Episode #61: Instalment Of The Jewish Calendar Series: Passover W/Joshua Erickson

0:05 On this episode, I have Joshua Erickson back on to continue our series, on the Jewish calendar and feast days. Again, I encourage everyone who has not done. So to go back and listen to the first five episodes of this series today. Joshua, and I sit down and have a conversation about Passover. We go through the story of Exodus. Then we talked about how the celebration is kept today. And finish up by talking about what we as Mormons can take away from the events of Passover. That's next on this episode of the Mormon Rena. Jade podcast. Because of your generosity last year, I was able to buy better audio equipment and software.

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4:10 Yeah, and I got a lot to talk about today. This is a little heavier than Purim. Yes, quite a bit heavier, actually. Yeah, for him is very light and fun and fanciful. Even and Passover is heavy stuff. This is Angel of Death stuff, Blood on the door stuff plagues and and and Redemption. And all I had a buddy who was who's an Evangelical but also, So a big fan of hard rock and heavy metal and he always said he was like that episode from Egypt will Moses is there? He's like that. Straight metal. I'm like, that's probably not a bad way of putting it, right? I mean plagues and everything else. So I mean, the horror, the horror of the whole, the whole whole scene, leading up to Passover, is just is horrendous. Yeah, yeah.

5:03 Well, and yeah, and here's the thing, anytime you enslave the people, Going to go well for you. Yeah. Yeah. I guess I would say. Amen to that. Yep. So tyranny tyranny, always brings its its own reward. Yep. Yep. So okay yeah so Passover is a big deal, not only for Judaism but for Christianity obviously and Judaism and Christianity, both kind of Point to various passover's as the foundation or the beginning of their religion. Of course, Christianity looks at the ancient Israelite Passover as a type and Shadow, in many ways of the Passover that occurred with Jesus as the Lamb of God, right?

6:00 And so, it really is so much of the Scriptures that the symbolism in the scriptures that go back to or point back to to the Passover and The Exodus or I suppose you could say the other way around that. So much of the the occurrences that happened with the Passover in Exodus actually point forward to gospel things. And also even as do all the feasts point to Future realities that are yet to be Yet to be fulfilled. So you know, you can correct me if I'm wrong on this. I'm used to be. Yeah, I'm used to being wrong to me.

6:40 I always looked at Passover and found it to be unique in the sense that it was both a religious holiday, as well as something that I think we could kind of, almost equate to Fourth of July on our end a little bit. Right? No, this is The Birth of a Nation. This is Independence Day. Yeah, in a real way, this is Independence Day for the nation. In of Israel. Yeah, it's kind of a, yeah, The Birth of a Nation. I don't know how else to put it is the way to put it. Yeah, they see. Is when Israel, as I mean Israel. Israel is, of course, the name, the, the additional name given to the new name, given to Jacob right after he wrestles with the angel and And then he's got his, his family, his twelve sons, and he's got at least one daughter that's mentioned and, you know, they have children and stuff.

7:35 But by the time, by the time, they're ready to leave all when they go down into Egypt, that's kind of a, it's kind of a proto pro donation, right? Little, it's the seed of a Nation, but by the time they leave Egypt there, many millions, strong. And so it was miraculous on it. you know, an enormous scale and and I think I think also the, the founders of this country recognize that. I mean, our first seal, wasn't the eagle with the arrows are fur. Seal was Moses crossing the Red Sea with the children of Israel and Pharaohs armies being drowned. Yeah and I didn't stick so yeah, it was. Yeah there there was this.

8:20 Okay I'll give a spoiler. You're going to want to show up to the Torah conference. I'm talking a little bit about this one when you're there but yeah it was it was very much The founder saw a lot that they could equate to and whatever your views are on blacks in the priesthood. I think, by now, we should all agree slavery's, probably not a great thing, at least the slavery that was practiced, you know, for the Africans during during Antebellum Period, oh yeah, there's because it was, it's not what it describes in the Bible, there's no justification for that. And if you look, if you look at the Bible, that was, that was indentured servitude with an end date, right?

9:00 There was an expiration date there. This was something different and I've often looked at the Civil War and thought, yeah, we probably paid a price, we definitely did write that was that there was a little bit of divine retribution there. Yeah. Amen. To that. So, okay, where to begin? I guess. I mean Exodus is a beginning. Passover is a beginning as we've been mentioning already. So Exodus chapter 12. This is this is a new before that in To this, we have the story of, you know, they're being a new pharaoh who didn't know about Joseph and the Egyptians are worried about this growing population of Israelites.

9:44 And you know, whether they're how loyal they are to the Egyptian crown and Pharaoh says, to start drowning the male children, right? And of course we have the story of the the Valiant midwives, right? Who lie to pharaoh and say oh we we've tried to do your order but the The Midwives are the the Hebrew women, their Lively, and they just give birth before we show up. And and and so fair wasn't pleased with that. But scripture says that God blessed those midwives.

10:26 Well, Anyway pharaoh, of course decides that if we can't control their population and you will continue to try to control their population, but we're also going to enslave them in as a as a means of controlling the Israelite population. And of course, then Moses comes into the story and this is and he's Moses typifies Christ in so many ways in this story. I mean, the first bit, we get about, Moses is well, going back to the story of Jesus, right? The we know the wise men come and Herod is not happy that there's going to be a new King, right? And so he sends soldiers to go and kill all the babies, of course, Joseph and Mary.

11:20 And Jesus, they flee to Egypt for safety ironic. Yeah. And so here here we have again actually A I would say Messiah, type figure in Moses and he's going to. He actually is going to take take the crown as essentially from Pharaoh. Pharaoh doesn't know that yet. But, but yeah, there's a wicked King who tries to kill the babies to get rid of this promised child that the promised child actually finds refuge in Egypt actually in Pharaoh's house.

12:01 Right is where Moses is raised and at some point, Moses, he's raised as an Egyptian raised as a prince, even, but he is out observing the Israelites in their bondage. He sees in Egyptian taskmasters, like seriously abusing this Israelite, man, and He secretly or he thinks it secretly. He defends the Israelite, man, and ends up killing the Egyptian and buries him in the sand and hopes that no one will know about it, but people did find out about it, somehow right.

12:46 And Moses is afraid that word is going to get out and we're does get out. And so he flees and he ends up in Midian, you know, which is Midian was one of Abraham. Children from Katara. So he ends up in Midian ends up in the camp of Jethro who ends up being his father in line and the midianites They have they have next to next to their next to Jethro's, land is Mountain, which they call the mountain of the lord. It's just, which was Sinai or Horeb. And we know the story.

13:29 Moses sees this T's tending sheep and he sees this Burning Bush was burning and not being consumed. And this is obviously a curious thing and he goes there to see what's going on. And the Lord speaks to him through or from the bush, right from the fire and gives him a mission. And Moses is not real happy about that. But God says you're the one. And, you know, I'll give you your brother, Aaron is there? And he can help too. So, there's so many things about Moses story that I'm going, fascinating, right?

14:13 And some of it, I can relate to you although I'll never be as good. good as Moses, but this idea of discovering your parentage, right? Discovering your heritage, and then having that Heritage via odds, with the worldly powers of the time. I think that's something we can all relate to, at this point, right? As we discovered, we're of the family of God. There's a reason we don't fit in with the rest of society. Also, I, you know, I remember when I first became a Mormon, when I joined the LDS church, I had to leave my In town because I was trying to quit drinking and I was at that point where the party found me, I didn't have to go look for it anymore.

14:58 Yeah. And so I had to remove myself and I remove myself to an itty-bitty town about 45 minutes away where no one knew me or as out in the country. And so there's some parallels there, right? That's what you described. There is, is the Passover story, right? Yeah. In in microcosm, yeah. Yeah. Year Are removed and so there was a lot of Egypt. Yeah, there was a lot of Moses story that that I could identify with and I've often thought and we'll get to it in a minute when he has to go back and talk to Pharaoh, must have been a strange reunions and I can sympathize a little bit with that cuz I'll ran into guys from time to time when I'm back in Idaho that I screwed around with, and it's a little awkward, right? Because, you know, they're like you want to go grab one and I'm like, no, no.

15:50 I'm I'm not much of a partaker anymore and I remember one guy goes, would you become a Mormon? Huh? I'm like. Yep, that's hilarious. So yeah, you can only imagine what it must have been like, for Moses to go through all of this to be so high and be brought low. I think, I think the way Cecil DeMille, painted it when when Charlton Heston was crossing the desert where, you know, it turns, you know, men in the Profit sort of a thing. Yeah. There's some, there's some good movies I've been made. Yeah, yeah. I mean, this is actually a this is a type of Christ as well. I mean, really Moses condescends. Yeah, from Egyptian royalty to identifying himself with the slaves.

16:38 Yeah, I mean Hebrew. He says yeah, he's yeah, I think there's something that we can all take away from Moses story. There's something there. It's such an intrical story of just not Just not the nation of Israel, not just the Jewish people not just Mormons or anybody else. I think there's something very intrinsic there. Yeah. That that we can take from. Yeah. I mean that's why it's I mean, you know, the Bible is the oldest, the oldest book in the world that still read, you know, then the most widely read ancient book and there's a reason for that. Yeah, these stories are everyone's story, right? And they just and the stories keep unfolding generation after generation. Yeah, and always will because there's just truth there that has to do with man's struggle.

17:27 Yeah. For freedom. And for salvation. Yeah. And it's made an impression to the point that it's in the psyche of every human, I think. Yeah, right. Yeah, I had a good friend who was an atheist named Jason and he once said, so why doesn't God continue to talk out of burning bushes? I said, because if anyone who was religious, saw burning bush, we all know we're going the other direction because nothing It's coming out the bat so amazing. Well we won't go over too much of the other the story, you know. But of course you know, Moses asks for pharaoh to let them go Vera, says no, then there's plague and we just go back and forth Affair saying, okay, okay call it off and then another plague comes along right? 10 of them culminating in the final The final two plagues, our darkness and then death, the slaying of the firstborns. Yeah.

18:28 And this brings us to Exodus chapter 12, which is so all that other stuff was the first part of Exodus. But in Exodus chapter 12, I'll read here. The Lord spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt saying this month shall be unto you the beginning of months. It shall be to you the first month of the year to you. So so yeah, this is really a beginning, this not only of their calendar which it was this is, of course, passover's in the spring and it actually used to be much more widespread this idea of New Year's being in the spring, are a Roman Calendar has switched it to Winter January but it used to be in the spring and this is this is why April 1st is April, April Fool's Day.

19:20 Because there was a propaganda propaganda. What's the word I'm looking for? Push to try to get people to stop celebrating New Year in the spring? Really? Yeah and if you did then you were called faithful fool. So really? I didn't know that. That's fascinating. Yeah. So anyway so yeah this is going to be the beginning. Not only of the the calendar but also the Inning of the nation. Like we, like we mentioned already. Now, this goes actually essentially goes way way back before that because if you go to Exodus 12, 43, 40 and 41. Now, this is this is after they're like the day that they're leaving.

20:17 Which was, by the way, on the 15th of the month. So I'll back up just a little. So beginning of chapter 12, he says, this is going to be the beginning of the month. This is basically going to be the new year here. So the first day of the first month is going to be the new year. And then later on, we'll talk about it. A little more on the tenth day of this month. They were supposed to pick out Lamb, excuse me, or goat to be the Passover and then, and then the 15th starting on the 15th and for seven days they're going to have the Feast of unleavened bread. So, and this, this timing of the first month actually is, there's an interesting mirror with the seventh month.

21:05 We talked about some of the festival's of the seventh month, but on the seventh month, on the 1st of the month is trumpets, And then, on the 10th is Yom Kippur and then on the 15th for seven days is the Feast of Tabernacles. So, in the first month, we have new year on the 10th, we select the Lamb on the 15th. And for a week, we have Festival of unleavened bread. And then in the 7th year month, we have the first is Feast of trumpets or but also called Rosh Hashanah. So the head of the year. It's a kind of a new year as well. And Then we have the day of atonement on the 10th and then Tabernacles. And there's, there's this kind of symmetry between the first and the seventh month for good reasons, there's actually a real connection between between those. So, of course, Passover and a is when we left Egypt. But but the that's like when the when Redemption was completed but the Redemption began.

22:15 This is a little bit of Jewish tradition. The Redemption began in the seventh month on Rosh Hashanah where the Feast of trumpets that's like, that's when the plagues began. So, so the Jersey is like, for six months. Often, you know, there'd be a few days or weeks of plague and then there would be a little break. And then another, you know, days or weeks of plague, you know, for ten plagues. And then by the time it comes to Passover, which is the 14th and then 15 is the day of unleavened bread. The first day of unleavened bread, then that's when our Redemption is complete and we actually have freedom. So okay, all that though, is to say that this, this wasn't actually, this is a beginning, but the story of Passover actually begins centuries before that.

23:03 So in chapter 12, verse 40, says, now the sojourning of the children of Israel who dwelled in Egypt. And there's actually a corruption in the text there. It should say, who dwelt in, Canaan and Egypt. That's what the the Septuagint, and some older versions. And in, in the New Testament talks about that too. So anyway, sojourning of the children of Israel who dwelt in Canaan and Egypt was 430 years and it came to pass at the end of the 430 years. And even the selfsame day, it came to pass. That all the hosts of the Lord, went out from the land of Egypt. Mmm, so hosts of the Lord, this is, of course, like the Hebrew, there is the armies of the Lord.

23:57 So this is the Lord's army is right. So, so ought to the day 430 years ago to the day. Now, what is the day? They're talking about even the selfsame day, that is the day. That the Lord commanded Abraham to go to Canaan. And where the God said, I will give you this land. So that's, you know, that goes that goes back to Genesis. Yeah. Well, Okay, so Genesis 12. Verse 1.

24:37 Now Jehovah had said unto Abraham, get the out of thy country and from thy Kindred, and from thy, Father's House unto a land that I will show thee and I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name, great. And thou shalt be a blessing and I will bless them that bless thee and curse them that curse thee and in thee, shall all the families of the earth be blessed. Okay, so there it is and and that that promise was repeated to Abraham a few times. But it's interesting because the story of Abraham is actually a microcosm of the Passover again because he Abraham starts out in Canaan.

25:24 And where does Israel start? They start out in Canaan as well and then at some Point Abraham goes to Egypt and says the problem was, there was a famine, right? The famine, so Abraham goes to Egypt and he stays there for a little bit and eventually, there's that, there's that episode with Pharaoh wanting his wife, right? And he ends up, Abraham, Abraham ends up rich, because of that mess up there and have a little white lie, that was told She's my sister and then Abraham leaves and goes back to Canaan.

26:11 Okay. And this is kind of the story of Israel as well, right? Jacob, and his twelve sons are in Canaan. There's a famine. They go down to Egypt and they're there for a little while, and eventually they come out with great riches. Yeah, and go back to eventually go back to Canaan. And and the Israelites when they go back to Canaan, then they drive out the inhabitants. Now the story for Abraham is he goes down, there's a famine, he goes to Egypt, comes out with great riches back and then he drives out some of the inhabitants to he has Wars with. Yep. Some of the, the kings around Sodom and Gomorrah. And then of course, Sodom and Gomorrah are and the other cities of the plain are Seriously destroyed.

26:57 But there's this this cleansing of the land for Abraham's sake. Well, you could say for Abraham's sake. So there's this, this mirror there between the father, whose Abraham and his his posterity, which Israel, you know, the the other thing that I find fascinating for both Moses and Abraham. Is this idea of get out of the country. Leave, I'm chopping you off to do something different. Yeah. What you're in now is corrupt, you need to be removed if you seek righteousness. And I think that there is something there that, that, that I think we all have to wrestle with, which is looking at her current circumstance, and go, is it good? Or is it bad?

27:48 Well, if it's bad, if it's corrupt, And you got to, you got to leave, right? And and I find that's corrupt in and irreparable and irreparable. It's time to leave. That's right, right. It's time to pack up and move and to me that is does something that takes strength on the part of the person, I understand God's commanding it. But you're not going to get that out of somebody who's just super who's just week or or think for themselves or something like that, takes a little bit of Guts right, for lack of a better term. I remember being 20 for having four kids the night before I leave for Maryland.

28:34 I'm laying in my house, a nice house, comfortable house and Western Idaho, looking up, the ceiling with everything packed up thinking. What the hell am I doing? I know crazy, right? And so I think there's something here where the Lord is saying, even if it's not a physical move, maybe it's a spiritual. Maybe the, the current system, you know, you're in or the current system, you have a spouse or the current system you have developed for yourself. Isn't working, doesn't seem good is irreparable. It's time to move. Yeah, yeah, especially when yeah. And you'll know that to right? Yep. Oh, he makes it. He makes it very clear and it's it's damaging to your soul.

29:18 Yep. To know. That you are in a bad place and doing the wrong things and to do it anyway. Yep. Yep. Because I think we all have that little bit of Light of Christ in this that calls to us and says yeah you better go this is not the place for you. I reminded of the kind of the contrast between Abram and his father. Terah, right? Tara. I mean there's not a lot in Genesis about Tara but in some of the midrash stories extra-biblical Or is Tara, is an idolater. There's my favorite story is Abrams, you know a young man and he's trying to figure out he wants.

30:04 He wants to be God's friend, he wants to know, God, he wants to serve God. He wants to find out who the real God is and serve the Living God and his father, Terah has a room full of idols and At some point he comes to realize that like, these are, these are all just man-made things, these are made by human hands, so this definitely can't. These definitely can't be gods. And so he he decides he's going to just chop up all the idols in his father's little Idol room, whatever that's called. And he takes a hatchet to all the idols. There's just like I don't know dozens and dozens of them chops them all up and then except for except for the biggest one. And he like puts the acts in the biggest Idols hands. And Tara comes home and he's like, goes, you know, goes to pray or whatever I do, make his offering him. Everything is just in splinters you know all the all these Idols are just in splinters and shattered Stone and whatever and Abraham or Abram.

31:11 What's going on? What you know what's the meaning of this and Abram says well I you know, I brought in food To offer to your idols. And when I, when I laid the plate of food down, all of the little gods, they like start to reach out to grab it before. The big God was able to take the food and he got mad and he chopped up all the other ones and Tears. Like that's ridiculous. Course he can't do that. He's just he's just he's just he's just wood or stone or whatever and and earring says well then why are why are we worried? We were Worshipping these, what are we doing?

31:51 But but Tara was no Tara was and I'm a servant of nimrod. Yeah. Yeah. He was at part of nimrods kingdom and just going along with With the society and the government and the religion of his time and was a coward, really. And knew that this was not right, but just kept his head down, you know, and did what was expected and didn't rock the boat. So to speak. Well, and I think this speaks to where we get ourselves how we get ourselves into trouble, right? As I think that it's one of those things where it's like, you think about leaving a society. So to speak or in your like, well, gosh, I Got my job and it's a cushy job and I'm paid well and you got this house and if I'm if I'm not making Idols, what am I gonna do?

32:40 Right? And so I'm good at it. Yeah and so I think, I think this is one of those things where it really points to us. You better stand on principle at some point because if you have to make justifications for well, Lord, you didn't expect me to like just leave all that. Did you get? Well, yeah, he kind of does kind of does kind of does, so he gets to the point where there's going to be the final plague, the the death of the firstborn. And so Jehovah tells Moses, this is what we're going to do, this is going to be, this is going to be the destruction of Egypt and the Redemption of Israel and everyone anyone who wants to be Part of Israel to. And that, that was not, by the way, limited to the literal descendants of Jacob only.

33:38 But when, when Israel left it actually specifically, says that there was a mixed multitude of people. Hmm. Gentiles Galore who who came along who were converted to the worship of the Living God, you know, by all the things that they had seen no doubt. But God said basically, Anyone who anyone who wants to survive this last plague. This is what you do. You take your lamb, choose it on the 10th day on the 14th day. Everyone together is going to kill the Passover, by the way Passover, it's just to get a little terminology here.

34:21 A lot of times in our everyday speech, when we're talking about Passover we get the term Passover confused with the Feast of unleavened bread and sometimes we'll say that. Silver and the Feast of unleavened bread are the same thing. There are actually two different, but related things, the Feast of unleavened bread is the thing that happens for seven days where they eat matzo only, which is the unleavened bread Passover is also not technically not a day, Passover is the Lamb. Okay? And so when you read the scripture that says Kill the Passover on the 14th day. So the Passover is the animal.

35:06 That's the name of the animal that is killed on the 14th and then is eaten with unleavened bread and bitter herbs on the evening of the 15th. Right? As as Nightfall comes after the 14th, then everyone's supposed to be inside the blood is put on the doorpost. Right? And there's just the the symbolism is so rich with the Lamb of God and, you know, applying the blood to the door of the house and basically salvation is inside the house. That's like you through through the blood that you have to go enter through the door. You have to enter through the blood of the Lamb to be in in the house of Israel, essentially, right over the houses of his right in order to be spared.

35:56 So the angel death comes and says there's you know there's not a there's not a house that isn't affected because there's firstborns all over the place, right? And so, So again, I mean, I want to kind of give you the broad overview, I guess here. They finally Pharaoh says, you have to leave, like, I've been wanting to keep you but you have to leave actually. So they gather bother other people. All their flocks, they scriptures say to borrow gold and jewels from their Egyptian, neighbors, their Egyptian, neighbors are happy to give them gold and jewels and treasure. I mean in In reality.

36:47 It's not of course Israel leaves with all this stuff. I would not call that theft though. I think that's just back payment for all of the years of slavery, right? Yeah. So anyway, they leave with all of that and then and then Pharaoh, hardened his heart again, right? And changes his mind and gets assembles what few chariots he has left because I mean, the animals have been plagued. As well but gathers up what chariots he can and chases him down. This is a, they Israelites have had a few days, Head Start and they there at the Red Sea, right? And Pharaoh meets them there.

37:30 And of course, the Army is held back by the pillar of fire until the sea splits, the Red Sea splits, and they go across and this. So the on the first day of unleavened bread is when they actually leave Egypt, But then Pharaoh chases them and then on the seventh day of unleavened bread, which if you include Passover, which is kind of, you know, the it's Passover like the day to prepare for the Feast of unleavened bread. So it's the eighth day since Passover, and then that's when they go through the Red Sea. So, that's on the and, you know, the scriptures say that the first and last day of unleavened bread are special, Sabbath's Where we there's supposed to be a holy convocation, says, or a solemn assembly. And so on that, on that seventh day is when they passed through the Red Sea and the armies of fairer destroyed. And this goes, I was going to point. I mean, this is there's so many symbolic things, but one of them that is often kind of Forgotten is the fact that like the Egyptians represent something and the Egyptians really, they represent the people in your life who To keep you in Egypt, right?

38:56 And you mentioned this area, like when you try to leave, there will be, there will be people who want to pull, you back into those old habits. Yep. Into that bondage of whatever sort it is, you know, spiritual or, you know, bondage or addictions, or bad relationships, our sins of all sorts. But you know, that's that's a real part of the story too. So you know there's a lot of symbolism just in that little bit we went through or things that we can take away obviously you know the blood of the Lamb is a big one but there's little ones to that pop out at you when you talk about having, you know killing the Lambs, these are slaves, okay, that are there the the Israelites that time. They're huddled together close.

39:53 We know that because of some things you know oral tradition what not the that it wasn't like the slaves were allowed to spread out. They want you know the Egyptians wanted them in one place so they could have their eye on Goshen was a huge one. They don't have room for livestock. So if they have a lamb that lamb, it's precious. It's almost a pet now, I want, I want to paint this picture because the Lord's trying to teach something here. This is an animal that your kids have played with this is an animal that has probably become kind of like a dog, right? I love my dog.

40:37 When all when everything else is down, my dog is always there. Right, always happy to see me, right? And then you're going to kill that lamb. Yeah. You're going to see your father kill. That way. I had to put a dog down just over a year ago that we had for 13 years about you bawled like a baby. I bawled like a little girl. I have no other way to say it. I that tore me up worse than I thought it would now you it's surprising. It is surprised you're faced with that. Yeah. Yeah. And motion involved. Yeah. And now all the sudden it takes on a different feel when you realized These people had that animal that animal was was kind of a part of the family at that point. And then to watch.

41:24 Your father, or maybe you have to go do it. There's some symbolism there likewise with with the gold and the silver, and The Jewels are taken out of Egypt. I think we can draw from that. This idea of there's things that we can take out of the world that aren't inherently evil, and then use them for the good use. Yeah. Now the same gold that was used to, that was taken from the Options. I shouldn't say taken, but because from oral tradition that I've read and I could be wrong, Joshua, the Egyptians are almost thrown in Adam right now, take it and go get you to get, get out, you know, here's all your goals, whatever you need, just go.

42:06 So they're throwing it out that same gold. Can be used to put the trim around the Tabernacle. Yep. On the Ark of the Covenant and it can also be used to make a golden calf. That's right. That's good. So there's some symbolism there. The other is Is later on in the in the story of the Israelites when they get to Canaan and they got to go to war and I never thought about this to my buddy bride up. He's like where do you think they got the weapons for war? And I'm like, I don't know. He's like, they were picking him up off the seashore from the Egyptians washing up. Yeah, I've got, that may be so I like that. And he's so there the symbolism here is Rich and deep and there's so much we can take away from this. If we spend some time really reading the story. And not just reading it but immersing ourselves in it and thinking about it.

42:59 Yeah, yeah, beautiful stuff. I mean, the story of Passover in The Exodus just has so many layers and they just pile up on top of one another. It's almost hard to like we're not we're just going to scratch the surface. You have this little meeting here. Yep. So I do want to now we've kind of laid the groundwork and and you know most people are kind of familiar. With the, I think the basics of the story but thanks Charlton, Heston. I know, I think Mormons can have kind of a special appreciation of the symbolic, meaning of this story because of our kind of view of the Plan of Salvation. So I'm gonna, I'm going to lay this out, just in brief but now there's all Kinds of details that we could pick out there. So The story as I mentioned, kind of you starts out with Abraham.

44:04 And he is the father of the faithful. That's more of a Rams names. And and then he has a son, and he has a son so it's Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And these are the three Patriarchs, okay? And and Jacob, Jacob actually becomes the people of Israel, okay? So then then when we're talking about the, the Mormon idea of the plant, Salvation, it kind of it all starts with these three starts with our, father starts with Father Son and Holy Ghost. Okay.

44:44 And and of course, the middle one is the one that's sacrificed. Right. That's right with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. That's that is the case as well. And also in this is a, you know, kind of a uniquely Mormon thing. Is that the story story of The Plan of Salvation doesn't start on Earth it actually starts It's in heaven. Mmkay. So by the story of Israel starts in Canaan, which is the promised land, which is symbolic of heaven, right? Okay. And then so we all start in Israel starts in the promised land. And then they go down to Egypt, which is the world, right?

45:26 And everything's good at first light and when we come to the Earth, everything is good at first because we're innocent and we're not accountable. But at some point Wait, slave. No sin enters in. Right? The, the bondage of sin, I will say. And then there's all the all that goes along with that, and and then that eventually, there's a savior provided. And then on, you know, we, you know, there's a savior provided in the Passover story. That was the lamb, okay? We Leave the World Behind, we leave the Egyptians behind, they don't. Want us to leave. They want to keep us in sin. We come to, you know, but we but we put our faith in the savior in the lamb and then we come to this point where we've had, we have faith.

46:19 So we we put the blood on our house and we repent, you know we like we're not going to build up Egypt anymore. We're going to do what God wants us to do. That's repentance, right, okay? And we're going to go out into the wilderness. Earnest and then that prepares us for baptism and that is the that is the Red Sea, right? Israel. The entire as a nation as a witch in the scriptures is often referred to as a as a person like Israel as a body, right is sometimes referred to as God's son, sometimes referred to as God's servant sometimes as God's wife. I just depending on the metaphor that's being used but but as a corporate body, we go underneath the water, right? And this is on the, on the eighth day to, hmm, right? So the number eight is is connected to the baptism, right? Okay.

47:18 In lots of stories, 8 Dare die, barges and eight people on NOAA ship and and so on. So we go under the, we go into the water and then there's a pillar of fire that guides Us in. This is the Holy Ghost Train, and we go out into the Wilderness and, and there's a period of purification, right? So after after we are, baptized the scriptures would refer to this, as like justification. But then there's a period of sanctification where we become holy, now, in the story of Israel, it's the the old generation dying off bit by bit and being replaced by the The new generation who then is finally worthy to enter Heaven.

48:02 Again, enter the promised land and so there's so there's this this cool thing right? Where we start in heaven, we descend to Earth, go through all these trials and plagues and and eventually escaped and there's baptism and then there's all this sanctification and then ultimately we want we end up back in the same place where we began and the other cool thing about it. Is that I mentioned this earlier is that Abraham who is symbolic of the Father Here, Right earlier in the story, he actually did all that stuff first before, right? Abraham, does this stuff? Yeah. Starts out in, Canaan goes down to Egypt, and returns to Canaan and goes through all the struggles and things, and then his descendants make the same new Trace in, Trace his footsteps.

48:56 So to speak. So, there's a lot of, there's a lot of details that could be pulled out there. Yeah. And what I find funny is that this story continues to cycle through in Time After Time, right? You can see it in this story that we're talking about. You can see it in in the the colonists that were here for Religious Freedom, right? We're going to break away, we're going to go do something different and then you see it again with with You know, in three or four generations after them where we're breaking from England and then let's make it really Mormon. Now Brigham's, going to take the Saints out of the United States and break away again, Mormon Moses, right?

49:42 Exactly. And so this story can I would imagine that we're going to see another episode of this only. Maybe not so physical. Right? Maybe now it's a matter of spiritually, coming out of Egypt. Oh yeah, right. Whatever your Egyptian. Chipped is there's this idea now of coming out of it, maybe it's shutting off the social media. Maybe it's, you know, just finding a way to leave Egypt or Babylon behind you and go forward. yeah, I mean yeah, I have a lot of thoughts going through my mind but yeah it's part of it is Part of it is the the truth of knowing what it is you're supporting. I mean, in one sense.

50:33 They were slaves. Yes. Okay. And so I don't know how much, you know, we can't. We can't necessarily blame individual Israelites for that, but in another sense like we sell ourselves. Yeah, into slavery, right? Yeah. It's like okay. We'll go along with that. And and before, you know, it, you're you're actually building up Egypt. Yes, yeah. And, and I think part of the plagues part of the plagues is to get pharaohs attention, but part of it's probably to get the Attention to be like hey you see this beautiful Nile near that you they probably made proud.

51:16 Maybe they'll of the Nile. They took pride in this awesome river. That was well it's that was in their country at least The Giver of Life. Yeah. Through there right. I mean you're probably drawn your water from there and Wells associated with it. Here it is. Yeah I'm going to turn it to blood. All the fish are going to die. It's going to stink and frogs are going to come out and all the things that Some point all the things that you thought, maybe we were kind of cool or nice about Egypt and they did think, Egypt was nice, they complain to Moses over and over. Let's go back. You know, in Egypt, we had cucumbers and leeks to eat, you know, and at least, at least we were, at least, at least the Egyptians fed us. It's like, wow, you would you want? I mean, it's selling your Birthright for a mess of pottage, you know.

52:07 Yep. Like you would Trade your freedom for some cucumbers. Well, and I think it's actually deeper than that. So I've I've thought about this a little bit. Once when, when we adopted our twins we had to become foster parents first. Yeah, which was just asinine, right? I have four kids who were doing well because of my wife. I'm not gonna lie. It wasn't it? It had nothing to do with me but anyway they're doing good and I'm taking a class on parenting from somebody who's never had kids. Move me nuts down, right, but I played the game. One day I was getting ready to head out of that class I mean, I'd go that class.

52:47 I'm like you look at what you get out of here, right? I would be watching the clock and I'm like, I'm out one day. I get caught, I was talking to another guy and the lady, he was teaching, the class came up and said, hey, I was wondering if you would go with us. Some, a pretty big guy, right? We have to do and what they called an extraction, okay? For my house. And the the, the city Police Department was fairly thin and she's like, they've assured us, that it's safe. But I would like some help. There's going to be one other cop there and I'm like, okay fine, right, so I get in there, do this, and we drive down there, and it's just horrible conditions, Joshua, there's no food in the house. There's moldy food in the house.

53:36 There is feces on the wall, filth and squalor. It's filth and squalor, and you can tell these kids have been abused like Having been a former smoker. I know what a cigarette butt burn looks like and those kids had them. It was horrific. Horrific made me want to pound somebody. I was like, where is he? I got something I want to give them. And what struck me is even when we were telling the kids we're going to take you someplace safer. You're going to be able to go someplace where there's good food they fought. They were Were like I can't leave here. I got to stay here. I got to stay here.

54:16 This is where I'm at and there's this human condition that we get in where the fear of the unknown. Seems worse than whatever condition you're in now. And I think that that we can take that lesson away that. Yeah, sometimes the unknown is way better than what's here. Devil, you don't the devil, you know, is better than the. Yeah. I don't I don't necessarily ascribe to that in most cases, I think, well, maybe not. Right and and I think I think that's the Lord saying don't be too scared of change. Change is inevitable. So yeah so I think part of the plagues was God just had to destroy Egypt. Yeah, it doesn't.

54:58 It's not appealing anymore because yes just hail and fire and all he did his. Yeah. Like let's just destroy this place so that by people are not gonna feel a desire to stay, right? Yeah. So, yeah. Anyway, I mean, that happens, there World felt of fell apart, and they experienced a lot of the plagues to not all of them, but the first few, the Israelites and the Egyptians felt equally. So there's you and there's a lesson in that to like God's people are not guaranteed to. Have an easy time at it when the plagues and the destruction come like you're going to feel it too.

55:43 But but Ultimate Destruction there's a promise there that Ultimate Destruction will not what you will pass over you. Right? So yeah. So let's see, so now there's There's kind of three, three kind of closely related festivals or important days surrounding Passover. There's the Passover itself, which is, as I mentioned before is the, is the Lamb actually in the lab or the, or the goat is killed on the on the 14th. And then beginning on the 15th and going for seven days, we have the Feast of unleavened bread and why unleavened bread to remind them of the haste with which they left.

56:32 Egypt, right? They couldn't wait for the bread to rise. And so, they baked these flat, this flatbread. And then the other thing is late, this didn't this didn't happen when they first left Egypt, but later on in Leviticus look in, Leviticus 23, it talks about the first fruits offering and this is the this this is the first fruits of the barley So in in the land of Israel The Barley becomes ripe. At about the time, I'll pass over a little before and the rule that God gave is when The Barley starts to become ripe, no one can eat, you're not supposed to eat the new grain until the first offering has been made to God. And then, and then, and then you can Partake of the bread after that.

57:33 So and that that first day of first, fruits, actually, there are different Traditions about this and we can talk about that a little bit, but it's connected with the Feast of unleavened bread. I'll just say that one, the most common tradition, which is the tradition that the rabbi is take, is that the day when the first Sheaf of barley is supposed to be offered is the second day of unleavened bread. Hmm. Okay. The carrots, which is another branch of Judaism.

58:13 They feel like that. It's it's going to be basically the Sunday during the Feast of unleavened bread. Whenever that it doesn't could be, could be the first or the second, third, fourth fifth or sixth or seventh day. But when there's going to be a Sunday in there, Somewhere, he would be the day after the weekly Sabbath basically. So, and in ancient times, these two views were basically the Pharisees and the Sadducees like disagreed. Coraz��n is about the Sadducees were of the of the opinion. That the first fruit offering mentioned in Leviticus 23, should be like during the Sunday during the Feast of unleavened bread. And the Pharisees said, No, it should be the second day of unleavened bread.

58:58 Whenever that is okay. So fast forwarding now, too. Jesus, and his fulfillment, of course, there's so many things that did that Jesus fulfilled. He's referred to as the Lamb of God and over and over throughout the scriptures when it when it talks about a lamb, like in the Book of Revelation, there's this lamb is talked about and I mean, it's referring to this Passover imagery. Okay. So there's all kinds of things that actually, the The celebration of Passover and the different kind of rituals.

59:42 They, they point to they talk about Jesus triumphant entry. They talked about his cleansing of the Temple. Before Shadow him as the as the Passover Lamb. The significance of the Lord's Supper, the sacrament, the the Passover rituals foreshadowed the place and time of his crucifixion. They foreshadow those responsible for his death. There's foreshadowing of the three days in the Tomb and also the the time of his resurrection. So all of those things We are fulfilled in detail by Jesus, and he is his passion week basically. So, first one is the the triumphant entry. So this and you can read, this is in John, in the gospels. Matthew Mark talked about it, too, but this is, when Jesus comes riding into Jerusalem, on the donkey and everyone's shouting Hosanna, and they've got the palm branches. Has and they're throwing down their jackets or whatever to to make a path for him and they they hail him as King right essentially and this at this point like until this this really is this setting Jesus

1:01:13 gets set apart from the rest of the Israelites. He's been mingling with them, he's been mingling with the lowlifes, right, the tax collectors, the prostitutes and the Sinners, and, but now suddenly he is, he's gaining traction, he's gaining popularity and he suddenly gets elevated to King essentially in. It's symbolically speaking they recognized him as that and this, you know, the Leadership has been nervous about him. Oh yeah but they're like no no we definitely got to take care of this problem.

1:01:54 This is embarrassing. Right? And this this happens this John gives the timing. This is happens on the tenth day of Passover their 10th day of the first month. This is when the Passover Lambs are so set apart from the rest of the flock as the as the sacrificial lamb. So, here he is, set apart. His with, with the triumphal entry. So Jesus, of course, cleanses the temple to okay, makes a whip and it's a, it's a great story for all those people who you have the the big teddy bear, loving accepting Jesus, right?

1:02:37 That wouldn't hurt a flea or whatever, right? But, you know, he braids takes the time to braid a whip, and then goes in and flips over the tables and cleans house. Yep. And this is fulfilling the Passover symbolism as well, because in preparation for the Feast of unleavened bread, they're supposed to clean their houses of all the comments or the Levin. So, here he is, he says, I'm cleaning my father's house right of the wickedness that's there. And of course leaven in the Hers has a number of meanings, but generally, not always, but generally there's kind of a negative connotation.

1:03:25 Right. 11 is represented representative of sin of some sort or false ideas. At least, like Jesus said, Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees right now. It's not always, it's not always negative, but usually it is. Jesus also says, To his followers, A little leaven leavens, the whole lump like he he wants us to be the leaven for the world. But I, but with the righteous counterpart, to the leaven of the Pharisees, in the wickedness of these, these uninspired Traditions that the Pharisees are constantly trying to pile onto everybody Jesus. he gets criticized for not following their Traditions all the time even though he's since he's keeping all the Commandments but he does not keep their Traditions, you know, he Pick some food on the Sabbath and heals people on the Sabbath.

1:04:27 And his his disciples eat with unwashed hands and he's being criticized constantly. But all these things that he's being criticized about, none of them are actual Commandments, right? These are otherwise, he's not a seamless, right? They're all, they're all the traditions of the Pharisees, which he says, beware of this this leavening that they have. So, so, so he's, so there's, there's some corruption in the temple. To and who knows what all that entails. I've heard the theories about. you know, your people bring animals and, and The priests were maybe saying oh you know you know we found this problem with your lab that you brought.

1:05:13 So why don't you? You know we have some here though that you can buy from us that are certified or whatever and they were you know kind of Abusing the system as they turned into a money-making operation. Yeah. Jesus didn't like that. No. So he cleaned 11 out of his out of his father's house. Then of course, he is the Lamb that the scriptures are full of that and he's not only is he the lamb? But he's the lamb that was slain from before the foundation of the world, from the foundation of the world. So this is always the plan and Time and place of his crucifixion.

1:05:58 Now, in the, in Exodus chapter 12, when they're, when Jehovah is giving instructions, he tells them to on the on the 14th. He says, you're supposed to kill kill the Passover Lambs on in the afternoon. The Hebrew phrase is between the evenings, okay? So in the Hebrew Hebrew way of thinking, about the day, there's actually two evenings and we actually in our English, modern speech, we refer to these things as evenings to the first evening is noon and when the sun, when the Sun reaches high place and then starts to go down that's evening and of course we say p.m. that's right.

1:06:42 Evening right. But then there's also the evening where the sun is actually getting close to the Horizon and you searched the sky turns red and starts to get dimmer. We call that evening as well. And so did ancient Israelites. So between the evenings is the, the phrase used. So so that was in the afternoon and typically the Passover Lambs were killed between like 3:00 and 5:00 p.m. And in the Gospels it says that's that is that is the time that Jesus was crucified to. Wow. Right. Right. Then when at the temple, all of the the Passover Lambs were being killed Jesus.

1:07:24 At that same time, was being flogged and then nailed to the cross and all those horrible things. So, so evil, feel that now There is kind of an interesting. Glitch in the gospels. And that is the synoptic gospels of Matthew, Mark. And Luke, they all say that the last supper or they don't necessarily say, but they imply, they imply very strongly that the last supper was the Passover however, John says that it was before the Passover Now, and which I agree, I agree with John because if Jesus had kind of eaten the Passover and then been killed the following day, he would, he would not have been the Passover Lamb.

1:08:31 Right? Is more important for him to be the Passover than to partake, eat the Passover, right? And actually in Luke, he says he says, I have really want. He says, I've desired with desire. Great. Our to eat this Passover, but I'm not going to I'm not going to partake it again until until the kingdom. I've got rights, basically. So anyway, there's some things we probably won't get into it but there's looking at the Greek construction of the sentences in Matthew, Mark and Luke it actually it actually can be translated a couple of different ways.

1:09:14 And I think the better translation is rather than at some point says on the first day of unleavened bread, the better translation is it actually says before before the Feast of unleavened bread they were getting they're making preparations. So anyway, that's just a little side note but I think Jesus was here, he was crucified when the Lambs were being slaughtered slaughtered. Yeah. Okay, so those responsible for his death to the Passover. The Passover ritual is actually tell us about that too and it's really tempting sometimes to point to the Romans say, ah, yeah those those dirty Romans, they're the ones that killed Jesus or even to say those the Jews, especially the, the corrupt Jewish leadership.

1:10:10 They're the ones that killed Jesus, but you know who, you know, who kills the Is over. It's the actual people of Israel when they allow Barabbas to go free. Yeah. The people you know the people the people do that. And and and that's what in Exodus chapter 12. He says you know, the father of every house you're going to you you are going to kill the lamb and it is it is by them and and for them that the lamb is killed and you know I mean that's a humbling thing to think about actually I think about that sometimes when you know what I'm doing the sacrament with my family ER fellowship or whatever. We partake of the bread and the wine. You in remembrance of Jesus.

1:11:08 But the guys, the guys who are administering, right? Are the ones who are ripping you have flesh, right? Yeah, this is me. This is my sins. Every time I tear it. I just think of my, you know, my sins. And this is what I do. This is what I did to my savior. Yep. And I, I his blood was poured out because of me. Yep. And for me, And it was not the Romans who shed his blood that was me. Yep, you know. So I think there's also an interesting parallel there to that. We know that there was a large faction of Israel that wasn't happy that Rome was there. Yeah.

1:11:54 Right. Right now. And rightfully so I don't think any of us would be happy with an occupying power. Very few having said that Because of political strife's. They were so angry, they prefer to murderer. Over somebody else and I think that that can be kind of a cautionary tale as well, right? And I get some Flack for this. I liked Trump as a president. I thought he did some good stuff. I was a huge fan when he moved the embassy to Jerusalem I'm like I didn't see that coming. So I yeah, II definitely didn't vote for Hillary, but I did write in another candidate.

1:12:39 I did right in Ted Cruz because I just didn't think Trump. Was was a constitutionalist. I was wrong. I'll admit that he was better than I thought he was. The one thing that scared me about Trump was that he appealed to everybody's anger? Oh, yeah, absolutely. And that to me is always troubling and I think you see parallels in that with what happened with Barabbas and Jesus, right? People are so angry that they're being occupied. We want we want not Jesus, right? We don't. They weren't look, whoever we doesn't matter, right? Just he's anybody to make the Romans lot harder and we know, That Barabbas, he was he was one of the zealots, right?

1:13:26 He was one of those hanging out down, by the Galilee performing Guerrilla tactics and that sort of thing because let's face it. If he's murdering other Jews, the Jewish people, probably are more like, yeah. You keep him. Yeah. Yeah. We'll take Jesus. And he Barabbas is killing quote, the right people. And so that political anger can be somewhat blinding and I think it's a cautionary tale to be very careful who you're pinning to? Yeah, no that's that's blinding is the right word. Yeah. Yeah. When you let your anger, dictate a lot of your decisions. You knew a lot of silly crap when you're angry and that was that was my only not now. And it's not only a.

1:14:13 Yeah. And it's and it's the anger of a crowd too, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's that mob mentality. You've seen those those Your posters like sky, right? Yeah, this Eagle soaring, or whatever or the cat hanging on and says, hang in there. Yeah. They're an excellence and persevere and all that. There's, there's also, there's a, his company is probably a few companies that make not motivational posters but demotivation I've seen those are awesome bellarius. My favorite one though is its pictures and all these hands like in the middle like we're going to we're going to do a go team kind of thing. But the caption is like I think the caption says, teamwork and but then the the subtitle is none of us is, as dumb as all of us.

1:15:00 Yep. Yep. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's easy. There's so many Grace embolisms within the Passover and when you start looking at what happens to Jesus, it's, it's, it's good stuff. Yeah. It's the it's the best. So, okay. You know, his time in the Tomb and the time of his resurrection, this is really cool too because Hey. Paul, the Apostle. Paul, he picks up on this in his writings and he refers to Jesus as the firstfruits of them that slept. Okay. And this is talking about the, the first fruits of the barley Harvest and, and equating that to the resurrection and Paul has plenty of imagery about this. But as I said, you know, the and this happens during Passover and it happens on happens on, as I said that the Sadducees felt like, it should always be on the Sunday and Pharisees thought it should be the second day.

1:16:10 And sometimes those were the same. And the year that and I love this to about about Jesus is that I think the year that he died, those were actually listening to same day. So, It actually satisfied, both both calendar systems. Okay? But but basically Jesus is the first Sheaf of the resurrection of the first fruits of the Resurrection. So and what that means is, no one else can partake of the Resurrection until that first shieff is offered right? And he and Jesus says that to Mary in the garden. He says I he says don't hold me. Some of the translations say don't touch me but that's not what he was intending.

1:16:57 I don't believe says, don't hold me as in. Don't hold me back. I need to go present myself to the father, right? As that as that first Sheaf of the resurrection and then once that is done, then other other folks can partake of the Resurrection to gotcha. So, so that was fulfilled there as well. So really, really amazing stuff. Now, how is it? How is it celebrated, you know these things? Well, the modern the modern celebration really is in a Seder. So seder, Passover seder is a Seder means and ordered meal. Mmm.

1:17:45 So they have this symbolic meal and there's kind of these parts it's kind of like a play almost and you're the father will say something and then the family will say something and then you know, the children will say something and there's kind of a script That you read and in a lot of ways I the Seder is very much like the endowment. Hmm. And the reason for that action, we're going to going to read see if I wrote it down. Let's see.

1:18:28 Well let's see. In Exodus 13 somewhere. Okay. So one of the one of The Commandments connect it to Passover is that you are supposed to teach this to your children, right? Forever and you're supposed to do these things. And you know, keep this as a memorial for ever, that's how important it is. So in Exodus 13 starting in verse 14. let's see, actually Okay.

1:19:08 Yeah now I'm going to read I start in verse 8. So just before that he's talking about seven days of unleavened bread. And verse 8 says and thou shalt show thy son in that day saying. And by the way, this aisle I'm going to back up to five, sorry. No Exodus 13 Verse 5 says when when the Lord shall bring thee into the land. Okay, so when the Lord brings them into the land, was there. Anyone who is brought into the land who actually experienced what happened in Egypt? No, because they all the old generation died off in the wanderings. No one except Joshua Caleb. Yep, that's it.

1:19:52 So, but even though, even though none of the people there who will be brought into the land actually experienced it, this is the Commandment that they're Ian, it's really amazing. Now shall Shew thy son in that day, saying this is done because of that, which Jehovah did unto me when I came forth out of Egypt. Hmm! See, so, even nowadays, like, you are the Commandment is that when you have your family, sitting around the table and you're eating unleavened bread and lamb and bitter herbs. And you tell the story you're supposed to tell your Children.

1:20:34 This is what God did for me when I came out of Egypt and, and every generation is supposed to tell, this is what God did for me. When I came out when he took me out of Egypt throughout your Generations because 11, our ancestors story is our story. Yep. And to this is this is a We've mentioned it several times. This is a personal story that gets told over and over, you know in the endowment it says each of you is supposed to consider yourselves as though you were.

1:21:15 You had him and Eve, right? We weren't Adam and Eve and yet we and yet we are Adam and Eve. And this is a story about us and we are learning. We are taking upon ourselves this the identity of our ancestors and add going through the thing. That they went through and learning about the things that they experience in hopes that we can have the blessings that they had. Right. And so when we when the Seder, when the seder meal is done and we tell the story and we go through these, this ceremonial reenactment of that night. Each of you is to consider yourselves as though you were there in Egypt, right? And you were freed and you tell your children, this is what God did for me.

1:22:01 Personally, you know, that's one of the Things I love about Mormonism, is that? You can always tell where God has been because he leaves an impression that lasts for generations and preceding Generations. Hearken back to it. We do this with our youth, right? And this this will ring true, especially in the LDS church. How many times have they went back? Re-enacted Trek. Right? Why would you do that? It's this exact same thing. It is, God was in the details of that. How do I know? Because his impression is so defined that we now have successive generations to Generations. Going back. To reenact those things to have an appreciation to have that experience.

1:22:43 It's the same thing he did with the Jewish Nation with Israel reenact this. This is just it's just like he went through it. It's just like the endowment. That's a good because you're going to pass through with the ultimate ancestor passed through. Yeah. To get here. That's right. Yeah. It's like the I mean I reminded of lectures on faith. I think it's six or seven. I can't remember now but it's basically like like you want you want the blessings that your ancestors had em. You do it? They did. Yep. And and it is vain for you to think that you can have the same blessing without the same sacrifice, you do it. They did. You'll get the blessing they got. And that's it, that's the rule.

1:23:23 And I think it's also a fulfillment of that promise where, you know, the hearts will be turned to the fathers. And the hearts of the children shall be turned to their fathers and their fathers to their children. Yeah, I think that is very much a part of that. Because what better way to have your heart turn to your ancestors, then to you, as they did to experience what they experienced. And if I'm not mistaken, the seder meal has some pretty bitter herbs, you're going to recoil at the experience, just like your ancestors did. That's right. Yeah, yeah. It's beautiful, beautiful. But that that like welding link between the generations is built into the Commandments surrounding surrounding. The observance of Passover.

1:24:11 So yeah. Now there's so the Seder. I said the stator is in seder is found in a book called the Haggadah. The Haggadah I've gotta means the telling. So this this contains the and I'm holding one here for those of you who can't see, but the Haggadah is it contains the story of Passover, which they're commanded to tell and also kind of the instructions for the Emil. Right. And yeah. And it involves these symbolic elements, the main, you know, the symbolic elements that are required by the scriptures are lamb, unleavened bread and bitter herbs and you mention bitter herbs can be many things, but traditionally that involves horseradish and, and the tradition with that is that you're supposed to take like the size of Olive like and it's uncomfortable, right?

1:25:12 And it's supposed to be, it's supposed to bring you to tears, you know? Yep. And it does. Okay. Now there are there are additional symbolic elements that have been added over time. And that includes like washing of hands. There's a couple of times where this is done and eating this mixture called Hora set, which is basically made from fruits and nuts. And juice or wine kind of boiled together into a paste. And this is to remind them of like the mortar that they made bricks with and stuff. Okay? And there's also these, these cups of wine trade, the tradition is four cups of wine at various points throughout the meal. And so, little side note on that, by the way, out of you, if you ever have you seen John Donne Bradley's book? The Lost 116 Pages.

1:26:13 I've seen it. I've never read it. Excellent book. Highly recommend it. He has some really interesting historical background that has been dug up about the contents of the Lost pages. And at least one of The interesting details that's lost is that at the time when Lehi and his family, make their Exodus from Jerusalem, it is during this Festival of the Jews. And there's good evidence from, there's good evidence that this was that Lehigh probably left during Passover. And the fact that fact that Nephi found Laban drunk in the streets, probably, because he was out, he's probably had more than four cups of wine.

1:27:02 But anyway, but is probably connected with Passover. There's a lot of actually Passover imagery, kind of in The Exodus of Lehi, and his family. So so there's a little more, another, another Mormon connection there. So anyway, the Seder is interesting because nobody actually knows who wrote the Seder. There's many different kind of versions that have come up over the years, but but we know that it's about 2,000 years old. At least interesting, though, smidge. Yeah, interesting though, is Many things in Christianity and Mormonism included. Have, you know, either I will say continued continued or borrowed symbolism and elements from Judaism but the the exchange has gone the other way too. And there's actually there's actually very good. There's some, there's some good evidence that the, the Jewish Seder actually was Is a response to the Christian celebration of Passover because the Last Supper, which although it was not a Passover, definitely had Passover significance, right? And so in the Seder, there's washing of hands in the Last Supper, there's washing a feet.

1:28:32 There is the the bread, there's the wine right? Which is in the Seder to there's Jesus dipping his his bread into some sort of diversion. It's op. It says right of course Judas dips within right but but in the in the Seder, there's these haroset, like I said, they actually dip into the haroset and also there's saltwater. That's vegetables, are dipped in at another time. But so there's all these and there's several cups actually have wine in the end. The Last Supper there was there's cups mentioned in throughout the synoptic gospels. So, Anyway, the oldest account in of any historical account that we have of anything that looks like a Seder is actually the last supper. And so this actually is a, you has its roots there where I believe so.

1:29:31 So, That was going to say. So, anyway, The satyrs Cedars, great. We usually have, oh, I was gonna say, so there is, there is some controversy about whether or not you should have lamb in modern times. So rabbinic Jews, they definitely frown upon eating lamb. During the Seder. And a big part of that is because they have no Temple, no, absence of a temple. All right.

1:30:11 And they say there are some verses in Deuteronomy that If you read it one way, seems to say that that the Passover needs to be killed at the temple. And in second in second temple times. Like, in Jesus day, that is kind of the practice at least for the people who were living in Jerusalem. They would bring their lambs to the temple, to kill them, and then take them home and eat them. But I don't want to get into the details there, but but isn't Deuteronomy 16 and it may be, I think Deuteronomy 16 is actually describing the the national celebration of Passover versus the individual, familial celebration of Passover, which is described in, Exodus 12 and 13, Passover unleavened bread. By the way, is this isn't.

1:31:11 Here's another kind of Mormon connection. There's there's some time. Of the year, when everyone is supposed to come together, come to the temple, come to Jerusalem, and bring their offerings. And also just receive instructions from the priest and stuff. And one of them is in the spring Passover, which is around April and one of them is in at the Feast of Tabernacles, which is in around October usually. So, although the, you know, the LDS General Conference the And the beginning of April, in the beginning of October, they're not, they don't always line up with unleavened bread and Tabernacles but they're definitely an echo there.

1:31:54 The other time the third time, when in this supposed to be this is just for the man other people, you know, the women are allowed to, there's no restriction there but the manner required to show up and bring their offering represent the family and bring their offerings. Like I said, and receive instruction and stuff. The other time is Shavuot or the Feast of Weeks. So which is coming up soon and you're going to you're going to give us a talk there at the restoration Torah conference. We'll talk more about that next time, I guess. But anyway, there's controversy about about that but I am convinced that although there are sacrifices and stuff that we're supposed to be done by the Levites and done in the temple.

1:32:42 And you Joseph Smith himself said someday. Those things are going to be done again when again. And and Joseph Smith says the same things at the rabbi say, which is when the temple is built. When there's a proper place to do these ironic things, that there will be a renewal at least partly of the, the animal sacrifices, as part of the restoration of all things. However, when I read the, when I read Exodus and read about the the Passover Lamb, there's is no Levites involved. Left. It's just the father of every family is supposed to do it. There's no Temple involved. You do it at your, at your house and so we we do that, we have, you know, a lamb that we've raised in, you know, have one in my backyard right now, that's getting bigger by the day and you will Slaughter and roast that lamb.

1:33:39 I built an oven in our backyard, so and that'll feed. Excuse me, fellow feed. Well, we usually have something like 60 to 70 people. Wow, who come, and they course we don't only eat the lamb, but we eat the lamb and and then eat the bitter herbs, and the matzo, and the Heart of satin and the glasses of wine and have the Seder. And it's a good experience, that's awesome. And so when you doing that this time, so this this year, it's going to be April 5th. The evening of April 5th. Evening of April 5th. Yep. Will be Paso, Paso the day that the quote, the day of Passover, the day that the lamb is killed is going to be the fifth.

1:34:26 But then as the fifth goes into the evening, you know, after Sundown then that becomes the 15th day of the first month which then is the first day of unleavened bread which is when the lamb is supposed to be eaten. So the lamb is killed on the 14th and then eaten with the, the matzo and the bitter herbs on the 15th of the evening of the 15th. Wow. So it's kind of been an emotional experience. Oh, you can't. Yeah. You know, I'm definitely not a vegetarian and I have no problem going to the store, you know, and buying this.

1:35:08 Yeah. Processed bloodless gutless hairless odorless piece of meat, you know wrapped in styrofoam and you know plastic wrap and whatever faceless but yeah the first time the first time that I actually slaughtered a lamb for my family to eat. It was hard and it still is hard guy. Don't do it that often. I mean do it once once a year. You know. I didn't know if I could do it the first time actually, I mean right. Which is but it was it was a little, it was surprising. Actually we mentioned that before like I didn't I didn't I didn't really think about it.

1:35:53 I didn't anticipate having a problem but ma'am. I know when I went to, you know, we cut its throat, you know, to slaughter it but that was it took a long time for me to get up the Courage, you know I guess I've got of Courage is the right word but just the strength to do it and then and then the loss that I felt was just palpable to. Yeah. Yeah. And Again, I think that's designed for a reason, right? That's that's to show you if you feel this way about Nana, Imagine essentially, having offer up your own firstborn, who did nothing wrong. Yeah, lived the perfect life.

1:36:48 Yeah. Yeah. I have my, until till my, when my kids are young. I don't really, you know, when they're really little, I don't really want him out there, right? It's hard to understand. But, but as soon as they're eight, That before that if they're interested they can come watch. But after they turn 8, they're required. Like you have to see what is being done on your behalf. Now, you are now that you're old enough that you're going to be accountable, you need to understand and I think that's a, that's a powerful image, you know. Absolutely. It is. yeah, and I hunted for a long time.

1:37:34 I stopped talking about 5 years ago. And mainly because I got lazy. I'll admit that the last time I woke up in October to a foot of snow up in the mountains, I'm like, yeah, what are we doing here? What are we doing? But No matter how many times I went hunting. There's still that twinge. I mean there's still that that feeling and I think that's how he looks good. Yeah, I think it's healthy. Yeah, I think that's healthy. I think, I think it does two things. You become truly grateful for that animal. You, you become truly grateful. The idea that this is something anyone would take joy or pleasure and is a silly. Silly thing.

1:38:19 Now I'm sure that there are those and them, I would question ever having them around my kids. But yeah. So this isn't something that's taken lightly. And I could tell by the way, you know, you look that that's something. You take pretty seriously and weighs on you. Yeah, absolutely. So anyway, we usually have a usually start. Those kind of an all day thing, will have people show up the house around noon, and then there's all kinds of preparations, cutting up vegetables. and we have a big with the kitchen turns into a big matzo making factory basically mix up dough and roll it out flat and Bake it or cookie tin pans, or things like that.

1:39:03 And so I mean we just cook hundreds of pieces of matzah and people are chopping up vegetables and getting tables set, people are outside you know skinning and gutting and roasting the lamb and so it's kind of a production and it's an all-day thing and it's It's great. So, that's what we do to celebrate, basically. And then, of course, and then we actually just eat matzah the whole week, you know, right. So yeah, it's good. We are this year. We're actually going to there's a lady in the ward, where I live, who's has this enormous nativity set, Collection. Hmm.

1:39:53 So on the evening of April 5th, we're going to have the Seder and all of that and then the morning of April 6th. We're going to go look at all these neat. She's going to set out a these nativity sets for us to come. Now, you look at, so that would be really fun. That's awesome. Well, dude, it's good stuff. Yeah, yeah, no. I one other thing I will say is that this first fruits, this like I said, it's on, I subscribe to the Care Act idea, which is also the sadducee idea, which is that it's supposed to be on the Sunday during.

1:40:39 Okay, leavened bread. Okay. So actually, I just remembered something else I want to mention. This is a nice segue into it. But this actually, this is this is Easter right? Easter is not always, but almost always the Sunday during Passover. The Feast of unleavened bread. Yeah, yeah. If you swing, we're sorry, yes, too big to be precise to which is, which is in common parlance often called Passover week of Passover. So that's fine. now, interesting thing about that though, is the At the council. I mean, this goes to, this goes to the great apostasy here. We talk about the great apostasy. We're going straight to the next, ER, yeah, yeah. So 325 Council in nicaea Constantine is presiding and one of the big things that they attempt to accomplish here. Well, let me back up here.

1:41:41 When, you know, when Mormons talk about the great apostasy, there's a couple of parts to it, right? One is, there's like physical. Incubation. And, you know, the apostles are being killed off and, you know, maybe other other priesthood leaders, right? So there's this interruption in the transmission of priesthood priesthood. And then, the other thing that we often talk about is this this corrupting influence of pagan, Greek, Greek, Pagan, and philosophical ideas, corrupting Doctrine, and things like that. The thing that we don't talk about those, Is that there was there was an intentional and this happened at Nicea which was the first the first Council as far as I know like the first church Council, but one of their goals was we got to figure out how to get rid of all of this Israelite stuff. That is encumbering the church and we want the church to be non-israelite as possible.

1:42:47 We want to have nothing. Thing in common with those detestable Jews. And so we're going to calculate Easter a different. We're going to we're not going to rely on the Jewish calendar to calculate Eastern, although they basically came up with a different way to calculate it. That ends up being equivalent pretty close. Yeah, but but yeah, there was the Jew, any of the any Jewish Bishops and there were still at this time, they were still Jewish Bishops, they were all excluded from the council. And they made these decisions to intentionally get rid of Jewish ideas. And one of them was the, the observance of Passover. This was actually a big part of the apostasy that eventually became Catholicism, is we need to root out these. There's these Christians are still observing Passover and the Feast of unleavened bread and we do not want them to do that anymore.

1:43:48 And you know, we're going to we're going to celebrate Easter and eventually, you know, this, this turns into egg-laying rabbits and you're celebrating right. Resurrection. Which is just so weird but but we'd rather have that and anything to do with Exodus and right and the symbolism involved there. And the there were kind of holdouts, I think early Christians who continue to sin. Celebrate this up until about 400 ad when the church is finally able to stamp it out from being practiced in Christianity.

1:44:29 So, so when I look at keeping the these feasts and Passover in particular, like I just consider it. As part of the restoration and this is like, pushing back like undoing the things that were done as part of apostasy the great apostasy. So are we? There's no that's awesome. I had again, my good buddy whose dad was a rabbi. He told me because I was really concerned, right? I was thinking when I was first thinking about, you know, these feasts and that sort of thing. When I lived in Maryland, I was always super nervous because I didn't want to, I wouldn't want somebody creeping into the temple. Who wasn't supposed to be there.

1:45:15 Likewise I didn't want to be that guy. Creeping in on somebody else's tradition, that shouldn't be there to my surprise, even Joel's dad was like, no, we welcome it. He's like, can we join us? Yeah, I mean, my first, my first seder was was at his house homey and, and I'm so glad I got to do it and he explained it. He was like, no, no, he's like if you're a Christian, if you profess to follow Christ. Why wouldn't you do this? He's like, okay. Well, Oh, that's a very why wouldn't you do this? That was Jesus is religion, was it not? Absolutely. And I was like, well, yeah, you know you got a point.

1:45:55 So I think sometimes we feel like, well, that's there's this is ours and I think it's like you were saying a hangover from from from the apostasy. Absolutely. Yeah. And there's one more thing I want to bring up is that Passover, Passover is a part of the restoration to not just in not just keeping the Seder like I like is I mean we don't really have evidence that Joe Smith, kept a Seder for example, right? But but the imagery of Passover is embedded in the fabric of the restoration.

1:46:37 So ancient lie. We talked about Israel being born as a nation on Passover. That That happened again. That was Passover, is the day. The church was re-established, April, 6th, 1830. The April 6th 1830 was the 13th of the first month but they, the meeting was into the evening, so it was on the 14th. It was on Passover. Now, when the church was re-established in, he's okay. And then There's another interesting thing that's part of the Seder and this is kind of a mysterious thing, but when but you Mormons will appreciate the symbolism here, is that there's always this place at the table left for Elijah, right?

1:47:32 Right. And the it's interesting because there's in are in the standard works, there's one prophecy that is Repeated in all of them and it's only 11 prophecy and that is the great. And Dreadful day of the Lord, when Elijah will come to turn the hearts of the father's to the children and the children to their fathers. That's something you li zhiting. Like it's one of his missions and that's repeated in the Bible, the doctrine covenants, the pro great price and the Book of Mormon whole have that process, right heated. So you Mormons are look, I appreciate that too, but that symbolism and so, yeah, they'll They'll have a they'll have the table set and the family will be sitting around the table but there will be a gap, right?

1:48:26 Where Elijah is place will be set. And you know a Mormon looking at that might might think about ceiling. I'm like, oh look if a lot when Elijah comes than that, actually completes the family, right? So Now that prophecy about the Elijah coming that was film incur fulfilled in Kirtland, right? Yeah. Yeah. The the Old Testament doesn't Doesn't have time associated with that. But for some reason and I don't know the reasons for this but for some reason that in the Jewish mind has been associated with Pat, they were looking for that to occur at Passover time Feast of unleavened bread.

1:49:12 And yes, you're right. So, April 3rd, 18 was at 32. I don't remember. I believe it was 32. Let's see, I can actually, I could be wrong. Let me just look up real quick, but anyway, yeah, right, the, the dedication of the Kirtland Temple. Elijah comes and That's good. Hmm, oh gosh. Well it doesn't matter. I'm just looking here through the Seder there's a couple other things I want to mention that are just kind of cool here. It is. 1836 April 30 1836?

1:50:03 Okay another one. Another big one is that the Passover is When you when you're slaughtering lamb, you're not allowed to break any bones. Hmm. And Jesus fulfilled, this too, because when he was crucified, he actually the the Roman soldier came to break his legs, to make sure that it was done. But decided to poke him with a spear instead and, and he was dead already. And so, I know bones were broken. So this was fulfillment of that, the Passover ritual as well. So, Way amazing stuff. So, yeah.

1:50:47 So we have those those other fulfillments in as part of the restoration, these the establishment of the church, the birth of the Latter-day church and the the visit of Elijah. They're so pretty cool stuff. That's awesome. So that book, the Haggadah, the Haggadah is that available online somewhere. You can get them online. This one is what this one is. One that That my father put together, okay? He edited and compiled, this and then and then I've kind of added to it since and added some extra added recipes to the back and stuff for the matzah and other things. So, but if you, if you'd like a copy, I'll leave this one with you.

1:51:38 Oh, thank you! I have Kevin Kraut Prince. These for me. Oh, does he if One wants a copy of my hagaddah, you just go to. Old Pioneer Press in Santaquin Utah, and Kevin crowd. Look, I've got some some haroset on there that someone spilled. It's all good, it's all good. And ask ask if you can, if he'd print out, a copy of Joshua, Erickson's nice, Passover, seder. And you'll know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, dude, I'll tell you what as we went through these I'm continually amazed at how many. Episodes in the restoration historically, just continue to land on these days over and over and over. Is definitely using his calendar still. Yep.

1:52:31 Absolutely. Whether we whether we want to admit it or not whether we are aware. Yep. Yes, right. And and when I think it also speaks to this idea of there's some responsibility if you're going to call yourself Israel. There are there are things that are required of you and even if you think that you don't want to do those things. If you're really committed, you'll find yourself there. Yeah, whether you want to or not. Yeah. And that's just just kind of the way it is. And Yeah, I'm just continually amazed at the Precision at which it's all ages.

1:53:13 All unfolded to stay in in lockstep with them. So, in this was the last one of these, right? They'll one more. What weeks yet? Feast of Weeks. Okay. Also write, as Shavuot also known as Pentecost. Nice. Nice. All right. We miss anything, anything think that's, there's much more that we could talk about as far as details. But this is, this is a good overview. Awesome, all right, well dude, as always I appreciate it. Pleasure, bye everybody.

1:54:02 You're listening to the Mormon Renegade podcast.