:34,880
righteous and and you know, May
and Abraham apparently didn't

1351
01:28:34,880 --> 01:28:37,120
know that Pharaoh was a
righteous man.

1352
01:28:37,480 --> 01:28:40,360
Nope.
Because he says he says Pharaoh

1353
01:28:40,360 --> 01:28:41,880
is not going to care about
adultery.

1354
01:28:42,400 --> 01:28:45,720
Right.
Says if I say you're my wife,

1355
01:28:45,720 --> 01:28:48,040
you belong to me, then they'll
say, well, let's get rid of this

1356
01:28:48,040 --> 01:28:51,520
man so that we can take his.
You know what's his?

1357
01:28:52,080 --> 01:28:54,560
Right.
But Pharaoh is worried both

1358
01:28:54,560 --> 01:28:57,040
about adultery and about incest,
right?

1359
01:28:57,040 --> 01:29:02,480
So Pharaoh knows about these
things somehow because we we

1360
01:29:02,480 --> 01:29:06,760
know the answer.
So the the Hebrew word for

1361
01:29:06,760 --> 01:29:13,320
sister is ahoti and it just just
like in English, this is used as

1362
01:29:13,320 --> 01:29:16,760
a biological term, but also
idiomatically so just mean

1363
01:29:17,480 --> 01:29:24,080
kinswoman or even just, you
know, someone who's shares some

1364
01:29:24,120 --> 01:29:29,080
either, you know, and similar
term for brother, you know, we

1365
01:29:29,080 --> 01:29:32,920
call people brothers at church,
you know, we call, you know,

1366
01:29:32,920 --> 01:29:35,760
we're our fellow soldiers or,
you know, our brothers in arms

1367
01:29:35,760 --> 01:29:40,240
or whatever, our fellow lodge
members or whatever, our

1368
01:29:40,240 --> 01:29:43,680
brothers or our sisters.
And in Hebrew those terms are

1369
01:29:43,680 --> 01:29:46,600
used idiomatically in the same
way too, right?

1370
01:29:46,600 --> 01:29:52,440
So, OK, so to Lot, you know,
just as another example of this,

1371
01:29:52,960 --> 01:29:55,800
what's the relationship between
Lot and Abraham?

1372
01:29:56,840 --> 01:29:59,360
Isn't correct me if I'm wrong?
I could be wrong here.

1373
01:29:59,640 --> 01:30:03,840
Wasn't Lot his nephew?
That is correct biologically his

1374
01:30:03,840 --> 01:30:09,000
nephew, but in Genesis 14 says
Abraham brought back all the

1375
01:30:09,000 --> 01:30:12,360
goods and brought again his
brother, his brother Lot.

1376
01:30:12,800 --> 01:30:17,840
OK, and his after after Lot is a
lot tangled up in the the wars

1377
01:30:17,840 --> 01:30:21,000
of the the kings and Abraham
rescues him.

1378
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:24,720
But here here says Lot is his
brother.

1379
01:30:24,800 --> 01:30:28,440
Lot is not his biological
brother, but you know, he's his

1380
01:30:28,920 --> 01:30:32,880
his brother in the faith his
brother as far as his his like

1381
01:30:32,960 --> 01:30:38,880
kinsman.
And so anyway, OK, now there is

1382
01:30:38,880 --> 01:30:40,320
one other interesting thing
here.

1383
01:30:40,840 --> 01:30:48,240
OK, that I'm going to go to.
So this is Genesis 11 again.

1384
01:30:49,040 --> 01:30:59,960
So Abram had two brothers, Haran
and Nahor and Haran.

1385
01:31:01,080 --> 01:31:03,040
So let me just let me just read
this.

1386
01:31:03,040 --> 01:31:04,760
This is the this is the
genealogy of Terra.

1387
01:31:04,960 --> 01:31:07,280
Terra begat Abraham, Nahor and
Haran.

1388
01:31:07,280 --> 01:31:08,960
So there's his brothers.
I could just read that.

1389
01:31:09,520 --> 01:31:13,520
Haran begat Lot.
So there's, there's the nephew,

1390
01:31:13,600 --> 01:31:15,520
right?
Abraham's brother Haran has a

1391
01:31:15,840 --> 01:31:19,280
lot.
And Haran died before his father

1392
01:31:19,280 --> 01:31:24,240
Terra in his native land in Ur
of the Chaldeans, then Abraham

1393
01:31:24,240 --> 01:31:25,960
and Nahor.
So those are the two living

1394
01:31:25,960 --> 01:31:28,600
brothers.
They took wives.

1395
01:31:29,080 --> 01:31:33,480
The name of Abraham's wife was
Sarai, and the name of Nahor's

1396
01:31:33,480 --> 01:31:39,280
wife Milka, the daughter of
Haram, the father of Milka and

1397
01:31:39,280 --> 01:31:42,440
the father of Iska.
But Sarai was barren, she had no

1398
01:31:42,440 --> 01:31:44,960
child.
So what this saying is that so

1399
01:31:45,080 --> 01:31:52,080
Haran has here at the list three
children that Haram has one son

1400
01:31:52,640 --> 01:32:04,800
named Lot and Haran has Milka,
the daughter of Haran and and

1401
01:32:04,800 --> 01:32:09,040
also Haran has another daughter
named Iska.

1402
01:32:10,040 --> 01:32:14,040
OK, so there's there's three
children, it says, but Haran

1403
01:32:14,040 --> 01:32:17,400
dies.
And then it says Abram and Nahor

1404
01:32:17,440 --> 01:32:22,560
took wives.
So it says here Nahor took one

1405
01:32:22,560 --> 01:32:28,200
of Paran's daughters.
And then let's see.

1406
01:32:28,280 --> 01:32:30,720
Oh, it says, yeah, it says they
took daughter took wife.

1407
01:32:30,720 --> 01:32:33,920
Sorry.
Abram was took Sarai and Nahor

1408
01:32:33,920 --> 01:32:36,160
took Milka.
And then it lists these two

1409
01:32:36,160 --> 01:32:38,560
daughters of Haran, Milka and
Iska.

1410
01:32:38,760 --> 01:32:40,200
And then it immediately follows
it.

1411
01:32:40,200 --> 01:32:42,400
What?
But Sarai was barren.

1412
01:32:42,400 --> 01:32:45,880
Now you know in the this
translation we have a period

1413
01:32:45,880 --> 01:32:48,520
there in the original Hebrew,
there was not there was not a

1414
01:32:48,520 --> 01:32:52,520
period, OK.
And this this clause right here,

1415
01:32:52,520 --> 01:32:56,960
but Sarai was barren was
actually understood to be an

1416
01:32:56,960 --> 01:33:02,440
explanatory note about Iska.
So Sarai is another name for

1417
01:33:02,440 --> 01:33:04,800
Iska.
OK.

1418
01:33:04,840 --> 01:33:10,200
So in other words, the the
ancient interpretation of this

1419
01:33:10,200 --> 01:33:16,400
verse was that Quran had three
children that are named anyway

1420
01:33:16,840 --> 01:33:20,720
son named Lot and then two
daughters Milka and Iska, who's

1421
01:33:20,720 --> 01:33:25,920
also known as Sarai Haran dies
and then his brothers Abram and

1422
01:33:25,920 --> 01:33:29,920
Nahor, they marry his two
daughters Milka and Sarai.

1423
01:33:31,040 --> 01:33:35,960
OK, so this is this is just to
show you this was the ancient

1424
01:33:36,640 --> 01:33:40,200
the ancient tradition.
OK, this is a Josephus

1425
01:33:40,560 --> 01:33:42,800
antiquities of the Jews.
Just see if this is like is a

1426
01:33:42,800 --> 01:33:45,040
contemporary of Jesus.
Yep.

1427
01:33:45,080 --> 01:33:48,480
OK Abraham had two brethren,
Nahor and Haran.

1428
01:33:48,480 --> 01:33:52,960
Of these Haran left his son Lot
as also Sarai and Milka, his

1429
01:33:52,960 --> 01:33:57,160
daughters OK and died among the
Chaldeans in the city of the

1430
01:33:57,160 --> 01:34:00,240
Chaldeans called Ur and his
monument is shown to this day.

1431
01:34:00,280 --> 01:34:05,080
These Nahor and Haran, these
married their nieces.

1432
01:34:06,000 --> 01:34:11,080
So now the question is like
incest, you know, between

1433
01:34:11,440 --> 01:34:16,920
siblings is not allowed and
actually interesting between

1434
01:34:19,120 --> 01:34:23,320
nephews and aunts is also
forbidden.

1435
01:34:24,240 --> 01:34:31,840
But uncles marrying nieces is
not against the Torah and so so

1436
01:34:31,840 --> 01:34:36,760
although so this is so anyway,
this is just showing that if you

1437
01:34:36,760 --> 01:34:41,080
get into the details here, Abram
was not in violation of

1438
01:34:41,080 --> 01:34:43,680
Leviticus 18, you know, marrying
his half sister.

1439
01:34:44,080 --> 01:34:46,600
The truth of the matter was she
was his.

1440
01:34:46,600 --> 01:34:50,400
She was his niece and that is
that is allowed.

1441
01:34:51,280 --> 01:34:55,360
And so Abram did not was not
breaking or violating any of the

1442
01:34:55,360 --> 01:34:56,680
commandments there.
OK.

1443
01:34:58,040 --> 01:35:02,480
So that was that was kind of a
long explanation, but but it's

1444
01:35:02,480 --> 01:35:09,560
just interesting.
I think that shows that now I'm

1445
01:35:09,560 --> 01:35:18,160
going to let's see.
So I'm going to actually end

1446
01:35:18,160 --> 01:35:26,320
this and close that.
And now I have AI have a few I

1447
01:35:27,600 --> 01:35:29,480
don't know.
Any any thoughts on this to this

1448
01:35:29,480 --> 01:35:32,080
point I guess?
No, it's, it's fascinating to

1449
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:41,680
see that not only was was there
obviously law there, but just

1450
01:35:41,680 --> 01:35:44,480
how widely adhered to it was,
right.

1451
01:35:44,880 --> 01:35:48,040
Even in some places where we
don't expect, like in Egypt,

1452
01:35:48,240 --> 01:35:52,880
right there, there there are
echoes of it that even those who

1453
01:35:52,880 --> 01:35:57,640
who maybe have gone away from
the family, right, so to speak,

1454
01:35:58,480 --> 01:36:02,000
right.
All feel compelled to live by

1455
01:36:02,000 --> 01:36:03,440
those things.
Right.

1456
01:36:03,440 --> 01:36:04,320
Yeah.
Right.

1457
01:36:04,640 --> 01:36:08,160
The the other thing that I was
noticing and this is kind of a

1458
01:36:08,160 --> 01:36:12,160
side tangent as I was looking at
those list of laws that you had,

1459
01:36:14,440 --> 01:36:18,720
those are very civilizing laws,
right?

1460
01:36:19,080 --> 01:36:23,680
Like we look at civilization
when when people start talking

1461
01:36:23,680 --> 01:36:31,720
about the the first civilized
societies, we tend to go to

1462
01:36:31,720 --> 01:36:37,600
Egypt or we tend to go to Rome
or Greece or something like

1463
01:36:37,600 --> 01:36:41,720
that.
But in all actuality, if we look

1464
01:36:41,720 --> 01:36:45,440
at the Bible, which certainly
predates those, we can see these

1465
01:36:45,440 --> 01:36:51,040
civilizing laws there, right?
And that without it, man really

1466
01:36:51,040 --> 01:36:55,640
does kind of devolve back into.
I shouldn't say back into

1467
01:36:55,640 --> 01:36:58,560
because I'm not a believer in
evolution, but devolves into an

1468
01:36:58,560 --> 01:37:00,280
animal.
Right.

1469
01:37:05,000 --> 01:37:08,280
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I agree.

1470
01:37:09,080 --> 01:37:14,000
And a lot of these, a lot of
the, a lot of the laws, you

1471
01:37:14,000 --> 01:37:17,080
know, some of the ceremonial
things aside, a lot of the, the

1472
01:37:17,080 --> 01:37:22,120
other laws, although like a lot
of those things are just like

1473
01:37:22,160 --> 01:37:25,440
they're, they're actually
necessary for society to

1474
01:37:25,440 --> 01:37:30,000
function, you know, so.
And, and I think, look, it's

1475
01:37:30,000 --> 01:37:33,760
kind of funny, right?
The more technologically

1476
01:37:33,760 --> 01:37:38,360
advanced we we seem to be
becoming now, the less lawful we

1477
01:37:38,360 --> 01:37:41,240
are, right?
I mean, we're in a time now

1478
01:37:41,240 --> 01:37:45,320
where, you know, a lot of those
laws aren't necessarily as taboo

1479
01:37:45,320 --> 01:37:48,360
as what's as they once were,
right?

1480
01:37:48,360 --> 01:37:49,760
I mean, that's.
True.

1481
01:37:50,120 --> 01:37:52,880
You you can look at, you know,
things like the the one about

1482
01:37:52,880 --> 01:37:54,960
processing.
We are right with that.

1483
01:37:54,960 --> 01:37:57,680
Weakening.
Weakening the fabric, yeah.

1484
01:37:57,840 --> 01:38:04,760
Absolutely, Absolutely.
OK, so I'll just go through

1485
01:38:04,760 --> 01:38:10,320
these kind of quickly, but you
know the, the, the 5th

1486
01:38:10,320 --> 01:38:14,480
commandment, like the Big 10 is
honor the Sabbath.

1487
01:38:15,320 --> 01:38:16,280
OK.
Right.

1488
01:38:16,880 --> 01:38:20,840
Was that was that a thing before
Sinai?

1489
01:38:23,080 --> 01:38:26,000
I would say so.
Yeah, yeah, I mean from the very

1490
01:38:26,000 --> 01:38:28,760
beginning, God says he rested on
the 7th day.

1491
01:38:29,880 --> 01:38:33,920
OK.
And also when the, when the

1492
01:38:33,920 --> 01:38:39,600
Israelites are out in the, the
wilderness, like 1, you know,

1493
01:38:39,640 --> 01:38:47,200
after, just right after they've
left Egypt, the, the manna

1494
01:38:47,200 --> 01:38:52,400
starts and God tells them you're
going to keep, keep my Sabbath

1495
01:38:52,920 --> 01:38:54,800
and I'm going to see if you're
going to keep my law.

1496
01:38:55,240 --> 01:39:00,640
And this is before, like before
where the covenant happened at

1497
01:39:00,640 --> 01:39:03,640
Sinai, where they have the man
for six days.

1498
01:39:04,040 --> 01:39:06,360
They have the man for six days.
And then they, you know, that

1499
01:39:06,360 --> 01:39:12,280
doesn't come on the 7th and, you
know, for, for 50 days between

1500
01:39:12,280 --> 01:39:16,760
Passover and Shabuot, they're
practicing keeping.

1501
01:39:17,120 --> 01:39:21,400
Yeah, the Sabbath and it seems
like like the the language that

1502
01:39:21,400 --> 01:39:25,040
God uses there is like you
already know, this is this is my

1503
01:39:25,040 --> 01:39:26,880
law.
He says before, before he

1504
01:39:26,880 --> 01:39:31,000
actually gives them the law,
like formally they're they're

1505
01:39:31,000 --> 01:39:34,400
doing this so.
Well, and, and and here's the

1506
01:39:34,440 --> 01:39:41,160
other thing right?
I, I wonder again it because,

1507
01:39:41,240 --> 01:39:43,960
because it doesn't seem like
it's that foreign to him, right?

1508
01:39:43,960 --> 01:39:47,560
That's not one because look, we
have records throughout Exodus

1509
01:39:47,560 --> 01:39:50,680
and Leviticus.
The children of Israel are

1510
01:39:50,720 --> 01:39:53,320
bumbling their way through this
whole thing, right?

1511
01:39:53,640 --> 01:39:57,600
And, and they're questioning God
at every turn, right?

1512
01:39:57,640 --> 01:40:00,840
I, I go back to, to one of my
favorite stories where, you

1513
01:40:00,840 --> 01:40:05,080
know, they sent, you know, Moses
says, send spies out to, to go

1514
01:40:05,080 --> 01:40:08,080
look at the land.
And then the evil report comes

1515
01:40:08,080 --> 01:40:09,640
back like, Hey, it's a great
land.

1516
01:40:09,640 --> 01:40:11,400
But there's a whole bunch of
guys back there.

1517
01:40:11,400 --> 01:40:13,160
And they're like, Oh, I'm not
going to go.

1518
01:40:13,160 --> 01:40:15,800
And God gets angry.
Moses intercedes.

1519
01:40:16,120 --> 01:40:18,760
And then they say, Oh, I don't
want to wander 40 years, so

1520
01:40:18,760 --> 01:40:22,600
let's go do it now, right.
So they they don't seem to have

1521
01:40:22,600 --> 01:40:25,200
a problem trying to second guess
God a lot.

1522
01:40:25,760 --> 01:40:29,640
But for whatever reason, the
Sabbath law there, they're like,

1523
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:33,280
well, yeah, of course, right?
I mean, there's no there,

1524
01:40:33,320 --> 01:40:35,200
there's no pushback on that,
right?

1525
01:40:35,520 --> 01:40:39,920
So again, was there a form of
Sabbath even in Egypt, right?

1526
01:40:39,920 --> 01:40:43,720
Like what actually?
Yeah, there are, you know,

1527
01:40:43,840 --> 01:40:49,440
apocryphal sources that say that
Moses.

1528
01:40:49,680 --> 01:40:52,680
When Moses, you know, Moses was
Prince in Egypt, right?

1529
01:40:53,680 --> 01:40:56,800
That Moses made sure that the
the Israelites when they were

1530
01:40:56,800 --> 01:40:59,760
slaves, that Moses made sure
that they got a Sabbath.

1531
01:41:00,680 --> 01:41:03,680
Right.
Even theirs so like while they

1532
01:41:03,680 --> 01:41:05,400
were slaves still.
So yeah.

1533
01:41:05,960 --> 01:41:09,560
OK, so there's one so altars.
The first time we have

1534
01:41:09,560 --> 01:41:15,280
instructions for building an
altar is in Exodus chapter 21 or

1535
01:41:15,280 --> 01:41:18,040
22 I think.
You know, and it God says you

1536
01:41:18,040 --> 01:41:23,240
either need to make it out of,
you know, earth or uncut stones

1537
01:41:24,120 --> 01:41:25,280
and that's how you're going to
do it.

1538
01:41:25,760 --> 01:41:31,560
But we have in the book of
Moses, we have Adam making an

1539
01:41:31,560 --> 01:41:33,040
altar.
You know, we have Abel, we have

1540
01:41:33,040 --> 01:41:36,760
Noah, we have Abraham.
They're all making altars, even

1541
01:41:36,760 --> 01:41:38,520
though there was no commandment
to do that.

1542
01:41:39,000 --> 01:41:42,840
You know, no command recorded,
recorded commandment not until

1543
01:41:43,640 --> 01:41:45,960
the law of Moses was given, but
there.

1544
01:41:46,000 --> 01:41:53,480
But there we have it.
See, I mentioned those things I

1545
01:41:53,480 --> 01:41:55,640
won't get into.
There's a lot of a lot of animal

1546
01:41:55,640 --> 01:41:58,280
sacrifice that goes on along.
Yep.

1547
01:41:58,840 --> 01:42:03,000
Goes on not only Sabbath, but
actually Sabbath years too.

1548
01:42:03,800 --> 01:42:07,840
So Sabbath years or sabbatical
years, these are cycles of seven

1549
01:42:08,000 --> 01:42:11,520
years.
And we have these interesting,

1550
01:42:13,760 --> 01:42:15,000
right?
We get instructions about this

1551
01:42:15,000 --> 01:42:19,120
in Leviticus 25.
The 7th year shall be a Sabbath

1552
01:42:19,640 --> 01:42:21,360
and also the Jubilee years,
right?

1553
01:42:21,360 --> 01:42:28,640
Hallow the 50th year and also we
have laws about servants,

1554
01:42:28,800 --> 01:42:32,800
indentured servants, serving Six
years he shall serve and in the

1555
01:42:32,800 --> 01:42:39,480
seventh he should go out free.
OK, so then we have Jacob

1556
01:42:40,040 --> 01:42:46,120
showing up for at layman's house
and serving for seven years.

1557
01:42:46,360 --> 01:42:50,160
Yep.
For, you know, to to pay for, to

1558
01:42:50,160 --> 01:42:53,360
pay his way and also the pay for
his wife.

1559
01:42:53,440 --> 01:42:57,520
He gets 2 wives out of the deal.
So he works 2 terms of seven

1560
01:42:57,520 --> 01:43:00,920
years back-to-back.
But that's that term of seven

1561
01:43:01,120 --> 01:43:07,200
years of servitude.
Like that's, that's a that's a

1562
01:43:07,200 --> 01:43:09,720
Law of Moses thing.
Yeah, this is happening.

1563
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:12,760
This is happening in Genesis
right before Moses was on the

1564
01:43:12,760 --> 01:43:16,080
scene.
OK, We talked about we talked

1565
01:43:16,080 --> 01:43:18,000
about murder.
Already.

1566
01:43:19,800 --> 01:43:24,760
Actually interesting.
Well, I don't want to get into

1567
01:43:24,760 --> 01:43:28,920
that.
Well I will say like in the law

1568
01:43:28,920 --> 01:43:32,400
of Moses, the the punishment,
punishment for murderers death.

1569
01:43:33,200 --> 01:43:38,000
Right.
It's interesting even even after

1570
01:43:38,000 --> 01:43:41,280
the Law of Moses is given,
murderers don't always die like

1571
01:43:41,360 --> 01:43:44,240
David, right?
David's guilty of murder, right?

1572
01:43:45,000 --> 01:43:46,600
David doesn't get put to death.
Why not?

1573
01:43:48,960 --> 01:43:51,160
I don't know.
I'll tell you why.

1574
01:43:51,600 --> 01:43:55,200
Because there's no witnesses.
Oh, OK.

1575
01:43:56,160 --> 01:43:58,040
Except God.
I mean, God knows everything,

1576
01:43:58,440 --> 01:43:59,160
right?
But God doesn't.

1577
01:43:59,640 --> 01:44:02,040
God doesn't.
I know.

1578
01:44:02,040 --> 01:44:04,280
No one's getting away with
anything, right?

1579
01:44:04,920 --> 01:44:07,440
Eventually, eventually everyone
will will that will make a

1580
01:44:07,440 --> 01:44:10,840
reckon of all their deeds and
words and thoughts.

1581
01:44:10,840 --> 01:44:13,080
So no one's getting away with
anything.

1582
01:44:13,160 --> 01:44:20,840
But here in on this stage, this
mortal stage, God has said no

1583
01:44:20,840 --> 01:44:24,240
one's, no one's going to be
punished for anything, even

1584
01:44:24,240 --> 01:44:26,360
murder, unless there's witnesses
against them.

1585
01:44:26,920 --> 01:44:31,520
That's what we're going to do.
And you know, This is why, This

1586
01:44:31,520 --> 01:44:36,840
is why when there's the
adulterous woman in John chapter

1587
01:44:36,840 --> 01:44:39,200
8, right?
The, they bring, they bring the

1588
01:44:39,200 --> 01:44:44,320
woman and, and you know, there
is a trap for Jesus.

1589
01:44:44,320 --> 01:44:48,920
Is he going to, is he going to
obey the law and and thereby

1590
01:44:49,600 --> 01:44:52,120
defy the Roman law?
Is he going to keep the Torah

1591
01:44:52,120 --> 01:44:55,680
and defy the Roman law and
you'll be right, guilty of

1592
01:44:55,680 --> 01:44:59,240
sedition or is he going to go
with the Roman law?

1593
01:44:59,240 --> 01:45:01,040
And then we can accuse him of
being an apostate.

1594
01:45:02,480 --> 01:45:06,120
But you know, he flips it around
and they all leave and he, he

1595
01:45:06,120 --> 01:45:09,440
tells the woman and she's
guilty, right, Right.

1596
01:45:09,440 --> 01:45:11,680
I mean, he says go and send no
more.

1597
01:45:11,920 --> 01:45:13,720
But he says, where are your
accusers?

1598
01:45:14,800 --> 01:45:17,960
Because if there's no accuser,
then there's no punishment,

1599
01:45:18,480 --> 01:45:19,880
right?
OK.

1600
01:45:20,040 --> 01:45:24,160
And even though, even though
Jesus knows, I mean, but he, he

1601
01:45:24,160 --> 01:45:28,640
knows by supernatural means and
that doesn't count.

1602
01:45:29,240 --> 01:45:31,880
You can't say I had a revelation
that my neighbor is an

1603
01:45:31,880 --> 01:45:33,320
adulterer.
Right.

1604
01:45:33,920 --> 01:45:37,400
And have that stand up in court.
Like there has to be there has

1605
01:45:37,400 --> 01:45:42,000
to be actual, yeah, witnesses
and physical evidence.

1606
01:45:42,200 --> 01:45:48,880
OK, so, so you know, the fact,
you know, the fact that David

1607
01:45:48,880 --> 01:45:53,000
isn't put to death is similar to
why Cain is not put to death,

1608
01:45:53,640 --> 01:45:55,440
right?
There's there's a supernatural

1609
01:45:55,440 --> 01:45:58,600
witness.
You know, God says the blood of

1610
01:45:58,640 --> 01:46:00,480
Abel is crying to me from the
dust.

1611
01:46:01,200 --> 01:46:03,360
But but there was no other
witnesses.

1612
01:46:03,360 --> 01:46:07,600
So Cain, Cain to God exiles him,
but but he's not put to death.

1613
01:46:07,600 --> 01:46:11,680
And that's just it's just kind
of a small little clue.

1614
01:46:12,400 --> 01:46:16,320
But this is this is the that the
fact that both David and Cain

1615
01:46:16,320 --> 01:46:24,520
are not killed immediately is
just a it's a hint that the law

1616
01:46:24,520 --> 01:46:26,600
witnesses being kept even back
then.

1617
01:46:27,840 --> 01:46:36,760
Interesting.
OK, OK, so intermarriage, right?

1618
01:46:36,760 --> 01:46:40,000
The the law forbids Israelites
from marrying, intermarrying

1619
01:46:40,000 --> 01:46:44,280
with the Canaanites.
OK, and there's this is a lot

1620
01:46:44,280 --> 01:46:50,280
bigger topic than we can get
into right now, but but before

1621
01:46:50,280 --> 01:46:55,720
that right that's in anyway,
that's that's in Deuteronomy.

1622
01:46:55,960 --> 01:46:59,640
OK, there's probably other
places, but before, before

1623
01:46:59,640 --> 01:47:05,360
Deuteronomy in Genesis, Esau was
40 years old when he took the

1624
01:47:05,360 --> 01:47:09,800
wife Judith, the daughter of the
era, the Hittite, and Bathshema,

1625
01:47:09,800 --> 01:47:12,360
the daughter of Elon the
Hittite, which were a grief of

1626
01:47:13,440 --> 01:47:17,720
mine to Isaac and Rebecca.
Like they were sad that he kind

1627
01:47:17,720 --> 01:47:19,720
of married outside the the
covenant family.

1628
01:47:20,400 --> 01:47:25,480
And even though we don't have
any commandments about that, but

1629
01:47:25,480 --> 01:47:27,680
it seems like they were
sensitive to those things even

1630
01:47:27,680 --> 01:47:31,600
before the Torah.
So OK, we talked about incest.

1631
01:47:31,960 --> 01:47:35,600
Actually, I mentioned another
interesting one that that showed

1632
01:47:35,600 --> 01:47:38,600
up.
So this has to do with Abraham's

1633
01:47:38,880 --> 01:47:43,480
family again.
So Lot, right, Lot is saved from

1634
01:47:43,600 --> 01:47:48,320
Sodom along with his two
daughters, right and his two

1635
01:47:48,320 --> 01:47:50,440
daughters at least like they
think that the whole world has

1636
01:47:50,440 --> 01:47:53,040
been destroyed, right?
Like they're, they're the only

1637
01:47:53,040 --> 01:47:56,080
ones left, or at least that's
the justification they give,

1638
01:47:56,080 --> 01:47:57,640
right?
They get him drunk and take

1639
01:47:57,640 --> 01:48:02,360
advantage of their father,
become pregnant by him and the

1640
01:48:02,800 --> 01:48:04,920
the Bible, just that, you know,
the King James, it actually

1641
01:48:04,920 --> 01:48:06,560
doesn't.
It just describes what happened,

1642
01:48:06,560 --> 01:48:10,120
but doesn't pass any judgment
about whether it was good or

1643
01:48:10,120 --> 01:48:12,560
bad.
But the JST actually adds

1644
01:48:12,560 --> 01:48:17,520
something to that and says that
what Lot's daughters did was

1645
01:48:17,520 --> 01:48:22,120
wickedness again, even though,
even though it was before,

1646
01:48:22,160 --> 01:48:26,920
apparently before, you know,
laws about that were given so.

1647
01:48:27,400 --> 01:48:29,680
Interesting, but of course.
But of course they were given

1648
01:48:30,200 --> 01:48:35,320
and the, the the JST kind of
restores that somewhat better.

1649
01:48:38,080 --> 01:48:41,400
Let's see, forbidden plural
marriages.

1650
01:48:43,360 --> 01:48:52,680
So there is besides like taking
another man's wife, there is

1651
01:48:52,680 --> 01:48:55,640
another kind of plural marriage
that's forbidden.

1652
01:48:56,680 --> 01:49:02,440
And that is as in Leviticus 18
says, you shall not take a wife

1653
01:49:02,600 --> 01:49:09,200
to her sister to vex her to
uncover her nakedness beside the

1654
01:49:09,200 --> 01:49:13,920
other in her lifetime.
So, so you are not allowed to

1655
01:49:14,280 --> 01:49:20,440
marry your wife's sister in
order to like to vex your wife

1656
01:49:20,440 --> 01:49:23,480
in order to make her jealous or
whatever.

1657
01:49:24,160 --> 01:49:27,680
OK, so.
Because if that was the case,

1658
01:49:27,680 --> 01:49:30,280
then Isaac would have been in
violation of that right If it

1659
01:49:30,280 --> 01:49:33,200
was just a Jacob.
Jacob, thank you.

1660
01:49:33,280 --> 01:49:35,320
Sorry.
Yes, with Rebecca and Leah.

1661
01:49:35,600 --> 01:49:38,320
Yeah, he would have been in
violation of that, but because

1662
01:49:38,320 --> 01:49:41,520
it wasn't to vex the other.
It was.

1663
01:49:41,640 --> 01:49:44,360
Acceptable.
Yeah, now this is interesting.

1664
01:49:45,560 --> 01:49:50,680
The the Bible doesn't say
anything about whether it was

1665
01:49:50,680 --> 01:49:56,080
vexing or not, but in the
Talmud, so this is so.

1666
01:49:56,640 --> 01:49:59,360
So the Talmud has good stuff.
I'm not not speaking against the

1667
01:49:59,360 --> 01:50:02,960
Talmud, which I, you know, we
talked about at the beginning.

1668
01:50:03,520 --> 01:50:06,280
I only take issue with the
traditions when they directly

1669
01:50:06,400 --> 01:50:08,720
contradict.
But the but the Talmud is

1670
01:50:08,720 --> 01:50:10,800
beautiful and interesting and
good.

1671
01:50:11,760 --> 01:50:13,200
I just have some some issues
with it.

1672
01:50:13,560 --> 01:50:16,960
Anyway, that aside, in the
Talmud it says.

1673
01:50:24,240 --> 01:50:27,800
Let's see, it must be
understood.

1674
01:50:27,800 --> 01:50:36,920
Let's see, I have it here, OK?
OK, so this is interesting

1675
01:50:36,920 --> 01:50:38,840
because I'm going to give a
little more little back story

1676
01:50:38,840 --> 01:50:41,400
here.
Of course, Jacob was a deceiver,

1677
01:50:43,440 --> 01:50:45,000
OK?
And he kind of reaps what he

1678
01:50:45,000 --> 01:50:49,880
sowed because he deceived Isaac
to get the blessing.

1679
01:50:50,280 --> 01:50:54,480
And then he gets deceived by his
father-in-law, Laban, right,

1680
01:50:54,600 --> 01:50:56,920
right.
With his wives and and also gets

1681
01:50:56,920 --> 01:51:01,680
deceived by his children with
Jacob, right?

1682
01:51:01,680 --> 01:51:05,120
They take this coat and tell the
jade that Joseph is dead.

1683
01:51:05,600 --> 01:51:09,600
So OK, so this is from the the
Gemara.

1684
01:51:09,600 --> 01:51:14,480
It was a Jewish writing.
What was the modesty shown to

1685
01:51:14,800 --> 01:51:18,880
shown by Rachel?
It is as it is written and Jacob

1686
01:51:18,880 --> 01:51:22,320
so this is a quotation now from
Genesis and Jacob told Rachel

1687
01:51:22,320 --> 01:51:28,120
that he was her father's brother
and that he was that he was

1688
01:51:28,160 --> 01:51:32,960
Rebecca's son and maybe asked
was he Jacob in fact her

1689
01:51:32,960 --> 01:51:35,680
father's brother?
Wasn't he the son of her

1690
01:51:35,680 --> 01:51:38,320
father's sister?
Rather it must be understood

1691
01:51:38,320 --> 01:51:41,600
that when Jacob met Rachel and
said and she said to her, will

1692
01:51:41,600 --> 01:51:44,040
you marry me?
She said to him, yes, but my

1693
01:51:44,040 --> 01:51:48,360
father Laban is a swindler and
you will not be able to outwit

1694
01:51:48,360 --> 01:51:51,560
him.
Jacob alleviated her fears as he

1695
01:51:51,560 --> 01:51:56,440
said to her that he is her
father's brother, meaning not

1696
01:51:57,320 --> 01:52:01,040
referring not to their familiar
familial affiliation, but rather

1697
01:52:01,040 --> 01:52:05,200
to his ability to deal with her
father on his level, as if to

1698
01:52:05,200 --> 01:52:07,720
say I am his brother in
deception.

1699
01:52:08,880 --> 01:52:15,240
OK, OK.
She's she said to him, but is it

1700
01:52:15,240 --> 01:52:18,040
really permitted for the
righteous to be involved in

1701
01:52:18,040 --> 01:52:20,240
deception?
He said to her, yes, it is

1702
01:52:20,240 --> 01:52:22,840
permitted when dealing with
deceptive individuals.

1703
01:52:23,000 --> 01:52:26,080
As the verse states, with the
pure you shall show yourself

1704
01:52:26,080 --> 01:52:31,200
pure and with the perverse you
show yourself subtle quotation.

1705
01:52:31,600 --> 01:52:35,720
Quotation from second standard
indicating that one should deal

1706
01:52:35,720 --> 01:52:37,440
with others in the manner
appropriate for their

1707
01:52:37,440 --> 01:52:40,080
personality.
Jacob then said to her what is

1708
01:52:40,080 --> 01:52:43,040
the deception that he will plan
to carry out and that I should

1709
01:52:43,040 --> 01:52:45,720
be prepared for.
And Rachel said to him I have a

1710
01:52:45,720 --> 01:52:51,480
sister who is older than I and
he will not marry me off before

1711
01:52:51,480 --> 01:52:55,240
her and will try to give you her
in my place.

1712
01:52:55,920 --> 01:53:00,920
So Jacob has a plan.
Says Jacob gave her certain

1713
01:53:01,120 --> 01:53:05,600
distinguishing signs that she
should use to indicate to him

1714
01:53:05,720 --> 01:53:08,280
that she was actually Rachel and
not her sister.

1715
01:53:08,640 --> 01:53:13,120
OK and when the wedding night
arrived and Laban planned to

1716
01:53:13,240 --> 01:53:20,480
switch the sisters, Rachel said
to herself, now my sister will

1717
01:53:20,480 --> 01:53:25,680
be embarrassed for Jacob will
ask her for the signs and she

1718
01:53:25,680 --> 01:53:31,040
will not know them.
So she gave them to her, and

1719
01:53:31,040 --> 01:53:35,240
this is as it was written.
It came to pass that in the

1720
01:53:35,240 --> 01:53:40,360
morning, behold, it was Leah.
Does this imply by inference

1721
01:53:40,360 --> 01:53:45,000
that until now she was not Leah?
Rather, due to the

1722
01:53:45,000 --> 01:53:48,160
distinguishing signs that Rachel
had given to Leah, he did not

1723
01:53:48,160 --> 01:53:51,120
know until now, when it was
light outside, that she was

1724
01:53:51,120 --> 01:53:53,840
Lydia.
Therefore, Rachel merited that

1725
01:53:53,840 --> 01:53:57,720
Saul that Saul should descend
from her due to her act of

1726
01:53:57,720 --> 01:54:01,600
modesty and not revealing to
Jacob that she had shown the

1727
01:54:01,600 --> 01:54:04,200
signs to Leah.
Interesting.

1728
01:54:04,200 --> 01:54:13,720
So to fulfill the law, she gives
this tell right and that way

1729
01:54:13,760 --> 01:54:16,960
they wouldn't be in violation of
the vexing thing.

1730
01:54:16,960 --> 01:54:19,360
Yes, right.
So it was not vexing.

1731
01:54:19,640 --> 01:54:25,760
In fact, Rachel, Rachel
participated according to this

1732
01:54:25,760 --> 01:54:28,960
tradition, and I have no reason
to disbelieve it, but according

1733
01:54:28,960 --> 01:54:33,000
to this tradition, Rachel
participated in the deception

1734
01:54:34,240 --> 01:54:39,280
for out of care for her sister,
not wanting Leah to be

1735
01:54:39,280 --> 01:54:44,880
embarrassed and wanting her to
be included in the family so.

1736
01:54:45,520 --> 01:54:51,080
Well, it and yeah, you got to
wonder too, If, if, if, if, if

1737
01:54:51,080 --> 01:54:53,200
there wasn't more love there
than just.

1738
01:54:53,200 --> 01:54:54,600
I'm going to save her
embarrassment.

1739
01:54:54,640 --> 01:54:56,800
Right.
Jacob, good guy.

1740
01:54:56,880 --> 01:54:59,360
I think he can do this.
Yeah.

1741
01:54:59,600 --> 01:55:03,600
And and what a leap of faith on
her part that Jacob was going to

1742
01:55:03,600 --> 01:55:09,280
stick around to do.
What she knew, The Jewish

1743
01:55:09,280 --> 01:55:14,920
tradition also says that the
plan was, the plan was, and

1744
01:55:14,920 --> 01:55:19,000
everybody knew it.
The plan was for Jacob to marry

1745
01:55:19,000 --> 01:55:27,000
Rachel and for Leah to marry
Esau, but Esau goes and marries

1746
01:55:27,000 --> 01:55:29,400
some Canaanites instead.
Right.

1747
01:55:29,920 --> 01:55:35,760
And and Esau is not interested
in righteousness really.

1748
01:55:37,040 --> 01:55:44,000
And so Genesis says that she was
like soft eyed dinner wide or

1749
01:55:44,000 --> 01:55:48,280
whatever it says.
The various translations say the

1750
01:55:48,280 --> 01:55:53,240
Jewish tradition is that like
her eyes were soft because she

1751
01:55:53,680 --> 01:55:58,000
spent so much time crying
thinking about what it was going

1752
01:55:58,000 --> 01:56:02,960
to be like to be Esau's wife.
And this was like dreading that

1753
01:56:03,520 --> 01:56:08,280
and dreading her law.
And so this kind of change of

1754
01:56:08,280 --> 01:56:17,040
events happens.
And anyway, now a lot of people,

1755
01:56:17,040 --> 01:56:21,960
a lot of people will point to
the, the very short stories that

1756
01:56:21,960 --> 01:56:25,600
we have of interactions between
Rachel and Leah and point to

1757
01:56:25,600 --> 01:56:29,720
that is like how awful plural
families are because they, they

1758
01:56:29,720 --> 01:56:31,000
follow with each other
sometimes.

1759
01:56:31,960 --> 01:56:38,000
And it's like, I just read that
and I'm like, there's so there's

1760
01:56:38,040 --> 01:56:43,080
so there's like there's like 20
verses about their lives.

1761
01:56:43,280 --> 01:56:45,120
You know, they lived a century
or something like that.

1762
01:56:45,120 --> 01:56:47,400
We have 20 verses.
And you think that that like Rep

1763
01:56:47,440 --> 01:56:51,840
is representative of their life
24/7 or something like that.

1764
01:56:52,280 --> 01:56:55,920
Like that is not that is not
their life 24/7, but it does.

1765
01:56:56,120 --> 01:57:00,520
But it just show the conflicts,
you know, which don't really

1766
01:57:00,520 --> 01:57:06,400
mean anything.
Like like even, even even

1767
01:57:06,400 --> 01:57:10,000
couples that are portrayed as
like couples, couples that are

1768
01:57:10,000 --> 01:57:11,840
portrayed as righteous have
problems too.

1769
01:57:11,880 --> 01:57:17,320
You know, Soraya is complaining
against Lehigh and you know, Eve

1770
01:57:17,320 --> 01:57:19,840
is tempting Adam and listening
to Satan.

1771
01:57:20,160 --> 01:57:22,520
You know, even though they're
Adam and Eve, they're the the

1772
01:57:22,520 --> 01:57:25,560
greatest, you know, the, the
exemplary couple or whatever.

1773
01:57:25,880 --> 01:57:28,920
Like they and they raised the
first murderer, you know, so

1774
01:57:29,000 --> 01:57:32,720
like, it's just, it's just part
of life that there's conflicts

1775
01:57:32,720 --> 01:57:36,760
and things.
So anyway, don't get me off on

1776
01:57:36,760 --> 01:57:42,920
that tangent.
So OK, the so Leviticus 18 says

1777
01:57:42,920 --> 01:57:45,920
thou shalt not lie with mankind
as with womankind it is as is an

1778
01:57:45,920 --> 01:57:49,040
abomination.
So homosexuality, you know,

1779
01:57:49,080 --> 01:57:51,920
that's not, that's not till
Leviticus and yet Sodom and

1780
01:57:51,920 --> 01:57:54,840
Gomorrah are destroyed.
Right, Right.

1781
01:57:54,840 --> 01:58:00,840
Yeah, Yep.
So, OK, here's another

1782
01:58:00,840 --> 01:58:06,720
interesting 1 Deuteronomy 25.
If brothers reside together and

1783
01:58:06,720 --> 01:58:10,320
one of them dies childless, the
dead man's wife shall not marry

1784
01:58:10,320 --> 01:58:11,920
an outsider.
Her husband's brother must come

1785
01:58:11,920 --> 01:58:16,520
to her, taking her as his wife
in a Leverett marriage.

1786
01:58:17,000 --> 01:58:20,400
The first born son of whom she
bears will then perpetuate the

1787
01:58:20,400 --> 01:58:24,040
name of the dead brother so that
his name will not be obliterated

1788
01:58:24,040 --> 01:58:27,040
from Israel.
That's Deuteronomy 25, five and

1789
01:58:27,040 --> 01:58:28,920
six.
So that's that.

1790
01:58:28,920 --> 01:58:31,840
You know, the law of Leverett
marriage, That's definitely law

1791
01:58:31,840 --> 01:58:36,080
of Moses thing, right?
And yet, before Moses, we have

1792
01:58:36,200 --> 01:58:39,760
this interesting story about
Judah and Tamar.

1793
01:58:40,320 --> 01:58:45,200
Right.
So Tamar Judah marries Tamar to

1794
01:58:45,240 --> 01:58:49,760
his oldest son ER, who dies
after that his next oldest son

1795
01:58:49,840 --> 01:58:56,840
Onan is married to her right.
He dies and then the next the

1796
01:58:56,840 --> 01:59:05,960
next brother Sheila is or Sheila
is promised, but but Judah kind

1797
01:59:05,960 --> 01:59:08,320
of withholds him because he's
kind of nervous that all his

1798
01:59:08,320 --> 01:59:12,320
sons keep dying.
But anyway, but regardless of

1799
01:59:12,320 --> 01:59:16,440
the the point I'm bringing up
here is that what what Judah is

1800
01:59:16,440 --> 01:59:23,600
practicing centuries, centuries
before Sinai is the Leverett Law

1801
01:59:23,600 --> 01:59:26,720
of.
Marriage absolutely so century

1802
01:59:26,720 --> 01:59:30,800
in that they have some sort of
knowledge about this right and

1803
01:59:30,840 --> 01:59:34,360
and and like here's the
interesting thing this isn't

1804
01:59:34,360 --> 01:59:38,880
just 10 commandments stuff right
this is going deeper than that

1805
01:59:38,880 --> 01:59:45,200
even right things that we would
we shouldn't expect to see if we

1806
01:59:45,200 --> 01:59:48,640
have the idea that the law of
Moses is brand new when Moses

1807
01:59:48,640 --> 01:59:53,440
brings down the law that's.
Right, OK, that's right.

1808
01:59:53,760 --> 01:59:58,160
So we have, you know, the death
penalty for murder.

1809
01:59:58,160 --> 02:00:00,400
We we kind of mentioned that,
but but.

1810
02:00:00,600 --> 02:00:04,200
That was like specifically
mentioned to to Noah.

1811
02:00:04,640 --> 02:00:06,720
Right.
OK, circumcision.

1812
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:11,880
Or was, you know, explicitly,
explicitly given to Abraham.

1813
02:00:12,680 --> 02:00:15,320
We have clean and unclean
animals explicitly mentioned,

1814
02:00:16,040 --> 02:00:18,160
you know, that's Leviticus 11
and Deuteronomy 14.

1815
02:00:18,160 --> 02:00:21,840
But we have that explicitly
mentioned in the story of Noah.

1816
02:00:22,400 --> 02:00:25,120
Right.
Right, he takes, he takes extra

1817
02:00:25,120 --> 02:00:27,880
pairs of clean animals, right?
Because he's going to eat some

1818
02:00:27,880 --> 02:00:29,680
of them and he's going to
sacrifice some of them.

1819
02:00:29,920 --> 02:00:35,080
So you need extras.
OK Theft.

1820
02:00:37,000 --> 02:00:40,760
Theft is mentioned like they
they have an understanding of

1821
02:00:40,760 --> 02:00:46,440
property rights.
OK, You know, this is in the in

1822
02:00:46,440 --> 02:00:50,000
the story of again, of Jacob.
And Laban says this is Genesis

1823
02:00:50,000 --> 02:00:51,880
30.
So shall my righteousness answer

1824
02:00:51,880 --> 02:00:56,000
for me in time to come, when it
shall come for my hire before

1825
02:00:56,400 --> 02:00:58,840
thy face, everyone that is not
speckled and spotted among the

1826
02:00:58,840 --> 02:01:01,600
goats, and brown among the
sheep, that should be counted

1827
02:01:01,600 --> 02:01:05,120
stolen with me.
So they got a deal.

1828
02:01:05,120 --> 02:01:07,680
And he knows.
They know what property means.

1829
02:01:07,680 --> 02:01:09,680
You know to own private
property.

1830
02:01:09,720 --> 02:01:11,200
So.
Right.

1831
02:01:12,200 --> 02:01:14,520
And there's other there's other
examples of all these things.

1832
02:01:15,440 --> 02:01:21,360
Kidnapping, OK, kidnapping is
specifically forbidden.

1833
02:01:21,360 --> 02:01:24,360
Deuteronomy 24, a man is found
to have kidnapped.

1834
02:01:25,600 --> 02:01:27,520
Let's see this all you want to
Exodus.

1835
02:01:27,520 --> 02:01:30,320
He kidnaps a man, whether he has
sold him or is still holding

1836
02:01:30,320 --> 02:01:34,640
him, shall be put to death.
That's in Exodus 2116.

1837
02:01:36,360 --> 02:01:44,000
But you know, Joseph's brothers,
they kidnap him and sell him as

1838
02:01:44,000 --> 02:01:49,440
a slave, OK, And now there's a
death penalty attached to that.

1839
02:01:49,440 --> 02:01:53,800
Now, I should say that a lot of
the the very harsh penalties in

1840
02:01:53,800 --> 02:01:58,720
the in the law of Moses, those
are should not be understood as

1841
02:01:58,720 --> 02:02:02,680
automatic, but those are like
maximum sentences, right?

1842
02:02:02,680 --> 02:02:05,000
Very similar to our own legal
system, right?

1843
02:02:05,000 --> 02:02:09,360
We have penalties up to a
certain number of years or up to

1844
02:02:09,360 --> 02:02:15,160
the death penalty anyway.
So but when when Joseph reveals

1845
02:02:15,160 --> 02:02:26,120
himself in Egypt, he he forgives
the trespass, but it says that

1846
02:02:26,120 --> 02:02:27,800
they trespass, says that they
broke a law.

1847
02:02:29,560 --> 02:02:31,320
Oh yeah, it does.
You're right.

1848
02:02:32,520 --> 02:02:35,000
Yeah.
Yeah, again.

1849
02:02:35,000 --> 02:02:40,800
Well before Moses.
OK, here's another example.

1850
02:02:41,560 --> 02:02:44,960
Ritual purity.
You know when you know when a

1851
02:02:44,960 --> 02:02:48,760
woman is on her period or even
if a man has some kind of sore

1852
02:02:48,760 --> 02:02:52,080
that keeps bleeding or, or
something like that, Then

1853
02:02:52,080 --> 02:02:58,320
there's there's ritual impurity
that is imparted to the person

1854
02:02:58,320 --> 02:03:03,480
until that's cleared up.
So again, centuries before, like

1855
02:03:03,520 --> 02:03:07,000
Rachel, like Rachel steals
layman's idols, right, Right.

1856
02:03:08,000 --> 02:03:10,600
You remember that?
And she layman comes looking for

1857
02:03:10,600 --> 02:03:12,720
them and she hides them.
Right you.

1858
02:03:13,320 --> 02:03:16,920
Remember what she does, she
there, she's in her tent and she

1859
02:03:16,920 --> 02:03:20,200
like puts them underneath her in
like this chest or whatever and

1860
02:03:20,200 --> 02:03:25,600
like sits on the chest and, and
when Laban comes in to search

1861
02:03:25,640 --> 02:03:30,960
the tents, she tells him that
she's she's on her period and

1862
02:03:31,040 --> 02:03:34,440
can't move.
And he's like, well, OK, you

1863
02:03:34,440 --> 02:03:38,400
know I won't touch you.
And why is and why is that like

1864
02:03:38,480 --> 02:03:41,600
a defense is because they are
sensitive to the.

1865
02:03:42,320 --> 02:03:46,040
Purity, these things.
Yeah, yeah, better security

1866
02:03:46,040 --> 02:03:51,760
laws.
OK, let's see Leviticus 19 you

1867
02:03:51,760 --> 02:03:59,040
shall do no unrighteousness in
judgment in meat yard, in weight

1868
02:03:59,040 --> 02:04:01,800
or in measure.
Just balances, just weights and

1869
02:04:01,800 --> 02:04:04,440
a just ephah.
Adjust him shall he have.

1870
02:04:04,440 --> 02:04:06,400
I am the Lord your God, which
brought you out of the land of

1871
02:04:06,400 --> 02:04:09,640
Egypt.
So just weights and measures,

1872
02:04:09,760 --> 02:04:11,160
right.
This is something every society

1873
02:04:11,160 --> 02:04:14,320
needs to have.
We have government agencies that

1874
02:04:14,560 --> 02:04:18,360
whose job is to make sure that
those things are regulated.

1875
02:04:18,680 --> 02:04:25,280
So in Job, Job chapter 31 says
if I have walked with vanity or

1876
02:04:25,320 --> 02:04:29,920
my foot has hastened to deceit,
let me be weighed in a just

1877
02:04:29,920 --> 02:04:34,600
balance or in an even balance
that God may know mind

1878
02:04:34,600 --> 02:04:37,400
integrity.
So he's talking about just

1879
02:04:37,400 --> 02:04:41,080
weights and measures.
OK, coveting, right?

1880
02:04:41,080 --> 02:04:43,400
This is the 10th commandment,
thou shall not covet.

1881
02:04:44,040 --> 02:04:47,360
But we have examples of this
before coveting, even coveting,

1882
02:04:47,360 --> 02:04:48,840
which is like a sin of your
mind.

1883
02:04:48,840 --> 02:04:51,080
It's not even it's not even
something that you do with your

1884
02:04:51,080 --> 02:04:52,960
hands or your body necessarily,
right?

1885
02:04:52,960 --> 02:04:56,640
Just a sin of your mind.
But Cain, Cain's the first one.

1886
02:04:56,960 --> 02:04:59,520
He covets Abel's flocks.
He's jealous.

1887
02:05:00,520 --> 02:05:04,320
Satan says, you know, if you
entering this agreement with me,

1888
02:05:04,320 --> 02:05:07,760
you can have you can have that
stuff right.

1889
02:05:07,760 --> 02:05:09,800
But but it starts with coveting.
OK.

1890
02:05:09,960 --> 02:05:15,640
And Job also says, if my step
has turned out of the way and my

1891
02:05:15,640 --> 02:05:20,320
heart walked after my eyes, and
if any blot has cleaved to my

1892
02:05:20,320 --> 02:05:23,200
hands, then let me.
Let me sow in another eat, let

1893
02:05:23,200 --> 02:05:26,240
my offspring be rooted out.
If my heart has been deceived by

1894
02:05:26,240 --> 02:05:28,520
a woman.
If I have laid weight at my

1895
02:05:28,520 --> 02:05:31,400
neighbor's door, like looking
for my neighbor's wife.

1896
02:05:32,200 --> 02:05:36,760
That.
OK, so and he says this is a

1897
02:05:36,760 --> 02:05:39,360
heinous crime and iniquity.
He was punished by the judges,

1898
02:05:41,600 --> 02:05:46,000
OK, widows and orphans, OK,
Exodus says.

1899
02:05:46,000 --> 02:05:50,000
You do not oppress the stranger,
do not oppress widows and the

1900
02:05:50,000 --> 02:05:51,800
fatherless right take care of
them.

1901
02:05:52,960 --> 02:05:55,000
Deuteronomy says the same thing
again.

1902
02:05:55,000 --> 02:05:58,680
Job says, If I have withheld the
poor from their desire, or have

1903
02:05:58,680 --> 02:06:02,160
caused the eyes of the widow to
fail, or have eaten my morsel

1904
02:06:02,160 --> 02:06:06,320
myself alone, and the fatherless
have not eaten thereof, you

1905
02:06:06,320 --> 02:06:09,120
know, then you know.
Then let me be punished, he

1906
02:06:09,120 --> 02:06:11,560
says.
So here he is concerned about

1907
02:06:11,560 --> 02:06:15,960
the widows and the fatherless,
just like Torah says we have.

1908
02:06:17,600 --> 02:06:22,400
OK, I'm we've probably gone on
long enough, but I'll just

1909
02:06:22,400 --> 02:06:24,840
mention some other ones.
There's, there's no respect of

1910
02:06:24,840 --> 02:06:30,520
persons in judgment.
There's things about rape, about

1911
02:06:30,680 --> 02:06:33,320
the Feast of Shavuot or
Pentecost, or something about

1912
02:06:33,320 --> 02:06:36,960
priesthood, or something about
tithing idols, idol worshipping,

1913
02:06:36,960 --> 02:06:40,600
blaspheming God's name or taking
God's name in vain, eating

1914
02:06:40,600 --> 02:06:44,720
blood, covering the blood with
dust, temples dividing the land

1915
02:06:44,720 --> 02:06:46,560
by lot.
I've read some of these already

1916
02:06:46,800 --> 02:06:51,200
on the other list.
So punishment for the punishment

1917
02:06:51,200 --> 02:06:56,280
for prostitution is in the Torah
and also mentioned in the story

1918
02:06:56,280 --> 02:06:58,520
of Judah and Tamar loving your
neighbor.

1919
02:07:00,480 --> 02:07:05,160
And anyway, lots of other
things, I don't want to take a

1920
02:07:06,600 --> 02:07:10,360
lot more time, but we've already
gone for a couple hours, I

1921
02:07:10,360 --> 02:07:12,160
guess.
But anyway, there's, there's so

1922
02:07:12,160 --> 02:07:14,400
many even detail.
I will, I'm going to mention one

1923
02:07:14,400 --> 02:07:18,920
more.
So I just, I just gave a Sunday

1924
02:07:18,920 --> 02:07:22,440
lesson about this, about meat
and milk.

1925
02:07:22,800 --> 02:07:25,240
So this is a big part of a
Jewish identity, right?

1926
02:07:25,240 --> 02:07:27,360
A lot of people think that it's
a lot of people think that it's

1927
02:07:27,360 --> 02:07:32,480
part of the Torah because the
Torah repeats 3 times this

1928
02:07:32,480 --> 02:07:34,560
phrase Thou shalt not boil a
kid.

1929
02:07:35,240 --> 02:07:38,160
Or, you know, the King James
says thou shalt not seed a kid

1930
02:07:38,160 --> 02:07:39,800
in his mother's milk.
Right.

1931
02:07:40,960 --> 02:07:44,960
And there's a whole, whole
string of interpretations,

1932
02:07:45,520 --> 02:07:47,720
Talmudic interpretations that
have come from that.

1933
02:07:48,320 --> 02:07:52,600
But there's an interesting event
that happens in Abraham's life

1934
02:07:52,600 --> 02:07:55,840
where the three men, 3 angels
come and visit him.

1935
02:07:56,240 --> 02:07:59,680
And immediately Abraham, you
know, says stay, let me wash

1936
02:07:59,680 --> 02:08:04,360
your feet, have a meal.
He tells Soraya to make some

1937
02:08:04,840 --> 02:08:09,160
unleavened cakes and bread.
He goes and gets a calf, gives

1938
02:08:09,160 --> 02:08:12,640
it to one of his young men, says
hurry up and fix this calf.

1939
02:08:12,880 --> 02:08:16,680
And Abram goes and gets milk and
butter and like gives him this

1940
02:08:16,680 --> 02:08:21,480
meal, bread, milk and butter and
meat all together.

1941
02:08:22,280 --> 02:08:24,960
OK.
And so the so the question is.

1942
02:08:30,640 --> 02:08:33,200
Well, a lot of times.
So like the again, like the

1943
02:08:33,200 --> 02:08:37,480
standard, maybe Christian or
even Mormon interpretation is

1944
02:08:37,560 --> 02:08:41,480
well, yeah, Abram did that and
the angels did that too because

1945
02:08:41,480 --> 02:08:43,800
the angels don't keep the law
because the law of Moses,

1946
02:08:43,800 --> 02:08:47,080
because it's all done away and
just like temporary and or, or

1947
02:08:47,080 --> 02:08:50,240
maybe you know, the law wasn't
given yet or something like

1948
02:08:50,240 --> 02:08:56,120
that.
But my interpretation is is not

1949
02:08:56,120 --> 02:09:01,440
that Abram didn't keep the law
because the Lord says that he

1950
02:09:01,920 --> 02:09:06,280
kept it.
My interpretation is that he

1951
02:09:06,280 --> 02:09:08,720
kept the law, but this
prohibition on eating

1952
02:09:08,720 --> 02:09:12,320
cheeseburger is actually not the
commandment is not part of the

1953
02:09:12,320 --> 02:09:14,720
law.
And so therefore the angels and

1954
02:09:14,720 --> 02:09:18,640
Abraham didn't see a need to
keep it.

1955
02:09:19,080 --> 02:09:21,440
So what's, So what, what do we
do with them?

1956
02:09:22,160 --> 02:09:24,160
Now I know there's there's
there's interesting

1957
02:09:24,160 --> 02:09:27,520
interpretations, like symbolic
interpretations of this about

1958
02:09:28,160 --> 02:09:31,640
cruelty, you know, and you're
being kind to animals and you're

1959
02:09:31,640 --> 02:09:34,480
not mixing life and death and
things like that.

1960
02:09:34,480 --> 02:09:37,440
And I think those are like
useful things to keep in mind.

1961
02:09:38,480 --> 02:09:40,560
But I don't think that the
commandment is thou shalt not

1962
02:09:40,560 --> 02:09:43,200
have cheeseburgers.
Thank you.

1963
02:09:45,360 --> 02:09:50,360
So rest that he is Dave, if it
was good enough for Abraham and

1964
02:09:50,360 --> 02:09:52,200
the angels.
Good enough for me.

1965
02:09:52,320 --> 02:09:53,440
Good.
Enough for you?

1966
02:09:53,520 --> 02:09:54,440
Yeah.
Good enough for me.

1967
02:09:55,000 --> 02:09:57,920
So I'll say, I'll just say very
briefly, there's a lot more that

1968
02:09:57,920 --> 02:10:04,440
can be said here.
But that word boil is a bashal,

1969
02:10:04,440 --> 02:10:06,720
if I remember right.
But it's, it is used

1970
02:10:06,720 --> 02:10:11,000
idiomatically to mean, it does
mean to like, it means to finish

1971
02:10:11,000 --> 02:10:15,240
cooking by boiling, but it also
means to like ripen or to like

1972
02:10:15,920 --> 02:10:19,000
grow to completion.
And it is.

1973
02:10:19,640 --> 02:10:23,880
And that word is used sometimes
to talk about like ripe grain or

1974
02:10:23,880 --> 02:10:31,160
ripe grapes, like so like
literally the Scripture, like it

1975
02:10:31,200 --> 02:10:34,480
if you're reading in Hebrew
would say the grapes have are

1976
02:10:34,480 --> 02:10:39,920
finished boiling.
OK, which obviously the grapes

1977
02:10:39,920 --> 02:10:41,400
have not been boiling on the
vine.

1978
02:10:41,520 --> 02:10:44,400
What it means is that they're
done, they're ripe.

1979
02:10:45,000 --> 02:10:52,480
So this this phrase do not boil
a kid means do not ripen the kid

1980
02:10:52,480 --> 02:10:56,960
or like grow it to adulthood in
its mother's milk because the

1981
02:10:56,960 --> 02:10:59,760
commandment is it's talking
about firstlings.

1982
02:11:00,040 --> 02:11:03,120
The commandment is that if you
have a first thing that you're

1983
02:11:03,120 --> 02:11:05,640
supposed to offer it on the like
on the 8th day.

1984
02:11:06,800 --> 02:11:11,840
And so the this phrase, it's
actually connected if in the

1985
02:11:11,840 --> 02:11:15,360
scriptures, in the Torah, it's
connected to the first fruits

1986
02:11:15,360 --> 02:11:18,640
offerings.
And it says in some places it

1987
02:11:18,640 --> 02:11:22,560
says do not delay, you know, do
not be slothful in keeping the

1988
02:11:22,560 --> 02:11:24,800
commandments.
Do not delay to bring the

1989
02:11:24,800 --> 02:11:30,200
offering that God has required.
And then idiomatically, do not

1990
02:11:30,280 --> 02:11:31,920
boil the kid in his mother's
milk.

1991
02:11:31,920 --> 02:11:34,720
In other words, don't, don't let
that animal that you're supposed

1992
02:11:34,800 --> 02:11:38,040
to offer on the 8th day grow to
adulthood because who knows what

1993
02:11:38,040 --> 02:11:39,680
might happen?
The animal that you were going

1994
02:11:39,680 --> 02:11:43,880
to offer might get sick or might
get injured or, or you, it might

1995
02:11:43,880 --> 02:11:46,880
grow up and then, and then you
kind of start second guessing

1996
02:11:46,880 --> 02:11:49,600
whether you want to offer it
because that's a pretty good

1997
02:11:49,600 --> 02:11:52,120
looking sheep.
Maybe I want to eat that or oh,

1998
02:11:52,120 --> 02:11:54,280
look at that.
It's, it's got wool on it now

1999
02:11:54,600 --> 02:11:57,440
because I left it so long.
I, I better, I might as well

2000
02:11:57,440 --> 02:12:00,920
shear it and get some wool from
this animal that I was supposed

2001
02:12:00,920 --> 02:12:03,840
to offer to the Lord or whatever
you, you can, you can think of.

2002
02:12:04,040 --> 02:12:06,360
And this has application beyond
that.

2003
02:12:06,360 --> 02:12:09,480
Like it's, it's just talking
about sloth in general.

2004
02:12:10,680 --> 02:12:13,640
Like when, when God, when God
commands something, do it.

2005
02:12:13,640 --> 02:12:16,080
Like that's what they, that's
what the idiom is, is saying in

2006
02:12:16,080 --> 02:12:20,040
my opinion, and not saying that
you need to avoid cheeseburgers.

2007
02:12:20,120 --> 02:12:25,560
Therefore, this story about
Abraham and the angels, I

2008
02:12:25,560 --> 02:12:28,280
believe is actually in keeping
with the Torah rather than than.

2009
02:12:29,320 --> 02:12:32,760
An exception to the rule.
Rather than an exception, yeah,

2010
02:12:32,760 --> 02:12:36,320
saying Abram didn't keep it or
they hadn't received the law, or

2011
02:12:36,600 --> 02:12:39,040
the law is not eternal or some
other explanation.

2012
02:12:39,200 --> 02:12:41,440
There are other, there are other
like really crazy explanations

2013
02:12:41,440 --> 02:12:44,080
too.
Like some of the rabbis will

2014
02:12:44,080 --> 02:12:47,640
say, well, Abram gave him this
meal, but he stood there and

2015
02:12:47,640 --> 02:12:50,840
made sure that they kept the
rules and like, and they they

2016
02:12:50,840 --> 02:12:53,440
had the milk and then he made
that he made them wait for an

2017
02:12:53,440 --> 02:12:55,080
hour before he let them eat the
meat.

2018
02:12:57,400 --> 02:13:00,360
There even some explanations
where they say Abram like

2019
02:13:00,920 --> 02:13:05,560
magically conjured up a fake
calf that wasn't really neat,

2020
02:13:05,640 --> 02:13:09,080
but it's like a magical creation
of Abraham so that it didn't

2021
02:13:09,080 --> 02:13:11,560
fall under this prohibition.
Anyway, There's, there's,

2022
02:13:11,680 --> 02:13:17,480
there's some imaginative
explanations entertaining, but

2023
02:13:17,480 --> 02:13:21,360
I, I just think it's an idiom
about not delaying to give what

2024
02:13:21,360 --> 02:13:27,200
the Lord requires.
So OK, that's OK.

2025
02:13:27,200 --> 02:13:29,240
We could go more, but that's
probably about all I got so.

2026
02:13:29,240 --> 02:13:32,480
OK, no, that's good.
I, I, I want to wrap, wrap up

2027
02:13:32,480 --> 02:13:34,400
with this and I want to ask you
this question.

2028
02:13:37,520 --> 02:13:39,920
We, we talked about all this,
right?

2029
02:13:39,920 --> 02:13:41,960
And this is fascinating stuff,
right?

2030
02:13:42,400 --> 02:13:44,480
I love talking about the Old
Testament.

2031
02:13:44,640 --> 02:13:48,840
I love making these connections.
But what should be the take away

2032
02:13:48,840 --> 02:13:52,320
here, right?
What is it we should take away

2033
02:13:52,320 --> 02:13:56,920
from knowing that the Law of
Moses, as we refer to it,

2034
02:13:57,520 --> 02:14:02,400
actually came well before Moses?
Well, the take away the take

2035
02:14:02,400 --> 02:14:08,320
away from me the part that I
love about that idea is that

2036
02:14:09,200 --> 02:14:16,440
that my God truly his ways and
his words are eternal and are

2037
02:14:16,480 --> 02:14:19,880
like in that revelation to John
Taylor, like I command something

2038
02:14:19,880 --> 02:14:22,680
and do I do a you know, it is
eternal.

2039
02:14:22,680 --> 02:14:27,840
Do I is it done away Now?
You know, apostasy occurs and,

2040
02:14:28,560 --> 02:14:32,720
and I know that, you know, the
Melchizedek priesthood and, you

2041
02:14:32,720 --> 02:14:36,960
know, the portions of the the
plan were, were kept back from,

2042
02:14:37,520 --> 02:14:39,640
have been kept back from people
from time to time.

2043
02:14:40,320 --> 02:14:43,600
And I don't, you know, I don't
deny that, but it's not because

2044
02:14:43,600 --> 02:14:47,040
God changed his mind.
Like it's not because it's not

2045
02:14:47,040 --> 02:14:50,440
because we worship Zeus or
Jupiter or Marduk or something

2046
02:14:51,000 --> 02:14:54,480
where they change their minds
and come up with different plans

2047
02:14:54,480 --> 02:14:56,720
or they're just doing things on
the fly and they're like, well,

2048
02:14:56,720 --> 02:14:59,320
from from dispensation to
dispensation, we're going to

2049
02:15:00,200 --> 02:15:05,240
switch things up.
I yeah, I don't believe that.

2050
02:15:05,520 --> 02:15:10,680
So for me it's a it's a matter
of faith and I and I find it

2051
02:15:10,840 --> 02:15:16,240
very faith promoting and and
comforting to know that God just

2052
02:15:16,240 --> 02:15:18,480
means what he says.
He says these things are

2053
02:15:18,880 --> 02:15:23,680
forever.
And now I will say also as a

2054
02:15:23,680 --> 02:15:29,440
take away that like Joseph Smith
in, you know, we started off

2055
02:15:29,440 --> 02:15:32,560
with that, that quotation from,
well, there's a paraphrase from

2056
02:15:32,560 --> 02:15:36,240
Joseph Smith about animal
sacrifice being restored and

2057
02:15:36,240 --> 02:15:40,440
also about everything that was
before Moses being restored, but

2058
02:15:40,440 --> 02:15:42,880
not, not all of the law of
Moses, you know, which I think

2059
02:15:42,880 --> 02:15:47,120
is a lot of traditions.
But Joseph Smith didn't, didn't

2060
02:15:47,120 --> 02:15:51,200
really start animal sacrifice,
at least not in, in Mass.

2061
02:15:52,040 --> 02:15:55,040
You know, there's, there's
whispers about a few things

2062
02:15:55,040 --> 02:16:00,440
being done here and there, but
it, animal sacrifice has not

2063
02:16:00,520 --> 02:16:03,160
been a mainstream part of the
restoration.

2064
02:16:03,640 --> 02:16:06,520
And Joseph Smith says Joseph
said that.

2065
02:16:07,400 --> 02:16:09,640
Well, the reason is we don't
have a proper place.

2066
02:16:12,040 --> 02:16:14,320
And you know, it's, it's, we're
kind of in the same position as

2067
02:16:14,320 --> 02:16:17,720
the Jews at this point.
They also totally believe, they

2068
02:16:17,720 --> 02:16:20,480
believe in animal sacrifice, but
they don't do it.

2069
02:16:20,960 --> 02:16:22,440
And why not?
Well, that's because they don't

2070
02:16:22,440 --> 02:16:25,480
have a temple, but they're
planning on building 1.

2071
02:16:27,320 --> 02:16:30,720
And you know, Joseph Smith said
the same says when, when the

2072
02:16:30,720 --> 02:16:35,840
temple's built and he was, he
was talking, I believe about the

2073
02:16:36,200 --> 02:16:40,200
temple complex in Independence.
When, when that temple complex

2074
02:16:40,200 --> 02:16:44,160
is built, then then animal
sacrifices will resume like as

2075
02:16:44,160 --> 02:16:51,559
part of this dispensation.
So, so I just want to make that

2076
02:16:51,559 --> 02:16:54,360
clear that even though there,
there are some, some laws that

2077
02:16:54,680 --> 02:16:58,080
we cannot keep, that doesn't
mean that God has changed his

2078
02:16:58,080 --> 02:17:00,040
mind.
But we just find ourselves in,

2079
02:17:02,480 --> 02:17:05,639
in kind of an exiled situation.
And we're like the, the Jews who

2080
02:17:05,639 --> 02:17:08,480
are exiled in Babylon, like we
are, we are living in Babylon.

2081
02:17:08,760 --> 02:17:13,200
And so, so we do the best we
can, but God has not changed.

2082
02:17:14,160 --> 02:17:17,360
Our circumstances may have
changed, but that doesn't mean

2083
02:17:17,360 --> 02:17:18,680
that the commandments have
changed.

2084
02:17:19,920 --> 02:17:24,240
And yeah, and I love that.
I love believing in a God that

2085
02:17:24,280 --> 02:17:27,680
who doesn't change and whose
plans don't change and who is

2086
02:17:27,680 --> 02:17:29,840
the same from everlasting to
everlasting.

2087
02:17:30,320 --> 02:17:33,400
So that's that's the take away
for me.

2088
02:17:34,160 --> 02:17:41,799
I I would agree, you know, I
expect God to deal justly with

2089
02:17:41,799 --> 02:17:47,200
all his children, right?
And as I alluded to before, if

2090
02:17:47,320 --> 02:17:51,680
if he favors one generation over
another, where does that leave

2091
02:17:51,680 --> 02:17:55,080
us?
Yeah, that's, that's no good.

2092
02:17:55,200 --> 02:17:57,879
That's that's no good.
That's a faith.

2093
02:17:57,879 --> 02:18:00,000
That's a faithless.
Guy yes, exactly.

2094
02:18:02,879 --> 02:18:06,879
I'll I'll use an example here
that I, I work with every day.

2095
02:18:07,200 --> 02:18:13,520
Latitudes and departures, right?
And so we'll take an angle in a

2096
02:18:13,520 --> 02:18:19,920
distance right.
And let's say you mean to kind

2097
02:18:19,920 --> 02:18:26,280
of turn a 90�� angle, right?
But let's say you turn 89

2098
02:18:26,280 --> 02:18:32,240
degrees, 59 minutes, 59 seconds
instead of 90��.

2099
02:18:33,440 --> 02:18:38,440
You're not going to see a
difference in a foot, right?

2100
02:18:39,240 --> 02:18:43,080
You're not going to see a
distance a difference in 100

2101
02:18:43,080 --> 02:18:44,480
feet.
Yeah.

2102
02:18:44,840 --> 02:18:47,920
You may not even see much
difference in 1000 feet, but you

2103
02:18:47,920 --> 02:18:50,360
get out a mile.
Well, now you're starting to

2104
02:18:50,360 --> 02:18:57,680
creep up there, right?
And so if God changes, then that

2105
02:18:57,680 --> 02:19:02,600
leaves us in a place where we
can't really reach our

2106
02:19:02,600 --> 02:19:07,080
destination, right?
We're going to miss where it is

2107
02:19:07,080 --> 02:19:10,680
we're trying to go.
And so the fact that God is

2108
02:19:10,680 --> 02:19:16,200
fixed, immovable, the North
Star, you can look and you can

2109
02:19:16,200 --> 02:19:18,879
always find your bearings again,
right?

2110
02:19:18,879 --> 02:19:21,719
You can always get back on the
path.

2111
02:19:22,480 --> 02:19:26,799
But if that target's moving,
good luck, right, because you

2112
02:19:26,799 --> 02:19:30,920
will never be able to come up
with a fixed location, right?

2113
02:19:30,920 --> 02:19:35,680
And, and, and one of the things
I love about the restored gospel

2114
02:19:35,959 --> 02:19:39,879
is that many of its doctrine
gives us proximity to deity.

2115
02:19:40,520 --> 02:19:44,040
It tells us here is deity, here
is us.

2116
02:19:44,879 --> 02:19:49,160
I can fix my sight here and get
to where it is God wants me to

2117
02:19:49,160 --> 02:19:52,200
go.
And without that knowledge,

2118
02:19:52,200 --> 02:19:57,560
without that surety, we're we're
flapping in the wind, right?

2119
02:19:58,680 --> 02:20:00,680
Maybe we get close, maybe we
don't.

2120
02:20:01,320 --> 02:20:06,400
But unless it's fixed, we, we,
we don't stand much of a chance

2121
02:20:06,400 --> 02:20:08,200
of getting exactly where we want
to go.

2122
02:20:08,960 --> 02:20:12,240
And we know as Mormons from
temple theology and and the

2123
02:20:12,240 --> 02:20:17,920
temple liturgy.
That he expects exactness and

2124
02:20:18,120 --> 02:20:21,000
and honor in these things?
Yeah.

2125
02:20:21,240 --> 02:20:24,520
And if that's what he requires,
you can bet that's what he

2126
02:20:24,520 --> 02:20:25,920
abides.
It's eternal law.

2127
02:20:25,920 --> 02:20:29,360
It's.
An undeviating course, yeah.

2128
02:20:29,400 --> 02:20:33,000
Yep, absolutely.
So dude.

2129
02:20:33,160 --> 02:20:37,360
Good stuff as always man.
Yeah, we'll have to.

2130
02:20:38,840 --> 02:20:39,960
We'll have to do this again
soon.

2131
02:20:39,960 --> 02:20:42,280
I have some other things I'd
like to talk to you about so.

2132
02:20:42,840 --> 02:20:46,160
Yeah, absolutely.
And you get back up here, down

2133
02:20:46,160 --> 02:20:48,120
back over here to Missouri,
we're going to have to smoke

2134
02:20:48,120 --> 02:20:50,480
brisket.
I'm just saying that's that's

2135
02:20:50,480 --> 02:20:54,040
par for the course.
I have, I have yet to throw a

2136
02:20:54,040 --> 02:20:55,760
major party.
So we're going to have to do

2137
02:20:55,760 --> 02:20:59,200
that soon, I think.
I think Spring it's going to,

2138
02:20:59,240 --> 02:21:03,480
it's going to be a deal so.
You have you have dairy with

2139
02:21:03,480 --> 02:21:07,320
that.
I mean, yeah, I mean, there's

2140
02:21:07,320 --> 02:21:09,000
going to be cheese on a salad
somewhere.

2141
02:21:09,040 --> 02:21:10,080
Yeah, there'll be cheese or
something.

2142
02:21:10,080 --> 02:21:12,280
I mean if.
If you want to go the way of

2143
02:21:12,280 --> 02:21:15,600
cane and OfferUp, you know,
fruits and vegetables, that's

2144
02:21:15,600 --> 02:21:18,520
your choice.
But I prefer to stick to the law

2145
02:21:18,520 --> 02:21:22,240
and just with the meat.
Yeah, but that's just so.

2146
02:21:22,240 --> 02:21:23,560
That's good.
Awesome.

2147
02:21:24,320 --> 02:21:26,120
All right, dude.
Well, I appreciate it.

2148
02:21:27,000 --> 02:21:28,280
Yeah.
All right.

2149
02:21:28,280 --> 02:21:29,920
Thanks.
We'll see you again later.

2150
02:21:29,920 --> 02:21:30,640
Yep.
Absolutely.

2151
02:21:30,640 --> 02:21:31,760
Stick around.
Just a few minutes.

2152
02:21:31,880 --> 02:21:33,040
All right.
Bye everybody.

2153
02:22:03,640 --> 02:22:03,720
The.