Episode #106: Examining The One Man Doctrine & The Second Anointing W/Sean Anderson

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Today on the podcast we're going
to be talking about some pretty

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heady stuff, so if you haven't
already, you might want to sign

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up for the $6 Patreon option so
you can get the transcript and

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hit all the scriptural
references here on this episode.

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I have Sean Anderson on the
podcast to talk about the One

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Man Doctrine.
We cover what it is, the history

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of it in Mormonism, where the
idea sprouts from and all its

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implications.
We then take a deep dive into

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scripture and history, and what
we find is that scripture might

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be saying something completely
different than what many of us

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had supposed.
Because this conversation

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touches so heavily on the ideas
of keys and authority, we are

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forced to take a pretty
significant dive into the second

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anointing and the principles of
priesthood keys and presiding.

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Get ready for a thought
provoking episode of the Mormon

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Renegade Podcast.
Look, it's no secret that our

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society has become much more
crude and coarse.

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To become and raise men and
women of virtue and character is

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a Herculean task.
To help with this, I've recently

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wrote and published a book.
Now, back in the 1700s,

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Washington had a book called
Rules of Civility and Decent

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Behavior and Company and
Conversation.

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It was a book with 110 rules
that talked about how to conduct

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yourself like a civilized person
in society, something that

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today's society is sorely
lacking.

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What I did is I went back
through the book and I

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reinterpreted his original
sayings for the 21st century.

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So the book is laid out in a way
in which you see Washington's

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original rule.
Right below that is my

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explanation for the 21st
century, and below that you'll

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find two or three examples of
where to use this in the real

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world.
Now, to go along with this,

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there's a workbook that helps
parents teach these principles

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and practices to their kids.
To find the book, go to

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mormonrenegade.com.
Go to the bottom of the page,

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search out the blog post, and
order your copy today.

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I can bear personal testimony
from personal experience that

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this is an invaluable tool to
help you raise men and women of

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virtue and character.
OK, just a couple of quick

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announcements here.
If you're looking for a place to

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attend sacrament meeting and
don't know where to go, I want

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you to reach out to me.
Me and others stand ready to

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help you find a spiritual home,
whether that's a new church, a

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gathering spot of independence,
OR even if you just need a soft

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place to land for a time to
learn how to have sacrament

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meeting in your own home.
Myself and others stand ready to

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help you find that place.
All you got to do is just drop

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me a line at
mormonrenegade@gmail.com and

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we'll quickly reach out to you
to help you find the place you

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want and need to be next.
I have felt for a while now that

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the sisters haven't had a good
place to go to have their

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questions answered without a
bunch of dudes creeping around

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to fill this need.
My wife Tanya has set up a

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Facebook group just for women to
talk about questions about

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fundamentalism.
The name of that group is Mormon

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Fundamentalism for Women.
Now, just a warning, if you're a

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dude thinking about trying to
jump on this site, I'm going to

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give this to you in my best Liam
Neeson impression.

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I have a certain set of skills
and I'll find you and I will

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publicly mock you endlessly
without mercy for many, many

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weeks.
So whether you're a

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fundamentalist woman seeking
sisterhood or a woman

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investigating fundamentalism,
this place is for you.

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Again, the name of that Facebook
group is Mormon Fundamentalism

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for Women.
You're listening to the Moreland

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Renegade podcast.
Sean, my man.

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How you doing, dude?
Pretty good.

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Good.
Good.

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How far, how how far do you have
to drive this morning?

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I was just about, it was about
35 minutes or so.

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Well, thanks for doing that.
I appreciate it.

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I didn't realize it was that far
out for you.

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So, so, well, if I could have
gone to Justin's, that would

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have only been like, you know, 3
minutes, but right, he's out of

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town, so I couldn't use that
facility.

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Yeah.
No, I get it.

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So I've had you on before, but I
had you on with Michael Ness and

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we didn't have a a chance to
kind of go over your story a

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little bit.
So I want to do that first.

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Now, were you raised a
fundamentalist?

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No.
No.

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Were you always, were you
mainstream LDS or or how?

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How did you come to be a
fundamentalist?

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That's that's I think we did go
over it in the last time we

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spoke.
But I'll give you a quick

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rundown.
Yeah.

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And I was my dad was, you know,
came from LDS stock.

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And so naturally when I was when
I was 10 years old, I was

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baptized in in the mainstream
church as was everybody in my

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family.
You know that my my mother was a

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widow with three daughters and
my dad was divorced and and when

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they married he, you know, she
came into the marriage with

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three daughters in tow.
And I don't think that they ever

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converted to to the church.
But the rest of us, you know, we

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naturally were grafted into the
mainstream church.

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And as far as my foray into
fundamentalism, interesting

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thing about my dad's side of the
family is that it was

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unbeknownst to me until I was
about 13 that he also came from

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fundamentalist stock.
And but that that wasn't made

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known to me until after I
started delving into fundamental

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fundamentalist principles.
And that's actually what caused

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my dad to sit down and have a
talk with me about it.

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But I was 13 at the time.
I was 13 at the time.

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I was very active in the church.
I was the only member of my

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family at the time that was
active.

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I was ordained A Deacon at the
age of 12, and around the time I

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was 13, me and another guy by
the name of David Schellenberg

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were out running around, you
know, bearing our testimonies of

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the Gospel and and where did
that got to the local Catholic

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priest.
And so he wanted to have a

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conversation with us.
David was advised by his parents

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not to go and and I didn't
really feel to even bring it up

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to my parents.
So I went and that's when I had

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a conversation with this
Catholic priest and his entire

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thing was to show me how Joseph
Smith was a false prophet.

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And in doing so he, I was saying
that Joseph taught that man may

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become God and stuff like that.
And so we had a debate about

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that and I think he felt
somewhat concerned because I was

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13 and I was already able to
debate him on that basis.

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I was quoting from Genesis, from
Psalms, from from John to make

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the case and and he it was kind
of yeah I could tell he was

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frustrated and maybe not so
frustrated in his own stance but

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the fact that that he was
dealing with a 13 year old and

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and I could present a good
argument.

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And it was shortly after that
that when I was in school my

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classmates put on my desk a
stack about that thick of anti

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Mormon literature, those little
pamphlets.

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And that's the first I really
became acquainted with

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principles, with the principles
of a plural marriage and Adam,

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God for instance.
And so I started.

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I read them at 1st and my first
inclination was to think that

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these anti Mormons just totally
lying, because none of this was

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taught when I was in church.
But the interesting thing

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happened.
It haunted me.

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I remember it wouldn't give me
any peace.

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And I remember it brought me to
it brought me into a prayer

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where I asked Father in Heaven
why I couldn't get any peace on

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this.
What was it about, what I read

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that just kept bugging me?
Well, I was impressed to read,

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to reread some of those
pamphlets and to ignore the

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commentary but just hone in on
the quotations where they quoted

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from Joseph Smith, John Taylor,
Brigham Young, and so forth.

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And it was in reading those
quotations that I got a

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testimony of those things.
And so you could say I've been a

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fundamentalist since I was 13,
but I was, you know, in the

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church at the time, and I didn't
actively seek out fundamentalist

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groups or acquaintances until I
was 2324.

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Wow, wow, dude.
You were a better young man than

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I was.
At 13, I was starting to get

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into trouble.
And at 13, you're like hanging

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out with your buddy going we
should go bear testimony.

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I mean holy cow that's good for
you.

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I I was not in that mode at 13.
So.

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So yeah, you become a
fundamentalist and this is where

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I think we'll, we'll roll roll,
unless you wanted to add more.

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No, the only thing I wanted to
add is just at one time our

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school when the teachers went on
strike.

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So we would go to school not
knowing whether there was going

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to be any classes or not,
whether class would be in

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session or not.
And one of the days when there

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wasn't, all, all of us kids just
showed up to school and there

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wasn't any class in session.
I remember one time when David

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Schellenberg and I were under a
tree reading the Book of Mormon

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to a good majority of our
classmates, and they were liking

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it.
I remember that.

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They they were digging on
Mormonism.

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Yeah, this is.
If if I'm not mistaken, this is

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when I was in.
They call it second of secondary

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school, but it's the equivalent
of 8th grade.

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OK, gotcha.
I was 13 at the time when when

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that took place.
You were just out there teaching

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under a tree.
Yeah, that's awesome.

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That's awesome.
So let me ask, Let's roll right

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in, then to to the subject at
hand, which is the one man

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doctrine.
If you're in, First off, define

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what the one man doctrine is for
for folks who may not be up to

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date about what it is.
Well, the one man doctrine in

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essence states that the keys of
the priesthood can only be

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exercised by one man at a time
on the earth.

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And they take this understanding
from section 132, verse 7, where

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and I'll go ahead and read it.
Let me see, I'm a little slow

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with this kind of stuff you
after.

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No, you're good.
You're just fine.

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You want me to read that?
Anyway, yeah, go ahead.

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OK, the parenthetical.
OK, 132.

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Seven.
I'll start right here.

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Holy, I'll just read the whole
thing so no one can accuse us of

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taking anything out of context.
How's that?

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OK.
All right.

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And verily I say unto you, that
the conditions of this law are

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these all covenants, contracts,
bonds, obligation, oaths, vows,

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performances, connections,
associations, or expectations

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that are not made and entered
into and sealed by the Holy

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Spirit of promise, of him who's
anointed both as well for time

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and for all eternity, and that
two most wholly by revelation,

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commandments through the medium
of mine anointed, whom I have

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appointed on the earth to hold
this power.

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And I have appointed unto my
servant Joseph to hold this

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power in the last days.
And there is never but one on

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the earth at a time on whom
these keys of this priesthood

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are conferred, are of no
efficacy, virtue, or force in

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and after the resurrection from
the dead.

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For all contracts that are not
made unto this end have an end

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when men are dead.
Yeah, that's it.

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But anyway, based off of that,
what most people in Mormonism

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take from that is that there's
only one guy who can do this and

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they'll they'll say that he can
delegate that to others.

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But you know that delegation is
temporary for the others to to

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be able to do that and under his
auspices that's kind of how they

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understand that and well,
naturally, having read the

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scriptures myself.
Hold on one second.

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So I want to break this down
real quick.

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So some of the groups within
Mormonism that might be

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considered one man adherence
would be like the LDS church,

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right?
Right.

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Probably the the, the, the, the
righteous branch, the Peterson

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group.
I I know for a fact.

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And then any the FLDS were.
I'm not sure where they stand

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now.
I haven't talked with many

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people yet on this.
They hold to the one man

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doctrine and then anybody else
you can think of off the AUB

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with the.
AUB.

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Yes.
All right.

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Anyone else you can think of?
I believe the Kingston's buy

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00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:58,680
into that as well.
OK all.

226
00:13:59,640 --> 00:14:01,200
Right, but I'm not too sure
about them.

227
00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:07,680
But the general and and even
amongst independents believe in

228
00:14:07,680 --> 00:14:11,120
that concept, but they believe
that that office has been lost.

229
00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,440
OK.
So they believe it has to be

230
00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,440
restored, but nevertheless, you
know, many people still believe

231
00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:20,880
in that concept.
So, so there's others, there are

232
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:25,160
independents who believe that
that in this one man doctrine so

233
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:28,960
to speak, but they believe that
office is just lost.

234
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:31,760
So we're waiting for that office
to be restored.

235
00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:32,920
Is that kind of the?
Right.

236
00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:36,960
Yeah, basically, yeah.
They look at it as they look at

237
00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,440
it as waiting for the one mighty
and strong to come to set things

238
00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,520
in order, and another one,
another one that has promoted

239
00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:47,040
that belief.
But they believe that only

240
00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:51,120
Joseph Smith is in that
position.

241
00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:55,080
OK.
And so but they believe that you

242
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:59,520
know his authority can carry on
and so forth and and so

243
00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:03,000
basically that's kind of a a
general spectrum.

244
00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:07,440
Gotcha.
OK so from from there that

245
00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:15,400
that's kind of their their their
understanding and and on a oh

246
00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:20,160
just a quick read it sure sounds
like that in in 132 seven right

247
00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:24,120
is that there's only one man.
So at at what point did you were

248
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,400
you like oh OK something doesn't
fit here.

249
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:29,840
At what point do you remember
thinking, maybe this isn't what

250
00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:33,120
we think, it's maybe this this
scripture isn't saying what we

251
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:35,560
think it's saying.
Well.

252
00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:41,760
As you know, I was in the AUB in
the in the early, early to mid

253
00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:48,400
90s and I I didn't I wasn't
officially removed from the AUB

254
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:56,120
till about, you know, 99.
But anyway, when it first, when

255
00:15:56,120 --> 00:16:01,800
it first started to enter my
mind, 'cause there was a lot of

256
00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,440
emphasis put on you have to get
the permission of the head of

257
00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:09,960
the priesthood to pretty much
advance, you know, in the

258
00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:13,800
ordinances, whether it be your
endowment, whether you want to

259
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:18,480
enter the principal, basically
all you know would say that you

260
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:21,920
have to get the permission from
the one guy or the man who holds

261
00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:26,080
the keys or the president, in
this case, the AUB, it was

262
00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:32,040
brother Owen Allred.
And so that was the and there's

263
00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:38,040
a part of me that you know that
I've, I've grown kind of in my

264
00:16:38,040 --> 00:16:40,320
life.
I've kind of grown to not to not

265
00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,160
trust implicitly authorities
placed over me, whether they be

266
00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:49,320
ecclesiastic or or political.
I think many men are prone to

267
00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:52,960
prejudice, and they have a
tendency.

268
00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:57,520
Most most people have a tendency
to make judgments based on what

269
00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:01,360
they hear or without really
looking into it.

270
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:04,880
Or something triggers them about
what something you said or

271
00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:09,280
whatever, and they form an
opinion without actually looking

272
00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:12,560
into what you meant.
Because sometimes we know we

273
00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:17,079
don't speak properly or we say
something that conveys a

274
00:17:17,079 --> 00:17:18,560
different idea than what we
meant.

275
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:24,280
And in my experience in life, I
found that most people do that

276
00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:27,520
whether they be in leadership
positions or or not.

277
00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:33,000
I mean, I definitely saw this in
the ODS organization from men

278
00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:37,160
who are appointed to be leaders
where they would listen, listen

279
00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:39,080
to a rumor or whatever, and they
went off of that.

280
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,040
Right.
And I found that generally

281
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:47,160
speaking this was more more the
rule and not the exception

282
00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:50,040
gotcha, which is kind of a shame
because should be the other way

283
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:51,280
around.
Right.

284
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:56,440
But anyway, things, statements
like that didn't sit right with

285
00:17:56,440 --> 00:18:00,760
me.
And it sounded to me it sounded

286
00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:06,080
a little too arbitrary.
And so I started just as I do

287
00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:07,760
often.
I'll, I'll go through a mental

288
00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:12,120
exercise.
When I first entered the, the

289
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:17,960
AUBI was satiated with the idea
that the president of the church

290
00:18:19,120 --> 00:18:21,600
can lead you astray because he's
president of the church.

291
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:23,040
He's not the president of
priesthood.

292
00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:26,560
So I, you know, they, I was told
that I was just looking at the

293
00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:29,840
wrong office cast, the man that
can't lead this astray kind of

294
00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,680
thing And and so it's the
president of the priesthood, not

295
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,640
the president of the church.
And that at times they have been

296
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:41,640
both in the same.
So that I was satiated by that

297
00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:44,520
for for some time.
It satisfied me for a little for

298
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:45,840
a little while.
But then I started thinking,

299
00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:48,920
well, what if the president of
priesthood leads me astray?

300
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:52,560
What Then?
When I started, I started

301
00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:56,120
rationalizing.
I can't take that off the table

302
00:18:56,120 --> 00:18:59,360
simply because that would be a
violation of his agency.

303
00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:05,160
Right.
And then I got to thinking about

304
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:08,520
what Wilfred Woodruff said about
the man that the Lord will not

305
00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:10,920
lead someone in this position to
lead you astray.

306
00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:14,240
For if he for if he did, he
would remove him.

307
00:19:15,360 --> 00:19:18,880
And I'm thinking to myself,
well, first of all, I think a

308
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,400
lot of people immediately
attribute that the Lord will

309
00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:24,560
take his life.
Right.

310
00:19:25,120 --> 00:19:26,920
But removing can mean something
else.

311
00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:31,320
He can remove him from a
position where he's a prophet by

312
00:19:31,360 --> 00:19:35,520
not speaking to him anymore.
He could be removed from his

313
00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:38,120
position as president of the
church.

314
00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:42,120
That can mean, you know, quite a
few different things.

315
00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:45,800
But more than anything is if the
Lord was to remove someone from

316
00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:50,840
that gift, does that necessitate
that we as a body of the Church

317
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:53,880
would know that?
No, not necessarily.

318
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,320
Would they be willing to?
Would they be willing to admit

319
00:19:56,320 --> 00:20:00,760
that as a matter of fact,
section 121 kind of argues

320
00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:04,560
against it, right?
Because it says air, they are

321
00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:07,560
aware they are there, they are
left unto themselves.

322
00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:14,560
Now the word air in this, in
this, that's ERE air, they are

323
00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:18,440
aware literally means before
they are aware they are, they

324
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:20,600
are left unto themselves.
Oh.

325
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,320
To kick against the pricks.
To persecute the Saints.

326
00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:27,840
To fight against God.
I see so.

327
00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,040
And why is that?
Because the Spirit of the Lord

328
00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:34,040
has departed from them.
Right, right.

329
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:35,440
And and that tells.
Us How?

330
00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,200
Why?
The Spirit of the Lord departs

331
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:41,800
because they sought to gratify
their pride and chose to

332
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:45,320
exercise unrighteous dominion
upon those they're there to

333
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,600
serve.
Yeah, yeah, and.

334
00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:55,960
And again, I believe it's 121
that talks about, you know, it's

335
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,200
the disposition of most men that
when they gain that kind of

336
00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,160
power, they want to hold on to
it.

337
00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,400
Right.
And and so there's, there's a

338
00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:09,320
little bit of this, you know,
not not wanting to let that go.

339
00:21:09,360 --> 00:21:13,120
Or, you know, gosh, as as I
think about human nature and

340
00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:17,200
human tendencies, I could even
see where if if there was a man

341
00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,400
in charge who felt that way,
he'd be like, well, I don't see

342
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,520
another worthy successor around
me.

343
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:26,480
So I by necessity have to stay
here and figure this all out.

344
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:32,600
Right, gotcha.
Anyway, it's in you quoted that

345
00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,960
that we have learned by sad
experience that it is the nature

346
00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:39,280
and disposition of almost all
men.

347
00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:42,040
Right.
That the moment they get a

348
00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:44,920
little authority, I think the
next words are really

349
00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:50,400
interesting as they suppose in
other words, that that kind of

350
00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:52,280
states that they don't have this
kind of authority.

351
00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:56,160
The minute they get a little
authority, as they suppose it

352
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,560
says, they begin to exercise
unrighteous dominion.

353
00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,640
Well, the rest of the Scripture
goes on to tell you that there

354
00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:05,280
is no authority like that.
Right.

355
00:22:06,360 --> 00:22:08,720
That the minute you do that, you
don't have authority.

356
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:13,880
Right.
And so I think that's the basis

357
00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:20,360
of this entire line of thinking.
I think Section 121 I think

358
00:22:20,360 --> 00:22:25,240
forms the basis of of the nature
of the authority of the fullness

359
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,240
of the priesthood or the keys of
the priesthood, as is not

360
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,480
usually known as.
But anyway, when I started

361
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:32,920
thinking that way, I said a
prayer.

362
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,640
After my prayer, I was impressed
to read Section 84.

363
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,720
And this is one of the things
that kind of jumped out at me

364
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:44,600
and and I'll, I'll go ahead and
go into that.

365
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:49,720
Now, of course, I started out by
with Ken, the president of the

366
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:54,040
priesthood lead us astray.
And if that is the case, then

367
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:56,400
what do we do?
Right.

368
00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,120
Does that mean we're, as, as you
know in the vernacular, does

369
00:23:00,120 --> 00:23:02,800
that mean we're Sol?
Right, right.

370
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:04,440
I said.
No, because yeah.

371
00:23:05,120 --> 00:23:07,280
I don't think that we are.
Right.

372
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:13,280
But anyway, so therefore I think
that naturally leads to if that

373
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:18,160
guy leads us astray.
And Joseph Smith stated that the

374
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:23,200
keys would not be removed from
the earth again and and if that

375
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:26,800
was the case, then would the
Lord not provide a way?

376
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,680
He would have.
A ram in the thicket, as it

377
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:31,920
were.
Right.

378
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:34,480
He he would kind of have to,
because he's promised that the

379
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,280
keys would never leave the Earth
again.

380
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:44,760
And if one man is the leader of
a group and and he he falls, you

381
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,160
know, for whatever reason, the
Lord still has to honor that

382
00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:51,080
promise that somehow those keys
are going to be preserved in the

383
00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:55,440
earth.
So in in Doctrine Covenants,

384
00:23:55,960 --> 00:24:01,840
section 84, starting in verse
33, it says, For whoso is

385
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:05,440
faithful unto the Obtaining
these two priesthoods of which I

386
00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:09,080
have spoken, and the magnifying
their calling, are sanctified by

387
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:13,200
the Spirit into the renewing of
their bodies, says they become

388
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:15,960
the sons of Moses, and the
Varon, and the seed of Abraham,

389
00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:19,000
and the Church and Kingdom, and
the lack of God.

390
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:21,840
I find it interesting because it
says we become the Church.

391
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:27,360
Right.
This is after magnifying, right?

392
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:30,560
So I think that that's a
question that should be in our

393
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,800
mind as to what that means, I
said.

394
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,040
Because, you know, most of us
have been members of the Church

395
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,400
for quite some time before we
even get the priesthood.

396
00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:41,240
Right.
So what does that mean as we

397
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:43,520
become the church and Kingdom in
the elect of God?

398
00:24:45,360 --> 00:24:48,320
And it says, and also all they
who received this priesthood

399
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:52,280
received me, saith the Lord for
he that received with my

400
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,280
servants.
And I want to bring special

401
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,440
attention there that it doesn't
say servant right.

402
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:05,040
It says For he that receiveth my
servants receiveth me, and he

403
00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:08,960
that receiveth me receiveth my
father, and he that receiveth my

404
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:10,720
father receiveth my father's
Kingdom.

405
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,720
Therefore all that my father
hath shall be given unto him,

406
00:25:16,120 --> 00:25:18,840
And this is according to the
oath and covenant which

407
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:22,680
belongeth to the priesthood.
Therefore all those who received

408
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:26,360
the priesthood received this
oath and covenant of my Father,

409
00:25:26,360 --> 00:25:29,240
which he cannot break, neither
can it be moved.

410
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:33,960
And it says, But whoso breaketh
this covenant after he hath

411
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,880
received it, and all together
turneth therefrom, shall not

412
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:40,520
have forgiveness of sins in this
world, nor in the world to come.

413
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:45,640
And woe unto all those who come
not unto this priesthood which

414
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,880
he have received.
Now which priesthood is it

415
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:53,240
talking about?
Well, if we read earlier on it,

416
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,880
speaking about the higher
priesthood, which is plainly

417
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:01,560
being spoken of, here it says,
And this greater priesthood

418
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:05,960
administered the the gospel, the
gospel, and and holdeth the key

419
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:10,080
of the mysteries of the Kingdom,
even the key of the knowledge of

420
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,880
God.
Therefore in the ordinances

421
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:18,640
thereof and the power, the power
of godliness is manifest, and

422
00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,320
without the ordinances thereof
and the authority of the

423
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,960
priesthood, the power of
godliness is not manifest until

424
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:28,880
men in the flesh.
For without this no man can see

425
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:31,400
the face of God, even the
Father, and live.

426
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:34,560
Now.
This Moses plainly taught to the

427
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:37,200
children of Israel in the
wilderness, and sought

428
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,680
diligently to sanctify his
people, that they might behold

429
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,760
the face of God, but they
hardened their hearts, and could

430
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,320
not endure his presence.
Therefore the Lord in His wrath,

431
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,880
for his anger was kindled
against them, swore that they

432
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:54,720
would not enter into His rest
while in the wilderness, which

433
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:56,920
rest is the fullness of His
glory.

434
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,760
Therefore he took Moses out of
their midst, and the holy

435
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:04,160
priesthood also, and the lesser
priesthood continued.

436
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,480
Which priesthood holdeth the key
of the ministering of angels and

437
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,960
the preparatory gospel?
Which gospel is the gospel of

438
00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:14,760
repentance, and of baptism, and
of remission, of sins, and the

439
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:18,760
law of carnal commandments,
which the Lord and His wrath

440
00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,040
caused to continue with the
House of Aaron among the

441
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,640
children of Israel?
And until John, whom God raised

442
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,400
up, being filled with the Holy
Ghost from his mother's womb?

443
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:33,600
It's showing you, it said.
Woe to all those who come not

444
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,920
unto this priesthood.
Right.

445
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,600
And here it gives you an example
of what he means by woe, because

446
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,840
it says that these people harden
their hearts against the

447
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:49,120
teachings of Moses, and the
teachings of Moses were directed

448
00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:51,440
at bringing them into the
presence of God.

449
00:27:52,120 --> 00:27:53,600
Yeah.
And if I'm not mistaken, didn't

450
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,440
Joseph have a a quote at which
he said that that one of the

451
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,880
reasons that the children of
Israel's minds were darkened was

452
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,040
because they didn't want to meet
the Lord?

453
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:07,400
They just basically told Moses,
you just go up the mountain and

454
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,360
you talk to God and we'll, we'll
take take, we'll we'll take

455
00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:12,880
whatever you have to say is
gospel.

456
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,920
We're good with this.
Right.

457
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:18,440
You speak to him on our behalf.
We don't want that

458
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:20,720
responsibility.
Gotcha.

459
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:28,280
But anyway, so after reading
that, what caught my attention

460
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,920
was that part that says the oath
and covenant of the Priesthood.

461
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,560
And when I read it, it seemed
vaguely familiar.

462
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:38,680
So I went back to section 132.
What is this oath and covenant?

463
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:45,320
In section 132 verse 26 you.
Want me to read that?

464
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:47,760
Yeah, let me.
Let me make sure that's what it

465
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:53,280
is before you start reading, but
notice how it talks about that

466
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:55,600
this open covenant can be broken
by God.

467
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,720
Right.
I'm going to make a point on

468
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,640
that in a minute, but go ahead
and read verse 26.

469
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,520
Verily, verily, I say unto you,
If a man marry a wife, according

470
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,720
to my word, and they are sealed
by the Holy Spirit of promise

471
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:14,280
according to mine appointment,
and he or she shall commit any

472
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:17,720
sin or transgression of the new
and everlasting covenant,

473
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,560
whatever and all manner of
blasphemes.

474
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:24,120
And if they commit no murder,
wherein they shed innocent

475
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:28,680
blood, yet they shall come forth
in the first resurrection, and

476
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,080
enter into their exaltation.
But they shall be destroyed in

477
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,720
the flesh, and shall be
delivered unto the buffetings of

478
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,120
Satan, unto the day of
redemption, saith the Lord.

479
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,400
Go ahead and read 27 as well.
The blasphemy against the Holy

480
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:47,880
Ghost, which shall not be
forgiven in the world, nor nor

481
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:52,640
out of the world, is in that ye
commit murder, wherein ye shed

482
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:57,400
innocent blood, and ascent unto
death, after ye have received my

483
00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:01,720
new and everlasting covenant,
saith the Lord God and he that

484
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:06,000
abideth not this law can in no
wise enter into my glory, but

485
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,840
shall be damned, saith the Lord.
OK, now we'll go back to section

486
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:14,400
84.
It says, And he that receiveth

487
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,840
my father, receiveth my father's
Kingdom.

488
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,840
Therefore all that my father
hath shall be given unto him.

489
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,640
And this is according to the
oath and covenant which

490
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:26,000
belongeth to the priesthood.
Therefore all those who receive

491
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,640
the priesthood receive this oath
and covenant of my father, which

492
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:32,000
he cannot break.
Neither can it be moved.

493
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,640
Notice how it just said that if
you were to commit any

494
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:41,400
transgression or sin in all
manner of blasphemy, save it be

495
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,640
the shedding of innocent blood.
Right.

496
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,280
Says you enter into your
exaltation.

497
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,120
Right.
It does say you'll be delivered

498
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,880
to the buffetings of Satan, but
you already have an exaltation

499
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,920
assured.
OK, but it says And who so

500
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,120
breaketh this covenant after he
hath received it, and altogether

501
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:01,320
turneth therefrom, shall not
have forgiveness of sins in this

502
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:05,480
world and in the world to come.
I think section 27 defines that.

503
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,640
Right.
I mean, that's section 27132,

504
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:11,200
verse 27.
Right.

505
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:15,600
But anyway, so when I read those
kind of things, that one of the

506
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:20,120
thoughts that came to me is a
lot of people speak that if in

507
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:21,960
the Church of your
excommunicated, they say you

508
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,240
lose your priesthood right and
and these different

509
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:29,400
fundamentalist organizations, if
the one man declares you no

510
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:33,560
longer have priesthood, then and
for them you don't.

511
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,560
But this here is telling us that
even God doesn't take or

512
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,280
priesthood away once it's given
right.

513
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,320
The only way you lose it is by
turning all together therefrom.

514
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:47,160
Right, OK.
And and so with that in mind,

515
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:53,640
you know, it kind of gives us,
AI have a tendency to look at

516
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,560
contradictions, or at least
apparent contradictions in

517
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,600
scripture or by the statements
of the prophets.

518
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:05,480
Because a lot of times what I
like about it is that it puts

519
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:07,400
you in a position to do some
careful reading.

520
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,520
And by careful reading, did the
scripture actually say what I

521
00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:14,520
thought it said?
Right.

522
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,040
Or is it Not saying that because
it's amazing how much we

523
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:22,360
interject into what we read and
it's not nefarious.

524
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,160
No, it's.
Just if we're operating under

525
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,160
certain paradigm, we kind of
read into things that aren't

526
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:29,720
there.
Sure.

527
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:35,520
And but anyway, so all this got
me thinking.

528
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,360
And then I remember and I read
verse 7 again.

529
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:43,960
With that in mind.
What is it actually saying?

530
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:48,920
Because here's my my view.
I saw contradictions to

531
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:53,520
scripture in scripture that way.
The section 84 tells us that

532
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:58,160
Moses got his priesthood
authority from Jethro, and that

533
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:02,560
Jethro derives his authority
from Isaias, and it says there

534
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:04,800
that Isaias was ordained by God
himself.

535
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:10,320
Well, we do know that Isaias was
blessed of Abraham, so I don't

536
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,600
know exactly what that means.
People can interject what he

537
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:20,840
gave him, the priesthood, Maybe.
Nevertheless, though I think

538
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:26,760
it's a moot point because you
have Isaias ordaining men down

539
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:30,640
to Jethro, who then you know
ordains Moses, right?

540
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:35,120
On the other hand, you have
Isaac, you have Jacob, you have,

541
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:36,840
you know, the 12 tribes of
Israel.

542
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:40,960
But yet Moses isn't getting the
fullness of priesthood from

543
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:42,560
them.
Right.

544
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:47,040
But it seems apparent to me that
they passed it down like I'm

545
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,160
pretty sure Abraham passed it to
Isaac, who passed it to Jacob.

546
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,680
Right.
Or else, why would Jacob also

547
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,800
have the promise of a multitude?
Right.

548
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:57,840
Yeah, makes sense.
Yep.

549
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:04,080
Well anyway, so to me I saw a
discrepancy there 2 lines of

550
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:08,760
priesthood, section 132, verse
seven seem to be in

551
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,040
contradiction to that.
And and then when you think of

552
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:16,760
the Nephites, you have Peter,
James and John in the old world,

553
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,080
and then you have the three
Nephites here, yeah, you know,

554
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:26,360
who are completely operating and
acting with every key power and

555
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:30,159
authority.
Well, just just off the top of

556
00:34:30,159 --> 00:34:32,040
my head, I just this just came
to mind.

557
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:37,920
You have Peter who's told that
he has those keys now in

558
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:41,239
Scripture and the New Testament.
When he says you know, when the

559
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,600
Lord tells him whatever you seal
on earth shall be sealed in

560
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:48,280
heaven and and that and at the
same time on in the Western

561
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:52,280
Hemisphere you have Nephi that
receives that very same promise.

562
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:56,960
So there are two lines of
authority operating even even

563
00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,000
during that time.
Right.

564
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,920
So one thing that I want to
point out about that is the

565
00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:06,880
scripture does say that Peter
has the presidency of it, right?

566
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:08,560
Even though he's on the other
side of the world.

567
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:14,120
But I have to, you have to say,
well, Nephi wasn't asking

568
00:35:14,120 --> 00:35:17,400
permission of Peter to do
anything right.

569
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:20,200
He had direct communion with
God, right.

570
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,200
And you're not going to believe
this, but I actually had

571
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:29,400
somebody tell me that that
telephones replace the the

572
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,400
spirit of God because back then
they through the spirit, they

573
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:38,040
would get permission.
And I I thought to myself, Are

574
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:39,680
you sure you want to go with
that argument?

575
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,480
Because it sounds pretty
ridiculous, you know?

576
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:47,360
But anyway, so, and I don't
really want to do a straw man

577
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:51,120
here because I know that people
who believe in one man is

578
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:53,560
there's different levels of
sophistication.

579
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:56,640
Right.
But anyway, that's what got me

580
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,520
thinking.
And so I reread section 132,

581
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:02,680
verse seven.
And as I read, I decided to read

582
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:06,840
the whole, the whole section.
And one of one of the verses

583
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:12,880
that really struck out stuck out
at me was verse 39, and I'd like

584
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:14,280
to read that.
Yeah.

585
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:20,360
Verse 39 of 132 and let's see if
you have it ready.

586
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:24,200
You can go ahead and read the.
Fact of it Here David's wives

587
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,800
and concubines were given unto
him by the hand hand of Nathan,

588
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,680
my servant, and others of the
prophets who had the keys of

589
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,240
this power.
And in none of these things did

590
00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:38,440
he sin against me, save in the
case of Uriah and his wife.

591
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,320
And therefore he hath fallen
from his exaltation, and

592
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:44,600
received his portion, and he
shall not inherit them out of

593
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,160
the world.
For I gave them unto another,

594
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,360
saith the Lord.
Right now the thing I wanna

595
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:55,080
bring your attention to is if I
heard you right.

596
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,080
Right.
It said that David also received

597
00:36:57,080 --> 00:37:00,920
many wives and concubines of me
by the hand of Nathan.

598
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:05,520
Right, correct.
And what And others of the

599
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:10,640
prophets who had the key?
Who had the keys of this power?

600
00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:16,120
OK, so right there we have a
scripture that denotes that

601
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:19,760
there was others besides Nathan,
right, Who had the keys of this

602
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:24,160
power, And it this power is, is
as you're reading that whole

603
00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:25,960
section, it's referring to the
same thing.

604
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:29,600
Right.
So the thing the question that

605
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:33,520
naturally comes is, did they
leave?

606
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:36,840
Did did they live
contemporaneous with each other

607
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:40,280
or was it 1 after another?
Well, we know they lived

608
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,560
contemporary, contemporary.
I'm sorry I can't pronounce that

609
00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:46,480
word again today.
They they lived at the same

610
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:49,280
time.
And one of the things is we know

611
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:54,080
that Nathan kind of lived
throughout David's life, but

612
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:56,960
that could still be argued that
he commissioned others to do it.

613
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:00,760
But that's not how the context
reads it says that they had the

614
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,240
keys of this power, right?
It doesn't.

615
00:38:03,240 --> 00:38:08,680
It doesn't specify that Nathan
gave them permission to use his

616
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:10,320
keys.
OK.

617
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:15,200
So again, let's go back to
section 132, verse seven, and

618
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:17,000
what does it really say in the
parenthetical?

619
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,600
And I have appointed unto my
servant Joseph to hold this

620
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:24,720
power in the last days, And
there is never but one on the

621
00:38:24,720 --> 00:38:30,680
earth at a time on whom the this
power and the keys of this

622
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,160
priesthood are conferred.
Right.

623
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:34,520
It doesn't.
Say only one holds it.

624
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:37,960
Does it?
No, I I guess it could be

625
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,640
inferred that that's what
they're saying, but the word is

626
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:45,480
conferred to not hold, right,
so.

627
00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:50,960
If we were to look at just the
the grammar there, but it's

628
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:56,560
saying that it is conferred one
at a time, it's not necessarily

629
00:38:56,560 --> 00:39:02,440
stating that, it's that only one
per lifetime can hold it.

630
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,440
Gotcha.
So it So it's talking about the

631
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:11,800
actual act of conferring the
keys as opposed to holding the

632
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,520
keys, right?
OK, conferring.

633
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:20,960
To receive do you have You
wouldn't have happened to have

634
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:24,600
access to the Wilford Woodruff
Journal or quotes from it

635
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,240
offhand, do you?
Not offhand, no.

636
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,560
I'll, I'll, I'll search it
really quick but in the.

637
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:34,240
You were saying in the Wilford
Woodruff?

638
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:39,440
Yes, the the date is December
18th, 1857.

639
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,840
OK, But anyway, I'm going to
paraphrase it because I'm having

640
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:46,920
a hard time actually finding it.
I neglected to write the page

641
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:48,720
number here, but.
No, you're good.

642
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,160
It's it's basically, I'm going
to paraphrase, he says.

643
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,960
They were in council to discuss
the administration of the second

644
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:56,720
anointing.
OK?

645
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:02,360
And in that Wilford Woodruff
says that that brother George

646
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,080
Albert Smith reminded us of
instructions given by the

647
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:10,800
prophet in this regard, that
only one king and a priest is to

648
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:14,440
be anointed at one time.
That you must open with prayer

649
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:16,320
and close with prayer before
admitting another.

650
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:21,480
And he says that that's only one
will be anointed at a time, but

651
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,520
several can be anointed in a day
in a temple.

652
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:27,760
OK.
Now I'm not really suggesting

653
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:31,280
that this answers the quadrant
that we find in in section 132

654
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:35,200
seven, because it states clearly
there that on the Earth.

655
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:38,880
Gotcha.
That's quite a qualifier, so,

656
00:40:39,240 --> 00:40:42,040
but it seems that the
administration of the second

657
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:46,920
anointing is being typified as
to whatever that this is is

658
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:50,760
talking about.
OK, before before we go on from

659
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,720
here, there's there's going to
be some in the audience who

660
00:40:53,720 --> 00:40:56,200
aren't familiar with what the
2nd anointing is.

661
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:59,280
And obviously we don't want to
get into the ordinance itself,

662
00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:03,280
but give just a real cursory
review of what what the 2nd

663
00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:07,160
anointing is.
The second anointing is the

664
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:12,520
basically the highest ordinance
that a man can perform on

665
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:16,880
another or the capstone.
It would be the capstone

666
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:20,640
ordinance that one can achieve
and from another mortal.

667
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,000
OK.
And and in that is, is that

668
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,560
where these these keys are.
These keys empower the

669
00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:29,000
priesthood that's being referred
to.

670
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,160
In seven is is the second
anointing where those keys are

671
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:35,720
passed along.
Yes, the 2nd anointing has a

672
00:41:35,720 --> 00:41:37,840
couple of synonyms that it's
known by.

673
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,520
It's referred to as the second
anointing, which if you've been

674
00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:45,640
if you've been endowed in the in
the temple, you receive an

675
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:47,680
anointing that's referred to as
your first anointing.

676
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,720
The 2nd anointing is supposed to
be one that happens afterward.

677
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:55,080
Gotcha.
And they also referred to it as

678
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:58,840
being anointed a king and a
priest unto the most high God.

679
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:03,240
And for the sisters is to be a
queen and a priestess unto her

680
00:42:03,240 --> 00:42:05,280
husband.
Gotcha.

681
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:11,040
And it's an ordinance that that
you really can't receive unless

682
00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:16,120
you have one wife that's in
harmony with you and because it

683
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:21,080
requires you know her her
participation to complete the

684
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:22,480
ordinance.
Gotcha.

685
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:26,160
And the other thing that's also
referred to as as the second

686
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:28,240
endowment.
OK.

687
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:30,040
All right.
And one more word.

688
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,680
And this Joseph Smith used
coined this this term.

689
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:38,040
He referred to it as receiving
the fullness of the priesthood

690
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:41,720
and the other one that was
referred to as being sealed by

691
00:42:41,720 --> 00:42:43,800
the Holy Spirit of promise.
OK.

692
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:46,680
All right.
That's pretty important.

693
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:50,200
Yeah, pretty.
Yeah, heavy, heavy stuff for

694
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:52,640
sure.
So yeah, I just wanted to clear

695
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,800
that up, 'cause I think that
factors in heavily into into

696
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:56,240
this.
So.

697
00:42:57,360 --> 00:43:00,000
So when what?
What Back to the Wilford

698
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:05,960
Woodruff Journal.
He's basically saying that you

699
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,320
every this is not a group
ordinance, right.

700
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:13,240
I mean some ordinances are if we
look at at the endowment,

701
00:43:13,240 --> 00:43:15,680
certainly that can be done in
groups.

702
00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:20,680
This one has to be done the 2nd
anointing one at a time.

703
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:27,520
And so we're we're thinking here
that this is what 7 could say in

704
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:31,880
conjunction with some historical
evidence from Wilford Woodruff,

705
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:35,560
where it talks about opening the
meeting with prayer and closing

706
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:39,560
the meeting with prayer.
And only one couple, if you

707
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:43,160
will, goes through at a time to
receive this.

708
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:45,640
Right.
And I'd like to point, I'd like

709
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,200
to point out that in that
ordinance, men and women are

710
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:51,280
considered one.
So when you say one man, it

711
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:55,480
includes the man and his wives.
Just like we look at like an

712
00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:58,280
Elohim unit, so to speak.
Gotcha.

713
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,080
And it and it's and it's, you
know, it just goes along with

714
00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:04,160
what the Apostle Paul says, that
the man is neither without the

715
00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:05,880
woman or the woman without the
man and the Lord.

716
00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:09,880
Sure, sure.
OK, so you were gonna, you were

717
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:14,120
gonna say, OK, let's let's look
at the term on the Earth at a

718
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:17,560
time 'cause you were saying
that's a heavy qualifier.

719
00:44:18,240 --> 00:44:22,760
Right.
Well years ago a friend of mine

720
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:28,360
and I were doing a study of this
topic together and he actually

721
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:34,280
put it forth in a in a pamphlet.
He no longer shares you know a

722
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:35,680
lot of the views that he put
there.

723
00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:43,080
I but I think what he did was
was was greatly inspired but we

724
00:44:43,080 --> 00:44:46,400
have that disagreement between
us now but back then we didn't

725
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,520
gotcha.
But one of the things that that

726
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,280
was that was the crutch is, So
what does it mean on the earth?

727
00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:58,760
What are we talking about here?
And he called me up and he says,

728
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:00,560
I think I have the answer.
And I says really?

729
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:09,080
And he says read verse 5 and 132
OK, And I'll go ahead and go

730
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:11,400
ahead and read it, since you
apparently have it right before

731
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:14,480
you.
Yep, For all who will have a

732
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:18,880
blessing at my hand shall abide
the law which was appointed for

733
00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:22,760
that blessing, and the
conditions thereof, as were

734
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:25,600
instituted from before the
foundations of the world.

735
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:31,440
OK, isn't that interesting?
You're saying, For if you will

736
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:35,440
have a blessing at my hands, you
must abide the law upon which

737
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:40,680
that blessing is is predicated
as we're, you know, as was

738
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:42,640
instituted from before the
foundation of the world.

739
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:44,800
Then it goes on to say, in the
conditions of this law, are

740
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:48,120
these in verse seven?
OK, so you should read verse

741
00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:51,880
seven with verse five in mind.
OK.

742
00:45:52,720 --> 00:45:58,720
Now here's the the the way I
understand it now I didn't

743
00:45:58,720 --> 00:46:00,520
understand it, you know when I
first read it.

744
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:03,880
But immediately when I read that
that light bulb went off in my

745
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:07,680
head and I says don't tell me
what what you think it means.

746
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:14,360
I wanna see if my inspiration
equals yours cuz I like the of

747
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:20,200
witnesses.
It's for whoso will receive a

748
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:24,920
blessing at my hands.
Most people look at that

749
00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:27,440
metaphorically, like any
blessing you get from God is,

750
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:29,280
you know, under the hands of
God.

751
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,640
But when you read it in context,
it seems to be talking about

752
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:36,200
that literally.
OK.

753
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:42,280
And it says, So who will be
blessed At my hands must live

754
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:43,880
this law?
And here are the conditions.

755
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:48,920
And it goes on to say, for there
is never but one on the earth at

756
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,360
a time on whom this power and
the keys of this priesthood are

757
00:46:51,360 --> 00:46:53,120
conferred.
Right.

758
00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:58,720
So, so that takes me to my next
line of reasoning.

759
00:46:59,240 --> 00:47:03,760
What does it mean?
What is the keys and power of

760
00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:08,640
the priesthood mean now?
A key, any simple definition, is

761
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:13,840
that which gives you access to
which others are barred from

762
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:17,240
right or or not entitled to
access.

763
00:47:17,240 --> 00:47:22,000
It can be a key to a house.
It could be a key to a safe, but

764
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:25,280
keys aren't always just a
physical object that you insert

765
00:47:25,280 --> 00:47:27,400
into a lock and open it.
Right.

766
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:31,640
It could be knowing the
combination to a lock, knowing

767
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:37,200
the key to be able to open or
have access to a particular,

768
00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:39,840
whatever it may be.
Right.

769
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:45,160
So by it's very nature, the keys
are there to give you access to

770
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:46,680
something.
Right.

771
00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:50,640
So then does that necessarily
mean that keys and power are

772
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:55,000
synonymous terms?
Not necessarily right now.

773
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:57,400
I think you can use the word
power, you know, quite

774
00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:00,880
generally, but I think in this
respect it's being, it's being

775
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:07,640
very specific, right so now.
I was going to say in this

776
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:10,880
instant, would it?
Would it be Speaking of keys as

777
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:14,400
being authorized to do
something, and the power of it

778
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:18,400
might be more dependent upon the
man's worthiness?

779
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:20,520
I would say so.
OK.

780
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:25,280
And but that almost seems too
simplistic in a way to to state

781
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:30,840
it that way, because authorized
by whom you know is the next

782
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:31,920
question.
Right.

783
00:48:33,240 --> 00:48:36,200
Now to the proponents of one man
is they believe the

784
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:39,200
authorization comes from the one
man if you're not the one man.

785
00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:41,160
And of course the one man gets
it from God.

786
00:48:41,800 --> 00:48:44,640
But I believe that it's a little
bit more.

787
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:49,120
What's the word?
There's a greater dispensation

788
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:50,440
than that.
OK.

789
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:53,600
One of the things that I think
kind of goes hand in hand with

790
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:59,600
this this line of thinking is
that we seem to believe, as

791
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:05,280
Mormons, and rightly so, that
Joseph Smith taught that we may

792
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:08,240
become as God right Right.
That we may become gods

793
00:49:08,240 --> 00:49:11,000
ourselves and that there's a
plurality of gods.

794
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:17,080
Judeo Christianity for the most
part they believe there's only

795
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:20,280
one God and they they believe
that kind of stuff because you

796
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:23,440
hear terms like, you know,
besides me, there is no savior.

797
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:28,880
I am the way, there is no other
way that gets you there.

798
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:31,520
And those are all true.
But I think we we have a

799
00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:35,840
tendency to over to over
disperse these ideas and

800
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:38,200
constant not to everything.
OK.

801
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:42,160
You know, as it says in the Book
of Mormon, that the Gentiles

802
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:44,080
will say a Bible, a Bible.
We have got a Bible.

803
00:49:44,080 --> 00:49:46,400
Need no more Bible?
Right.

804
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:49,840
Well, in Mormonism today I think
we can say a prophet, a prophet,

805
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:51,760
We have got a prophet and we
need no more profit.

806
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:56,280
But scripturally, when has this
ever really been true?

807
00:49:57,160 --> 00:50:00,360
I don't think it has.
I I I mean honestly in thinking

808
00:50:00,360 --> 00:50:04,480
back I mean maybe you can well
no I don't think you can make

809
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:08,960
the case in Moses time because
obviously Jethro held the keys

810
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:13,360
and it's my understanding that
once you receive the the the the

811
00:50:13,560 --> 00:50:16,320
the 2nd anointing and the keys
you become a prophet and

812
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:20,080
apostle.
So obviously Jethro was alive

813
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:26,200
during Moses ministry.
I can't think of one off the top

814
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:28,080
of my head.
I I think you could maybe make

815
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,920
the case early on in the
restoration with Joseph before

816
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:35,520
he rolls the Kingdom off to the
the 12.

817
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:39,600
But I yeah, I I can't think of
any.

818
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,920
Well, I'll there, I'll say that
there were in the sample that he

819
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:47,840
brought up with Joseph Smith.
I would say that him that it's

820
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:50,920
true that for a time he was the
one man, right?

821
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:52,680
But I believe that was
circumstantial in that

822
00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:56,680
principle.
OK, meaning he was the one man

823
00:50:56,680 --> 00:50:59,280
because for a while he hadn't
passed it on to anyone else.

824
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,160
Right.
And we have the testimony of the

825
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:07,400
12 and among others, that he
passed on every key, power and

826
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:10,240
authority to them individually.
Right.

827
00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:16,680
And this we have ample record of
from from various from various

828
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:18,920
brethren.
You have Wilfred Woodruff saying

829
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,120
that you have Brigham Young
saying that you have John Taylor

830
00:51:21,120 --> 00:51:25,560
saying that you have others
saying it OK and and you know I

831
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:27,880
I know that this is met with
yeah.

832
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:31,600
But they, you know, they may
hold the keys and they have them

833
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:34,680
in common, you know, and but
only one guy can exercise the

834
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:40,800
keys and the others kind of have
it in limbo in a way until, you

835
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:44,080
know, one passes away.
So there's that there's that

836
00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:50,480
variation on it.
And so I by understanding it

837
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:54,200
that way, most people would
think that the most people would

838
00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:58,240
think that the great apostasy
took place by them rejecting the

839
00:51:58,240 --> 00:52:01,560
one man.
But that's not how Isaiah for

840
00:52:01,560 --> 00:52:05,280
foresaw the great Apostasy is.
That's not how partly P Pratt,

841
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:09,120
or Joseph Smith, or any or any
of them, spoke of the great

842
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:11,400
apostasy.
They spoke of the great

843
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:16,800
Apostasy, as have broken the new
and everlasting covenant, and as

844
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:19,280
changing the ordinances.
OK.

845
00:52:19,920 --> 00:52:22,720
That's the qualifier they use
for apostasy.

846
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:28,600
Now, I dare say that a belief in
one man ISM almost facilitates

847
00:52:28,600 --> 00:52:31,360
apostasy.
And how so?

848
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:35,000
Well, if you have a one man that
begins to state things that

849
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:39,720
aren't scripturally sound or
sound in relation to the

850
00:52:39,720 --> 00:52:43,280
previous prophets, you dare not
question them because you're

851
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:45,520
going against the one man.
Right.

852
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:50,680
So these changes begin to happen
based on the fact that, well,

853
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:56,280
he's the one guy he can do it.
OK, so that's that's one of the

854
00:52:56,280 --> 00:53:02,240
pitfalls of the one man is that
now you can can basically just

855
00:53:02,240 --> 00:53:04,440
change everything Car Blanc,
right?

856
00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:08,280
Right now that's oversimplifying
it in a way, because I don't

857
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:10,200
think that they do it so
brazenly.

858
00:53:10,680 --> 00:53:13,800
Sometimes they do, but more
often than not, they're a little

859
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:16,840
bit more subtle about it, OK?
And sometimes I even wonder if

860
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:19,640
they're even all that aware that
they're doing it.

861
00:53:20,240 --> 00:53:24,480
Gotcha.
But nevertheless, it shuts down

862
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:29,440
the ability to protest this type
of change within those given

863
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:31,320
organizations.
Right.

864
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:39,560
Because questioning, questioning
them becomes becomes synonymous

865
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:44,560
with accusing the Brethren and
being on the High Road of

866
00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:48,960
apostasy.
Yeah, no, that's that's a good

867
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:54,040
point And and to back that up, I
think, I think even if we look

868
00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:58,160
at, well, let me back up here a
little bit let me put this into

869
00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:02,160
to full context here.
What was the original war in

870
00:54:02,160 --> 00:54:05,160
heaven all about?
It was about it.

871
00:54:05,360 --> 00:54:06,960
It could be summed up really
simply.

872
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:12,120
Can man govern himself and still
return back to the presence of

873
00:54:12,120 --> 00:54:14,640
God?
That's what the argument was

874
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:15,960
about.
Right.

875
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:20,680
The the, the, the council up
there came to the conclusion no

876
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:24,040
man can and you had the
adversary who said he he can't.

877
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:27,560
The the adversary said you're
going to need a strong man over

878
00:54:27,560 --> 00:54:32,360
them to enforce them back into
the Kingdom.

879
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:39,920
Likewise, if we look at at the
the we'll just look at the

880
00:54:39,920 --> 00:54:45,560
Constitution, right?
It was done in such a way that

881
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:50,680
man's rights were protected and
and the Constitution was set up

882
00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:55,400
to be about principle, not men.
It doesn't make sense, at least

883
00:54:55,400 --> 00:55:00,520
from my point of view, that the
Lord is this concerned about

884
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:04,760
agency that he this is what the
war in heaven's about.

885
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:10,040
In forming a country where the
gospel could could flourish, he

886
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:13,000
sets up a form of government
that's built on principle rather

887
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:17,760
than men.
But in his gospel, if if if this

888
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:21,960
one man thing holds water, he
does the exact opposite, he says

889
00:55:21,960 --> 00:55:25,080
no, This will be all about the
man and not about the principle.

890
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:27,080
Would that be a fair way of
looking at that?

891
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:32,160
Yeah, but I would dare say that
the, the proponents of it don't

892
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:35,880
see themselves in that light.
I don't think they they truly

893
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:39,360
see it that way.
I think most of them have, I

894
00:55:39,360 --> 00:55:42,880
think most of them actually
believe they're being benevolent

895
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:46,480
and and you you do have terms
like benevolent dictatorships or

896
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:49,280
whatever like that.
And at times that's actually

897
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,840
true.
You have people that are nice

898
00:55:51,840 --> 00:55:53,320
dictators.
Right.

899
00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:58,160
And but I I believe that the
principle is wrong and it's only

900
00:55:58,160 --> 00:55:59,840
a matter of time before you get
a tyrant.

901
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:03,360
Right.
And I think one of the things

902
00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:07,120
that's kept the ODS church from
having too much of that is the

903
00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:10,640
fact that they have a public
face that they have to uphold

904
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:13,880
gotcha.
So that kind of keeps magnifying

905
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:18,040
glass on them a little bit and
and keep some to a certain

906
00:56:18,040 --> 00:56:22,880
extent within certain limits.
But in other cases where in

907
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:26,600
other cases where that hasn't
been the issue, or they haven't

908
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:31,040
concern themselves with public
opinion but actually shield away

909
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:34,360
from public opinion altogether,
then you do have cases like

910
00:56:34,680 --> 00:56:40,440
Ervil Lebaron and his followers
where they, you know, believe

911
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:44,800
some pretty extreme stuff.
And I don't really want to get

912
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:48,760
too much into criticizing sure
other branches of Mormonism

913
00:56:48,760 --> 00:56:50,440
because I don't think it's
necessary to do that.

914
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:54,360
I think we can speak principle
and people can judge for

915
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:57,200
themselves where they're at.
Sure, sure.

916
00:56:57,240 --> 00:57:00,960
But anyway, But we historically
we know that there can be great

917
00:57:00,960 --> 00:57:02,560
excesses.
Right.

918
00:57:03,480 --> 00:57:05,960
So yeah, so back to where we
were it.

919
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:09,960
It sounds like that there's
almost always, with the

920
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:15,920
exception of of the early
restoration, that there's always

921
00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:19,480
been more than one person on the
earth at a time holding those

922
00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:22,720
keys.
Well, I'm not going to say

923
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:24,840
always.
You know, there's there's been,

924
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:29,840
I think you can make the case
that occasionally the keys were

925
00:57:29,840 --> 00:57:34,120
reduced down to one man, OK, you
know, because others were killed

926
00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:38,840
or others, you know, either
apostatized or fell away and

927
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:41,800
maybe one guy was left.
But that's not a principle,

928
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:44,280
that's a circumstance.
OK.

929
00:57:44,960 --> 00:57:49,680
And you know, if and quite
frankly, the men who have this

930
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:54,640
this given to them, they're also
given a charge to perpetuate

931
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:58,760
that which they have received.
And in doing so you would think

932
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:01,280
that you know, they would at
least be looking for candidates

933
00:58:03,680 --> 00:58:07,960
to whom they can pass this on.
But to do it righteously they

934
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:13,640
should be asking the Lord right.
You know, whom shall I bless

935
00:58:13,640 --> 00:58:19,240
with this now?
This issue of of of the keys and

936
00:58:19,240 --> 00:58:23,080
everything has become such a
triggering point that some have

937
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:26,120
taught that to even ask about
them or ask for them proves that

938
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:29,400
you're unworthy because you're
seeking self aggrandizement.

939
00:58:30,200 --> 00:58:33,560
Well, this this can't be
supported scripturally and it

940
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:35,320
can't be supported even
historically.

941
00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:40,120
Because we're told asking, you
shall receive knocking.

942
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:44,400
It shall be opened.
And we're told specifically and

943
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:46,480
have and and having God in our
lives.

944
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,480
And I'm not just talking about,
you know, having religion in our

945
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:54,680
lives.
We're invited to have to abide

946
00:58:54,680 --> 00:58:59,040
with God.
And so Joseph Smith went on that

947
00:58:59,040 --> 00:59:02,520
very suggestion.
If you lack wisdom, let him ask

948
00:59:02,520 --> 00:59:06,600
of God, who giveth to all men
liberally, but let them ask in

949
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:11,120
faith, right.
And it says he giveth liberally

950
00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:16,520
and Abradeth not so.
I mean, it's at the very core of

951
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:19,040
what it is to to be a follower
of Christ.

952
00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:22,680
Right.
Yeah, we we're we're invited.

953
00:59:22,680 --> 00:59:27,600
That's that's that's one of the
main invitations of Mormonism is

954
00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:30,840
to receive everything that the
father has to give.

955
00:59:32,240 --> 00:59:38,240
And if if we're not seeking
after those things, then then

956
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:43,840
what are we really doing?
Are we content just to or are we

957
00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:47,560
content just to be the backup
quarterback, so to speak, right?

958
00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:50,080
Or or should we be looking for
something more?

959
00:59:50,600 --> 00:59:55,360
Now let's go to section 128 and
let's go to verse 9 through 11.

960
00:59:55,920 --> 00:59:58,840
OK, all right.
Do you want me to read that

961
00:59:58,840 --> 01:00:01,320
again?
Let me read this one and you'll

962
01:00:01,320 --> 01:00:03,160
just have to bear with me.
I'm a little slow in pulling.

963
01:00:03,160 --> 01:00:04,560
No, you're good.
You're good.

964
01:00:05,400 --> 01:00:08,160
And the reason being is I I
kinda would like to add some

965
01:00:08,160 --> 01:00:10,520
emphasis in key areas.
Sure.

966
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:13,840
So that I can manipulate
everybody into believing as I

967
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:19,480
do.
But anyway, I say that jokingly.

968
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:23,480
I hope you know that.
But it says it may seem to some

969
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:27,680
to be a very bold doctrine that
we talk of a power which records

970
01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:29,640
or binds on earth and binds in
heaven.

971
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,240
Nevertheless, in all ages of the
world, whenever the Lord has

972
01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:37,080
given a dispensation of the
priesthood to any man by actual

973
01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:44,480
revelation, or any set of men,
notice that, or any set of men,

974
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:46,840
this power has always been
given.

975
01:00:47,440 --> 01:00:50,800
Hence whatsoever those men did
in authority in the name of the

976
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:54,760
Lord, and did it truly and
faithfully, and kept a proper

977
01:00:54,760 --> 01:00:58,480
and faithful record of the same,
it became a law on earth and in

978
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:01,800
heaven, and could not be an old
according to the decrees of the

979
01:01:01,800 --> 01:01:04,480
great Jehovah.
This is a faithful saying who

980
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:07,680
can hear it?
And again for the precedent,

981
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:12,520
Matthew 16 verses 18 and 19 And
I say unto thee, that thou art

982
01:01:12,520 --> 01:01:16,360
Peter, and upon this rock I will
build my church, and the gates

983
01:01:16,360 --> 01:01:17,920
of hell shall not prevail
against it.

984
01:01:18,560 --> 01:01:21,040
And I will give unto thee the
keys of the Kingdom of heaven,

985
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:24,480
And whatsoever thou shalt bind
on earth shall be bound in

986
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:26,840
heaven, and whatsoever thou
shalt loose on earth shalt be

987
01:01:26,840 --> 01:01:30,080
loosed in heaven.
Now 11 is this is where it

988
01:01:30,080 --> 01:01:33,760
really nails it.
Now the great and grand secret

989
01:01:33,760 --> 01:01:36,960
of the whole matter, and the
Sonam Bonam of the whole

990
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:41,280
subject, that is lying before
us, consists in obtaining the

991
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:45,600
powers of the holy priesthood.
For him to whom these keys are

992
01:01:45,600 --> 01:01:49,000
given, there is no difficulty in
obtaining a knowledge of facts

993
01:01:49,240 --> 01:01:51,880
in relation to the salvation of
the children of men.

994
01:01:51,880 --> 01:01:53,800
Both as well for the dead As for
the living.

995
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:57,920
Here in his glory and honor and
immortality and eternal life,

996
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:01,920
the ordinance of baptism by
water to be immersed there in

997
01:02:01,920 --> 01:02:04,080
order to answer to the likeness
of the dead.

998
01:02:04,680 --> 01:02:06,640
That one principle might accord
with the other.

999
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:09,440
To be immersed in the water and
come forth out of the water, is

1000
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:11,920
in the likeness of the
resurrection of the dead, and

1001
01:02:11,920 --> 01:02:13,360
coming forth out of their
graves.

1002
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:18,800
But anyway, notice how here it
says that the son and Bonum and

1003
01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:22,240
the subject of the whole matter
is lies in obtaining.

1004
01:02:23,160 --> 01:02:28,680
Right, right.
And and it's almost a Commission

1005
01:02:29,360 --> 01:02:34,440
that these keys that that.
That within the priesthood we

1006
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:37,360
should be be looking to obtain
these keys, correct?

1007
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:43,520
Which if if that's what we're
we're if that's what the the

1008
01:02:43,520 --> 01:02:46,960
emphasis is there to obtain
those keys.

1009
01:02:47,880 --> 01:02:53,160
One man ISM can't really be a
thing within this context.

1010
01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:57,320
Right now, I do want to say
something in regards to order

1011
01:02:57,320 --> 01:02:59,600
within the Kingdom of God,
whether it be the Church,

1012
01:03:00,040 --> 01:03:03,760
Kingdom, or priesthood, or
however you want to frame any

1013
01:03:03,760 --> 01:03:07,720
quorum.
I do believe in order.

1014
01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:11,600
I do believe there should be
someone who presides in the

1015
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:16,240
various quorums, but what I
contend is what the nature of

1016
01:03:16,240 --> 01:03:21,720
that presidency is.
In other words, I differentiate

1017
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:26,160
between the keys generally and
having the right to preside.

1018
01:03:26,800 --> 01:03:30,880
Yeah.
In other words, you know if we

1019
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:34,880
have a a quorum of elders, not
all of them can preside at the

1020
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:37,440
same time in that quorum without
there being confusion.

1021
01:03:38,360 --> 01:03:42,600
One way, you know, one way to
exemplify this is let's say I'm

1022
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:44,520
in an elders quorum and I visit
a widow.

1023
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:48,760
Let's say I'm, I'm doing my home
teaching and I'm visiting a

1024
01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:52,240
widow and I realized that she
has a leaky roof and it's in

1025
01:03:52,240 --> 01:03:55,640
really bad shape.
I don't have the authority to

1026
01:03:56,400 --> 01:04:00,680
speak on behalf of the Quorum
saying we'll be here on X, we'll

1027
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:02,400
be here at at such and such
time.

1028
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:05,160
Right.
I have to 1st talk to the

1029
01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:08,880
President of the quorum, and
it's not because he has any

1030
01:04:09,040 --> 01:04:13,960
authority above mine, but he's
been vested with the ability to

1031
01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:16,960
represent the whole Quorum.
Gotcha.

1032
01:04:17,640 --> 01:04:20,840
To speak on our behalf and and
to do business in our behalf.

1033
01:04:21,640 --> 01:04:26,200
So now I come to him and say
this widow needs a roof.

1034
01:04:26,880 --> 01:04:29,240
Well, he has the ability to see
where the quorum's already

1035
01:04:29,240 --> 01:04:31,520
allotted.
Right.

1036
01:04:31,520 --> 01:04:34,320
But the quorum's already
spending its time on it, and so

1037
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:37,960
he knows where the where the
vacant times are, where he can

1038
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:40,080
assign it.
Gotcha.

1039
01:04:40,320 --> 01:04:43,000
That's that's not him exercising
authority over me.

1040
01:04:43,680 --> 01:04:46,160
It's just maintaining order,
right.

1041
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:50,240
And then our meetings.
He presiding in the meeting

1042
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,680
means he maintains the order of
the meeting.

1043
01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:56,800
Right.
By, you know, giving time in a

1044
01:04:57,480 --> 01:04:59,680
so people speak in turn rather
than at a turn.

1045
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:01,560
Right.
Yeah.

1046
01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:03,200
And and I agree with you
totally.

1047
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:07,600
I had an episode on here with
Michael Ness early late last

1048
01:05:07,600 --> 01:05:10,720
year about the difference
between priesthood and presiding

1049
01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:15,680
and and broke this broke this
down and I I agree with you you

1050
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:20,120
totally and and I think at least
this is how it works in my

1051
01:05:20,120 --> 01:05:23,360
simple mind.
I looked at at presiding as more

1052
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:27,760
of of the guy who kind of sets
the agenda a little bit or sets

1053
01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:35,240
sets the the direction in that
time not necessarily he has any

1054
01:05:35,920 --> 01:05:38,320
more authority than anybody
else, right?

1055
01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:40,080
That that wouldn't make sense
either.

1056
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:43,800
You use the the analogy of an
elder scorum.

1057
01:05:43,800 --> 01:05:48,400
Well if you're all elders nobody
has any more keys or or

1058
01:05:48,400 --> 01:05:51,560
priesthood authority then the
president does right?

1059
01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:55,760
The president holds the same
priesthood as rest of the rest

1060
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:59,520
of his quorum, so he's simply
there to help set the agenda.

1061
01:06:00,400 --> 01:06:05,920
Correct and so and you know
others, others can bring in,

1062
01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:10,200
others can bring in things to
consider during that meeting.

1063
01:06:11,440 --> 01:06:15,720
And so the man the man presiding
is he has, he has to be aware of

1064
01:06:15,720 --> 01:06:17,400
the amount of time allotted they
have.

1065
01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:23,960
He has to try to balance pro and
con arguments, pro and con on on

1066
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:29,120
any given subject and make sure
that there's no one speaking

1067
01:06:29,240 --> 01:06:31,360
over someone over the top of
someone else.

1068
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:35,320
And so it's just basically
maintaining order.

1069
01:06:35,320 --> 01:06:38,240
In other words, he has the gavel
like a judge does in a

1070
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:40,920
courtroom.
Now they even say the honorable

1071
01:06:40,920 --> 01:06:44,680
so and so presiding and in most
cases the judge listens to a

1072
01:06:44,680 --> 01:06:50,600
case more than interjects you'll
have the prosecuting or the

1073
01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:54,640
defense attorneys saying stuff
like I object give their reasons

1074
01:06:54,640 --> 01:06:58,560
for their objection and the
judge says either overruled or

1075
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:04,640
sustained based on the rules of
of engagement and and so but in

1076
01:07:04,640 --> 01:07:07,320
the end you know sometimes the
judge does you know give a a

1077
01:07:07,320 --> 01:07:10,760
judgement at the end but in in
in in more ideal cases you have

1078
01:07:10,760 --> 01:07:15,800
a jury and the jury is neither
the judge presiding nor the but

1079
01:07:15,800 --> 01:07:20,240
they are there as the judges
that that watch this whole thing

1080
01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:26,480
play out gotcha and but anyway
so I'm not one who thinks that

1081
01:07:27,160 --> 01:07:29,720
I'm not one who thinks that
everybody should just be doing

1082
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:32,720
their own thing.
We should actually all be

1083
01:07:32,720 --> 01:07:34,120
engaged in doing the work of
God.

1084
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:36,960
Right.
But we have to also understand

1085
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:41,000
what that is.
So it lays the responsibility on

1086
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:47,280
us to know for ourselves what
the word of God consists of, and

1087
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:52,360
then to see who is aligning
himself to those principles.

1088
01:07:52,360 --> 01:07:56,080
More than we also have to
realize and find out.

1089
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:58,760
Is there a line of authority
that comes down to this

1090
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:03,160
individual?
And I kind of rather like the

1091
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:07,760
free market of ideas, the free
market of goods and services,

1092
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:09,880
but also the free market in
priesthood.

1093
01:08:10,840 --> 01:08:15,600
Because as an individual you can
then judge who are these guys

1094
01:08:16,520 --> 01:08:22,120
who may or may not have the
authority, is acting within the

1095
01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:24,760
realm of what I've studied to be
the Kingdom of God.

1096
01:08:25,479 --> 01:08:28,680
And you know Frederick Bastian,
this kind of ties in the

1097
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:33,399
political and economic and and
religious freedom kind of all in

1098
01:08:33,399 --> 01:08:36,040
one.
Frederick Mustiat wrote a book

1099
01:08:36,040 --> 01:08:38,960
called The Law.
But in it he wrote this

1100
01:08:38,960 --> 01:08:42,439
principle can be used in various
various fields in the field of

1101
01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:46,120
religion.
He said How do you know whether

1102
01:08:47,920 --> 01:08:51,840
a pastor is a true pastor of God
or a priest?

1103
01:08:52,439 --> 01:08:57,000
Says ask yourself the question,
Does the pastor serve his flock,

1104
01:08:57,000 --> 01:09:02,760
or is this the flock serve him?
He actually says that he used

1105
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:04,439
the.
He he said that, yes, he said

1106
01:09:04,439 --> 01:09:06,399
that.
And he also said, he also said

1107
01:09:06,399 --> 01:09:12,720
does does the the priest or
pastor serve his faith or just

1108
01:09:12,720 --> 01:09:16,920
the faith serve him?
And he says, and you may usually

1109
01:09:16,920 --> 01:09:19,319
come, you know, from that simple
question, you may know whether

1110
01:09:19,319 --> 01:09:21,720
you have a true shepherd or a
wolf in sheep's clothing.

1111
01:09:22,120 --> 01:09:24,439
Gotcha.
Interesting.

1112
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:28,800
Yeah.
And and that's one of the things

1113
01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:33,160
that especially with my boys, I
tried to drive home as I passed

1114
01:09:33,160 --> 01:09:39,880
priesthood on to them was this
idea of look, this isn't just a

1115
01:09:39,880 --> 01:09:43,920
badge of honor for you to to
wear and say look at how

1116
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:47,080
righteous I am.
This is a Commission to serve.

1117
01:09:47,720 --> 01:09:51,680
Right you you receive any of
these things from from the from

1118
01:09:51,680 --> 01:09:54,720
the Deacon on up to someone
who's received their second

1119
01:09:54,720 --> 01:09:58,120
anointing.
This is this is a Commission to

1120
01:09:58,120 --> 01:10:03,560
serve and the level of service
goes up as you progress through

1121
01:10:03,560 --> 01:10:08,080
these these priesthood offices.
And so I like, I like what you

1122
01:10:08,080 --> 01:10:11,160
brought out there.
That is is is he?

1123
01:10:11,160 --> 01:10:15,600
Is this man serving or is he
looking to be served by having

1124
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:18,560
this authority?
Now, of course, sometimes it

1125
01:10:18,560 --> 01:10:20,640
takes a little bit more
discernment than simply asking

1126
01:10:20,640 --> 01:10:25,040
that question because I don't
know of too many imposters out

1127
01:10:25,040 --> 01:10:29,000
there that are going to be that
open about the people serving

1128
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:31,200
them.
But as you as you see their

1129
01:10:31,200 --> 01:10:35,520
policies, as you see, you know
how they the rhetoric that they

1130
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:37,920
use.
This episode of the podcast is

1131
01:10:37,920 --> 01:10:40,080
brought to you by Deseret
flag.com.

1132
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:42,320
I've said this before and I
really mean it.

1133
01:10:42,320 --> 01:10:44,960
Mormonism isn't just a religion,
it's a culture.

1134
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:48,040
As such, it has its own
vernacular and practices, but

1135
01:10:48,040 --> 01:10:50,800
also its own symbols.
And those symbols become even

1136
01:10:50,800 --> 01:10:53,040
more important and prominent
when you look back into our

1137
01:10:53,040 --> 01:10:54,880
history.
Perhaps one of the most

1138
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:57,840
recognizable symbols of
Mormonism is the Deseret flag.

1139
01:10:58,120 --> 01:11:01,440
This is the flag that I use as
cover art in this podcast.

1140
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:04,840
This was also used for a good
chunk of time during the Pioneer

1141
01:11:04,840 --> 01:11:07,520
era in Utah.
Now today we have people who

1142
01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:10,520
want to replace the existing
Utah flag with some other

1143
01:11:10,520 --> 01:11:13,560
progressive monstrosity.
Well, I think it's damp past

1144
01:11:13,560 --> 01:11:16,240
time that we start pushing back
here a little bit in Utah.

1145
01:11:16,600 --> 01:11:19,320
Our friends at Defending Utah
are here to help you with that.

1146
01:11:19,520 --> 01:11:21,720
Now.
If you go to deseretflag.com,

1147
01:11:21,880 --> 01:11:24,400
you can now purchase your own
Deseret State flag.

1148
01:11:24,840 --> 01:11:28,040
It's time here that we start
making ourselves known and join

1149
01:11:28,040 --> 01:11:30,880
the resistance against those who
seek to rewrite our state's

1150
01:11:30,880 --> 01:11:34,400
history.
Go to deseretflag.com or check

1151
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:38,000
out the link in this episode's
page, Show Notes and get yours

1152
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:40,000
today.
Can't get enough of the Mormon

1153
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:42,880
Renegade Podcast?
Well, good news, we're on

1154
01:11:42,880 --> 01:11:45,320
Patreon and there's three
packages that you can choose

1155
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:47,480
from.
The first one, the Slightly

1156
01:11:47,480 --> 01:11:50,760
Rowdy package, allows you to
hear the podcast without all

1157
01:11:50,760 --> 01:11:52,720
those pesky commercials getting
in the way.

1158
01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:55,800
For those who want a slightly
more in depth experience,

1159
01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:58,760
there's the Stirring It Up
package where you can hear ad

1160
01:11:58,760 --> 01:12:01,760
free audio, AD free video and
transcripts.

1161
01:12:02,240 --> 01:12:05,640
Finally, for those who want to
go full Renegade, that package

1162
01:12:05,640 --> 01:12:08,280
is available too, where you can
get everything in the previous

1163
01:12:08,280 --> 01:12:12,360
two packages plus an extra show
where myself and Ben Winfield

1164
01:12:12,600 --> 01:12:15,480
breakdown the news of the day
from a very Mormon point of

1165
01:12:15,480 --> 01:12:17,560
view.
You will also get exclusive

1166
01:12:17,560 --> 01:12:21,320
access to Renegade chat and on
there you'll be able to talk to

1167
01:12:21,320 --> 01:12:23,800
others about the show or
whatever topics are on your

1168
01:12:23,800 --> 01:12:26,680
mind.
Go to Patreon today and get your

1169
01:12:26,680 --> 01:12:29,400
exclusive content.
You can kind of discern it

1170
01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:32,520
fairly quickly, whether the
people are there to serve him or

1171
01:12:32,520 --> 01:12:34,880
he's there to serve the people.
Right.

1172
01:12:35,800 --> 01:12:39,800
And it's going to become kind of
apparent if you're if you, if

1173
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:41,400
you go into it with your eyes
open.

1174
01:12:41,880 --> 01:12:46,800
Right.
Now it's been said before this

1175
01:12:46,800 --> 01:12:47,720
statement.
I love it.

1176
01:12:48,880 --> 01:12:53,360
It says that he who will not
reason is a bigot.

1177
01:12:53,960 --> 01:12:58,240
He who cannot reason is a fool,
and he who dare not reason is a

1178
01:12:58,240 --> 01:13:03,080
slave.
And I think we can all think of

1179
01:13:03,080 --> 01:13:06,120
examples in our lives where we
met someone in in all three of

1180
01:13:06,120 --> 01:13:09,080
those categories.
But I I I dare say that the

1181
01:13:09,080 --> 01:13:11,320
majority of people fall under
the third category.

1182
01:13:12,120 --> 01:13:15,000
Right.
Most people are intelligent and

1183
01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:19,400
most people are, you know,
willing to consider things, but

1184
01:13:19,400 --> 01:13:24,640
where they dare not.
Meaning they don't dare question

1185
01:13:25,440 --> 01:13:29,440
authority in any degree,
especially authority that they

1186
01:13:29,440 --> 01:13:34,320
have great respect for.
Then at that point they're not

1187
01:13:34,320 --> 01:13:38,160
necessarily giving the support
to those people that they

1188
01:13:38,160 --> 01:13:42,720
should, but they're more
sycophants and they dare not

1189
01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:46,240
reason if it.
If they feel that that reasoning

1190
01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:49,040
is going to take them somewhere
that doesn't agree with them.

1191
01:13:50,320 --> 01:13:54,720
And I'm not saying that and and
and that I think people can be

1192
01:13:54,720 --> 01:13:58,520
wrong, right and wrong at the
same time.

1193
01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:01,080
Just because you question
someone doesn't mean you're

1194
01:14:01,080 --> 01:14:02,400
going to throw them under the
bus.

1195
01:14:02,960 --> 01:14:05,880
Right.
But quite frankly, if you take

1196
01:14:05,880 --> 01:14:08,600
that attitude and you do support
someone, I think you'll be a

1197
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:11,880
greater support to them because
you'll be able to tell them.

1198
01:14:11,880 --> 01:14:14,280
Watch out for these pitfalls.
Yeah.

1199
01:14:14,760 --> 01:14:19,400
You'll be in a position to
sustain them from a greater,

1200
01:14:19,400 --> 01:14:22,760
from a position of strength
rather than one of weakness that

1201
01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:25,520
this is one of the, well, this
is one of the things that made

1202
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:31,000
the US military so successful is
that commanding officers

1203
01:14:31,000 --> 01:14:33,960
generally taught their job to
the rank below them, right.

1204
01:14:34,360 --> 01:14:37,280
So if anything was to happen to
them, the chain of command would

1205
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:39,000
remain.
Right.

1206
01:14:39,280 --> 01:14:43,880
And a lot of these other, like
let's talk about the, the Iraqi

1207
01:14:43,880 --> 01:14:46,200
Republican Republican Guard for
instance.

1208
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:49,920
They were kind of an elite
group, but they had a very

1209
01:14:50,760 --> 01:14:55,440
tiered line of authority and
there was no fraternizing at all

1210
01:14:55,440 --> 01:14:58,760
between officers and enlisted
men and so forth.

1211
01:14:59,920 --> 01:15:02,880
It was, it was kind of like a
nobility thing, nobility and

1212
01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:05,520
peasants.
So yeah, you kill off an

1213
01:15:05,520 --> 01:15:07,840
officer, the army doesn't know
what to do.

1214
01:15:09,120 --> 01:15:11,080
Got you.
But it actually shoots itself in

1215
01:15:11,080 --> 01:15:15,480
the foot, right.
And by sharing an authority and

1216
01:15:15,480 --> 01:15:20,360
by sharing and delegating, the
American military became

1217
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:23,320
extremely powerful.
Right, Because it would.

1218
01:15:23,440 --> 01:15:26,520
Kill off officers and we still
had people competent enough to

1219
01:15:26,520 --> 01:15:28,320
lead.
Right.

1220
01:15:29,160 --> 01:15:32,360
OK, Interesting.
And and yeah, going back now.

1221
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:34,920
And and that makes me go back to
what?

1222
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:40,320
What those early brethren?
Brethren's idea was about the

1223
01:15:40,320 --> 01:15:43,680
apostasy, right?
It wasn't simply killing off the

1224
01:15:43,680 --> 01:15:47,360
appointed servants.
It was more a turning away of

1225
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:52,000
the ordinances and changing some
stuff, the apostasy not

1226
01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:55,840
necessarily killing them off,
because theoretically there

1227
01:15:55,840 --> 01:15:58,960
there could have been enough men
in there to to perpetuate that

1228
01:15:58,960 --> 01:16:00,960
with the 12.
That's that's OK that's

1229
01:16:00,960 --> 01:16:02,400
fascinating.
That's.

1230
01:16:02,480 --> 01:16:06,800
Not only that, but if you look
at Catholic claim to authority

1231
01:16:07,560 --> 01:16:10,960
in modern times, they'll show
you a line of ordination all the

1232
01:16:10,960 --> 01:16:13,720
way back to Peter.
Right.

1233
01:16:14,520 --> 01:16:16,360
Yeah.
So if we're going to believe so

1234
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:19,880
from my standpoint and then this
might be oversimplified and to

1235
01:16:19,880 --> 01:16:21,560
some people probably a straw
man.

1236
01:16:22,080 --> 01:16:29,280
But I think that simplicity is
actually quite, quite deep.

1237
01:16:29,360 --> 01:16:33,200
In a way, Yeah.
Because if we are to believe

1238
01:16:33,360 --> 01:16:37,600
that one man doctrine does an A
doctrine to to be held

1239
01:16:37,600 --> 01:16:40,400
inviolate, then why aren't we
Catholic?

1240
01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:44,400
Because they can, they can
actually state that the the the

1241
01:16:44,400 --> 01:16:48,440
keys were handed to Peter by the
Lord himself and and that those

1242
01:16:48,480 --> 01:16:51,240
were handed on to what they call
Apostolic succession.

1243
01:16:51,480 --> 01:16:53,560
Yeah, yeah.
No, you you asked a good

1244
01:16:53,560 --> 01:16:56,320
question.
Yeah, yeah, it.

1245
01:16:56,600 --> 01:16:58,320
Yeah.
I I suppose if you were going to

1246
01:16:58,320 --> 01:17:02,080
hold hold to that that one man
doctrine being inviolate, that

1247
01:17:02,080 --> 01:17:06,920
that the guy who has the keys
can never lead you astray, Yeah.

1248
01:17:07,600 --> 01:17:10,640
Well, obviously one of those
guys somewhere along the line

1249
01:17:10,640 --> 01:17:14,120
did lead us astray or we
wouldn't have a necessity for a

1250
01:17:14,120 --> 01:17:17,320
restoration.
Well, and I think the same

1251
01:17:17,320 --> 01:17:20,640
argument could be applied to to
Mormon fundamentalism, correct?

1252
01:17:21,160 --> 01:17:26,920
If if the one guy can never lead
you astray, then none of us

1253
01:17:26,920 --> 01:17:31,520
should be living fundamentalist
principles at this point, right?

1254
01:17:31,520 --> 01:17:35,080
Because the one man said no, no,
those.

1255
01:17:35,080 --> 01:17:36,840
You don't need to worry about
those anymore.

1256
01:17:38,120 --> 01:17:40,200
You know, I kind of know how to
get around that.

1257
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:43,240
And you know, they say that, you
know, yeah, Wilford Woodruff

1258
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:48,040
made some statements, but
secretly he, he made provisions

1259
01:17:48,040 --> 01:17:51,880
for it to continue.
And that John Taylor, you know,

1260
01:17:51,880 --> 01:17:56,400
ordained these gentlemen at the
8 hour meeting and apparently

1261
01:17:56,400 --> 01:17:59,040
they were kind of held him in
limbo until the church gave him

1262
01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:01,160
up and then they sprung up and
started.

1263
01:18:02,400 --> 01:18:04,800
Historically, there's a lot of
issues with that interpretation

1264
01:18:04,800 --> 01:18:09,080
of the events.
From what I've been able to read

1265
01:18:09,160 --> 01:18:13,120
in the history of those events
is that John Taylor set been

1266
01:18:13,120 --> 01:18:16,720
apart to keep the principal
alive because some of the men

1267
01:18:17,040 --> 01:18:20,480
that he called to do that
already had the fullness men

1268
01:18:20,480 --> 01:18:25,960
like George Q Cannon and what's
his name, the old John Nuttall.

1269
01:18:26,640 --> 01:18:30,440
OK.
Those men already had some of

1270
01:18:30,440 --> 01:18:35,800
this stuff, and so I don't think
it was an issue of handing over

1271
01:18:35,800 --> 01:18:38,000
keys per Southeast.
Right.

1272
01:18:39,040 --> 01:18:41,880
It was a charge to keep these
things alive to some men that

1273
01:18:41,880 --> 01:18:44,960
had the keys, and to those who
didn't have the keys, a charge

1274
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:48,640
to obtain them.
Now we have record that John

1275
01:18:48,640 --> 01:18:51,520
Wooley was given the 2nd
anointing not too long

1276
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:54,880
afterwards.
But you know, considering some

1277
01:18:54,880 --> 01:18:59,440
of the I'm thinking of a letter
that John Taylor wrote to state

1278
01:18:59,440 --> 01:19:02,800
presidents across the church
saying that they've been

1279
01:19:02,800 --> 01:19:06,640
negligent in seeking out and
recommending people for the 2nd

1280
01:19:06,640 --> 01:19:11,640
Anointing.
And he says we encourage you to

1281
01:19:11,640 --> 01:19:16,520
actively seek out brethren
within your stakes that would

1282
01:19:16,520 --> 01:19:20,600
qualify and bring them to us for
consideration, recommend them

1283
01:19:21,360 --> 01:19:25,120
for consideration.
And he says, as presidents, as

1284
01:19:25,120 --> 01:19:30,360
state presidents, we presume you
have yours if you do not rectify

1285
01:19:30,360 --> 01:19:34,040
this at your earliest
convenience or as soon as

1286
01:19:34,040 --> 01:19:34,840
possible.
Kind of.

1287
01:19:35,640 --> 01:19:38,720
So with that in mind, there's
quite a few people with the

1288
01:19:38,720 --> 01:19:40,440
keys.
Right.

1289
01:19:41,080 --> 01:19:47,680
And when John Taylor was was
subpoenaed to to take the

1290
01:19:47,680 --> 01:19:51,720
witness stand in the Rutger
Clausen trial, he was asked if

1291
01:19:51,720 --> 01:19:56,080
the authority came from him, you
know, to affect plural marriages

1292
01:19:56,080 --> 01:19:57,440
when the church.
And he said he did.

1293
01:19:58,200 --> 01:20:03,640
And he says, so how is it if
you're not directly directing

1294
01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:07,080
them, how is it happening?
And and he made a statement that

1295
01:20:07,080 --> 01:20:10,080
there are hundreds who've been
given the authority to

1296
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:13,080
perpetuate A to perform a plural
marriage.

1297
01:20:13,960 --> 01:20:16,680
And he was asked, would you be
so kind as to give us a list?

1298
01:20:17,280 --> 01:20:19,080
And he said, no, I would not be
so kind.

1299
01:20:19,280 --> 01:20:21,960
And he went on to say that I
make it my business not to know

1300
01:20:23,360 --> 01:20:27,960
interesting.
So I don't know how John Taylor

1301
01:20:27,960 --> 01:20:29,600
actually stood on the one man
issue.

1302
01:20:30,040 --> 01:20:32,640
It seems to me like the early
Brethren kind of bought into

1303
01:20:32,640 --> 01:20:35,640
that idea early on.
I mean, this is kind of

1304
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:40,360
evidenced by the fact that Orson
High, Orson Pratt, the same day

1305
01:20:40,360 --> 01:20:43,840
that the revelation of plural
marriage was brought to before

1306
01:20:43,840 --> 01:20:45,440
the People.
He made a statement to that

1307
01:20:45,440 --> 01:20:49,160
effect.
And later on, I think I read it

1308
01:20:49,160 --> 01:20:51,440
in Fred Collier's unpublished
revelations.

1309
01:20:51,440 --> 01:20:56,520
He he had a resolution where the
Brethren there resolved that

1310
01:20:56,520 --> 01:20:59,520
only one man can hold the keys.
I thought it was interesting

1311
01:20:59,520 --> 01:21:03,720
that he put it under unpublished
revelations when that particular

1312
01:21:03,720 --> 01:21:07,240
thing's not a revelation at all,
it says we resolved it was a

1313
01:21:07,240 --> 01:21:08,560
vote.
Right.

1314
01:21:09,280 --> 01:21:13,320
And so I'm I'm not debating the
idea that some of the early

1315
01:21:13,320 --> 01:21:17,640
brethren or even a good deal of
them believe this way, because I

1316
01:21:17,640 --> 01:21:20,680
don't believe that, you know,
the church just all one day had

1317
01:21:20,680 --> 01:21:23,760
this situation and that Mormon
fundamentalist just followed

1318
01:21:23,760 --> 01:21:27,440
suit.
I think the I think the roots of

1319
01:21:27,440 --> 01:21:29,640
that were actually established
pretty early on.

1320
01:21:30,000 --> 01:21:34,400
But the one thing that I say is
the revelation of 1880 argues

1321
01:21:34,400 --> 01:21:37,640
against one man ISM.
And as you know the revelation

1322
01:21:37,640 --> 01:21:41,600
of 1880 was was revealed to
Wilford Woodruff when he was in

1323
01:21:41,600 --> 01:21:44,960
Sunset, Arizona and he was
asking about the political

1324
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:46,920
conditions of the church at the
time.

1325
01:21:47,680 --> 01:21:49,640
What are they to do?
You know he's he's pretty

1326
01:21:49,640 --> 01:21:53,760
humbled and asking you know what
kind of the situation is pretty

1327
01:21:53,760 --> 01:21:55,520
hard.
Well, you know, how do we deal

1328
01:21:55,520 --> 01:21:57,600
with this.
And it's interesting that the

1329
01:21:57,600 --> 01:22:03,600
Lord says ask them the question
if they if, if, if they didn't

1330
01:22:03,600 --> 01:22:06,040
have the apostleship, which is
the greatest authority given to

1331
01:22:06,040 --> 01:22:09,400
men on earth.
The Lord answers for them and

1332
01:22:09,400 --> 01:22:13,080
says yes, each and everyone of
you, you hold the keys in common

1333
01:22:13,600 --> 01:22:15,520
and it's.
And then it goes on to say that

1334
01:22:15,520 --> 01:22:18,280
if any one of you received
revelation on behalf of my

1335
01:22:18,280 --> 01:22:21,920
church and Kingdom, you are to
present it in your counsels.

1336
01:22:23,040 --> 01:22:25,960
And I think that's interesting
because it's plural counsels

1337
01:22:26,240 --> 01:22:28,760
you're presented in your
counsels.

1338
01:22:28,760 --> 01:22:36,280
And if they by common consent
deem it wise to to give it to

1339
01:22:36,280 --> 01:22:41,440
the people, then let my servant
John you're let my it says, let

1340
01:22:41,440 --> 01:22:46,560
my servant, your president John
Taylor be voice to the people.

1341
01:22:47,000 --> 01:22:50,840
For this is the order of the the
church and Kingdom of God in in

1342
01:22:50,840 --> 01:22:54,160
every generation.
But what I took away from that,

1343
01:22:54,680 --> 01:22:57,560
and it goes on to say, for all
the burden should not be upon

1344
01:22:57,560 --> 01:22:59,800
one man.
And So what I took away from

1345
01:22:59,800 --> 01:23:04,360
that was that the Lord was
correcting the brethren, because

1346
01:23:04,360 --> 01:23:06,800
when you read it, it is given
the spirit of correction.

1347
01:23:07,320 --> 01:23:10,320
Or what's the point of being
that specific about it?

1348
01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:12,640
Right.
If they already knew.

1349
01:23:13,160 --> 01:23:15,680
Right.
He makes a special point in

1350
01:23:15,680 --> 01:23:19,200
telling them for all the burden
should not be on one man and it

1351
01:23:19,200 --> 01:23:24,120
goes on to say this way you may
uphold him or those who are

1352
01:23:24,120 --> 01:23:26,200
called to preside.
Right.

1353
01:23:26,720 --> 01:23:29,280
So so yeah.
I'm not.

1354
01:23:29,280 --> 01:23:33,480
I'm not I'm not going to be
disingenuous and say that this

1355
01:23:33,480 --> 01:23:35,400
is something that came up later
on or whatever.

1356
01:23:35,400 --> 01:23:38,800
No, it's it's pretty early on.
But the one thing I I never

1357
01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:42,680
really have read is from Joseph
Smith where he as a matter of

1358
01:23:42,680 --> 01:23:45,360
fact he seems to give an awful
lot of things that seem to

1359
01:23:45,360 --> 01:23:50,760
counter the one man ISM.
There is one entry in the Joseph

1360
01:23:50,760 --> 01:23:56,400
Smith Journal that speaks of him
being the only man and or saying

1361
01:23:56,440 --> 01:23:58,960
I'm the one who holds the keys
and there's never but one on the

1362
01:23:58,960 --> 01:24:02,480
earth on whom this is conferred.
And I've always said that a man

1363
01:24:02,480 --> 01:24:05,040
should have but one wife unless
the Lord directs otherwise.

1364
01:24:05,880 --> 01:24:09,600
Well, for the sake of argument,
I do have a question on that

1365
01:24:09,600 --> 01:24:12,800
particular entry because there
is evidence that there was some

1366
01:24:13,440 --> 01:24:17,240
interjection that wasn't there
originally, but I can't make

1367
01:24:17,240 --> 01:24:19,920
that charge and say that that's
actually the case.

1368
01:24:20,480 --> 01:24:23,520
It's just it's open to that
probability.

1369
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:26,720
But even for the sake of
argument, even if I was to

1370
01:24:26,720 --> 01:24:31,240
accept it as as completely
historical, the wording is still

1371
01:24:31,240 --> 01:24:35,120
the same as it is in section
132, that it is conferred upon

1372
01:24:35,120 --> 01:24:37,320
them one at a time.
And then the fact that he

1373
01:24:37,440 --> 01:24:40,360
equates that with I have said
that men are to have but one

1374
01:24:40,360 --> 01:24:42,440
wife unless the Lord directs
otherwise.

1375
01:24:43,160 --> 01:24:46,000
You can almost tie that into the
man who the man who holds the

1376
01:24:46,000 --> 01:24:47,360
keys.
Right.

1377
01:24:48,080 --> 01:24:53,240
That you know there it's only
one at a time on the earth, You

1378
01:24:53,240 --> 01:24:56,640
know, I'm the one who has it.
And when he made that statement,

1379
01:24:56,640 --> 01:24:58,560
I wonder if he was the only man
still.

1380
01:24:59,480 --> 01:25:04,080
Right.
So maybe some of the historians

1381
01:25:04,080 --> 01:25:07,040
out there might be able to
pinpoint the date that when he

1382
01:25:07,040 --> 01:25:12,760
said that, as opposed to the
date when he began to ordain

1383
01:25:12,760 --> 01:25:16,400
others or anoint others as kings
and priests.

1384
01:25:17,000 --> 01:25:21,600
Well, and and yeah that would
that would be a I'll have to

1385
01:25:21,600 --> 01:25:24,880
take a look at that.
But yeah, because as we alluded

1386
01:25:24,880 --> 01:25:27,960
to before, there was a point at
which Joseph was the only guy

1387
01:25:27,960 --> 01:25:32,040
that held it and then he gave it
to Hiram I think 1st.

1388
01:25:32,480 --> 01:25:36,800
And then from there, during
Joseph's last charge, if you

1389
01:25:36,800 --> 01:25:41,360
will, he at at some point there
he he rolls all of those keys

1390
01:25:41,360 --> 01:25:43,840
back onto the quorum of the 12.
Right.

1391
01:25:44,360 --> 01:25:49,480
And so yeah no he that's that's
a good way of of looking at that

1392
01:25:49,480 --> 01:25:53,600
too is at that point he could
have been the only guy that held

1393
01:25:53,600 --> 01:25:55,840
up.
Well, I just want to make a a

1394
01:25:55,840 --> 01:26:02,840
certain statement here.
Section 124 is based on a

1395
01:26:02,840 --> 01:26:06,520
revelation that was received on
January 19th, 1841.

1396
01:26:07,400 --> 01:26:11,360
And this is the one that that
that says that the the keys,

1397
01:26:11,880 --> 01:26:14,920
even those of the Holy Spirit of
promise for to be given to Hiram

1398
01:26:14,920 --> 01:26:20,920
Smith 124.
If you read verses 92 through

1399
01:26:20,920 --> 01:26:25,120
95, it gives you the nature of
those keys, which is the same

1400
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:27,320
ones that we've been talking
about with Peter, James and John

1401
01:26:27,320 --> 01:26:30,040
and others.
You know, being able to record

1402
01:26:30,400 --> 01:26:32,800
on earth, to be recorded in
heaven or bind on earth, to be

1403
01:26:32,800 --> 01:26:37,560
bound in heaven and so forth.
And 124 verse 124 goes on to say

1404
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:41,600
that Hiram is to be patriarch,
to have the ceiling keys of my

1405
01:26:41,600 --> 01:26:43,520
church, even the Holy Spirit of
promise.

1406
01:26:44,320 --> 01:26:47,760
So it's there stating that Hiram
is to have these.

1407
01:26:48,400 --> 01:26:52,120
And we do have an instance where
Joseph gets after Hiram because

1408
01:26:52,120 --> 01:26:54,560
he performed a plural marriage.
Right.

1409
01:26:55,200 --> 01:26:58,680
And Joseph was came down on him
pretty hard over that.

1410
01:26:59,440 --> 01:27:02,640
But the thing I would like to
bring the note is there's a

1411
01:27:02,640 --> 01:27:06,000
difference between a revelation
saying you are to be given the

1412
01:27:06,000 --> 01:27:09,040
keys and actually receiving the
keys.

1413
01:27:09,600 --> 01:27:14,200
Got you.
Now as a note it's stated in

1414
01:27:14,440 --> 01:27:18,000
Joseph Smith's journal on under
September 28th, 1843.

1415
01:27:18,600 --> 01:27:22,360
It states that Baruch Ehle was
anointed a king and a priest

1416
01:27:22,360 --> 01:27:26,280
along with his wife, queen and
priestess, and in that was

1417
01:27:26,280 --> 01:27:29,840
sustained as president of that
society by the common consent of

1418
01:27:29,840 --> 01:27:34,080
its members.
Well, I don't know the semantics

1419
01:27:34,080 --> 01:27:36,800
of how Joseph received
everything because there's their

1420
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:41,360
statements in 132 verses 45 and
46 where the Lord says I gave

1421
01:27:41,360 --> 01:27:44,440
this to Joseph, Joseph you know,
like stating he personally gave

1422
01:27:44,440 --> 01:27:47,320
it to him.
But it seems to indicate to me

1423
01:27:47,320 --> 01:27:51,040
that Hiram probably wasn't
anointed till around that time

1424
01:27:51,040 --> 01:27:53,080
at least.
OK, so.

1425
01:27:53,200 --> 01:27:57,480
Joseph is being Joseph is being
anointed here in September 28th,

1426
01:27:57,480 --> 01:28:03,280
1843, because we know that he's
Baruch Gale spoken of in that in

1427
01:28:03,280 --> 01:28:07,920
that instance and so and then
when you have section 124 is

1428
01:28:07,920 --> 01:28:11,640
revealed in 1841, there was a
lapse of time between the

1429
01:28:11,640 --> 01:28:16,680
revelation of Hiram having
received these revelation saying

1430
01:28:16,680 --> 01:28:20,280
that Hiram is to receive these
keys from the time he actually

1431
01:28:20,280 --> 01:28:22,520
received them.
And it's possible that Hiram,

1432
01:28:22,520 --> 01:28:25,320
misunderstanding the revelation,
acted on it.

1433
01:28:25,960 --> 01:28:30,480
I understand.
OK, so Hiram's in in in 124

1434
01:28:31,280 --> 01:28:35,960
Hiram is promised that at some
point he'll receive those keys,

1435
01:28:36,400 --> 01:28:43,160
which again was in in October.
Excuse me, looks like October.

1436
01:28:43,920 --> 01:28:47,880
January, January 19th, 1841.
OK.

1437
01:28:48,240 --> 01:28:51,960
All right.
And we don't have Joseph

1438
01:28:52,680 --> 01:28:56,200
receiving it actually until
1843, right?

1439
01:28:56,680 --> 01:28:59,920
Yeah, I I have to say, make a
special note there.

1440
01:29:00,280 --> 01:29:02,880
It's one thing that's
interesting is the brethren that

1441
01:29:02,880 --> 01:29:05,000
received these under the hand of
Joseph Smith.

1442
01:29:05,800 --> 01:29:07,880
When they built the temple in
Naboo, they repeated the

1443
01:29:07,880 --> 01:29:09,320
ordinance.
OK.

1444
01:29:09,760 --> 01:29:14,680
And I think, you know, I'm just,
I'm just speculating here, but I

1445
01:29:14,680 --> 01:29:17,080
think they did it so that it's
done in more proper order.

1446
01:29:17,760 --> 01:29:20,240
Gotcha.
And it's possible that Joseph

1447
01:29:20,240 --> 01:29:24,440
had it redone by a human hand,
as possibly gave it to someone

1448
01:29:24,440 --> 01:29:26,080
else 1st, and then they did it
to him.

1449
01:29:26,600 --> 01:29:29,760
Gotcha, gotcha.
Much like what happened down in

1450
01:29:29,760 --> 01:29:35,000
in at at the Susquehanna River
with the the baptisms with him

1451
01:29:35,000 --> 01:29:37,800
and Oliver Cowdry.
Right now.

1452
01:29:37,920 --> 01:29:41,040
If we if we read section section
124 verse 124.

1453
01:29:41,040 --> 01:29:45,960
It's my memory's a little fuzzy
but I think if I remember

1454
01:29:45,960 --> 01:29:48,920
correctly it I'm going to make a
point with it.

1455
01:29:49,560 --> 01:29:51,680
OK.
Says First I give unto you,

1456
01:29:51,680 --> 01:29:56,640
Hiram Smith, to be a patriarch
unto you, to hold the sealing

1457
01:29:56,640 --> 01:30:00,480
blessings of my church, even the
Holy Spirit of promise, whereby

1458
01:30:00,480 --> 01:30:03,760
you are sealed up unto the day
of redemption, that ye may not

1459
01:30:03,760 --> 01:30:06,880
fall, notwithstanding the hour
of temptation that may come upon

1460
01:30:06,880 --> 01:30:08,960
you.
Notice here it says to be.

1461
01:30:09,480 --> 01:30:12,480
Right.
And then to hold, so it's

1462
01:30:12,480 --> 01:30:15,480
speaking in the future tense.
Right, I mean.

1463
01:30:15,960 --> 01:30:18,280
It could have happened
immediately thereafter, but

1464
01:30:19,200 --> 01:30:21,720
Judge, judging by the historical
record, I don't think so.

1465
01:30:22,880 --> 01:30:26,080
Gotcha.
Because as we know, Hiram was

1466
01:30:26,080 --> 01:30:28,400
opposed to the principal until
he was converted.

1467
01:30:29,120 --> 01:30:30,760
OK.
All right.

1468
01:30:30,760 --> 01:30:34,200
And a lot of that we're talking
about is actually revolves

1469
01:30:34,200 --> 01:30:37,440
around section 1213132 quite a
bit.

1470
01:30:38,360 --> 01:30:43,960
Right now, if this is the case,
so often we look at 1:32 as

1471
01:30:43,960 --> 01:30:48,320
simply being about ceilings or
plural marriages or those sorts

1472
01:30:48,320 --> 01:30:50,480
of things.
But given the context, we've

1473
01:30:50,480 --> 01:30:57,680
looked at this and this could be
an A, a not just about that, but

1474
01:30:57,680 --> 01:31:02,760
also about receiving keys and
and understanding authority and

1475
01:31:02,760 --> 01:31:04,880
and power of the priesthood as
well, right?

1476
01:31:05,880 --> 01:31:08,920
Interesting.
Which should really change

1477
01:31:09,680 --> 01:31:12,880
'cause I could kind of get how
people could have read that in

1478
01:31:12,880 --> 01:31:14,560
there.
Then if they're not

1479
01:31:14,560 --> 01:31:17,840
understanding fully the context
of what they're reading about,

1480
01:31:17,840 --> 01:31:21,760
right, 'cause in, in in from an
LDS perspective.

1481
01:31:21,760 --> 01:31:26,160
And I'd say even from in in in
fundamentalism, if you're kind

1482
01:31:26,160 --> 01:31:31,120
of brought up about it and you
know you keep going back to 132

1483
01:31:31,120 --> 01:31:34,600
to talk about ceilings or about
plural marriage, you just make

1484
01:31:34,600 --> 01:31:37,440
the assumption that's what it's
all about.

1485
01:31:37,560 --> 01:31:42,200
But I guess an honest reading of
it, or or a more nuanced reading

1486
01:31:42,200 --> 01:31:45,280
of it might point out that the
Lord could be talking about

1487
01:31:45,280 --> 01:31:48,240
something else in conjunction
with all of these things.

1488
01:31:48,240 --> 01:31:50,640
Because he's talking to you
about, Yeah.

1489
01:31:50,640 --> 01:31:53,720
If you want to be sealed, if you
want to live plural marriage and

1490
01:31:53,720 --> 01:31:57,560
have those be eternal, you have
to 1st understand keys and

1491
01:31:57,560 --> 01:31:58,880
authority.
Right.

1492
01:31:59,240 --> 01:32:04,000
And you know to to piggyback on
what you just said at the very

1493
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:05,920
beginning.
It says, You know, Verily, I

1494
01:32:05,920 --> 01:32:07,880
saith the Lord unto you, my
servant Joseph.

1495
01:32:08,600 --> 01:32:11,600
And as much as you've inquired
of me to nowhere, and I

1496
01:32:12,280 --> 01:32:13,680
justified my servants, Abraham,
you know.

1497
01:32:14,320 --> 01:32:17,480
And it says, I will answer the
pretending to this matter.

1498
01:32:17,480 --> 01:32:23,280
It's it's not just notice how
the purpose isn't to say I'm

1499
01:32:23,280 --> 01:32:27,080
going to reveal to you Pearl
marriage, but why I justified my

1500
01:32:27,080 --> 01:32:28,920
servants in it.
Right.

1501
01:32:29,440 --> 01:32:34,880
And so the Lord unpacks it as
This is much bigger than just

1502
01:32:34,880 --> 01:32:38,800
marriage, right?
It's marriage as it relates to

1503
01:32:38,800 --> 01:32:40,680
authority.
Gotcha.

1504
01:32:41,840 --> 01:32:47,600
And it's basically really, I
think a lot of people

1505
01:32:47,680 --> 01:32:52,640
underestimate how much is really
packaged in that section gotcha.

1506
01:32:53,240 --> 01:32:56,920
But if you take that section
cross reference, it was Section

1507
01:32:56,920 --> 01:33:00,440
84.
It's gonna give you a much

1508
01:33:00,440 --> 01:33:02,560
deeper understanding of what
it's talking about.

1509
01:33:04,120 --> 01:33:06,840
Interesting.
Like like I already showed you

1510
01:33:06,840 --> 01:33:14,680
how you know verse 26 really
fits the the mold of what is

1511
01:33:14,680 --> 01:33:17,160
referred to as the oath and
covenant that which belongeth to

1512
01:33:17,160 --> 01:33:22,280
the priesthood in section 84.
See this to me is another

1513
01:33:22,320 --> 01:33:25,280
indicator that Joseph Smith was
a true prophet.

1514
01:33:26,040 --> 01:33:29,400
Because you have this
consistency throughout the

1515
01:33:29,400 --> 01:33:35,000
scriptures, you have this idea
in Section 132 that's more fully

1516
01:33:35,000 --> 01:33:38,880
developed from what is revealed
in Section 84.

1517
01:33:39,320 --> 01:33:45,000
In section 84 is really giving
you an outline of what you'll

1518
01:33:45,000 --> 01:33:48,160
eventually find in Section 132,
right?

1519
01:33:48,240 --> 01:33:52,680
And there's there's just all
kinds of things.

1520
01:33:52,680 --> 01:33:56,160
When you begin to look into it
from that that angle, I believe

1521
01:33:56,160 --> 01:34:00,640
the Scriptures just open up in
the It's a floodgate that opens

1522
01:34:00,640 --> 01:34:04,640
up and overwhelms you almost.
Yeah, And and here's, Here's the

1523
01:34:04,680 --> 01:34:09,840
other thing, right?
Is this idea of only one guy

1524
01:34:09,840 --> 01:34:15,880
having it at a time.
Well, you then have to start

1525
01:34:15,880 --> 01:34:19,160
answering some questions, right?
If you're gonna hold to this

1526
01:34:19,160 --> 01:34:23,840
idea of of it can only be one
guy who holds these keys, which

1527
01:34:23,840 --> 01:34:26,840
is when he ordains somebody else
to receive it, 'cause we know

1528
01:34:26,840 --> 01:34:29,760
all the apostles, right?
And I'm speaking in, in the

1529
01:34:29,760 --> 01:34:35,040
traditional framework of the
hierarchy that we would be

1530
01:34:35,040 --> 01:34:39,560
familiar with within the LDS
Church or other fundamentalist

1531
01:34:39,840 --> 01:34:43,560
groups is you have your first
Presidency, you have your quorum

1532
01:34:43,560 --> 01:34:48,720
of the 12 year 70s.
And it's my understanding that

1533
01:34:48,720 --> 01:34:53,480
when Joseph gave his last
charge, he also performed

1534
01:34:53,480 --> 01:34:57,160
seconds for for the 12.
OK.

1535
01:34:57,800 --> 01:35:03,800
So if the 12 have all the same
keys, well, then this idea of

1536
01:35:04,240 --> 01:35:10,080
only one man at a time doesn't
hold water at all because at

1537
01:35:10,080 --> 01:35:15,200
that point you would have to
say, OK, then then it it becomes

1538
01:35:15,200 --> 01:35:19,120
confusion unless you have.
And and we alluded to this early

1539
01:35:19,120 --> 01:35:25,560
on Sean, we alluded to there's a
difference between presiding to

1540
01:35:25,560 --> 01:35:31,560
have order and then authority
and he's in power within the

1541
01:35:31,560 --> 01:35:35,160
priesthood.
Well, that brings me to my next

1542
01:35:35,160 --> 01:35:37,240
point.
Now, in saying this, I'm not

1543
01:35:37,240 --> 01:35:40,400
going to be authoritative with
it.

1544
01:35:41,360 --> 01:35:43,760
I'm just going to show you my
own mindset.

1545
01:35:44,560 --> 01:35:48,040
And.
In saying that, you know, I, I

1546
01:35:49,400 --> 01:35:53,840
I'm just being honest.
I believe that someone who holds

1547
01:35:53,840 --> 01:35:59,240
the priesthood can at any time
when inspired to pass that

1548
01:35:59,240 --> 01:36:06,280
priesthood on to anyone that
qualifies within or without any

1549
01:36:06,920 --> 01:36:08,800
church and or priesthood
organization.

1550
01:36:09,880 --> 01:36:12,440
I don't believe they have to
give their go ahead to make it

1551
01:36:12,440 --> 01:36:15,840
valid.
However, it would be out of

1552
01:36:15,840 --> 01:36:20,400
order for him to induct him as a
member of any organized quorum

1553
01:36:21,640 --> 01:36:27,640
without FIRST without that
quorum having a say so.

1554
01:36:28,840 --> 01:36:34,760
Gotcha.
So basically it's like, let me

1555
01:36:34,760 --> 01:36:38,320
put it this way, it's like
delivering the keys to the

1556
01:36:38,320 --> 01:36:41,960
priesthood is like giving you
the knowledge to be a doctor.

1557
01:36:42,960 --> 01:36:45,760
You now have a diploma.
You now have the keys that

1558
01:36:45,760 --> 01:36:49,120
enable you to fill a position as
a as a doctor.

1559
01:36:51,680 --> 01:36:55,440
But that doesn't mean you can go
into any hospital and start

1560
01:36:55,440 --> 01:36:57,320
practicing.
Right.

1561
01:36:58,280 --> 01:37:01,120
You have to be hired on.
You have to be approved by their

1562
01:37:01,120 --> 01:37:07,400
board, but you have the keys
that qualify you to act in any

1563
01:37:07,400 --> 01:37:10,440
hospital or you can start your
own clinic.

1564
01:37:11,440 --> 01:37:14,720
Right.
And the point here becomes, is

1565
01:37:15,120 --> 01:37:20,280
the quality of your medicine and
of your knowledge now becomes

1566
01:37:20,400 --> 01:37:25,880
the the premise upon which
people will choose to come to

1567
01:37:25,880 --> 01:37:27,680
you or not.
Got you.

1568
01:37:28,840 --> 01:37:32,720
OK, so with that in mind, let me
ask this question, 'cause we

1569
01:37:32,720 --> 01:37:36,520
know Joseph did give this
authority to other men, do we

1570
01:37:36,520 --> 01:37:45,120
have any indication if if any?
Priesthood Dr., so to speak, to

1571
01:37:45,120 --> 01:37:48,040
stay with that analogy, went and
started their own clinic?

1572
01:37:49,600 --> 01:37:52,480
Well, yeah, we have Lyman White.
Right.

1573
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:55,480
That's that's a good point.
And Brigham?

1574
01:37:56,040 --> 01:38:00,160
It doesn't sound like Brigham
ever, ever really said that

1575
01:38:00,160 --> 01:38:02,360
Lyman White was doing anything
out of order.

1576
01:38:02,360 --> 01:38:06,080
He just wanted him to bring his
followers up with the rest of

1577
01:38:06,080 --> 01:38:09,040
the body of the Saints, correct?
Correct.

1578
01:38:09,040 --> 01:38:12,400
If I'm not mistaken, I may be
conflating things here, OK,

1579
01:38:12,880 --> 01:38:17,280
because I don't have it at hand
right now, but I remember

1580
01:38:17,280 --> 01:38:21,920
reading that there was, and I
think if I recall where I read

1581
01:38:21,920 --> 01:38:26,720
it, it's probably in Mysteries
of Godliness, but by David

1582
01:38:26,720 --> 01:38:29,280
Berger.
But don't hold me to that.

1583
01:38:29,760 --> 01:38:34,120
OK, but there was a dialogue
between, I believe it was Lyman

1584
01:38:34,120 --> 01:38:35,480
White.
Or it could have been Alpheus

1585
01:38:35,480 --> 01:38:38,000
Cutler or another guy by the
last name of Carter.

1586
01:38:38,640 --> 01:38:42,480
OK.
Where one says, one says to

1587
01:38:42,480 --> 01:38:47,400
Brigham, I have, I have every
authority to bear off the

1588
01:38:47,400 --> 01:38:52,160
Kingdom anywhere on the earth.
And the answer to him from

1589
01:38:52,160 --> 01:38:54,360
Brigham was actually pretty
interesting, because he said yes

1590
01:38:54,360 --> 01:38:56,160
you do.
And there are others who can

1591
01:38:56,160 --> 01:39:01,400
make that claim, but we have the
presidency of it, and the Lord

1592
01:39:01,400 --> 01:39:05,720
does not want us to be divided.
Send them to that effect.

1593
01:39:07,440 --> 01:39:10,040
And so when I saw that I was
like, that was a real

1594
01:39:10,040 --> 01:39:12,600
interesting take.
I found it interesting that

1595
01:39:12,600 --> 01:39:15,760
Brigham said, no, you don't.
He didn't say that.

1596
01:39:16,600 --> 01:39:22,840
Right now I want to read
something to you regarding.

1597
01:39:24,600 --> 01:39:27,760
It's a statement by William
Smith and I know that he's not

1598
01:39:27,760 --> 01:39:34,040
held in high regard amongst the
Brigamite branch of the of the

1599
01:39:34,040 --> 01:39:37,120
Church.
But I think his statements are

1600
01:39:37,120 --> 01:39:41,600
still pretty germane to the
subject here because he actually

1601
01:39:41,600 --> 01:39:44,800
echoes what some of the 12 said
about the last charge.

1602
01:39:46,280 --> 01:39:52,440
Now let's see page 12.
OK now, William Smith in a

1603
01:39:52,440 --> 01:39:55,480
letter to the Warsaw Signal,
said.

1604
01:39:56,760 --> 01:40:01,120
Now the date of this is January
7th, 1846, so it's it's fairly

1605
01:40:01,120 --> 01:40:03,280
close to, you know, the time of
the last charge.

1606
01:40:03,680 --> 01:40:07,800
It's only like a couple of years
removed, says I received my

1607
01:40:07,800 --> 01:40:12,080
initiation into the highest
priesthood lodge, was washed and

1608
01:40:12,080 --> 01:40:17,360
anointed and clad with sasser
dawdle, robe of pure white and

1609
01:40:17,360 --> 01:40:21,120
ordained to be a priest and a
king, and invested with all the

1610
01:40:21,120 --> 01:40:23,680
power that any man on earth ever
did possess.

1611
01:40:24,280 --> 01:40:27,040
I hold as much power, and as
many keys to seal and bind on

1612
01:40:27,040 --> 01:40:30,080
earth as can possibly belong to
Brigham Young.

1613
01:40:30,600 --> 01:40:33,760
The power was conferred equally
on all the 12, and not therefore

1614
01:40:33,760 --> 01:40:38,160
bestowed on one.
Well, yeah.

1615
01:40:38,160 --> 01:40:39,680
And.
And even if you don't like him,

1616
01:40:39,680 --> 01:40:44,200
you have to at least acknowledge
that that he's a contemporary in

1617
01:40:44,200 --> 01:40:48,560
this time period, right?
And you have to at least account

1618
01:40:48,560 --> 01:40:57,080
for him being I I don't see a a
ton here where where you know we

1619
01:40:57,080 --> 01:41:01,520
would necessarily need to call
Williams account of this into

1620
01:41:01,520 --> 01:41:05,760
question because we have Brigham
backing up the same statement as

1621
01:41:05,760 --> 01:41:07,720
you just made that many could
make that same.

1622
01:41:08,040 --> 01:41:11,800
All right, I have a couple here
just to as an example, OK?

1623
01:41:11,920 --> 01:41:15,600
Wilfred Woodruff said Said the
12 apostles had received their

1624
01:41:15,600 --> 01:41:19,440
endowment and actually received
the keys of the Kingdom of God

1625
01:41:19,880 --> 01:41:22,480
and oracles of God, keys of
revelation and pattern of

1626
01:41:22,480 --> 01:41:27,040
heavenly things.
Orson Hyde and this is found in

1627
01:41:27,040 --> 01:41:30,640
a book called The Return Volume
to page 253.

1628
01:41:31,320 --> 01:41:34,840
Orson Hyde said the 12 apostles
have been given the keys of the

1629
01:41:34,840 --> 01:41:38,800
Kingdom and every gift, key and
power that Joseph ever had

1630
01:41:38,800 --> 01:41:43,240
confirmed upon our heads by an
anointing George Miller in a

1631
01:41:43,240 --> 01:41:46,200
book called Thal Paolo
Thalaestilia.

1632
01:41:46,200 --> 01:41:51,920
I don't know why it has that
Spanish title, but that means

1633
01:41:51,920 --> 01:41:56,600
basically it refers to like
father, like son.

1634
01:41:57,040 --> 01:42:00,240
OK.
Pal Palo talo estia, Paolo being

1635
01:42:00,240 --> 01:42:05,080
the the stick, Estia is
splinter.

1636
01:42:05,960 --> 01:42:08,080
OK.
So it's like like father, like

1637
01:42:08,080 --> 01:42:11,280
son, pal, Palo talo, estia.
That's the this is where

1638
01:42:11,280 --> 01:42:13,680
sometimes where me knowing
Spanish helps, because I don't

1639
01:42:13,680 --> 01:42:15,200
think anybody could read that
from.

1640
01:42:15,560 --> 01:42:17,600
That title I couldn't.
No, it's not Spanish.

1641
01:42:18,600 --> 01:42:21,440
As many of the apostles and
elders having returned from

1642
01:42:21,440 --> 01:42:24,920
England, Joseph Washington
anointed as kings and priests of

1643
01:42:24,920 --> 01:42:28,480
God, and over the House of
Israel the following named

1644
01:42:28,480 --> 01:42:33,640
persons, as he said was
commanded of God, which is James

1645
01:42:33,640 --> 01:42:36,880
Adams, William Law, William
Marks, Willard Richards, Brigham

1646
01:42:36,880 --> 01:42:39,960
Young, Hebrew, C Kimball,
Newell, K Whitney, Hiram Smith,

1647
01:42:39,960 --> 01:42:43,480
and myself, and conferred on us
patriarchal priests of this took

1648
01:42:43,480 --> 01:42:46,520
place on the 5th and 6th of May
1842.

1649
01:42:49,040 --> 01:42:51,760
OK.
So that actually kind of gives

1650
01:42:51,760 --> 01:42:54,280
us a date there when Hiram.
Right.

1651
01:42:55,280 --> 01:42:57,800
I don't know if this was their
first endowment or not because

1652
01:42:57,800 --> 01:43:07,160
they, you know, the way William
said of it was he said to be, he

1653
01:43:07,160 --> 01:43:10,440
says, ordained to be a priest
and a king.

1654
01:43:10,920 --> 01:43:13,640
So it could be that, you know,
William was jumping the gun a

1655
01:43:13,640 --> 01:43:15,440
little bit with that.
Right.

1656
01:43:16,520 --> 01:43:22,400
But who knows, you know, But
anyway, And so from manuscript

1657
01:43:22,400 --> 01:43:25,520
history of Brigham Young, for
any person to have the fullness

1658
01:43:25,520 --> 01:43:27,680
of that priesthood, he must be a
king and a priest.

1659
01:43:28,400 --> 01:43:33,200
So you have a lot of these
statements that actually give

1660
01:43:33,560 --> 01:43:35,800
credence to what William William
Smith said.

1661
01:43:36,320 --> 01:43:37,680
Right.
I thought it was interesting

1662
01:43:37,680 --> 01:43:42,080
that William Smith came out and
said so, you know, as far as one

1663
01:43:42,080 --> 01:43:47,240
man, because he said the power
was conferred equally on all the

1664
01:43:47,240 --> 01:43:49,600
12 and not therefore bestowed on
one.

1665
01:43:54,720 --> 01:43:57,520
That's that's pretty that's
pretty convincing.

1666
01:43:59,720 --> 01:44:04,840
But anyway, as as you can see,
once once this key of knowledge

1667
01:44:04,840 --> 01:44:08,240
is given to understand what is
meant by one at a time on the

1668
01:44:08,240 --> 01:44:09,880
earth.
Right.

1669
01:44:10,360 --> 01:44:13,320
Rather than contradiction, you
now have complete harmony of

1670
01:44:13,320 --> 01:44:14,720
Scripture.
Yeah.

1671
01:44:15,880 --> 01:44:21,280
And you'll no longer have to
come up with with with pseudo

1672
01:44:21,280 --> 01:44:26,720
reasons of why like well the you
know there wasn't telephone in

1673
01:44:26,720 --> 01:44:34,760
those days or right stuff to
that to that extent And to me if

1674
01:44:34,760 --> 01:44:37,240
we look you know Hugh Nibley
made a statement about why the

1675
01:44:37,240 --> 01:44:41,800
Pope doctrine is false.
Now the Pope doctrine is that

1676
01:44:41,800 --> 01:44:49,160
all keys and powers are are held
within the the Holy See or the

1677
01:44:49,160 --> 01:44:52,680
Vicar of Christ being the Pope,
the Bishop of Rome.

1678
01:44:53,480 --> 01:44:57,680
Right.
They say that, and he goes on to

1679
01:44:57,680 --> 01:44:59,440
say why That's an incorrect
doctrine.

1680
01:45:00,760 --> 01:45:03,800
He says when when Christ gave
the keys, he didn't give it to

1681
01:45:03,800 --> 01:45:07,120
just Peter, right?
We read that the keys were given

1682
01:45:07,120 --> 01:45:12,920
to Peter, James and John, and
subsequently we can infer from

1683
01:45:12,920 --> 01:45:15,520
that that he they possibly gave
the keys to the other 12.

1684
01:45:16,600 --> 01:45:19,680
Who knows?
We don't have, we don't actually

1685
01:45:19,680 --> 01:45:21,320
have record of that that I know
of.

1686
01:45:22,360 --> 01:45:24,920
But what's really?
But they sure seem to act like

1687
01:45:24,920 --> 01:45:27,080
they did.
Yeah.

1688
01:45:27,320 --> 01:45:30,160
And the various missions that
they that they performed.

1689
01:45:31,040 --> 01:45:38,240
But anyway, Hugh Nibley used a
an analogy that I really liked,

1690
01:45:38,960 --> 01:45:41,480
he says.
The reason that the Pope

1691
01:45:41,600 --> 01:45:47,520
doctrine cannot be cannot be
true is that it's likened unto a

1692
01:45:47,520 --> 01:45:51,040
chain where you have
interconnect interconnecting

1693
01:45:51,040 --> 01:45:53,760
links through time.
And he says the strength of the

1694
01:45:53,760 --> 01:45:56,480
chain is only as strong as its
weakest link.

1695
01:45:57,840 --> 01:46:00,880
Right.
He says, but more it was like a

1696
01:46:00,880 --> 01:46:03,800
rope that the keys were given to
each strand.

1697
01:46:05,200 --> 01:46:10,400
And he says many strands can
fail, but the rope still holds.

1698
01:46:10,960 --> 01:46:14,320
Right, right.
I I can see that.

1699
01:46:14,320 --> 01:46:18,120
Yeah, yeah, 'cause in a chain,
if just one link fails, you're

1700
01:46:18,120 --> 01:46:19,600
done.
You're done.

1701
01:46:20,000 --> 01:46:23,640
The entire chain's strength is
measured by the weakest link,

1702
01:46:23,960 --> 01:46:27,120
and in one man at a time.
The way most people see it,

1703
01:46:28,000 --> 01:46:32,040
where all the authorities vested
only in one man, the whole work

1704
01:46:32,040 --> 01:46:35,360
is only as strong as the weakest
man in that link.

1705
01:46:36,160 --> 01:46:43,200
OK.
Or in that chain you can you can

1706
01:46:43,200 --> 01:46:46,520
interpret that literally to mean
that the weakest member along

1707
01:46:46,520 --> 01:46:49,440
that chain determines the
strength of the whole.

1708
01:46:50,520 --> 01:46:54,040
Right.
No, that that makes perfect

1709
01:46:54,040 --> 01:46:59,120
sense.
So I I want well. 1st.

1710
01:46:59,960 --> 01:47:03,720
Let let me ask this question,
OK.

1711
01:47:03,720 --> 01:47:07,680
Was there more that you wanted
to bring out in this before I

1712
01:47:07,680 --> 01:47:10,240
move on to to a question I want
to clarify?

1713
01:47:12,560 --> 01:47:15,200
No, I think we've kind of
covered this quite well.

1714
01:47:15,440 --> 01:47:19,800
Yeah, I do too.
I I want to go back to, but

1715
01:47:19,920 --> 01:47:26,160
never one on Earth at a time
because I I had some questions

1716
01:47:26,160 --> 01:47:29,120
there and and I'd imagine a few,
a few other people listening

1717
01:47:29,120 --> 01:47:35,080
would too.
So on Earth, at a time we we've

1718
01:47:35,080 --> 01:47:38,760
talked about that meeting that
that every time a man and and

1719
01:47:38,760 --> 01:47:42,080
his wife or wives go through
that process of receiving those

1720
01:47:42,080 --> 01:47:45,360
keys, the meeting is stopped and
then opened again.

1721
01:47:46,600 --> 01:47:50,120
If we were talking about a
worldwide institution where this

1722
01:47:50,120 --> 01:47:53,880
was being performed, couldn't
you have more than one at a time

1723
01:47:53,880 --> 01:47:56,880
on Earth receiving that if
they're in different parts of

1724
01:47:56,880 --> 01:47:58,480
the globe?
Yes.

1725
01:48:00,120 --> 01:48:04,280
Yes, so.
How does that naturally?

1726
01:48:04,360 --> 01:48:06,480
Leading into where I'd like to
clarify, but go ahead.

1727
01:48:06,640 --> 01:48:09,000
OK, so then how would that
square then?

1728
01:48:09,000 --> 01:48:12,800
Because it it talks about only
one at a time on the earth.

1729
01:48:13,440 --> 01:48:19,560
Right.
Well, I want to preface it by

1730
01:48:20,800 --> 01:48:24,600
having you read section 10 of
the Doctrine and Covenants,

1731
01:48:25,480 --> 01:48:34,000
verse 67 and 68. 1067 and 68 OK,
here we go, starting in 67

1732
01:48:34,760 --> 01:48:38,080
Behold, this is my doctrine,
Whoso repenteth, and cometh unto

1733
01:48:38,080 --> 01:48:42,920
me the same as my church.
Whosoever declareth more or less

1734
01:48:42,920 --> 01:48:46,600
than this the same, is not of
me, but is against me.

1735
01:48:46,960 --> 01:48:48,840
Therefore he is not of my
church.

1736
01:48:48,840 --> 01:48:52,840
He said 67 and 68.
Yeah.

1737
01:48:53,240 --> 01:48:56,080
OK.
Now the take away from there is

1738
01:48:56,080 --> 01:49:01,320
we generally we would generally
interpret literally the part

1739
01:49:01,320 --> 01:49:05,760
that says repent, right?
Those who repent and come on to

1740
01:49:05,760 --> 01:49:10,160
me, we we we seem to give it a
figurative or a metaphorical

1741
01:49:10,160 --> 01:49:11,480
meaning.
Right.

1742
01:49:12,720 --> 01:49:14,520
Well, let's suppose that's
literal as well.

1743
01:49:15,680 --> 01:49:19,560
Those who repent and come unto
me become my church.

1744
01:49:19,560 --> 01:49:25,440
OK, those are my church.
Now if you take the word church,

1745
01:49:26,040 --> 01:49:29,080
you know, generally speaking,
you know the we derive that word

1746
01:49:29,080 --> 01:49:32,080
from the New Testament.
And the translation of churches

1747
01:49:32,520 --> 01:49:37,040
in the Greek was Ecclesia, which
means body OK, body of Christ,

1748
01:49:37,040 --> 01:49:38,720
right?
Say it.

1749
01:49:39,280 --> 01:49:45,120
And so again, remember when we
brought out in section 84.

1750
01:49:45,600 --> 01:49:49,400
Yes, that those that that are
faithful and obtaining and

1751
01:49:49,400 --> 01:49:52,000
magnifying their priesthood
become the Church and the elect

1752
01:49:52,000 --> 01:49:53,520
of God.
Right.

1753
01:49:54,440 --> 01:49:58,240
Then it goes on to say kind of
why 'cause they receiveth my

1754
01:49:58,240 --> 01:50:01,240
servants and then they receive
me and receive my father.

1755
01:50:01,640 --> 01:50:05,240
Right.
And so the question I need to

1756
01:50:05,240 --> 01:50:09,080
ask here is what does it mean to
come unto Christ?

1757
01:50:10,320 --> 01:50:13,280
Well, I would think that
there's, there's two ways of

1758
01:50:13,280 --> 01:50:15,160
looking at this.
Just as you said, right, there's

1759
01:50:15,160 --> 01:50:19,200
a medical, metaphorical way,
which would be bringing yourself

1760
01:50:19,200 --> 01:50:21,520
into alignment with God's will,
right?

1761
01:50:22,000 --> 01:50:24,880
Doing all the things that he
asks you to do, whether that's,

1762
01:50:24,880 --> 01:50:27,360
you know, studying your
scripture, saying your prayers,

1763
01:50:27,840 --> 01:50:30,400
attending to your ordinances.
Any of those things

1764
01:50:30,560 --> 01:50:37,360
metaphorically could be coming
unto Christ I suppose, if you

1765
01:50:37,360 --> 01:50:42,920
wanted to be more literal about
it, seeking that audience with

1766
01:50:42,920 --> 01:50:49,000
the Savior that or seeing God
face to face as Moses did, as

1767
01:50:49,000 --> 01:50:56,880
Joseph did, which really is is
kind of one of the the higher

1768
01:50:56,880 --> 01:51:00,360
promises made within Mormonism,
I think is that we can't have

1769
01:51:00,360 --> 01:51:04,160
that if we're willing to pay the
price and and live live in a way

1770
01:51:04,160 --> 01:51:06,440
that would allow us to abide in
His presence.

1771
01:51:07,120 --> 01:51:15,400
Right, So I believe I will
suggest here that it's being

1772
01:51:15,400 --> 01:51:20,200
literal and I'll tell you why,
as it says to those who repent

1773
01:51:20,400 --> 01:51:23,720
and come unto me.
OK.

1774
01:51:24,320 --> 01:51:28,880
So if repenting is the coming
unto him, why is it in addition

1775
01:51:28,880 --> 01:51:32,680
to it?
OK.

1776
01:51:33,120 --> 01:51:37,960
All right.
For those who repent and come

1777
01:51:37,960 --> 01:51:41,040
unto me.
Interesting.

1778
01:51:41,040 --> 01:51:45,040
OK.
Now I'm going to Let's hold that

1779
01:51:45,040 --> 01:51:49,400
thought for a minute.
Now again, if we read verse 5

1780
01:51:50,400 --> 01:51:55,120
and section 132 where it says
that, go ahead read that.

1781
01:51:56,000 --> 01:52:00,040
For all who will have a blessing
at my hands shall oblige the law

1782
01:52:00,600 --> 01:52:04,040
which was appointed for that
blessing, and the conditions

1783
01:52:04,040 --> 01:52:07,920
thereof as were instituted from
before the foundation of the

1784
01:52:07,920 --> 01:52:10,440
world.
Right, OK.

1785
01:52:10,800 --> 01:52:14,960
It's saying for those who will
have a blessing at my hands, so

1786
01:52:15,080 --> 01:52:16,880
who's the administrator of that
blessing?

1787
01:52:17,880 --> 01:52:21,160
That would be the Savior or the
Father even.

1788
01:52:21,880 --> 01:52:27,440
Now, in that case, how many men
can be conferred?

1789
01:52:28,240 --> 01:52:30,920
Just one on the earth.
Just one.

1790
01:52:31,640 --> 01:52:36,160
Just one.
Just one so and and this is

1791
01:52:36,160 --> 01:52:40,400
fascinating because this also
gives us a glimpse into the

1792
01:52:40,400 --> 01:52:43,480
second anointing as well right.
Is that there's a part that's

1793
01:52:43,480 --> 01:52:49,040
then if I'm.
If my logic follows is there's a

1794
01:52:49,040 --> 01:52:55,560
part that's done by man and then
there's a part performed by the

1795
01:52:55,560 --> 01:52:59,240
Savior.
I would like to say that now the

1796
01:52:59,240 --> 01:53:01,640
way some people have kind of
started to interpret this,

1797
01:53:02,000 --> 01:53:05,320
interpret this, is that unless
you have the Savior's hands upon

1798
01:53:05,320 --> 01:53:09,120
you, don't have any authority.
And I wish to like Joseph S

1799
01:53:09,120 --> 01:53:11,080
Smith said, enter my solemn
protest.

1800
01:53:11,080 --> 01:53:13,280
For I know this to be false.
OK.

1801
01:53:13,680 --> 01:53:20,720
And that is you have to actually
receive these things in order to

1802
01:53:20,720 --> 01:53:23,520
qualify?
Right.

1803
01:53:23,720 --> 01:53:27,560
You have to have the keys before
you can have access.

1804
01:53:28,480 --> 01:53:33,160
Gotcha.
And part of that is perpetuating

1805
01:53:33,160 --> 01:53:35,960
that which you received.
Now if you read in section 132

1806
01:53:36,160 --> 01:53:39,480
verse seven, it's when it's
talking about being sealed by

1807
01:53:39,480 --> 01:53:42,840
the Holy Spirit of promise, it
says of him who is anointed and

1808
01:53:42,840 --> 01:53:45,240
appointed right.
Right.

1809
01:53:46,360 --> 01:53:52,360
Now I want to here make a very
strong statement about the term

1810
01:53:52,400 --> 01:53:57,080
of and the term by.
Now go back to verse 39.

1811
01:53:58,080 --> 01:54:04,040
OK, read that David's wives and
concubines were given unto him

1812
01:54:04,240 --> 01:54:08,840
of me by the hand of Nathan, my
servant, and others of the

1813
01:54:08,840 --> 01:54:11,880
prophets who had the keys of
this power.

1814
01:54:12,480 --> 01:54:16,680
OK, So what that's telling us as
it was done of God's authority,

1815
01:54:18,160 --> 01:54:19,920
but it was performed by someone
else?

1816
01:54:20,920 --> 01:54:23,560
Right.
Now initially we know that

1817
01:54:23,560 --> 01:54:27,920
Joseph Smith had this authority,
this fullness of authority and

1818
01:54:27,920 --> 01:54:31,120
power conferred upon him by the
Lord himself.

1819
01:54:31,560 --> 01:54:35,120
Right.
And things have to be done of

1820
01:54:35,120 --> 01:54:37,640
his authority.
Right.

1821
01:54:38,480 --> 01:54:42,040
Notice it's not necessarily by.
Yes.

1822
01:54:42,240 --> 01:54:44,480
It's of him who is anointed and
appointed.

1823
01:54:45,040 --> 01:54:46,840
And it says, And I have
appointed unto my servant

1824
01:54:46,840 --> 01:54:50,160
Joseph, and there is never but
one on the earth at a time on

1825
01:54:50,160 --> 01:54:56,720
whom this is conferred.
So if any of these men, even if

1826
01:54:56,720 --> 01:55:00,280
nobody, qualified to receive
that authority between US and

1827
01:55:00,280 --> 01:55:03,760
Joseph Smith, if he passed on
the keys, and they had the

1828
01:55:03,760 --> 01:55:08,640
authority to pass on the keys
down to our day, we can still

1829
01:55:08,880 --> 01:55:11,240
step up and claim that
privilege.

1830
01:55:12,080 --> 01:55:14,680
Right.
And would have the keys to do

1831
01:55:14,680 --> 01:55:16,280
so.
Yeah.

1832
01:55:16,280 --> 01:55:22,840
So I do believe there may have
been a sprinkling of people who

1833
01:55:22,840 --> 01:55:25,480
have achieved this, like John
Taylor is one I believe who did.

1834
01:55:25,840 --> 01:55:28,120
I don't have evidence to that
effect.

1835
01:55:28,480 --> 01:55:32,560
I do have evidence that he, you
know, spoke with the Savior.

1836
01:55:33,560 --> 01:55:36,160
And, well, I don't.
I'm not going to call it

1837
01:55:36,560 --> 01:55:40,000
conclusive evidence, but we have
testimony that he talked to the

1838
01:55:40,000 --> 01:55:42,080
Savior in 1886.
Right.

1839
01:55:42,680 --> 01:55:45,240
The 8 hour meeting and.
The 8 hour meeting.

1840
01:55:46,200 --> 01:55:52,800
But right there, it's it doesn't
specify whether you know the the

1841
01:55:52,800 --> 01:55:56,280
fullness was conferred upon,
confirmed upon Him by the

1842
01:55:56,280 --> 01:55:58,120
Savior.
Right.

1843
01:55:59,040 --> 01:56:00,480
We have to.
We don't have evidence of that,

1844
01:56:00,480 --> 01:56:04,240
so we don't really know.
I think we can know if we seek

1845
01:56:04,240 --> 01:56:07,960
this knowledge from God himself,
but as far as having an actual

1846
01:56:07,960 --> 01:56:10,200
record of it, we really don't.
We can only surmise.

1847
01:56:10,680 --> 01:56:15,280
Right.
But to me, what that shows the

1848
01:56:15,280 --> 01:56:19,760
of and by shows that it's done
of that authority.

1849
01:56:20,040 --> 01:56:25,880
But by whom it's done can be
different by of whom it's done.

1850
01:56:26,600 --> 01:56:30,160
Right.
No, that makes, that makes

1851
01:56:30,160 --> 01:56:31,880
sense.
OK.

1852
01:56:31,880 --> 01:56:33,720
No, that clears that up.
That's good.

1853
01:56:34,040 --> 01:56:36,960
That's one of those things I
wanted to get to get cleared up

1854
01:56:36,960 --> 01:56:42,400
here.
And so because of that because

1855
01:56:42,400 --> 01:56:46,800
we focused on the, the word of
and by we can, we can kind of

1856
01:56:46,800 --> 01:56:53,880
confer or kind of come to the
conclusion that this doesn't

1857
01:56:54,760 --> 01:56:58,480
because you maybe someone didn't
receive that personal visitation

1858
01:56:58,480 --> 01:57:01,240
yet.
They can still act in that

1859
01:57:01,240 --> 01:57:04,080
authority even without that
personal, OK.

1860
01:57:04,160 --> 01:57:07,320
Now that gets me to my next
point, and that's the difference

1861
01:57:07,320 --> 01:57:09,720
between keys and power.
OK.

1862
01:57:11,320 --> 01:57:15,080
Like we mentioned earlier, the
keys are that which enable you

1863
01:57:15,720 --> 01:57:23,760
to have access and so I think
that the power can only be given

1864
01:57:23,760 --> 01:57:29,400
to you without unconditionally
when you have met certain

1865
01:57:29,400 --> 01:57:35,680
conditions as a spoken of a
section. 7 But, and there are

1866
01:57:35,680 --> 01:57:40,000
several instances in scriptures
where the Lord confirms this

1867
01:57:40,000 --> 01:57:42,840
type of power upon his servants,
like he did with Moses, like

1868
01:57:42,960 --> 01:57:47,600
Elijah, like he did with Joshua,
like he did with like Jesus.

1869
01:57:48,960 --> 01:57:56,160
And in Helaman chapter 10,
verses 5 through 7.

1870
01:57:56,160 --> 01:57:57,640
It's really interesting what it
says there.

1871
01:57:59,040 --> 01:58:02,040
Do you have it ready or would
you like me to look it up real

1872
01:58:02,040 --> 01:58:03,440
quick?
I'm looking it up now.

1873
01:58:03,440 --> 01:58:05,360
I'm almost there.
OK.

1874
01:58:06,320 --> 01:58:09,840
Helaman What?
10/5 through seven, yeah.

1875
01:58:11,080 --> 01:58:13,760
OK.
And here it is.

1876
01:58:14,640 --> 01:58:18,920
And now, because thou hast done
this with such unweariness,

1877
01:58:19,720 --> 01:58:22,640
behold, I will bless thee
forever, and I will make thee

1878
01:58:22,640 --> 01:58:25,800
mighty in Word, and in deed, and
in faith, and in works.

1879
01:58:26,080 --> 01:58:32,120
Yeah, even that all things shall
be done unto thee, according to

1880
01:58:32,120 --> 01:58:34,680
thy word.
For thou shalt not ask that

1881
01:58:34,680 --> 01:58:38,920
which is contrary to my will.
Behold, thou art Nephi, and I am

1882
01:58:38,920 --> 01:58:41,920
God.
Behold, I declare unto thee in

1883
01:58:41,920 --> 01:58:45,280
the presence of mine angels,
that ye shall have power over

1884
01:58:45,280 --> 01:58:48,640
this people, and shall smite the
earth with famine, and with

1885
01:58:48,640 --> 01:58:51,880
pestilence and destruction,
according to the wickedness of

1886
01:58:51,880 --> 01:58:54,840
this people.
Behold, I give unto you power,

1887
01:58:55,160 --> 01:58:58,320
that whatsoever ye shall seal on
earth shall be sealed in heaven,

1888
01:58:58,320 --> 01:59:01,360
and whatsoever thou shalt loose
on earth shall be loosed in

1889
01:59:01,360 --> 01:59:05,160
heaven, and thus shall ye have
power among this people.

1890
01:59:07,480 --> 01:59:09,760
So it seems pretty.
Oh, go ahead.

1891
01:59:10,680 --> 01:59:16,360
It seems pretty intriguing to me
that he's promising him power

1892
01:59:16,360 --> 01:59:20,400
over the elements, in a way.
Yeah, Yep.

1893
01:59:21,960 --> 01:59:27,160
And this has been delivered to
to a few, very few people in

1894
01:59:27,160 --> 01:59:30,240
Scripture.
But you know, Moses, depart the

1895
01:59:30,240 --> 01:59:35,560
Red Sea, you know.
And now I do believe that even

1896
01:59:35,560 --> 01:59:38,800
before this power is granted,
you know by faith that the Lord

1897
01:59:38,800 --> 01:59:41,680
may exercise his power in your
behalf.

1898
01:59:42,360 --> 01:59:45,000
But I I believe at a certain
point he trusts you with that

1899
01:59:45,000 --> 01:59:46,400
power.
Yeah.

1900
01:59:46,880 --> 01:59:49,600
Joseph Smith once made the
statement that the Lord had told

1901
01:59:49,600 --> 01:59:54,000
him that he would have the power
to remove his enemies if all if

1902
01:59:54,040 --> 01:59:57,400
if all he did was say so.
And Joseph stated that he

1903
01:59:57,400 --> 02:00:00,160
hesitated to use that power,
lest they should repent.

1904
02:00:01,480 --> 02:00:05,120
Right.
Which shows to me that is why

1905
02:00:05,120 --> 02:00:07,000
the Lord blessed him with that
power.

1906
02:00:07,760 --> 02:00:09,800
Well, yeah.
And and it says that in five

1907
02:00:09,800 --> 02:00:14,920
there in Helaman, where it says,
for thou shalt not ask that

1908
02:00:14,920 --> 02:00:18,560
which is contrary to my will.
So the Lord is basically saying,

1909
02:00:18,560 --> 02:00:20,480
look, we've we've been together
a while.

1910
02:00:20,680 --> 02:00:23,640
I trust that your will lines up
with my will.

1911
02:00:24,080 --> 02:00:27,120
And I know you're not gonna do
anything that's contrary to my

1912
02:00:27,120 --> 02:00:31,440
will.
And so the these things I give

1913
02:00:31,440 --> 02:00:35,840
unto you and that's probably
really the qualifier I would

1914
02:00:35,840 --> 02:00:40,440
suppose to having that other
visitation, right one, one of

1915
02:00:40,440 --> 02:00:44,840
the qualifiers is that we've
aligned our will with that of

1916
02:00:44,840 --> 02:00:49,760
the fathers perfectly.
So I believe that men that have

1917
02:00:49,760 --> 02:00:55,800
received the keys are in a
position to be able to have as

1918
02:00:55,800 --> 02:01:01,200
as it were a theophany or a
personal visitation of the Lord

1919
02:01:01,200 --> 02:01:05,920
Jesus Christ.
Even the Father to it says that

1920
02:01:05,920 --> 02:01:07,360
they will take up their abode
with you.

1921
02:01:07,400 --> 02:01:11,480
It even says that the pure in
heart shall see God.

1922
02:01:12,000 --> 02:01:16,000
Right.
So there seems to be something

1923
02:01:16,000 --> 02:01:20,680
about what is you know, and I
believe a lot of that is

1924
02:01:20,680 --> 02:01:23,960
actually tied to what we term in
Mormonism as charity or the pure

1925
02:01:23,960 --> 02:01:29,480
love of Christ that we are
possessed of, that we will be

1926
02:01:29,480 --> 02:01:34,040
determined to have a pure heart.
And as a.

1927
02:01:34,040 --> 02:01:38,520
And I wish to say that that says
they shall see God and I think I

1928
02:01:38,520 --> 02:01:42,920
see a a double meaning there,
that you have become one like

1929
02:01:42,920 --> 02:01:44,880
God.
So he can't.

1930
02:01:44,880 --> 02:01:47,800
He will no longer withhold
himself from you.

1931
02:01:48,200 --> 02:01:51,760
Right.
Because you're now acclimated to

1932
02:01:51,760 --> 02:01:55,320
be in His presence and and
second of all, when you look in

1933
02:01:55,320 --> 02:01:57,160
the mirror, you behold God as
well.

1934
02:01:57,880 --> 02:02:01,360
Because we're creating his
likeness and image, right?

1935
02:02:02,000 --> 02:02:04,080
Right.
And that would go with

1936
02:02:04,240 --> 02:02:06,960
recognizing that spark of
divinity within all of us, I

1937
02:02:06,960 --> 02:02:08,240
think.
Right.

1938
02:02:09,560 --> 02:02:12,440
So basically and according to
Mormon and all men are born with

1939
02:02:12,440 --> 02:02:17,160
the spirit of Christ and Christ.
As you know, the pure love of

1940
02:02:17,160 --> 02:02:22,440
Christ is that quality that we
should all seek to magnify,

1941
02:02:22,920 --> 02:02:24,400
right?
But I do believe that spirit of

1942
02:02:24,400 --> 02:02:28,280
Christ, we were born with it,
yeah, but it's up to us to

1943
02:02:28,280 --> 02:02:32,640
nourish it or neglect it.
And in accordance with that

1944
02:02:32,640 --> 02:02:37,840
nourishment or rejection, the
more we become like God or the

1945
02:02:37,840 --> 02:02:39,320
more we become different from
Him.

1946
02:02:40,480 --> 02:02:44,720
No I I would agree and and I
think that's I go back to this

1947
02:02:44,720 --> 02:02:50,680
scripture often because even
before I I really understood

1948
02:02:51,480 --> 02:02:54,760
fundamentalism or a lot of these
deeper concepts.

1949
02:02:55,400 --> 02:02:59,400
There was something powerful
where the Savior's in the garden

1950
02:02:59,400 --> 02:03:02,360
suffering and he's like, I know
what's coming.

1951
02:03:02,400 --> 02:03:07,600
This is horrible, you know, but
not my will, your will be done

1952
02:03:08,200 --> 02:03:11,280
there.
I I I think that's hugely

1953
02:03:11,280 --> 02:03:13,840
important.
Whether we've had that second

1954
02:03:13,840 --> 02:03:18,040
anointing or not, to get to that
point to where we can align our

1955
02:03:18,040 --> 02:03:21,000
will with with that of God's, I
think that's the only thing we

1956
02:03:21,000 --> 02:03:26,080
really, truly have to surrender.
That is truly ours is our will,

1957
02:03:26,720 --> 02:03:29,040
our agency.
Right.

1958
02:03:29,960 --> 02:03:32,360
Do you have any more questions?
No, no.

1959
02:03:32,360 --> 02:03:33,840
Well, I do.
I got two more.

1960
02:03:33,960 --> 02:03:36,240
But but these are kind of
concluding questions.

1961
02:03:36,240 --> 02:03:38,840
So I want to make sure that
you've hit all the points you

1962
02:03:38,840 --> 02:03:43,480
want to hit for Sean.
No, I think that, I mean there's

1963
02:03:43,480 --> 02:03:46,640
a lot of things I can hit on,
but at some point they started

1964
02:03:46,640 --> 02:03:49,000
becoming tangential to the.
Yep, Yep.

1965
02:03:49,040 --> 02:03:52,680
And and and and I feel, look I
feel like we got we covered a

1966
02:03:52,680 --> 02:03:57,320
lot because not only did we
cover one man ISM, but we also

1967
02:03:57,320 --> 02:03:59,960
got into a pretty good
conversation about the 2nd

1968
02:03:59,960 --> 02:04:02,800
anointing as well.
So I feel like we've covered

1969
02:04:02,800 --> 02:04:08,960
some really good stuff and if
you don't want to answer this, I

1970
02:04:08,960 --> 02:04:14,360
I completely understand.
But in your estimation, what?

1971
02:04:14,360 --> 02:04:17,320
What are some of the dangers of
adhering to the one man

1972
02:04:17,320 --> 02:04:20,480
doctrine?
But what are some of the

1973
02:04:20,480 --> 02:04:25,840
dangers?
Yeah, I think it promotes.

1974
02:04:27,400 --> 02:04:29,480
I think it promotes a blind
obedience of man.

1975
02:04:32,840 --> 02:04:36,800
I think it promotes a spiritual
laziness and the individual.

1976
02:04:38,120 --> 02:04:42,320
Kind of like what Joseph Smith
said, that he likened the 14th

1977
02:04:42,320 --> 02:04:45,240
chapter of Ezekiel to the
current station, current

1978
02:04:45,240 --> 02:04:46,720
position of the Latter Day
Saints.

1979
02:04:47,560 --> 02:04:50,440
That they they neglect the
duties devolving upon themselves

1980
02:04:50,440 --> 02:04:54,040
because they rely on the Prophet
too much and therefore their

1981
02:04:54,040 --> 02:05:00,520
minds become darkened.
I believe it actually weakens

1982
02:05:01,400 --> 02:05:04,560
the faith overall.
Right where?

1983
02:05:05,840 --> 02:05:10,800
Fewer and fewer people can
answer difficult questions, and

1984
02:05:11,760 --> 02:05:16,040
I think it I think it exposes
the flock, if you will, to the

1985
02:05:16,040 --> 02:05:18,120
wolves.
Yeah.

1986
02:05:19,000 --> 02:05:21,720
Because they haven't been
equipped to think for themselves

1987
02:05:22,200 --> 02:05:26,120
and and and that when that
happens when they get an anti

1988
02:05:26,120 --> 02:05:31,040
Mormon in this case can usually
wreck their testimonies.

1989
02:05:32,000 --> 02:05:38,240
Right.
They fall more prey to false

1990
02:05:38,240 --> 02:05:41,960
narratives that exist because
they don't understand the

1991
02:05:41,960 --> 02:05:43,800
concept.
Like for instance you have the

1992
02:05:45,200 --> 02:05:47,600
the polygamy Joseph Smith
polygamy denial.

1993
02:05:48,160 --> 02:05:50,280
You know, they come up with
statements from Joseph Smith

1994
02:05:50,280 --> 02:05:55,200
where he seems to be speaking
about it in a negative way, or

1995
02:05:55,640 --> 02:05:57,160
doesn't seem to.
He actually does.

1996
02:05:57,920 --> 02:06:01,880
But they don't understand
context because when Joseph

1997
02:06:01,880 --> 02:06:04,480
Smith revealed these principles,
it wasn't to the Church

1998
02:06:04,600 --> 02:06:07,880
organization.
It was done within the Holy

1999
02:06:07,880 --> 02:06:09,880
Order of Nauvoo.
Right.

2000
02:06:11,200 --> 02:06:15,080
And there he taught things that
weren't accepted as doctrine yet

2001
02:06:15,080 --> 02:06:16,880
within the church.
Yeah.

2002
02:06:17,920 --> 02:06:23,600
It wasn't until 1852 that
Brigham Young presented these

2003
02:06:23,600 --> 02:06:26,560
before the people and then they
voted to accept that as a tenant

2004
02:06:26,560 --> 02:06:29,920
of their faith.
This is the reason that we had

2005
02:06:29,920 --> 02:06:32,760
one of the sections in Doctrine
Covenants replaced by section

2006
02:06:32,760 --> 02:06:37,720
132 because it was a a different
law of the church at that point.

2007
02:06:38,920 --> 02:06:42,800
Previous to that is that you you
could only have one wife, right?

2008
02:06:43,520 --> 02:06:46,520
And in fundamentalist circles,
we like to say, well, that was a

2009
02:06:46,520 --> 02:06:50,320
law to the Church, but not to
the priesthood, which is correct

2010
02:06:51,640 --> 02:06:54,440
because the Holy Order of Nabu
was a priesthood organization.

2011
02:06:54,920 --> 02:06:59,040
Right.
That dealt specifically with the

2012
02:06:59,040 --> 02:07:01,760
endowments and the keys of the
priesthood.

2013
02:07:02,720 --> 02:07:06,760
Gotcha, gotcha.
And and I want to be careful

2014
02:07:06,760 --> 02:07:10,560
here and and and I want to say
this, I'm not saying if you're

2015
02:07:10,560 --> 02:07:14,040
in a group that has a one man
that that we're calling your one

2016
02:07:14,040 --> 02:07:16,120
man bad.
That's not what we're saying.

2017
02:07:16,800 --> 02:07:18,720
I I wouldn't characterize it as
that.

2018
02:07:18,720 --> 02:07:23,040
What what I am saying is that
the the one man doctrine in my

2019
02:07:23,040 --> 02:07:31,520
estimation does open up the the
door to a little bit of tyranny.

2020
02:07:31,960 --> 02:07:36,080
Now you can have, like you were
saying Sean, a benevolent

2021
02:07:36,080 --> 02:07:39,520
dictator.
And in which case things are

2022
02:07:39,720 --> 02:07:43,920
fine on the surface, right.
But you can't guarantee who's

2023
02:07:43,920 --> 02:07:46,680
going to be the next man up,
right?

2024
02:07:47,120 --> 02:07:49,440
And you can't guarantee that
it's always going to be like

2025
02:07:49,440 --> 02:07:51,760
that.
We've certainly seen the One Man

2026
02:07:51,760 --> 02:07:55,840
Doctrine abused, right?
Warren Jeffs can't do and and

2027
02:07:55,840 --> 02:07:57,120
this time I'm going to name
names.

2028
02:07:57,120 --> 02:08:01,120
Obviously, Warren Jeffs couldn't
do what he did without the One

2029
02:08:01,120 --> 02:08:02,880
Man doctrine.
Correct.

2030
02:08:03,360 --> 02:08:06,040
Because if someone would have
been able to make the assertion

2031
02:08:06,040 --> 02:08:11,440
that he was on par with Warren
Jeffs, you could have questioned

2032
02:08:11,440 --> 02:08:16,400
his decision making and been
been within the pale of

2033
02:08:16,400 --> 02:08:22,080
orthodoxy to do it.
And so it it opens this up to

2034
02:08:22,080 --> 02:08:24,920
some of those abuses.
You used Ervil Lebaron as an

2035
02:08:24,920 --> 02:08:28,440
example.
And so we have seen where this,

2036
02:08:28,440 --> 02:08:32,520
where this opens up the the the
door to that tyranny.

2037
02:08:33,560 --> 02:08:36,840
But I want to go out of the way
and say, you know, not everybody

2038
02:08:36,840 --> 02:08:39,520
who's leading a group is, is
Warren Jeffs, right.

2039
02:08:39,520 --> 02:08:42,200
I do believe there are good men
out there trying to do the best

2040
02:08:42,200 --> 02:08:47,080
they can, but understand that
this doctrine does give give way

2041
02:08:47,080 --> 02:08:49,000
for this.
I also want to say this.

2042
02:08:49,680 --> 02:08:54,480
Brigham Young towards the end of
his life was very nervous about

2043
02:08:54,640 --> 02:08:59,640
the power that was consolidated
within the offices there.

2044
02:09:00,400 --> 02:09:03,000
He had made the statement.
My worst fear for this people is

2045
02:09:03,000 --> 02:09:06,480
that they would be apartment to
follow their leaders to hell.

2046
02:09:08,000 --> 02:09:11,880
And so I I think even later in
Brigham's life we see that that

2047
02:09:11,880 --> 02:09:16,040
he grows concerned about this a
little bit And we have Brigham

2048
02:09:16,040 --> 02:09:18,840
also admitting that yeah,
there's there's other authority

2049
02:09:18,840 --> 02:09:21,480
out there as well.
He was definitely looking to

2050
02:09:21,480 --> 02:09:25,160
consolidate Mormonism under 1
banner and I think rightfully so

2051
02:09:25,160 --> 02:09:29,720
for safety I cut.
I cut Brigham an enormous amount

2052
02:09:29,720 --> 02:09:32,840
of slack for all he had to deal
with, and in no way would I ever

2053
02:09:33,280 --> 02:09:36,240
throw him under the bus, as it
were, because he was

2054
02:09:36,240 --> 02:09:37,960
indispensable for that time
period.

2055
02:09:38,360 --> 02:09:42,400
But even he realizes that that
too much power consolidated in

2056
02:09:42,400 --> 02:09:46,320
one spot can lead to some pretty
nasty things.

2057
02:09:48,240 --> 02:09:53,840
If someone obviously you've come
to these conclusions as well

2058
02:09:54,160 --> 02:09:57,280
that that that you don't hold to
the one man doctrine.

2059
02:09:58,240 --> 02:10:00,920
And it sounds like maybe you
came to some of this while you

2060
02:10:00,920 --> 02:10:05,400
were in a group that that that
practice this.

2061
02:10:06,400 --> 02:10:11,120
If someone's in a group and and
they don't necessarily you know,

2062
02:10:11,120 --> 02:10:13,240
they listen to this and they get
shook a little bit.

2063
02:10:13,240 --> 02:10:14,800
What would be your advice to
them?

2064
02:10:14,800 --> 02:10:19,440
Should you know how how does
someone navigate those waters

2065
02:10:19,440 --> 02:10:21,720
while still being in a group,
and then maybe starting to

2066
02:10:21,720 --> 02:10:23,640
question the one man doctrine a
little bit?

2067
02:10:24,440 --> 02:10:28,280
Well.
I would start by taking comfort

2068
02:10:29,040 --> 02:10:32,200
that there are probably others
out there who have this ability,

2069
02:10:32,280 --> 02:10:38,160
who have this authority, whose
direction is more in line with

2070
02:10:38,160 --> 02:10:41,200
what the scriptures inform us a
servant of God would be like.

2071
02:10:43,560 --> 02:10:46,080
If you don't know who they are,
well, you at least know the of

2072
02:10:46,080 --> 02:10:51,560
the possibility that they exist.
And one thing that gave me that

2073
02:10:51,560 --> 02:10:59,680
gave me hope was the realization
that close close to 500 men

2074
02:11:01,080 --> 02:11:06,680
received the fullness in the
Naboo era and that between 1850

2075
02:11:06,800 --> 02:11:11,120
to 1900 within the church
organization, they averaged one

2076
02:11:11,120 --> 02:11:13,720
second anointing a day.
Whoa.

2077
02:11:15,040 --> 02:11:19,240
So that gets into, you know,
about 14,000 or so by the time

2078
02:11:19,240 --> 02:11:23,080
you you reach 1900.
Now, of course, not all of those

2079
02:11:23,080 --> 02:11:26,520
guys lived throughout that whole
time, many passed away and so

2080
02:11:26,520 --> 02:11:28,920
forth.
But in Joseph F Smith's

2081
02:11:28,920 --> 02:11:32,240
administration, they had roughly
about 2500.

2082
02:11:34,000 --> 02:11:37,800
Wow.
And it it didn't effectively

2083
02:11:37,800 --> 02:11:39,600
come to a stop until the Heber
J.

2084
02:11:39,600 --> 02:11:43,640
Grant or administration?
I believe in his entire

2085
02:11:43,640 --> 02:11:45,080
administration.
They only had eight.

2086
02:11:46,160 --> 02:11:49,120
Holy cow.
Which is which is remarkable

2087
02:11:49,120 --> 02:11:54,000
because he was the second
longest reigning.

2088
02:11:54,480 --> 02:11:58,120
Right.
President of the church, Brigham

2089
02:11:58,120 --> 02:12:03,080
Young being I think the longest.
Just see Brigham Young.

2090
02:12:03,080 --> 02:12:06,400
You know, he wasn't I I What
year was he sustained as

2091
02:12:06,400 --> 02:12:08,600
president?
Oh, I'd have to.

2092
02:12:08,680 --> 02:12:11,000
Look, 18 fifties, right?
I believe.

2093
02:12:12,880 --> 02:12:16,080
I'm not sure about that, but I
know there was a a a time.

2094
02:12:16,080 --> 02:12:19,200
There was a time when it was
just under Apostolic direction.

2095
02:12:19,200 --> 02:12:21,520
Right.
So, yeah, so it depends on where

2096
02:12:21,520 --> 02:12:27,080
you want to start.
You know, effectively whether or

2097
02:12:27,080 --> 02:12:29,160
not officially but maybe
effectively.

2098
02:12:29,480 --> 02:12:38,000
You could say his leadership
started in in 1844 and cemented

2099
02:12:38,000 --> 02:12:40,680
by the Transfiguration thing I
think, which took place what, in

2100
02:12:40,680 --> 02:12:42,840
184546?
Yep.

2101
02:12:43,840 --> 02:12:48,120
Well anyway, from there to 1877,
right is when he died.

2102
02:12:48,320 --> 02:12:50,720
Yep.
So how many?

2103
02:12:51,040 --> 02:12:55,360
How many years transpired?
There is the time he was in

2104
02:12:55,360 --> 02:12:58,400
charge. 32 years if my math is
correct.

2105
02:12:59,160 --> 02:13:03,120
And Heber Jay Grant?
Didn't he come in around 1918?

2106
02:13:03,520 --> 02:13:07,400
Yes.
And was it 44 or 45 when he

2107
02:13:07,400 --> 02:13:09,960
died?
Want to say it was 45?

2108
02:13:10,920 --> 02:13:15,880
OK, so however long, that was
just shy of 30 years.

2109
02:13:16,480 --> 02:13:18,840
Right.
So he was in there quite a long

2110
02:13:18,840 --> 02:13:22,400
time, you know, compared to
other presidents since his since

2111
02:13:22,400 --> 02:13:24,920
his day.
But I find it remarkable, you

2112
02:13:24,920 --> 02:13:29,600
know, that Joseph F Smith,
didn't he take over around 19?

2113
02:13:29,600 --> 02:13:34,280
Oh. 1909 if I'm not mistaken.
That late?

2114
02:13:35,320 --> 02:13:38,360
No.
He was president 1904. 04, OK.

2115
02:13:38,720 --> 02:13:42,640
So I think he took over
basically around 19031904 around

2116
02:13:42,640 --> 02:13:43,400
that time.
OK.

2117
02:13:43,600 --> 02:13:46,280
All right.
And then he left in 1918.

2118
02:13:46,280 --> 02:13:50,320
So he was in there quite a while
too, but not not nearly as long

2119
02:13:50,320 --> 02:13:58,160
as Heber J Grant and and under
his administration they had 2500

2120
02:13:59,080 --> 02:14:03,160
right administration.
So the second anointing and only

2121
02:14:03,160 --> 02:14:04,360
eight in Heber J.
Grants.

2122
02:14:04,360 --> 02:14:07,400
That's a very telling thing
about where their mindset was.

2123
02:14:07,720 --> 02:14:13,520
Right.
So I've heard that, you know, in

2124
02:14:13,520 --> 02:14:14,760
the church, they still perform
them.

2125
02:14:16,080 --> 02:14:19,800
Yep.
But I don't really know what it

2126
02:14:19,800 --> 02:14:21,480
is they're giving them or not
giving them.

2127
02:14:22,920 --> 02:14:26,480
But it is, it is telling that
most members of the church have

2128
02:14:26,480 --> 02:14:30,920
no knowledge of what these
things are, right.

2129
02:14:32,120 --> 02:14:34,440
And I don't think that should be
the case.

2130
02:14:34,440 --> 02:14:37,040
I think the knowledge of these
things should be there,

2131
02:14:37,920 --> 02:14:40,000
especially to those people who
have been in doubt.

2132
02:14:41,200 --> 02:14:43,600
Yeah, I I.
Because in the endowment they

2133
02:14:44,360 --> 02:14:46,240
they're told that they are
anointed to become.

2134
02:14:47,280 --> 02:14:49,280
Yeah.
And and I think you made a

2135
02:14:49,280 --> 02:14:52,000
really good case that that is
something that that we should

2136
02:14:52,000 --> 02:14:55,520
aspire to, that isn't something
that we should look at as

2137
02:14:55,520 --> 02:15:00,120
something that's unattainable.
Right and and Joseph Smith was

2138
02:15:00,280 --> 02:15:05,520
was asked if if it was, if we
could be saved without living

2139
02:15:06,280 --> 02:15:07,960
the ordinances of of the
priesthood.

2140
02:15:07,960 --> 02:15:10,600
And he says no, at least not the
fullness of it.

2141
02:15:11,200 --> 02:15:13,480
Right.
And he went on to say that you

2142
02:15:13,480 --> 02:15:19,800
have to receive all the
ordinances of the priesthood and

2143
02:15:19,800 --> 02:15:24,320
obey them, or you will lose, you
may lose the whole, right?

2144
02:15:24,720 --> 02:15:28,360
So from his point of view, these
were absolutely necessary.

2145
02:15:29,200 --> 02:15:32,720
And when I read in his journal,
especially when he started

2146
02:15:33,440 --> 02:15:37,480
performing the 2nd anointing, he
had a sense of urgency about it.

2147
02:15:37,880 --> 02:15:41,400
Yeah, Yep.
And that I, I think that's

2148
02:15:41,400 --> 02:15:44,080
beyond dispute.
Right.

2149
02:15:44,880 --> 02:15:48,640
And you know when you read in
the in the journal entry of

2150
02:15:48,640 --> 02:15:55,440
September 28th, 1843, it says
there that this is the greatest

2151
02:15:55,560 --> 02:15:58,400
or the highest priesthood on the
earth.

2152
02:15:58,920 --> 02:16:00,360
Yeah.
The highest quorum of the

2153
02:16:00,360 --> 02:16:04,120
priesthood on the earth.
Now when I when I found this

2154
02:16:04,120 --> 02:16:08,480
myself and I was looking and I
was looking and the heading on

2155
02:16:08,480 --> 02:16:16,080
it Church historian wrote Joseph
is is anointed by a group of

2156
02:16:16,080 --> 02:16:20,320
elders kind of thing and then
when you read the actual entry

2157
02:16:20,320 --> 02:16:23,800
it says he was an he was
anointed king and priest into

2158
02:16:23,800 --> 02:16:26,400
the highest order of the
priesthood and selected as

2159
02:16:26,400 --> 02:16:31,760
president by the same body.
I'm like, boy, that talk about

2160
02:16:31,760 --> 02:16:34,360
underselling it.
Right, Yeah.

2161
02:16:34,360 --> 02:16:37,760
Because the entry itself says
it's the highest, and here it's

2162
02:16:37,760 --> 02:16:39,639
oh, it's just a group of elders
getting together.

2163
02:16:40,639 --> 02:16:44,120
Right.
I find that that that little

2164
02:16:44,120 --> 02:16:48,200
premise that he that he wrote
there was trying to defuse the

2165
02:16:48,200 --> 02:16:52,600
importance of what was happening
there and why they put it that

2166
02:16:52,600 --> 02:16:58,320
way, I don't know.
Yeah, there's there's any number

2167
02:16:58,320 --> 02:17:03,840
of reasons, privacy being one,
or maybe even, you know, trying

2168
02:17:03,840 --> 02:17:07,040
to once again instill this idea
of, OK, you have these, but now

2169
02:17:07,040 --> 02:17:08,840
you have to go be of service,
right?

2170
02:17:09,200 --> 02:17:13,680
Kind of making sure it wasn't
used as just a status symbol,

2171
02:17:13,879 --> 02:17:17,320
but no.
No, what I'm getting at is the

2172
02:17:17,320 --> 02:17:23,600
historian that quoted that.
Oh, the historian quoted that.

2173
02:17:23,600 --> 02:17:24,320
OK.
Yeah.

2174
02:17:24,480 --> 02:17:26,000
He said.
That like a preamble.

2175
02:17:26,000 --> 02:17:31,000
OK, that's my fault.
And and and and to me it was he

2176
02:17:31,000 --> 02:17:35,799
was really underplaying it right
and under.

2177
02:17:36,240 --> 02:17:39,480
Yeah, and underestimating what
is actually taking place there.

2178
02:17:40,000 --> 02:17:42,559
Yeah.
Yeah, well, a group of elders,

2179
02:17:42,719 --> 02:17:44,040
give me a break.
Yeah.

2180
02:17:44,040 --> 02:17:48,600
No, I I suppose from that
context, if it's something that

2181
02:17:48,600 --> 02:17:53,000
may have been lost to the group
of wherever this historian came

2182
02:17:53,000 --> 02:17:56,280
from, it's not a comfortable
position to be in.

2183
02:17:56,760 --> 02:17:59,080
No.
If if you've lost it because you

2184
02:17:59,080 --> 02:18:02,360
now have to kind of downplay it
or else some of maybe your your

2185
02:18:02,360 --> 02:18:06,639
authority claims begin to wane,
but yeah.

2186
02:18:08,120 --> 02:18:10,639
Well.
Dude, this was good stuff.

2187
02:18:10,639 --> 02:18:14,680
I mean, we covered a lot and and
we actually got got something

2188
02:18:14,680 --> 02:18:18,680
done I'd been wanting to do in
addition to this one, which was

2189
02:18:19,000 --> 02:18:21,280
kind of breaking down the 2nd
anointing a little bit.

2190
02:18:21,280 --> 02:18:23,719
So you did a great job, man.
I appreciate it.

2191
02:18:25,280 --> 02:18:27,360
You're welcome.
Anything else you want to add

2192
02:18:27,360 --> 02:18:31,920
before we wrap up?
Basically what I want to say is

2193
02:18:32,959 --> 02:18:37,520
as as the Lord provided a ram in
the thicket in lieu of Isaac.

2194
02:18:38,719 --> 02:18:44,879
The Lord has you covered and and
if you seek him out in these

2195
02:18:44,879 --> 02:18:47,320
things, he will bring you to
where you need to be.

2196
02:18:48,080 --> 02:18:53,120
These things are still in
existence and and they aren't

2197
02:18:53,120 --> 02:18:58,959
governed by priest craft,
they're actually priesthood and

2198
02:18:59,040 --> 02:19:00,240
and I would like to leave that
with you.

2199
02:19:00,240 --> 02:19:02,440
In the name of Jesus Christ,
Amen.

2200
02:19:02,959 --> 02:19:05,240
Amen.
Beautiful stuff, my man.

2201
02:19:06,840 --> 02:19:07,920
Awesome.
All right.

2202
02:19:08,040 --> 02:19:08,799
Bye everybody.